Yeah the second amendment is the problem, smh. If there were no guns, there would be more knives. You seem to think that guns are the reason for hate in this world. My guns stay in my gun safe and guess what? They have never shot anyone from in there. Sorry the us is not full of sissies who are scared of metal and lead.
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U.S. Could Expand Tablet and Laptop Ban to All International Flights
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That has been for ages the usual procedure for electronics in Europe. It is not a ban.
This is a perfeft example of security theatre once again installed by the Trump Administration. All it's meant to do is make Americans feel like they're safer but in reality it does nothing to prevent attacks. Just like the Muslim ban.
Now, frankly, that is a rather silly assertion.
And why the need for that last dismissive sentence? Can you not argue the point in a post without the need to add insult? Those who dislike the idea of societies armed to the teeth dislike armed societies that fetishise guns and the right to bear them; that does not - in any way - make them "sissies".
Firstly, I do not think that guns are the reason for hate in this world, and if I thought that, I would have written it as I am quite capable of articulating my thoughts on paper.
However, - but this is a separate debate - I will say that I am of the opinion that religion - in all its forms - causes far more than its fair share of hate in the world.
Re guns, my comment was more an observation on what seems to be a growing atmosphere of fear and paranoia that increasingly governs the tone of much discourse that emanates from the US.
I come from a country where the police do not carry arms, let alone the population.
Needless to say, I do not deny that we face challenges, but I do not wish to live in a world governed by fearful attitudes and dictated to by paranoia.
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There has been some dreadful trigger happiness during an extremely serious situation.
Fair question, and one that I think has not been sufficiently justified by the relevant government departments. If you wish to ban something, you must make an argument for it - and the argument - 'a possible bomb' is insufficient to my mind.
In any case, I don't think a complete ban is the answer.
For my part, firstly, I would be most uneasy about stashing my MBA into my hold luggage - not only could it run the risk of theft, I would not trust law enforcement officials in the US not to seek to access it.
This would most certainly have an influence on any decision I might make on whether (or not) to use US airlines, or even visit the US for official purposes.
Except lithium ion battery fires have brought down planes before. See UPS Flight 6 and they were also a possible culprit on Asiana Flight 991. Cargo fires are no joke, and have been the cause of many fatal crashes over the years. There has never been a case where a bomb hidden inside a laptop was detonated. But cargo hold fires have brought down many planes, and more specifically, batteries brought down one, possibly two 747s. Forcing people to put laptops and tablets in checked luggage will do more to make flying more dangerous than anything ISIS could ever pull off.
And maybe that's ISIS's end game. Scare people enough to cause plane crashes without ever setting foot in an airport. Because there's going to be another Dell, there's going to be another HP, there's going to be another Note 7, but this time, the devices will be in the cargo hold where no one will know there's a fire until it's too late.
This thread isn't about gun ownership. Since 9/11 how many US airline terrorist acts involved firearms? None, afaik. Even the 9/11 hijackers used box cutters. The only gun-on-plane incident I know of was this idiot who left her service weapon in the bathroom by accident.
At this point someone could run with this as a platform issue in 2020. "Bring tourism dollars back to America by removing restrictive security theatre."
This has already been the situation in Europe for years; you are required to remove your laptop and any tablets you have from a briefcase or rucksack and put them through the scanner separately. This is not a ban, merely a security precaution.
Exactly.
How is this related? And FYI that document has helped create the greatest most powerful country ever. That 2nd amendment is just as important as the other 9. If you don't like it tough.
No, I "don't like it", but, I would argue that the reasons I don't like it are more important than the simple fact of my dislike.
Now, as it happens, I really do not wish to derail this thread - there are more than enough Second Amendment threads as it is - and we can take this discussion elsewhere - but two thoughts occur.
The first is that this feeds into a persistent environment of fear that seems prevalent in parts of US political and social culture.
And the second - which I truly do not understand - is the inability of some of the second amendment supporters to conduct a discussion or debate in a civil manner.
Dismissive or insulting replies do not serve to persuade many outside of you country of the arguments that might support your position, or benefits - or advantages - (if any) to having this amendment; quite the contrary, in fact.
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Everything that's happened in airplane security since 9/11 is paranoia. The only thing that they've done since 9/11 that would have possibly prevented it is reinforcing and locking the cabin doors but really it's that passengers would now fight back against hijackers since they're going to assume the plane is going to crash into buildings. Stopping a lone suicide psycho from blowing up a plane... I guess it's a risk of living in the world where it happens at a concert or subway or bus or Olympics or mall, there are lots of nut jobs from all religions... and the solution for all this extremism is to end poverty and hunger worldwide.
If they have reason to believe explosives can bed built into an iPad, there should be a simple method to test their presence.
To be fair, a terrorist can do as much damage at the security checkpoint as on a plane. He could bring down an entire, busy, airport, and create far more casualties. So maybe airports should move security to another building and transport cleared luggage and passengers to the terminal building after security.
To be fair, a terrorist can do as much damage at the security checkpoint as on a plane. He could bring down an entire, busy, airport, and create far more casualties. So maybe airports should move security to another building and transport cleared luggage and passengers to the terminal building after security.
If they ban laptops then they better get rid of the TSA as well. I will only fly if I can get the airport 30 minutes before my flight and make it. Otherwise what do they expect people to do these days when there is a delay and we need to get work done?
They want you to shop.
No joke. I have a family member in this line of work, and airports are all being redesigned to be mini-malls. You are a captive audience with nothing to do, so you'll fill the time by spending money. And this helps offset airport costs, which traditional levies no longer cover adequately.
If there is a real risk here then I can understand and support a ban, but it will have a serious impact on business travel. Many private individuals will be hesitant to put their personal laptop into checked baggage but doing so for business is far more serious. Most tech companies that I have worked for would flat out refuse to do this for data security reasons; no company would want their classified information to leave the employee's possession. These companies will need to find another way to get classified information to the destination. Personally it is not that big of a deal to me but my employer would never allow it; fortunately I have no need to travel for business.
That is always the case for any electronic device for at least the last 5 years i remember
i think its a bit of a vicious circle like if any maniac can get a gun without a proper background check than you may get paranoid and assume every one may carry one so you get one yourself. Over here i just do not expect someone to carry, it never even crossed my mind. I think the mindset of americans is a whole lot different based on their history or up bringing. E. G. BUT SOMEONE COULD BREAK INTO YOUR HOUSE AND KILL YOU while i am more like MEH WHAT R THE CHANCES OF THIS HAPPENING AND EVEN IF IT DOES I WOULD BE DEAD BEFORE EVEN GETTING TO MY GUN
Either way that is getting a bit OT
also first rule "do not talk with americans about politics, guns or health care"
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Agreed. They could even ask ppl passing through security to have their tablets turned on. There is no way anybody can squeeze a bomb into one and keep it operational. This might create some delays in screening but it should be manageable.
Isn't this already required? I'm pretty sure those signs at security say that all your devices must be able to power on. Though, admittedly, it's been a while since I've actually read them. I spend most of my time eye rolling at people holding up the line.
From the onset, this ban has seemed to be to just be a blatant admission that the TSA can't do the job they're supposed to be doing. It says, "we can't do the job we said we've been doing this entire time, so now we're just going to tell you to stop flying with your things."
And why, if information is being shared, does the ban only apply to USA and some UK flights.
I shall certainly not be travelling.
BTW lithium batteries are different from lithium ion.
I shall certainly not be travelling.
BTW lithium batteries are different from lithium ion.
I think this line of thinking is pure BS. I was in Washington DC on 9/11 for business and when I was finally able to fly home they broke the file off of my nail clippers. Really, they just wanted to protect everyone, I don't think so.
What the TSA wants is to escape blame when something happens, regardless of how much they inconvenience travelers. The risk of getting in a car accident has to be 100's if not 1000s of times larger than a terrorist attack in the US, but you don't see anyone trying to ban cars.
Government fear mongering is at an all time high. Its time we forced the governments of the world to make life worse for terrorists rather than making life worse for travelers. See it is easier to attack travelers than terrorists and that is what the government does. Getting on a plane involves risk, does not matter if that risk is from a malfunction or a bomb, your still dead. The government has plenty of tools to use to identify and stop terrorists, they just need to use them and we travelers need to understand that the government is not perfect, the world is not perfect, we are not perfect.
You have got this completely in reverse. The chances of a lithium battery catching fire in the cargo hull is extremely high especially since it is not pressurized. This is the reason you are asked to not checkin your battery backups. In most countries this is checked.
I don't remember about those signs but what I am suggesting would go further than that. Make people take their tablets out of their bags, turn them on and put them in separate bins when they go through security. This shouldn't slow down the screening process much and as I said, I can't imagine anybody being able to squeeze a bomb inside a tablet so that the tablet remains functional.