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If any of you actually read the documents presented/used and follow the case closely, especially reading the jury instructions by Judge Koh (the 109 page release), you will realize that the verdict is not really right and seemed very rush due the the amount of errors in their scribbles. It does show that the jury is incompetent. Why did the judge not fire them ?. Oh, she does not want to rock the boat so much and knows the appeal will sort a lot of things out. It sure will because the appeals will be read by judges and no normal street-level people who cannot seem to make any value judgments.

Being objective, one can see several patents that are clearly "common sense" based judgement calls yet, the jury seems swayed by the evidence presented. They can take all-of-it, some-of-it and none-of-it was the judge's instructions but own judgement is the key to doing a clear deliberation. I still stand by one patent award to Apple and 4 patent awards to Samsung. The word "copying" was used very loosely to mean many things to many people and I am appalled that the judge did not specifically define the limits of "copying". Emulation and following along the lines are NOT copying and legal in many instances. No one seemed to want to define the very word that was abused by the system and Apple to great effect. It will be a short-live victory for apple while the appeals will drag on for a long while.
Meanwhile the Motorola suit is getting hot as Round Two for Apple soon fires off. In the meantime, I think Apple just lost about 20% of their customers who were outraged by this verdict.

Dude get back to reality, less than 0.01% will change their spending habits because of this case. Which I believe was rightly won, but im not a share holder so it doesnt affect me too much. But if I were Apple id be pissed off by BLATENT copying.
 
It's funny how some, not all Apple fans actually have such a distorted view on reality and feel Apple invented all the things they think they did.
Like the idiots who keep posting pictures of the dock connector....

http://youtu.be/wFeC25BM9E0

Perhaps learn something here.
 
Asked yourself this:

Did Samsung invented anything at all?
Did Samsung invent its own mobile OS like Apple did?
Would Samsung smartphones be this popular if Apple didn't exist?
Would Android exist if Apple Inc. did not have the chance to live?

From the very beginning, Samsung doesn't have a solid foundation to step foot into the smartphone market. It wasn't until they came up with the idea to use Apple's patents to produce smartphones.

And once they made those smartphones, they rely on Google Inc. to provide them their mobile OS (Android) for their devices to run on.

So technically, this Korean company never put in a single effort in making its own product not even its own mobile OS. They were so lazy enough to rely on other people's work. They don't have the innovative people like Apple do.

I'm not surprised to see Samsung lose in this trail against Apple. The jury has done their job marvelously. Samsung has to pay dearly for being such a dirty copycat.

Ask yourself this. Would the iPhone exist without Motorola?
 
Can you name some recent android innovations?

Listen, Im an Apple guy and because I am a huge fan of apple does not mean i have to love and accepting everything thing they make.

Now, you name something Apple has made within the last 3 years that has wowed you.
 
Anyone following the trial and paying attention to important things like FACTS and TESTIMONY and the INTERNAL EMAILS WITHIN SAMSUNG should have clearly been expecting the outcome Apple was awarded. No reasonably intelligent person, looking at the situation objectively, taking, you know, THE LAW into consideration, and leaving EMOTION out of it, could have possibly come to any other conclusion than Samsung WILLFULLY and with specific intent copied Apple's patented features and trade-dress.

Samsung has proven it has nary an iota of corporate honor. Hell, even in their own post-verdict remarks, Samsung doesn't deny that they copied. Samsung basically argues that they should have been allowed to continue to copy.

And, contrary to Samsung's post-verdict claims, this verdict is the best possible outcome for consumers. Now Samsung and others will be FORCED to actually innovate. Copying another company's patented features is NOT innovation. It's the exact opposite of innovation.

It's when companies come up with completely new and better ways of designing a UI that we, the consumers, get true innovation. And that is exactly why the iPhone became such a sensation! It was something the world had never seen before and Apple knew full well that dishonorable companies like Samsung would want to copy it, so Apple patented the hell out of it. Just as every single one of YOU would do if you ever created/innovated something new and wonderful. Particularly if it cost you MILLIONS of dollars to get there!

And speaking of honor, every single person that celebrates and condones Samsung's dishonorable practices is a person without personal honor themselves. The whines and complaints are not any surprise to me, however. Personal honor has been going in the toilet since the '70s in this country. These days, far too many individuals simply want to mimic the sickening typical corporate greed credo of "screw the other guy before he screws me".

I applaud Tim Cook and the entire team at Apple for fighting for what is right and just. I applaud them for NOT settling for anything less than a clear and decisive victory over the illicit activities of a dishonorable company!

Mark
 
Then vote with your wallet and don't buy it. There are enough alternatives.

I will, but other than aesthetics the alternatives are no better. I just want to best to work hard to get better and not become complacent.

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This pattern slide unlock thing is a good example I think. It would be cool to have that on iOS, but it is patented..

The pattern slide lock is pretty darn cool, much better then simple slide or weak fingerprint scan
 
Have you done eye test lately? Hoppe the opticians are much closer then an Apple store for you. So... obviously is lot more then rect rounded shape and icon grid that you ppl try to use as an example but you don't like to believe that. Samsung has shamelessly copied lots of thiks from Apple! Even the Samsung stores and staff shirts are 100% mimic of the Apple stores.

But looks like a dead end now, doesn't it?

It would appear from your post you need the eye test more.
 
Watch what happens if the Surface or Windows Phone becomes super popular, they'll attempt to find a loophole to pull the cross licensing on the Surface and the Windows Phones ( tho I don't think they have any for Windows Phone, its VERY different ), then sue Microsoft and say they invented everything on the Surface/Windows Phone.

" Its a rectangle with a touch screen! THEY STOLE IT! "

Apple has 0 interest in actually competing by making products. We already see what a pile of fail the iPhone 5 will be.

What happened to the company that made phones I wanted to buy?

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So, other than looking like a rectangle.

They run different OS's, use different hardware, have a different amount of buttons, are different sizes, use different apps, and aren't even made of the same material?

Yes, copying!
After reading a number of your posts, I decided to check on your post history. It appears that you have not had a single kind thing to say about Apple or their products. Furthermore, your remarks have little or no merit and are *obviously* intended to annoy and/or offend. You might want to Google the term "troll." :)

I'm pretty sure I actually scharted just a bit from laughing so hard when you commented that you "actually have a life." Are you implying that people who jump into a thread on occasion at MR's don't have a life? Huh! Interesting observation. I can't speak for everyone but I have a beautiful girlfriend, beautiful daughter, wonderful grand kids and more friends than I can list all of whom I spend a *lot* of time with. I also run a successful company, live less than 100' from the edge of the water in San Diego and surf almost every afternoon. Oops. Forgot one thing. I also really like Apple products and stop by MR on occasion to get my rumor mill groove on. I'll tell you one place you will never see me post and that's a site geared towards Android fans. To do so would be kinda creepy considering I don't paticularly care for Android OS and honestly I "actually have a life" and won't waste my time at a site that talks about something I have no interest in. Capesh?

One last thing. You mentioned that you would never stand in line at an Apple Store for a product release. I highly recommend you do just that. Maybe by doing so, you'll lighten up just a bit. I stood in line at the Fashion Valley store with my daughter for the initial iPhone release and we had a blast! Met some really great people and the funny thing is that the *vast* majority of talk had nothing to do with phones or Apple.
 
Listen, Im an Apple guy and because I am a huge fan of apple does not mean i have to love and accepting everything thing they make.

Now, you name something Apple has made within the last 3 years that has wowed you.

Nothing has wowed me. But that's not the point. I don't expect to be wowed everytime a company releases a new phone. That's not a logical thing to expect.

The point of my question is that your implication that Google is innovating all day everyday while Apple remains stagnant is wrong. Neither side has done anything revolutionary or innovative in years. They're both improving their product but not turning the market upside down with innovation.

Ios is a great software, as is Android. I'm not going to declare a phone a failure because it doesn't cook breakfast for me.
 
Can you name some recent android innovations?

Pattern lockscreen
Notification bar --Kinda a big deal and Apple 'borrowed' completely.
Customizable widgets in a mobile platform (you can say widgets existed before Android, but so did multitouch, pinch to zoom, etc, existed before the iPhone)
 
Asked yourself this:

Did Samsung invented anything at all?
Did Samsung invent its own mobile OS like Apple did?
Would Samsung smartphones be this popular if Apple didn't exist?
Would Android exist if Apple Inc. did not have the chance to live?

There's a difference between inventing and innovating - Samsung's latest handsets have a few clever tricks. They're a big company, so they must have invented something sometime. But as far as smartphones go, the answer to your first question is no. The answer to your second and third question is obvious: no. The answer to your last question is yes. Android would have existed today, but it would be copying RIM.
 
Pattern lockscreen
Notification bar --Kinda a big deal and Apple 'borrowed' completely.
Customizable widgets in a mobile platform (you can say widgets existed before Android, but so did multitouch, pinch to zoom, etc, existed before the iPhone)

So the last time Android innovated was years ago too, right? That was my point, thank you for proving it.

I'll ask again...can you name some "recent" Android innovations?
 
What happens when Apple comes out the Ipad mini, is Amazon going to sue Apple for coping the kindle?
 
Nothing has wowed me. But that's not the point. I don't expect to be wowed everytime a company releases a new phone. That's not a logical thing to expect.

That statement is exactly why it is not logical to expect a company to wow you everytime they come out with a new product. You and people who share that philosophy are always willing to settle. I could understand it if we were talking about cars, but a phone who's tech is always outdated in less than a years time should always wow you. These people get paid millions of dollas to build a new product every year.
 
For some they could be tired of Apples attitude even when they are right to a degree. My issue with their attitude is in part with issues like these, now with You Tube, Google, Adobe Flash, Blu-ray, living too far in the future etc... they also have many strong points of where they have taken tech today. Just feels that we are often reading about an issue Apple has with another company all too often.

You're reading about how Apple "has an issue with other companies" because everyone overanalyzes Apple's strategies and policies. In some ways the microscope they live under is a result of their own success. They've become the mega-celebrity of the technology world, and people who make such a big deal of their decisions, strategy and positions on such things as Flash and Blu-ray are blowing up and raising a stink about decisions that Apple tries to make privately within their own organization. Their philosophy is to produce products that are stylish, polished and appeal to normal people, as opposed to geeks. Technology that works halfway is not their thing. Just because Apple doesn't see the benefit in a particular technology, or sees the drawbacks outweighing the benefit, or sees the technology never really being the game changer that others claim it will be does not mean that they have "an issue with other companies." It just means their strategy for bringing their products to market is different. The problem that Apple faces today is that they have such celebrity status that even their beta software and unreleased, supposedly secret products are talked about openly in non-tech circles as if they're already available. I can't tell you how annoying it is to me, personally to read posts on this and other sites criticizing the stability and functionality of developer builds of iOS and OS X.

By contrast, Google exposes their half-finished projects to the world openly, and never really finishes most of them. They roll out a new gee-whiz technology with nearly unbridled abandon, and let it mature (or sometimes not mature) in front of the users' eyes.

I'm not making judgments about either company's strategy. They're both obviously doing well. I, personally prefer using Apple's products, because I find them more polished and stylish, and I have grown weary over the years of getting "grease under my fingernails" using technology. But to each his own.

However, criticizing Apple for their research, development and sales strategy just because they don't pursue, or abandon a particular technology that they don't feel fits well with what they're trying to do is unfair. If you don't like what they offer, vote with your wallet. Pretty simple concept, if you ask me.
 
Come on guys, both Android and iOS developers innovate in their own ways. It's unfair to both sides to say none of them innovate.

The problem here is Samsung intentionally/actively copied Apple products while being a key Apple partner. The OEM arm was only separated from Samsung Electronics after this thing blew up.

Even if one or two patents fell out, the key thing is still Samsung doggedly trying to copy Apple. They admitted in court that the high level folks gave instructions to copy Apple. They also did not preserve the evidences as instructed by the court.

Apple did not sue Microsoft for Surface, or Sony for Xperia and Vita. As long as the manufacturers innovate in their own ways, they should be ok. I myself look forward to the next Sony Xperia pad too. I already have a mix of Android and iOS devices at home.


What happens when Apple comes out the Ipad mini, is Amazon going to sue Apple for coping the kindle?

They can if they think Apple imitate Kindle look & feel, or violate Kindle patents !
 
I've read this statement before....oh right it was GM complaining when they passed CAFE laws. GM fought it claiming it would hurt consumers and stifle innovation and pass prices onto consumers. What happened? The Japanese companies innovated, made fuel efficient cars, and sold affordable cars to millions of Americans. GM went kicking and screaming and eventually went bankrupt. Now suddenly they are making cheap fuel efficient cars and are doing well. What's the lesson, companies that claim something will stifle innovation, raise prices, etc. don't want to change, they just want to keep doing what they have been doing. Innovate or die Samsung. Go make your own OS. See how hard it is to do.

Please read about how CAFE actually works. CAFE actually killed off station wagons and compact trucks both of which are more fuel efficient than the SUVs, large trucks, and crossover that replaced them. The way CAFE works does not promote fuel efficiency. Its actually what fueled the popularity of large suv's. The manufactures couldn't make a full size car but they could make an even less fuel efficient SUV. It forced the manufacturers to replace their larger cars with with vehicles classified as SUV's as the fuel requirements are lower on them. The ford ranger which was the last truely compact truck sold in the US is not no longer in production.
 
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good for innovation my rear end. If Apple was not abusing the crappy American patent system then yeah but those patents are crapents and Apple is just continuing to prove it is the worlds largest patent troll.

This is a sad day. It means I can patent crap and if I have enough money I can be a patent troll. Apple is to scared to compete any more so they have got to litigation.

OH get over it. :D
 
Well said Timmy. Well said.

hold on though - that almost word for word what the apply spokesperson released under her name earlier in the day! would have been nice to have pretended it was a uniquely written letter for the employees.
 
What happens when Apple comes out the Ipad mini, is Amazon going to sue Apple for coping the kindle?

It's comments/questions like this that prove that you didn't bother to pay ANY attention to the facts, testimony, and patent law during the trial. The only similarities between an iPad mini and a Kindle will be that they are both tablets and about the same size. That was NOT what the Apple v Samsung trial was about.

Please, go educate yourself before asking anymore questions.

Mark
 
Nothing has wowed me. But that's not the point. I don't expect to be wowed everytime a company releases a new phone. That's not a logical thing to expect.

That statement is exactly why it is not logical to expect a company to wow you everytime they come out with a new product. You and people who share that philosophy are always willing to settle. I could understand it if we were talking about cars, but a phone who's tech is always outdated in less than a years time should always wow you. These people get paid millions of dollas to build a new product every year.

There's a difference between expecting it and it actually being realistic. I would love revolutionary innovations all the time, but that's not logical or realistic...
 
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