I’d say my test is much more scientific than advice go buy a machine and use it for two week trying to convince myself unsee what I saw already.
Yeah, we can agree on that.
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Torn between Air M2 and Pro 14 - Any news on the horizon?
- Thread starter Muyfa666
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Yeah, we can agree on that.
I am sorry that you took what I said as trying to make you unsee what you saw. Really not what I was trying to say.
Best to you.
It doesn’t matter what you see. Apple confirmed it’s the same aluminum used in both. End of story. No need to recreate the wheel.I beg to differ. You see obviously why that claim is wrong when you look at the both machines from the side.
Meaning, if we _pretend_ that aluminium sheets on the bottom and keyboard deck were equal in thickness, there is still huge difference on the sides that make machine rigid against torsion. Sides are very thick as you can see how deep the ports are but in MBP due to ”fatter” chassis that part has way much more aluminum making it much more rigid.
So what everyone can see from that video is just imagination? Are you for real?
We are gonna need you to elaborate how that in your logic would make MBA sturdier, considering what I said above about the sides?
Excuse me but you did not seem to understand the issue we were discussing. Maybe you should read the older posts, before to understand what the topic was before jumping in with the comments having nothing to do with the issue in hand.
I should not even bother to comment your message above, but I do so anyway, so that you maybe get a glimpse of what was the topic here. I was not claiming at any point anything about the aluminum alloy itself. It is recycled aluminum in both models - so what, that was not the point here. So to spell this out for you using a very simple example, if you have two same length aluminium rods but one is 1/4" thick and another it 1/2" thick. Which one bends easier? Basically you guys are "saying" the 1/4" is stiffer or at least as good. I say 1/2" is stiffer.
The actual matter here is that you are missing the point of the discussion here!
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Again, your assumption the aluminum thickness is different on both models are based on a fallacy. You are making things up. If you read my earlier statements, APPLE says there is NO DIFFERENCE. The material is the same. The thickness is the same In plain English, the Pro does not have aluminum that is thicker than the Air on the M2 models.
Nothing more needs to be said.
So you are really telling me that MBA M2 has the same thickness sides as MBP 14"? From Apple web site it says MBP 14" 1,55 cm and MBA M2 1,13 cm. So the SIDES that have the thicker wall already (look how deep the ports are) are much thicker in MBP 14" and this is where MBP 14" gets more stiffness to chassis against flexing.
Looks like you have no idea about the topic here or you just read it wrong, so I hope above was spelled out for you simply enough. Please read and learn what the topic is before entering discussion.
Offtopic, Joan please giggle. I love to hear her giggling. ;D
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it doesn't need to be as thick, its also lighter and still feels plenty rigid. But whatever helps you feel better I guess
No, you realize it as soon as you try put some torsion force on each and feel the difference easily. We are not just talking alone about the weight of the machine and what strain it put to chassis when you hold it from the one corner, but actual flexibility of the chassis.
What you claim about that thickness does not need to be the same to archieve the same rigidness against torsion is just wrong.
Are you kidding? The sides of either are not even close to those measurements. The port depth has nothing to do with the thickness of the aluminum. The body of the MBP is slightly taller than the MBA, but the aluminum properties are identical. They will both flex the same amount.
Even if the aluminum on the sides was thicker (which it isn't) it's not enough to preclude the horizontal panels flexing any less.
The MBP is not any more rigid than the MBA.
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tried both multiple times, both feel just fine. Ones just thicker and heavier, good luck with this though
Same here.
Not sure what is you definition for fine, but I was talking about flexiblity/bending and MBA M2 is much more flexible than MBP 14”.
You too, you are gonna need it more than I.
Offtopic, Joan please giggle. I love to hear her giggling. ;D
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Why? Are you now insinuating the m2 air is going to break?
No I’m not but I hope you are because I have tried to spell this out for you too many time already.
Again, even you minus the display lid thickness off, the MBP 14” has obviously thicker sides. Just use a caliber and measure it yourself if you don’t get it.
GREAT, so you finally undestood what I’ve been spelling out to you for couple of days.
So this is exactly what I was asking from you using an simple example, you have two same lenght aluminium rods but one is 1/4” thick and another is 1/2” thick. Now you basically say that both are as ridig/flexible. I say 1/2” is stiffer. I don’t think we need to call to MythBusters to get the answer saying that I was right.
It is thicker (or taller as you may wanna see this). Probably since you don’t understand even simple examples I gave, I should call it volume. Sides of the MBP 14” have MORE VOLUME (contain more aluminium in weight) than MBA M2.
I hope you finally understand what I told you so many times already.
It is much more rigid.
Offtopic, Joan please giggle. I love to hear her giggling. ;D
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I see multiple people who actually own the M2 MBA say it is not "flimsy" or has poor structural integrity and one person who does not own the device in question arguing with multiple people over and over again always struggling to have the last word whether or not the last response means anything.
The points being made about the supposed lack of thickness of the sidewall do not even make sense as everything is designed proportionally to the size, weight, and thickness of the device. Apple engineers did not suddenly make a mistake on the frame of the M2 MBA. It is a surprisingly solid laptop specially when the design is taken into consideration.
Looking at this thread there is only one person going round and round......
But again everyone has their own perceptions and if one person has an opinion that is fine and I respect it but it does not make their opinion objectifiable truth.
No, there are multiple people who don't simply get the simple fact behind this. There is simply MORE ALUMINIUM IN MBP chassis especially on the sides, it simply make it more resistant to torsion. I could show it to you on your machine to you in detail.
Responses here mostly are people saying they right but give no detailed explanation/elaboration to their reply. I at least spell out in detail my replies, but mostly people just pretend they don't understand what I said and start saying again, there is no difference between the two, or turn discussion to sidetrack. You don't really see a problem here?
Should I just play this game like you guys and simply answer to everything saying I know this and I'm right without justifying/explaining my comments in detail in any way like most others seem to do?
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I have responded multiple times to those who claim what they don't actually know. More aluminum is not the point. Design is not just more material makes something stronger. There are a lot of factors that are in play that for some reason are being ignored to make a false point.No, there are multiple people who don't simply get the simple fact behind this. There is simply MORE ALUMINIUM IN MBP chassis especially on the sides, it simply make it more resistant to torsion. I could show it to you on your machine to you in detail.
Responses here mostly are people saying I'm right and give no detailed explanation to their reply. I at least spell out in detail my replies, but mostly people just pretend they don't understand what I said and start saying again, there is no difference between the two. You don't really see a problem here?
Actually there are few, you included.
The MBP is a thicker, heavier, and larger device overall so wouldn't it need more aluminum on the sides than a smaller, lighter, and thinner device but still have the same structural rigidity in both? That would be called proportional design. Why would the M2 MBA have the same amount of aluminum as the MBP? It makes no sense.
I don't see a problem when people who have owned a M1 MBP and M2 MBA saying they are both as solid and well made because they have personal experience and have owned both for a long time. I would trust their observation over someone who doesn't own something who wants to complain about a problem that simply doesn't exist. \
However as I have said repeatedly anyone can have whatever opinion they want. It is just amazing that some can't seem to understand that a personal perception of something is an opinion and not fact no matter what else they say. It is also amazing that just because I hold an opinion if it is counter to what some believe they can't acknowledge that they respect my opinion and move on. So have any opinion. I am done.
In retrospect I probably should have kept the M2 Air since the MacBook Pro Mini LED is causing me headaches that make it uncomfortable to use for extended periods, but for those that aren't sensitive to display flickering and don't need the highest degree of portability the 14" Pro is a better machine overall.
The performance felt comparatively more constrained on the Air, whereas my eyes feel strained on the Pro...
The performance felt comparatively more constrained on the Air, whereas my eyes feel strained on the Pro...
Maybe if you turn the brightness up it would reduce the flickering on the MBP?In retrospect I probably should have kept the M2 Air since the MacBook Pro Mini LED is causing me headaches that make it uncomfortable to use for extended periods, but for those that aren't sensitive to display flickering and don't need the highest degree of portability the 14" Pro is a better machine overall.
The performance felt comparatively more constrained on the Air, whereas my eyes feel strained on the Pro...
What were you doing that the performance felt constrained on the M2 MBA? I am curious because beyond workloads the device was not designed for my experience was the opposite?
I am sorry about your eye strain. I had a similar experience with the 16" M1 Max MBP.
So you are insulting me telling I don't know what I say?
So you know and I don't? You just come here and say so and that's it. Not sure what gives you an idea you are a GOD here?
Of course it is. More aluminium on the sides are the whole point for making chassis rigid. Bottom and top (keyboard deck) plates are so thin already they have no much to do with torsion rigidness but sides do make the difference. This is what I could demonstrate to you on your MBA.
So explain in detail exactly how design makes this stronger? Use as many words as you need. Same time you probably find an explanation that 1/4" aluminum rod is no more easily bending than 1/2" thick rod in same length.
Sure it naturally need more material but that volume or weigh of the aluminium used on the sides make it much more torsion resistant than MBA. It is very simple to feel. place MBA M2 on the table and open lid, then hold left side wrist rest area down and on your right hand light gently under right side wrist rest area. You feel how easily that one leg raise off the table while other 3 are still touching the table. Now do the same test on different models. BTW! MBP 13" is the stiffest in this test, practically both front legs go up if you use too much force, it does not lift with reasonable force at all, it is so stiff.
Who calls it, you??
For the millionth time - for torsion resistance. Jump few lines above and read my explanation again for that.
Time does not make it any more solid. Just try that test to see it yourself.
Again, I have described you many time test method. Is is not opinion or personal perception, it can be seen clearly.
Offtopic, Joan please giggle. I love to hear her giggling. ;D
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Intreresting. Since in this side of the forum MBA M2 being faster than MBP 14" argument seems to be popping up all the time.
Design is not just more material makes something stronger. There are a lot of factors that are in play that for some reason are being ignored to make a false point.
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So explain in detail exactly how design makes this stronger? Use as many words as you need. Same time you probably find an explanation that 1/4" aluminum rod is no more easily bending than 1/2" thick rod in same length.
Sure it naturally need more material but that volume or weigh of the aluminium used on the sides make it much more torsion resistant than MBA. It is very simple to feel. place MBA M2 on the table and open lid, then hold left side wrist rest area down and on your right hand light gently under right side wrist rest area. You feel how easily that one leg raise off the table while other 3 are still touching the table. Now do the same test on different models. BTW! MBP 13" is the stiffest in this test, practically both from legs go up if you use too much force, it does not lift with reasonable force, it is so stiff.
Who calls it, you??
For the millionth time - for torsion resistance. Jump few lines above and read my explanation again for that.
[
/QUOTE]
I don't see a problem when people who have owned a M1 MBP and M2 MBA saying they are both as solid and well made because they have personal experience and have owned both for a long time.
[/QUOTE]
Time does not make it any more solid. Just try that test to see it yourself.
It does not seem to apply here. I'm not free for having my option here, some of your followers attack me right away, or keep harassing me with "HaHa" reactions constantly, seeing 10 in a row form one person at the time.
Again, I have described you many time test method. Is is not opinion or personal perception, it can be seen clearly.
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I don't have followers.
I have been repeatedly insulted/comments that are argumentative and personal in nature by the same people multiple times.
I am not referring to anyone specifically and have said I respect other people's opinions so I don't see how I could be insulting anyone.
I believe in God but have repeatedly said that my opinion is an opinion and I could never be disrespectful to God thinking I am anywhere even close to God, where others seem to state their opinions as facts which is why I started responding in the first place.
If what I said doesn't make sense about the structural integrity of the M2 MBA then I don't know what else to say. I don't actually work as an engineer for Apple and would think any test I could come up with would be biased and not impartial.
I thought so too.
Really depends what the person was doing on their M2 MBA but for heavy sustained and graphics intensive workloads that would make perfect sense to me because the air was not designed for that.
So MBA M2 is faster than MBP 14" but it is not faster than MBP 14".
Honestly when I've been testing MBA M2 I did not notice it being noticeable faster in anything. Actually often demo models felt laggy due to lot of apps open but I closed them and tried more without seeing the "fastness".
Sure, if your tasks need no more than few seconds bursts but as soon as you start to push it, active cooling comes in handy. I notice huge difference in my MBP 14" compared to my previous MBA M1 and Mini M1, even they should be based in this MBA M2 faster logic being as fast.