U.S. Could Expand Tablet and Laptop Ban to All International Flights

[Shirasaki]

The clear problem is people, ban those on flights and we are safe.

Time for some smartarse getting explosices into material, we can fly nude without bringing anything on board.

Terrorists can implant bombs into human body, albeit small and less destructive.
So we should ban people onto flight. Oh? Then we have no need to fly at all.

It already started. I just flew from Florida to NY about a week ago and the TSA made everyone take out iPads from their luggage and put them through the scanner separately.

As pointed out by many, this has been a common practice in countries around the world for a long time.

 

[sorcery]

Aircraft cargo bays are pressurised, thus your pets arrive alive.

 

[Spink10]

Everything that's happened in airplane security since 9/11 is paranoia. The only thing that they've done since 9/11 that would have possibly prevented it is reinforcing and locking the cabin doors but really it's that passengers would now fight back against hijackers since they're going to assume the plane is going to crash into buildings. Stopping a lone suicide psycho from blowing up a plane... I guess it's a risk of living in the world where it happens at a concert or subway or bus or Olympics or mall, there are lots of nut jobs from all religions... and the solution for all this extremism is to end poverty and hunger worldwide.

Please tell me the last line was sarcasm. I'm 99% convinced it was sarcasm. Little worried if not.

 

[truthertech]

Who is going to pay for stolen or broken gadgets and didnt they say that those devices should be in a carry on because of the danger of batteries malfunctioning in the storage in the past?

USA is getting less and less attractive to travel to as a tourist tbh
i am already avoiding the US as a stop over since you guys have no transit zone and it is such a hassle to get through TSA. No thank you

Yet, the National Tourism Office is predicting a record number of tourists to the USA this year with almost 80 million people and a steady rise to 94 million over the next five years. I guess the vast majority of people haven't been deterred from fulfilling their dream to come to America. We love to show our beautiful country to visitors, even those who love to take shots at us. No hard feelings, we get it, it's the dark side of envy. The New York Yankees baseball franchise experiences the same phenomenon. Speaking of the Yankees, your comment reminds me of the famous Yogi Berra quote about a popular NY restaurant, "Nobody goes there anymore, it's too crowded."

 

[likegadgets]

Assuming safety is required, why not offer an add on optional service at cost:

If you want you laptop / iPad with you on the cabin

1) Arrive at the Airport an hour earlier than what is required
2) place it in a special box that will be individually checked & scrutinized (x-rays / dog sniffing / residue test)
3) will be delivered to you in that box at boarding - like duty free in some airports

Logistical issues - so a fee to cover add on cost required. May even be another small profit center for airlines and airports. The fee may be high - but worth it for many business passengers on a long haul flight.

If the fee is high and not convenient - check it. If it is worth it to you, pay it.

Again, this is assuming there is a ban, so the extra fee is to cover the extra logistic expense of securing that risk and offering convenience for those willing to pay. Not that different from airports that offer fast pass VIP services to avoid lines.

 

[truthertech]

Please tell me the last line was sarcasm. I'm 99% convinced it was sarcasm. Little worried if not.

It wasn't. It is the product of educational systems that no longer stress critical thinking and reading, and instead focus on the opposite: indoctrination of political viewpoints. We have to hope that people occasionally get hit upside the head with facts that give wake them up and give them cause to get informed, e.g., Bin Laden and the many Saudi terrorists come from an extraordinarily wealthy country and are themselves often extremely wealthy, thus there may be something other than poverty and hunger at work here. Or one might give pause as to the connection between gunning down schoolchildren on a bus in one's own neighborhood because these children were being driven to a school for a religion different than the shooters, and hunger and poverty. We can only hope.

 

[ejfontenot]

Even if allowed, I'd think twice before bringing my iPhone let alone my MBP through TSA.

I have nothing to hide, but going through and forcing you to unlock your personal devices without reason or a warrant, is wrong.

TSA has no right to force this upon you as it violates due process. BUT, CBP can. As you have not crossed the border into US soil until you clear customs, the right to due process is a murky one. Especially to non-citizens.

I have not seen reports of TSA asking for this information.

 

[garirry]

The U.S. Department of Homeland Security is considering expanding its carry-on restrictions for electronic devices to include flights departing from the United States, according to CNN.

In March, restrictions were announced that prevented U.S.-bound passengers from eight Middle Eastern countries from carrying certain electronic devices in the passenger cabin. The TSA order, which does not have a stated end date, covers laptops, tablets, e-readers, cameras, portable DVD players, and handheld gaming devices larger than a smartphone.

However, those restrictions could also soon include flights departing from the United States, according to Homeland Security Secretary John Kelly, who spoke briefly to reporters on Friday.
As with the original ban, the U.S. officials declined to comment on any new or specific threats, but implied that the decision had been made on evaluated intelligence.

The original ban applies to Jordan, Qatar, Kuwait, Morocco, United Arab Emirates, Saudi Arabia, and Turkey. The nine airlines impacted by that order are Royal Jordanian, EgyptAir, Turkish Airlines, Saudia, Kuwait Airways, Royal Air Maroc, Qatar Airways, Emirates and Ethiad Airways. The United Kingdom issued a similar ban covering flights from six countries shortly after the U.S. announcement.

Last week, Politico reported that U.S. airlines are making preparations for an "imminent" expansion of the ban to Europe and possibly other regions.

Note: Due to the political nature of the discussion regarding this topic, the discussion thread is located in our Politics, Religion, Social Issues forum. All forum members and site visitors are welcome to read and follow the thread, but posting is limited to forum members with at least 100 posts.

Article Link: U.S. Could Expand Tablet and Laptop Ban to All International Flights

Well I'm glad as hell I don't have to live in the US!

 

[satchmo]

TSA has no right to force this upon you as it violates due process. BUT, CBP can. As you have not crossed the border into US soil until you clear customs, the right to due process is a murky one. Especially to non-citizens.

I have not seen reports of TSA asking for this information.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/14/business/border-enforcement-airport-phones.html

 

[MadeTheSwitch]

To be fair, a terrorist can do as much damage at the security checkpoint as on a plane. He could bring down an entire, busy, airport, and create far more casualties. So maybe airports should move security to another building and transport cleared luggage and passengers to the terminal building after security.

This is what Disneyland has now done. They moved their main checkpoint to the parking area and created additional new checkpoints around their shopping mall which was strangely outside any checkpoints all this time. I think that's smart.

As for airplanes, if they think they have violent passengers now, just wait until they take away all the things that keep them occupied. This will not turn out well.

 

[justperry]

The original ban applies to Jordan, Qatar, Kuwait, Morocco, United Arab Emirates, Saudi Arabia, and Turkey. The nine airlines impacted by that order are Royal Jordanian, EgyptAir, Turkish Airlines, Saudia, Kuwait Airways, Royal Air Maroc, Qatar Airways, Emirates and Ethiad Airways. The United Kingdom issued a similar ban covering flights from six countries shortly after the U.S. announcement.

It's Etihad Airways!

7 ½ hours in and nobody saw this error?

 

[cube]

It's Etihad Airways!

7 ½ hours in and nobody saw this error?

I did not read the article. This is old news.

 

[michaelsviews]

Instill fear in the people and anything the government says they will follow. People have got to wake up.

 

[wschutz]

There was also "rumors" about the ban expanding to flights coming in from Europe and that didn't happen as well. However, at the rate we're going, the U.S. is quickly becoming the land of the fear and the home of the paranoid.

There were not rumours. The proposal was on. the table and the EU discussed the matter with the US, and said no (and probably that included some counter-measures toward the US should the ban apply to the EU).

I guess the US is considering instead an all-in counteries ban instead to avoid pointing fingers and pretending to protect what can't be protected (because a proper ban would be to prohibit such devices in all flights, not just some from certain countries as if all airports within the US have means to detect such threat).

This will just make the US less attractive for tourism (thanks to Trump it is not that attractive anymore for work) so... one more I guess that it doesn't matter. And then Trump will be able to sell to his electorate that he is 'protecting' the country... by isolating it from the world... great idea, indeed.

 

[smallcoffee]

Except lithium ion battery fires have brought down planes before. See UPS Flight 6 and they were also a possible culprit on Asiana Flight 991. Cargo fires are no joke, and have been the cause of many fatal crashes over the years. There has never been a case where a bomb hidden inside a laptop was detonated. But cargo hold fires have brought down many planes, and more specifically, batteries brought down one, possibly two 747s. Forcing people to put laptops and tablets in checked luggage will do more to make flying more dangerous than anything ISIS could ever pull off.

And maybe that's ISIS's end game. Scare people enough to cause plane crashes without ever setting foot in an airport. Because there's going to be another Dell, there's going to be another HP, there's going to be another Note 7, but this time, the devices will be in the cargo hold where no one will know there's a fire until it's too late.

You're just proving my point that it is extremely rare. Now, I'm not in favor of a laptop ban, so keep that in mind, but considering the magnitude of the annoyance of what would happen if laptops were banned, don't you think that there might be some possible justification for it? Let's say you don't ban them and that ISIS or somebody found a way to spoof a laptop and turn it into a bomb, what happens if that brings down an airliner? Do you look back and say well, ya know, DHS took the risk and we'll just call it a day? I think its important for us to all collectively not freak out and wait to see what happens. I really don't think the DHS wants to ban laptops for funsies, and even if they did, why wait until now?
[doublepost=1496088306][/doublepost]

You have got this completely in reverse. The chances of a lithium battery catching fire in the cargo hull is extremely high especially since it is not pressurized. This is the reason you are asked to not checkin your battery backups. In most countries this is checked.

And you suggest it is extremely high based on what?

 

[AsherN]

You can probably stuff more explosives up your arse than in a laptop. And detonate that on the plane.

 

[dampfnudel]

It's going to be a major hassle for passengers and airlines to say the least if the total international laptop/tablet/e-reader/DSLR cabin ban becomes reality this summer. However, a plane being blown up by one of these devices would be a lot more than a hassle.

 

[Plutonius]

If it's a credible and serious threat, laptops and tablets should be banned from flights where we have a low confidence that the threats will be detected. If that's all international flights or even domestic flights, they should do it.

 

[Sefstah]

Here in the United States of America, we believe everyone is equal. Except if you're coming from a Middle Eastern county with an electric device. Then no, you're not allowed in. Happy Memorial Day!

 

[LovingTeddy]

Yeah the second amendment is the problem, smh. If there were no guns, there would be more knives. You seem to think that guns are the reason for hate in this world. My guns stay in my gun safe and guess what? They have never shot anyone from in there. Sorry the us is not full of sissies who are scared of metal and lead.

Yea... Like you can really cause damage with knife like mess gun shooting. Gun is problem, there is no question about it. Lesser the gun, more safer.

I can't understand the logic behind arm everyone with gun and all sudden world will be safe place. That is not how thing works

 

[2010mini]

What if a lithium battery catches fire in the luggage hold? Ban laptops altogether? Why not just ban commercial flight except for Air Force One and the other official flights?

I work for a major freight forwarder. Everything from batteries to infectious disease samples gets loaded on passenger planes every day without your knowledge. In fact the airlines will gladly bump you to take cargo.

And when I worked at a major international airport.... I was able to exit and return to "secure areas" with no one checking me or my co-workers. Security at airports are largely just theatre.... there to give you the sense of security.

 

[Duane Martin]

Sorry the us is not full of sissies who are scared of metal and lead.

Given the level of gun violence in the US compared to almost all other countries you should be.

 

[itsamacthing]

I think this line of thinking is pure BS. I was in Washington DC on 9/11 for business and when I was finally able to fly home they broke the file off of my nail clippers. Really, they just wanted to protect everyone, I don't think so.
What the TSA wants is to escape blame when something happens, regardless of how much they inconvenience travelers. The risk of getting in a car accident has to be 100's if not 1000s of times larger than a terrorist attack in the US, but you don't see anyone trying to ban cars.

Government fear mongering is at an all time high. Its time we forced the governments of the world to make life worse for terrorists rather than making life worse for travelers. See it is easier to attack travelers than terrorists and that is what the government does. Getting on a plane involves risk, does not matter if that risk is from a malfunction or a bomb, your still dead. The government has plenty of tools to use to identify and stop terrorists, they just need to use them and we travelers need to understand that the government is not perfect, the world is not perfect, we are not perfect.

If I had my nail clippers broken by TSA on 9/11, then clearly I would be an expert on the subject as well... and the logical comparison of being a victim of terrorism to the dangers of cars, flawless. OH, and then the government fear mongering lines... lucky for us, you are not in charge but then again, maybe your guy is.
[doublepost=1496103378][/doublepost]

I don't remember about those signs but what I am suggesting would go further than that. Make people take their tablets out of their bags, turn them on and put them in separate bins when they go through security. This shouldn't slow down the screening process much and as I said, I can't imagine anybody being able to squeeze a bomb inside a tablet so that the tablet remains functional.

That is exactly what the terrorist are trying to do, put a bomb in and leave the device working... I travel far too often, I say leave all that crap at home and rent iPads on the road. New business at the airports, hotels, etc.. iPad Rental

 

[M2M]

I could understand banning laptops, but tablets? Manufacturers can barely put a decent battery in one and people are worried about a bomb? Even if you can fit a bomb, how much damage would it really do. Tablets are very thin.

That ! Plus why are laptop scanned at security check individually ?
Plus how is putting laptops into luggage a plus for security ? A modified laptop with a timer in checked in luggage is a bigger risk I expect !
[doublepost=1496105025][/doublepost]

It already started. I just flew from Florida to NY about a week ago and the TSA made everyone take out iPads from their luggage and put them through the scanner separately.

This has been common practice in all flights I took ever between Europe and Asia since 9/11. I find this annoying but more reasonable the putting laptops into check-in luggage. At least when put into a scanner separately, the chances are higher a modified device is detected. I presume a modified device (with a timer) inside a luggage is more difficult in being detected. So this would actually lower security.

 

[pika2000]

USA is getting less and less attractive to travel to as a tourist tbh
i am already avoiding the US as a stop over since you guys have no transit zone and it is such a hassle to get through TSA. No thank you

Actuaklt this is what baffles me. Plenty of people criticizing the US since forever, yet everybody wants to go there. I don't get it. One person like you might avoid the US, but there are a dozen more trying to enter the country.