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Tim Cook on Mobile Payments: 'It's In Its Infancy'

NedBookPro said:
For Tim cook to say that NFC is in it's infancy is just ignorant. Outside of his country, it's widely embraced. HTC and Samsung (and others) seem to recognise this.
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I'm not sure, In the UK, I'm only aware of McDonalds taking NFC payments (because they had a poster up stating it, until the refurbishments). Other may have the facility, but i'm not aware who they are, they certainly don't advertise it or push it. I've have an NFC credit card for years, never used it, never been offered the choice of using it.

For me, even though passbook is basically limited to Starbucks, it's still more use than NFC to me. Not that i'm against it, I just don't see it as a needed feature at the moment.

Perhaps a combined passbook/NFC system may take off. I've always worried that a successful passbook may be stifled by the need to maintain numerous small balances on different cards, so a 'central bank' such as your iTunes balance, would be needed to stop people having to manage 20 different cards, each with a £10 credit on it.
 
bedifferent said:
Tim Cook has been making a lot of statements recently. I'm a bit surprised with this announcement, given that Apple was (rumored) to be releasing NFC but backed out when credit companies refused their terms in taking a percentage of NFC sales.

NFC has been around for a long time in Japan, E.U., etc. and is used for more than payments. Infiniti is releasing all new vehicles lines this summer, and NFC will be implemented as an option for locking/unlocking doors, drivers' settings, etc. It's more secure than "blink" systems. Dateline (and other security experts) have shown it is easy to steal credit card data from "blink" cards. Readers are available online for ~$100, place one in a carry wallet and wave it near someone's purse or wallet. Copy that data onto something as simple as a hotel key, make a purchase (in one case, a couple thousand dollar purchases) and no one checked to verify the card. NFC is much more secure with a short transmit range.

NFC might be "in its infancy" in North America, but it has been around for a long time in many countries.
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I think every store I have try to pay with tap and go has fail. Store have the systems around me, but they don't work!
 
charlituna said:
There are like six different versions. So which one should Apple support. Because its not really their style to try to cover all of them.
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Well, I bet Apple just want to introduce their own version, if possible.
 
i hope to see more and more improvements in this field. the local coffee shop (which is part of a chain) has an app that enables you to pay with your phone (you basically get assigned a barcode, and they scan your screen) and i find it very comfortable.
 
AlexisV said:
The whole system needs overhauling. At the moment chip and pin is painfully slow and long winded. I can't believe we're still here in 2013 and I have to sit tapping my fingers in restaurants and supermarkets while we wait for the payment to go through.

Contactless payments are the future, but like electric cars there is no infrastructure (in the UK at least). I think only McDonalds do contactless here, and it just seems to be being pushed by Barclays Bank and nobody else.

If Mastercard and Visa want separate systems, it's just going to end up like another Bluray v HDDVD.
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You'll still have to wait for payment to go through..

Don't get me wrong I don't have anything against NFC. I'd love to have the option but frankly I don't care one bit for it right now because there is zero infrastructure for it like you say.

I wouldn't want to use contactless payment without a PIN code though. Lose your phone and the one who took/stole it can go on a shopping spree.

So in the end NFC payment won't be much faster... Or faster but a huge security risk.
 
lordofthereef said:
It's bit about a debit card being thick and heavy. It's about convenience. It can also potentially be more secure. You lose your wallet or it is stolen, the new owner has a shopping spree. Lose your phone, assuming proper security is in place, there is no such risk.

Sure, I suppose this increases the risk of a droppd phone. So does doing just about anything on your phone though, versus jeeping it tucked away, so I feel like the point is moot.
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I'll give you security, but I just don't feel that paying for things with my phone is natural or is that much more convenient.

Also, as a side note, a lot of people here are extolling the virtues of NFC by claiming its widespread adoption in Asia, but here in Taiwan it's still uncommon to find NFC yet. The closest equivalent is the metro's EasyCard, which can be used at select places like Starbucks, Muji, and 7-11. But considering most businesses here don't even accept debit cards, perhaps if would be more specific to limit that argument to places such as Japan and South Korea.

Putting on my pedant cap, but when a point is moot, it actually means it's debatable.
 
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snebes said:
The retailers don't want to invest in new scanner technology to support either Passbook (reading barcodes on screens) or NFC readers.
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The retailers will have to replace their scanners soon. The US is way behind in card reader technology --- still relying on a magnetic stripe that is easily forged or modified.

In most of the rest of the civilized world, card issuers have converted to the smart chip reader. They charge a higher merchant fee for a magnetic stripe transaction, so merchants quickly invested in the necessary hardware.

To accommodate visitors from the US, most will still accept a card with a magnetic stripe, but not without additional measures like checking ID. Some refuse altogether.
 
AlexisV said:
The whole system needs overhauling. At the moment chip and pin is painfully slow and long winded. I can't believe we're still here in 2013 and I have to sit tapping my fingers in restaurants and supermarkets while we wait for the payment to go through.

Contactless payments are the future, but like electric cars there is no infrastructure (in the UK at least). I think only McDonalds do contactless here, and it just seems to be being pushed by Barclays Bank and nobody else.

If Mastercard and Visa want separate systems, it's just going to end up like another Bluray v HDDVD.
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Erm:

1. Pret
2. Caffe Nero
3. London buses
4. Banks
5. Boots
6. Eat
7. YoSushi
8. Crussh
9. Subway
10. London taxis
11. Clinton Cards
12. Strada
13. LOADS of bars and clubs

If you're thinking "Ah but he lives in London!" then fear not, I searched the VisaPay Wave website for Manchester - 100 stores found.

Sorry but the idea that McDonald's is the only UK store to use it is completely false. Sure, you might not use it but I have contactless cards and use it daily and see plenty of others doing so.

NFC is the way forward, and the sooner that is realised the better.

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For those who say the infrastructure isn't there - it is. Most new chip and pin card machines facilitate NFC payments. Often I've been in a bar and the bartender hands me the machine for my PIN and I see it's NFC enabled. The infrastructure is there often but not known by staff.
 
AlexisV said:
The whole system needs overhauling. At the moment chip and pin is painfully slow and long winded. I can't believe we're still here in 2013 and I have to sit tapping my fingers in restaurants and supermarkets while we wait for the payment to go through.

Contactless payments are the future, but like electric cars there is no infrastructure (in the UK at least). I think only McDonalds do contactless here, and it just seems to be being pushed by Barclays Bank and nobody else.

If Mastercard and Visa want separate systems, it's just going to end up like another Bluray v HDDVD.
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Well Cafe Nero have contactless payments as do M&S.

The payment takes time because everything has to be authorised, it has nothing to do with being 'Chip and Pin'. The wait is down to the banks servers

As more places start replacing their first gen machines we will see contactless payments becoming far more widespread. Lloyds cards are also starting to be contactless. Although as you say Barclays are the main protagonist at the moment.

Barclays (Barclays Bank and Barclaycard)
HSBC
Lloyds Banking Group (Halifax)
MBNA
Newcastle Building Society
The Royal Bank of Scotland Group (NatWest and RBS)

Have all started the process of moving towards contactless systems.
 
What problem does NFC solve? What in my everyday life becomes easier because of it? I use a card for almost all of my payments, it's directly tied to my bank, it's available everywhere. Moving this into a phone seems like a convoluted and complicated process that serves no purpose.
 
subsonix said:
What problem does NFC solve? What in my everyday life becomes easier because of it? I use a card for almost all of my payments, it's directly tied to my bank, it's available everywhere. Moving this into a phone seems like a convoluted and complicated process that serves no purpose.
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does it need to solve any problems ? its a feature, not a fix for problem
 
ALange said:
does it need to solve any problems ? its a feature, not a fix for problem
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Yes it does, or it's a redundant gimmick without a wide appeal. To clarify, it has to actually do payments, better, more convenient, safer etc (pick one or more). than current methods, otherwise why should anyone care.
 
subsonix said:
What problem does NFC solve? What in my everyday life becomes easier because of it? I use a card for almost all of my payments, it's directly tied to my bank, it's available everywhere. Moving this into a phone seems like a convoluted and complicated process that serves no purpose.
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It takes literally seconds to make an NFC payment. That alone is worth it when you consider the amount of time you waste:

1. Waiting for the cashier to press the card payment
2. Inserting card
3. Processing
4. Entering PIN
5. Authorising
6. Removing card
7. Printing receipt

Most NFC payments don't print out a receipt here, so that saves paper too.

Not to mention the time you will save NOT waiting for everyone else in the queue to do the above.

Over time I imagine this will add up to quite a bit of time saved.
 
coffeemadmanUK said:
The irony is that a lot of technology now solves nothing other than making things just a bit easier for us. NFC is that - making something we already have faster and easier.
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and thats what they shoul do. smartphones are for making your day easier , not problem fixing
 
ALange said:
does photo camera or mp3 player in iphone solves any problems ?? get real...
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Of course it does. It prevents you from having to carrying 3 devices, a phone, a camera and a mp3 player.

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ALange said:
and thats what they shoul do. smartphones are for making your day easier , not problem fixing
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Making your day easier is fixing a problem, it's contributing something of value.
 
subsonix said:
Of course it does. It prevents you from having to carrying 3 devices, a phone, a camera and a mp3 player.

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Making your day easier is fixing a problem, it's contributing something of value.
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are you reading with understanding ?
 
subsonix said:
Yes it does, or it's a redundant gimmick without a wide appeal. To clarify, it has to actually do payments, better, more convenient, safer etc (pick one or more). than current methods, otherwise why should anyone care.
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Payments are more convenient, easier, faster an safer with NFC
 
Last time I've heard that NFC has only 8% worldwide adoption. A majority of retailers need to get on board before this becomes a reality.
 
subsonix said:
Excuse me, what?

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Well, I don't see it that way, and you don't provide any arguments for me to change my mind.
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Tapping an smartphone is easier and faster than passing a card and entering a PIN.

Tapping an smartphone is more convenient than passing a card.
 
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