TrendForce: 16-Inch MacBook Pro Will Hit Shelves This Fall

[Falhófnir]

Apple has been using 227 PPI on Retina laptops since the 2012 MacBook Pro with Retina Display. It's definitely underwhelming on a laptop now in 2019 though, considering the 12.9" iPad Pro has 264 PPI which gives it more pixels than the current 15" MacBook Pro, and many PC manufacturers have moved on to higher-density 4K displays while Apple is stuck at 227 PPI.

I'd like to see a 4K 16:10 display on the 16", making it a true Retina version of the old 17". Apple's refusal to increase the PPI has made it less tempting to me at any price point.

If the screen is at least 16.4" then I think making the 1920x1200 resolution standard would be ideal, and especially if it used a 4K panel for integer @2x scaling. If it's ~16.0" maybe sticking to 1680x1050 would be better, though it is still a little disappointing they're not making the resolution up to 3360x2100 to restore the integer scaling of the default resolution. It's noticeable when you swap from 1440x900 to 1680x1050 on 15" retina models, not end of the world, but you do lose some of that pixel-perfect clarity.

 

[NT1440]

Well, for starters it's approximately $/£200 more than the current base 15" equipped with 1TB, or the same price as the upgraded stock 15" upped to 1TB.

Then there's the Dell XPS 15, where the lowest 1TB configuration costs £2,149 (i7 and 32GB RAM) or there's an i9 and 32GB model for £2,499, or if you max it out (there is no £2,999 model, it's only £2,899) you get 2TB and i9/32GB.

Razer, as far as I can see, are a bit of a let down and don't offer a 1TB SSD option, but their whole 15" lineup tops out at £3,149 (4K OLED) for that you're getting a computer that will blow this thing out of the water if it's going to be similarly specced to a current 15".

HP's Spectre x360 maxes out at £1,999 and that gets you a 4K/i7-9750H/GTX-1650/16GB/1TB configuration.

So to answer your question, I can pretty much point at the market and show you a $/£2,999 1TB 16" MBP still wouldn't even be particularly great value.

I misread your original post as "I want 1TB to be the base configuration (as in THE standard) at this price point", sorry for the confusion on my end.

 

[Zdigital2015]

If that resolution is right, then it doesn't seem to a Retina type display like everything else is nowadays. I'm fine with that personally, but seems contrary to the recent Apple trend.

Rumored resolution is 3072x1920, with a true Retina (@2x) resolution of 1536x960, which translates to right around 16.4" at 220 DPI, while the current 15.4" is 2880x1800 with a true Retina (@2x) resolution of 1440x900.

While not very impressive to me, an extra 1" might be useful for many people. Again, I was hoping for a revival of the 17" with a 3840x2400, with a true Retina (@2x) of 1920x1200, but Apple must be very resistant to producing a laptop of that size and scale, which would/could be a very narrow market, while the 16.4" might be Apple's attempt at a compromise size for its users.

 

[AppleHaterLover]

Rumored resolution is 3072x1920, with a true Retina (@2x) resolution of 1536x960, which translates to right around 16.4" at 220 DPI, while the current 15.4" is 2880x1800 with a true Retina (@2x) resolution of 1440x900.

While not very impressive to me, an extra 1" might be useful for many people. Again, I was hoping for a revival of the 17" with a 3840x2400, with a true Retina (@2x) of 1920x1200, but Apple must be very resistant to producing a laptop of that size and scale, which would/could be a very narrow market, while the 16.4" might be Apple's attempt at a compromise size for its users.

Before getting my 1st Mac, I had a 15.4 HP and really it was almost the size of an IMAX screen. Not many people want/need a large laptop nowadays.

I'm still betting on Apple simply eliminating whatever's left of the bezels on the Mac and that resulting in the 16" MBP

 

[Zdigital2015]

Before getting my 1st Mac, I had a 15.4 HP and really it was almost the size of an IMAX screen. Not many people want/need a large laptop nowadays.

I'm still betting on Apple simply eliminating whatever's left of the bezels on the Mac and that resulting in the 16" MBP

I had several versions of the 17" model, both PowerBook G4 and MacBook Pro and it was useful to me as a desktop replacement when I had no access to an external monitor. However, lugging the thing around got to be again in the @$$ after a while.

Several users have expressed interest in Apple releasing a 17" MacBook Pro, but most are going to be better served by the 16.4" MacBook Pro and a 4K display or an iPad Pro running Sidecar for those who need a portable onsite solution where a larger external monitor is not available or practical. I can certainly run my 2016 15" MacBook Pro at 1920x1200 (interpolated) and I really don't feel as though I was missing out. It took a bit of adjustment, initially, but after 7 years of no 17" and using a 15" Retina MacBook Pro, I certainly prefer the smaller overall size, weight and thinness of my 2016 and previously, the 2012 and 2015. Again, the butterfly keyboard and the battery life are two of my least favorite things, so here's hoping the rumored 16.4" model improves on both of these counts.

 

[bionic_arm]

I just bought a maxed out 13". Have until the 19th to return it. I will use this to the 19th return it and then hold out for the 16". hopefully it is coming out in September so will only be without a Mac for a month!

 

[code-m]

Before getting my 1st Mac, I had a 15.4 HP and really it was almost the size of an IMAX screen. Not many people want/need a large laptop nowadays.

I'm still betting on Apple simply eliminating whatever's left of the bezels on the Mac and that resulting in the 16" MBP

Sales were through the roof for the previous 17" MBP that Apple discontinued it in favour of the 11" MBA instead. /s

 

[CarlJ]

Apple has been using 227 PPI on Retina laptops since the 2012 MacBook Pro with Retina Display. It's definitely underwhelming on a laptop now in 2019 though, ...

Do you regularly notice individual pixels at 227 PPI at normal viewing distance?

 

[GrumpyCoder]

Do you regularly notice individual pixels at 227 PPI at normal viewing distance?

But... the spec sheet is all that matters...

 

[redheeler]

Do you regularly notice individual pixels at 227 PPI at normal viewing distance?

I do notice the degradation in picture quality running the 15" at 3360x2100 instead of 2880x1800, if that's what you meant to ask. The "individual pixels" argument is irrelevant.

 

[albusseverus]

As I recall, the 15" Retina was marketed as 'the new 17 inch' back in the day. Able to fit an HD image, plus editing controls on screen, at the same time!

My haven't times changed… and screens not?

The sooner the 16" arrives, the less likely it will have a new keyboard and we've all given up on better processors that run cooler and won't be thermally limited. Not much of a gain in my book. I'd rather wait a year and get redesigned 14" and 16" MacBook Pro models and make the price Apple will undoubtedly be charging nearly worthwhile.
[doublepost=1565424221][/doublepost]

Sales were through the roof for the previous 17" MBP that Apple discontinued it in favour of the 11" MBA instead. /s

11" MBA, still one of the great Macs.
Along side the 12.9" MacBook and the 17" 'lunch tray' MacBook Pro, for that matter.

 

[kreasonos]

Now make the 13” a 14” and we're in business

 

[iandk]

Just bought a MBP 15" i9/16GB RAM/ 560X/ 512GB SSD a few weeks ago.
Could still return it and get a 16" later on, would you do it?

 

[HappyIntro]

Just bought a MBP 15" i9/16GB RAM/ 560X/ 512GB SSD a few weeks ago.
Could still return it and get a 16" later on, would you do it?

I'm typing this from my new MBP 15" that I took delivery of on Thursday. I am very intrigued by the rumored 16" laptop, but I'm not considering returning my new laptop. I been reading the rumors of it for some time now, but I still chose to pull the trigger on the current gen MBP. The only way I'd have put off my new MBP purchase is if I knew exactly what the new 16" would be - all specs, prices, keyboard quality, date it can be ordered, etc. Then I could make an informed decision, but now there is not enough information to warrant waiting, for me. If the 16" turns out to be a dream machine (e.g., great new scissor keyboard, physical function keys, beautiful retina screen, user serviceable, reasonable price, etc.) then I will save up my pennies and plan to purchase it when it gets refreshed, likely in 2020, when it might be able to get 10nm intel CPU for even better battery life and cooler operation.

Also, the current gen MBP can be had at a discount if one looks around (Amazon, bhphoto, etc.), making it very likely much less expensive than what the 16" will be priced at for similar performance.

 

[deconstruct60]

...
Sorry---I didn't mean the laptop. I was referring to standalone display, as the comment I responded to mentioned buying a display with the 16 inch and he talked about the LG and how he hoped Apple would make a "less pro" display.

Sorry about that (didn't notice context had shifted away from thread topic that much). After the revised LG 5K came out that was a dead end as for as Apple label solution being an option.

There has been little sign for a decade that Apple wants to be in the monitor market ( only being a monitor). Display docking stations perhaps. The XDR is an even smaller niche that is more move to look relatively thin by standing next to the side show "Fat Lady". ( 'bargain' $6K monitor as alternative to $10+K one. ).

They haven't done more had a product line with more than one display docking station since 2010-2013 ( dropped relatively ancient 30" display in 2010 (which was introduced in 2004 ! Ran the ACD 27" in parallel for while thunderbolt rolled out. ). When Mac Pro 2013 launched without a "matching" Apple container for the 4K screen that was another long term indicator. Most indicators are that Apple doesn't like the commodity product aspects of the most of the monitor market. Pricing falling yearly, low barriers to entry , etc. Lots more work and less reward than they want to pursue. The XDR is high margin and probably won't touch it for 4-5 years on updates or pricing.

I doubt the backlight would "trickle down' to the iMac Pro either. That panel with a "normal" iMac 5K backlight might ( pressure for more internal volume in iMac Pro and/or bigger market segmentation gap from future 10, or more, core iMacs 27" models. ) . The CPU package for "higher than average" cores is probably going to grow over the next several years. Heat is probably going up too (if staying out of the future mainstream performance zone). So needed bigger iMac anyway so bigger screen is synergy. The iMac Pro also has enough other internals to keep the price relatively constant ( not commodity pricing pressure).


Laptops more a tickle 'up' . Watch -> Phone -> Laptops on screen tech.

 

[code-m]

As I recall, the 15" Retina was marketed as 'the new 17 inch' back in the day. Able to fit an HD image, plus editing controls on screen, at the same time!

My haven't times changed… and screens not?

The sooner the 16" arrives, the less likely it will have a new keyboard and we've all given up on better processors that run cooler and won't be thermally limited. Not much of a gain in my book. I'd rather wait a year and get redesigned 14" and 16" MacBook Pro models and make the price Apple will undoubtedly be charging nearly worthwhile.
[doublepost=1565424221][/doublepost]

11" MBA, still one of the great Macs.
Along side the 12.9" MacBook and the 17" 'lunch tray' MacBook Pro, for that matter.

Yep, higher resolution is not replacement for physical space. If this was the case Apple should sell a 8K resolution in the size of an 11” display and market it as we have a 30” display equivalent.

I do miss that 11” MBA, the only thing lacking was a retina IPS display.

 

[Glockworkorange]

Sorry about that (didn't notice context had shifted away from thread topic that much). After the revised LG 5K came out that was a dead end as for as Apple label solution being an option.

There has been little sign for a decade that Apple wants to be in the monitor market ( only being a monitor). Display docking stations perhaps. The XDR is an even smaller niche that is more move to look relatively thin by standing next to the side show "Fat Lady". ( 'bargain' $6K monitor as alternative to $10+K one. ).

They haven't done more had a product line with more than one display docking station since 2010-2013 ( dropped relatively ancient 30" display in 2010 (which was introduced in 2004 ! Ran the ACD 27" in parallel for while thunderbolt rolled out. ). When Mac Pro 2013 launched without a "matching" Apple container for the 4K screen that was another long term indicator. Most indicators are that Apple doesn't like the commodity product aspects of the most of the monitor market. Pricing falling yearly, low barriers to entry , etc. Lots more work and less reward than they want to pursue. The XDR is high margin and probably won't touch it for 4-5 years on updates or pricing.

I doubt the backlight would "trickle down' to the iMac Pro either. That panel with a "normal" iMac 5K backlight might ( pressure for more internal volume in iMac Pro and/or bigger market segmentation gap from future 10, or more, core iMacs 27" models. ) . The CPU package for "higher than average" cores is probably going to grow over the next several years. Heat is probably going up too (if staying out of the future mainstream performance zone). So needed bigger iMac anyway so bigger screen is synergy. The iMac Pro also has enough other internals to keep the price relatively constant ( not commodity pricing pressure).


Laptops more a tickle 'up' . Watch -> Phone -> Laptops on screen tech.

You made me cry a little, but I think you're right. I am in the market for a new monitor and will probably go with the updated 4K. I sort of considered the XDR and then came to my senses and also don't feel like getting divorced once my wife saw it!

 

[ajfahey]

I’m expecting overpriced SSD soldered to the motherboard, no butterfly keyboard, same performance as 15”. No physical function keys.

Pretty much a slightly bigger screen, different keyboard, higher price, that’s it.

Next generation processors aren’t available yet so you’re likely right. The extra space would be ideally suited for longer battery life.

 

[LuciusWrong]

How is that getting more clear? It will have up to a 8-core CPU. Are you saying it won't have a GPU?

I hope they have heavily modified the scissor switch keyboard and won't return to the 2015 wibbly-wobbly piece of cr&% of a keyboard. The butterfly is the best keyboard when it comes it typing, still disappointed they never released an external version. Would have replaced all my mechanical keyboards with it. Touchbar is a must, saves so much time. Problem is, there's no external version. 4x USB-C is fine. Hope it won't be bigger/thicker. All they really have to do is improve the screen/bezels and modify the cooling a little. But I'm afraid they have done more (and screwed it up).

As for price, 6 or 8 core machine, 32GB, 1TB drive and decent GPU for $4k to $4.5k is totally fine.

The term "Pro" is overrated. What is a pro? I've just ordered a $125k Dell box (20c/40t Xeon, 384GB RAM, 4x Nvidia V100 SMX2 with 32GB each) to do some basic computation, for more I use cloud services, because it's too expensive to buy. A laptop will never have enough processing power for heavy workloads, so one could argue if any mobile device can be pro. Then again, a person answering emails all day long can be a pro.

What makes macbooks expensive?

The display is top of the list. It is the thing overlooked by everyone who complains macbooks are too expensive.

So.....this is the tricky part....if apple wants to make a cheaper macbook, they can, i dont know, use a cheaper display?

They can literally leave everything else the same, aside from the display, and the machine can sell for hundreds less. (I know, this is complicated stuff. Sorry 'bout that.)

And it makes sense from a product standpoint to have the "macbook" vs "macbook pro" choice in two sizes. They used to have a regular macbook that had a 15" screen, so why would anyone be surprised by them bringing it back?

Also, we dont actually know that it has an aluminum chassis. I kinf of expect it will, but it is also possible that they will switch that up as well. Eventually they will have to "innovate"...

 

[cmaier]

What makes macbooks expensive?

The display is top of the list. It is the thing overlooked by everyone who complains macbooks are too expensive.

So.....this is the tricky part....if apple wants to make a cheaper macbook, they can, i dont know, use a cheaper display?

They can literally leave everything else the same, aside from the display, and the machine can sell for hundreds less. (I know, this is complicated stuff. Sorry 'bout that.)

And it makes sense from a product standpoint to have the "macbook" vs "macbook pro" choice in two sizes. They used to have a regular macbook that had a 15" screen, so why would anyone be surprised by them bringing it back?

Also, we dont actually know that it has an aluminum chassis. I kinf of expect it will, but it is also possible that they will switch that up as well. Eventually they will have to "innovate"...

When did they have a non-pro 15” MacBook?

 

[LuciusWrong]

When did they have a non-pro 15” MacBook?

Maybe I remembered wrong...it was probably the old 13.3"....it wasn't mine. It was my girlfriends. I remembered it as being about the same physical size as my current 15", but that was 10 years ago... It was white and plastic-y

Anyway, I still think they would do well to make two sizes of "macbook".

 

[kp98077]

Just bought a MBP 15" i9/16GB RAM/ 560X/ 512GB SSD a few weeks ago.
Could still return it and get a 16" later on, would you do it?

yes I would return it, and in same boat, and will return mine as much as I love my 15! I just hope the wait is not THAT long....

 

[Zen_Arcade]

Maybe I remembered wrong...it was probably the old 13.3"....it wasn't mine. It was my girlfriends. I remembered it as being about the same physical size as my current 15", but that was 10 years ago... It was white and plastic-y

Anyway, I still think they would do well to make two sizes of "macbook".

That sounds like the 13" polycarbonate Macbook. Apple did make a white iBook in a 14" size; it was discontinued around the time Apple switched to Intel.

 

[limo79]

This fall I would like to see refreshed MBP 13" with 10nm 4-core i5 Ice Lake U processor (with new integrated Wi-Fi card AX) and finally new scissor mechanism keyboard.

In case of OLED screens be careful what you wish for... because OLED panels have significant current draw (much shorter battery life) and I believe this is one of reason why Apple does not want to offer it now. Also according to external tests OLED delta color errors are much higher (see Dell 7590 tests) so percentage of screens that can fulfill Apple hardware requirements is much lower so overall unit cost is much higher than in competitor products (Dell or Lenovo does not worry about delta color errors, brightness uniformity/ light leakage etc. which is visible in almost every test where panel is focused only on brightness and maybe contrast ratio).

 

[Itfdb]

Here’s to hoping for a 10-key!