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forget about Porsche or Tesla. let's get back the the main point of the OP.

does SUV or crossover have gas efficiency like car? or can it carry big load like pick-up truck? Dmunjal can't answer this question. He kept using other companies as an example that he likes apple to follow. all he want is converged product but as Tim Cook mentioned, it would lost all advantages.
I'll answer your question. You do give up mileage (except Tesla) with a crossover/SUV but you make that up by not having to buy two cars. The compromise is worth it to many people.
 
I don't see how supporting the Pencil on more devices fragments anything? That's the opposite of fragmenting.

Also, it's really strange that you quote me saying I have a Surface, then tell me to go buy a Surface.

View attachment 600367

That's 3 sales... Though one is my last gen that I am reselling. Surrounded by my Apple products because I really do love Apple for mobile and TV. Returned the new AppleTV, but that had more to do with the fact that I just couldn't stand the new Netflix app.

As a filmmaker, designer, and photographer and ever since my first iPhone (the 3G) I've been waiting to jump over to OSX. But then little things keep happening to scare me away. The big one was Final Cut X. I'm very connected in the indie filmmaking world. Before FCX I did not know a single filmmaker who didn't edit on a Final Cut... Within months after that, there wasn't a single one that wasn't on Premiere. Back then, I was just too poor to buy a Mac Pro, but today it is a choice that works for me. Thankfully Adobe is cross platform.

There's millions and millions of Windows users like me, that also love Apple devices. You may think we're stupid, but not stupid enough to use a Windows Phone or their pathetic smart Band!

I'm a part of the problem though, I'm inflating those iOS numbers by buying all their casual (consumption) devices while I'm buying Windows for professional (creation) stuff.

indie film-making can be fascinating of a process which I used to do storyboards back in Cleveland, OH ( long story ). I used to do it by hand and would scan it via Photoshop and edit it there. Once done, I'd compress all the files and attach them by email which would be long before Dropbox came into the scene ( a godsend, I must say ).

The guy I worked with used FCP 4 which amazed me with its UI and effects. He gave me a copy of FCP 4 for my PowerBook ( this was back in around 2004 ) and I never found the time to sit down to master it. iMovie, on the other hand, was okay. Keynote became my tool of choice when I wanted to present my storyboarding to an old friend/cliente a few years back. Around 2011, Keynote had excellent features I was able to use to manipulate the motion and timing.

And you're right that it's great that Adobe is cross platform. This is why it's a win-win when there's OS X and Windows versions to use as long as there is a serial key available under the CC subscription.

But I think there is another flaw in the iPad Pro design. It lacks a kick stand. If this was going to be touted as a pro device, they should've built a kick stand instead of the uni-body design. Because of that, people wouldn't have to buy a cover and flip it around to angle it, similar to the hardbound Dodo Case I have for my original iPad. It was nice but the angle was a bit too low and fixed whereas the Surface tablets' kickstands can change angles.

This way the user doesn't have to hold the iPad Pro with one hand and start drawing, if they're too poor to buy a cover or such. I just realized that now by re-examing the iPad Pro images.

The other is the UI design for iOS. I think it's a huge mistake on Apple's part to be slapping iOS all across the board ( with the watch and tv as the exception ). Even it was supposed to be scalable, it doesn't look right on the latest device. How can someone like Tim Cook be okay with the fact the icons are spaced far apart on the home page and let the thing be built? This is where I think someone got lazy at this point.

They should've kept iOS 9 from iPhone to iPad Mini/Air and that's it. But iPad Pro's iOS should have been re-built from the ground as ' professional ' or advanced OS. And leaving out the 3D Touch was a mistake and I can see why it could've been expensive to add the screen layer, it's still a BS excuse regardless.

They could call it iOS Plus just for the iPad Pro. Why the F--- didn't they bother with this? Oh, but noooo, they had to spend at least four years on what Tim Cook said " The wrist is an interesting place ".
 
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The arguments against hybrids are funny. Surface pro is no compromise. They nailed it. Hell, I will even say that Surface Pro 4 is a better standalone laptop than any of Apples.
And I will even ask, are you nuts? This is the first year Microsoft even attempted to build a glass trackpad and testers report half a second lag when scrolling in Firefox and Chrome before anything moves. The recommended workaround is to disable pinch to zoom in preferences.

And that's your better than anything Apple!
 
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Let us remind ourselves that this is the same Apple that said "no one" would want a smartphone with big screens and went on to release a 5.5" phablet iPhone, the same company that said they wouldn't make a smaller iPad and released exactly that afterwards:rolleyes:

I don't think this should be compared to an iOS and OS X merger of software and hardware into one device. This is not the same! At the time a lot of people didn't want larger devices, but over time we did grow a want for it. People wanted the same tablet but smaller and people wanted the same phone but larger, and some people wanted a larger tablet like myself so I now have the iPad pro.

It is much easier to do this and be successful than create an entire new product line which is a laptop and tablet in one, which perform no less than how both the MacBook Pro and iPad perform today.

iOS will gradually improve along with iCloud Drive with better cross platform features and integration. So far Apple has been doing an excellent job improving the features in iOS.

My iPad pro has already replaced my MacBook Pro. There isn't anything I really miss about my Mac. I don't burn cd's anymore, I don't use dvd's, I don't download torrents, I don't connect external drives for back ups since everything is backed up in my iCloud. I don't use flash drives to save documents, again thanks to iCloud. Most people don't need a computer running full desktop OS or applications. People are just stubborn and hate change so they cry about how much they need it. They did it with the floppy disk, optical drive, USB port things that claim they need but do not.
 
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Surface Pro 4
$899 tablet only, pen included
$1.029 w/ keyboard

iPad Pro
$799 tablet only
$1.067 w/ keyboard and pen

Wow, what a difference for buying Windows trash.
Try to make your comparison a LITTLE more fair....

The Surface Pro 4 is 4GB/128GB. The $799 iPad Pro is 4GB/32GB. The 4GB/128GB iPP is $949.

Surface Pro 4 : tablet, keyboard, pen : $1030
iPad Pro : tablet ($950) + keyboard ($170) + pencil ($100) = $1170

$140 difference. Depending upon how one uses their devices, the Surface Pro 4 is a notebook that is closer to being used as a tablet than the iPad Pro being a tablet than can be used as a notebook.
 
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Incredible how many people here state they own Surface Pros. Personally I'd rather bite my head off and eat it than use Windows on anything, which is why I have an Android tablet, but obviously Windows 10 has won a lot of people back.

The real reason why Apple will never release a 2-in-1 is called Jony Ive. The screen would have to be at least as thick as the thinnest iPad (6.1mm). But then the keyboard must be heavier than the screen, otherwise the thing would fall flat on the screen all the time. That means at least 12mm thickness (unless the keyboard is heavier for some reason which it probably won't as all the guts will be in the tablet part), probably more if you want to have reasonable key travel. The new Macbook is 13mm at its thickest with its absolutely terrible keyboard. Apple aren't going to start making thicker products anytime soon. iPad Pro with a Whateveritscalled Keyboard Case is as good as it gets.
This. Why would we want to go back to the days of 1/2" thick (or more) laptop screens instead of the current insanely thin and amazingly balanced ones? The biggest flaw I've seen in the Surface Book is it is top-heavy. Adding weight to the screen will detract from the user experience not add to it.
 
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I'll answer your question. You do give up mileage (except Tesla) with a crossover/SUV but you make that up by not having to buy two cars. The compromise is worth it to many people.

beside giving up gas mileage, you can't carry big load like pick-up truck. so you still have to buy a truck.

so are you willing to lose 10-hour battery life of the ipad so that you can have something like Surface Pro? what about heat and weight? are you willing to lose these advantages that current ipad has?

for most people, including kids, all they want to do is casual gaming, mail, browsing.
 
Do you own an iPad Pro? To suggest he cannot do his job with one suggests you have inside knowledge and that he's a liar, or you are shooting from the hip with ignorance. I'm guessing it's the latter.

What's that have to do with anything? That's long-ago history in the 1990s. And has no relevancy today. Apple's continued success today, with ever increasing sales, has nothing to do with that, but rather knowing what people want, and making outstanding products people are willing to open their wallet and pay a premium price. Simple as that.

You could've said that the first time around to be more clear.

As for the iPad Pro, I don't plan on buying it until they get their priorities straightened out. I'm still not impressed from what I've seen and read about their latest device.

I believe Tim Cook is a hypocrite. It's going to bite him in the rear once he realizes the iPad Pro is limited when he plays around with it more and ends up returning to his desktop/laptop in his private office. He can't just go around, opening his mouth saying the iPad Pro is going for replace a desktop/laptop, and then end up using them which I'm very sure he does.
 
I like how Tim doesn't offer disinformation about secret projects like Steve used to. Steve would lie when asked about a project and say thing like "we're not doing anything like that" or "nobody wants ___"
 
The iPad Pro will never replace the laptop no matter how much Tim Cook says it can, there's no file system. It's just fundamentally hobbled. I'm not saying iOS is bad. It works great for a phone. It works alright for a tablet, but there's a lot of tasks that are going to be very difficult if not impossible to do as efficiently without a solid built in keyboard and mouse, and a file system that can be accessed to store and retrieve any files you want.

The Surface Book is a great example of what Apple could do. It has all the power of a real computer, all the battery life of a real laptop (12 hours when plugged into the base) and 4 hours of battery when detached as just a tablet. It's the size of an iPad Pro, slightly higher resolution, and it includes the pencil. Apple could do this very easily, just make the tablet turn into iOS mode when detached and run in Mac OS X when docked into the laptop keyboard in laptop mode. Honestly this would be ridiculously easy for a company with $200B sitting around and some of the best minds in computer engineering on the planet. I am actually really tempted to buy the Surface Book and I still may, it's just a bummer I lose iMessage from my laptop capability. hmm, I really wish Tim Cook wasn't so stubborn about following Microsoft's lead here.

Honestly, the hybrid I described would be just as good as as either a tablet or a Mac but Apple would lose being able to sell iPads to Mac owners and vice versa. I know some people said he's just buying time to make his own but I think Tim Cook honestly doesn't want to do it. Reason is, he is making his own processors now and he's not about to become anymore reliant on Intel than he already has to be. Mac OS X would have to be running on an ARM processor, that's a nightmare and a half. He'd rather just slowly stop investing in the Mac line and invest in the iOS line and hope Mac becomes less relevant.
 
The iPad is useful for checking email and reading news headlines and viewing weather forecasts and weather maps. Too many news sources provide only the initial news in condensed form. No updates. It's not for working on spreadsheets or editing photos or organizing financing. It's not even very good for on-line shopping.

Try being a programmer: the idea of a OS X/iOS merger terrifies me.
 
My bubble is London. Big bubble. Wise, educated, smart people. ;)
Oh so your bubble is London as a whole. Wow you must see millions of people w macs everyday... how do you process seeing them everyday? Wonder why London sales don't match your "bubble". Btw, you don't understand what a bubble is... Makes sense because you think everyone in London are wise, smart people...
 
hmm, I really wish Tim Cook wasn't so stubborn about following Microsoft's lead here.

What you described is not the same as what MS has done. You have described a dual OS boot system, while MS have created a single OS for both desktop and mobile.
 
Most folks know that Apple users can partition their Apple computers to run on Apple OS as well as on a PC operating system. There should be no reason that when the monitor is attached to the MacBook Air keyboard it runs the standard Apple Mac OS, but when the monitor comes off, it flips to Apple mobile OS.
Yeah! I'd love to undock my monitor, wait for OS X to shut down, then wait for iOS to boot. Sounds like a great time!
 
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Actually, it is what customers (especially us Mac users) have wanted. Apple could actually squeeze more profits if they did streamline all their products into a single monolithic jack-of-all-trades-OS.
You are not all Mac users, because this Mac user and many others vehemently disagree that a hybrid OS is a good idea.
 
Love my IPad Air 2 , likely will be getting a Pro , my old MacBook Pro 17" is still one of my favorite laptops of all time , so I like Apple products and Linux and Windows.

But Cooks a nutcase.

Why would anyone buy a PC ? Really ?

My secondary machine at home crushes any IMac's speed , and my main gaming rig uses two Titan X's in Sli as I actually prefer my gaming hobby in 4K to be able to stay at 60fps.


What world is he in to actually say would would anyone buy a PC when the IMac's and MacBook Pro's and Mac Pro's are severely gimped in the GPU world.
 
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Try to make your comparison a LITTLE more fair....

The Surface Pro 4 is 4GB/128GB. The $799 iPad Pro is 4GB/32GB. The 4GB/128GB iPP is $949.

Surface Pro 4 : tablet, keyboard, pen : $1030
iPad Pro : tablet ($950) + keyboard ($170) + pencil ($100) = $1170

$140 difference.
I stand with my numbers. But when you want to be correct, why don't you calculate in that the Surface Pro 4 only comes with a 30-day trial period of Office compared to all iWork and iLife apps are included with iPad Pro. There goes your price difference.
 
Exactly. This is no longer Steve Jobs' Apple.
Actually, Steve ignored what people wanted more than I would suggest Apple under Cook has. I'm not going to take a stand on this issue, but Steve seemed to love the quote frequently attributed (perhaps incorrectly) to Henry Ford, something to the effect of "If I'd asked people what they wanted, they'd have said a faster horse."
 
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No Mac? iPad ... Pro? You can't even read and write files from USB Drives you got from a colleague at work.

Ever worked in Finance? USB drives are locked down due to security. No chance of ever using one of those, ever. That has been the norm for the past 5 years. No removable media. Similar to the legal industry, insurance and medical. Audit, security and regulation requires the ability to track data and not allow it to be sent outside of an organization.

An iPad is more secure than a laptop/desktop. That's actually a good thing.
 
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Whatever. Could we have a lightweight device that's fast enough to run Xcode 7, please? (Yes, it means it either has to run OS X or you have to make an iOS version of Xcode.)
 
Maybe make it possible for file system access in iOS and stop there.
You already have file system access in iOS. If you didn't, you'd have a paperweight.

However, if you're referring to an app such as Finder, trust me, you'd hate it. If you're really curious, jailbreak your iOS device and open it up in some app that lets you view the contents of an iOS device's storage volume—it's a mess.
 
I stand with my numbers. But when you want to be correct, why don't you calculate in that the Surface Pro 4 only comes with a 30-day trial period of Office compared to all iWork and iLife apps are included with iPad Pro. There goes your price difference.
Office >> iWork

Though the iPad does have LTE. But most people are tethering now.
 
I stand with my numbers. But when you want to be correct, why don't you calculate in that the Surface Pro 4 only comes with a 30-day trial period of Office compared to all iWork and iLife apps are included with iPad Pro. There goes your price difference.
YOU are the one who focused on hardware prices.

But if you want to move the goal posts in order to prove that you are correct, then it simply shows that your argument is weak.
 
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