UK Antitrust Watchdog to Investigate Apple's App Store Policies [Updated]

[Suckfest 9001]

Umm, no one forgot that's how the Mac works. They just understand that Apple decided a mobile device needed to be much more secure and stable... And having had years and years of experience with security, stability, and compatibility issues on the Mac, one way to deal with it was to restrict 3rd party development.

People need to stop comparing the Mac with iOS - these are two completely platforms with completely different backgrounds. The Mac came from an era where you wanted a completely open development environment to encourage developers to write software for your hardware. iOS was born from a device in which stability and security was of utmost importance... in fact, there weren't any 3rd party apps when it was released.

Nah if it works for Mac it can work for iPhone. Don’t agree with the current system just because that’s the way apple happened to set it up. You vote with your wallet but you’re also entitled to an opinion

 

[sashavegas]

Hackers are finding ways to hide inside Apple’s walled garden

The iPhone’s locked-down approach to security is spreading, but advanced hackers have found that higher barriers are great for avoiding capture.

www.technologyreview.com

 

[iPadified]

So much for the UK shedding it’s overreaching regulatory EU Mind Manipulation post Brexit.

Just because UK have left does not mean that UK must have completely opposite opinion to EU. I bet they are 99% in agreement about trade and legislation. The liberal agenda of EU including market economy principles was driven to large extent by UK so for me it is logical the UK also reacts.

I find is strange the US and Chinese people does not question the market practice of their companies. Yes, I clump US and China together because the countries both seem to accept either private or state monopolies. Monopolies are evil and kills market economy as fast as a communistic 5-year plan.

 

[gregmancuso]

How could you possibly know this

He couldn't. The vast majority of apps that use IAP are free to download - so no "plenty of money."

Those apps that actually are paid apps with IAP are generally productivity type apps that have "standard" features and IAP to unlock "pro" features.

 

[iPadified]

This is exactly the point. A market is generally not defined as a single manufacturer. The market would be more correctly be categorized not as "Apple mobile phone" but rather "mobile phone." Unless, of course Android (collective of all manufacturers and custom branches) cease operation and Apple is the only mobile phone manufacturer left. At that point, the market would rightly be called "Apple mobile phone" and this complaint would make more sense.

This is not an argument for or against the merits of alternate app stores on Apple devices, but rather simply a question about what market we should be talking about.

A common mobile market works as as long as apps bought in on platform (Apple) can be used in another (Google). They can´t so you should treat each platform as an individual market. Platform as in iOS and Android. Under each platform there should be many market places.

 

[jimbobb24]

I can see apples walled garden is going to end. There are so many more deserving targets - We have google search being messed with, algorithm of YouTube and Facebook designed to influence opinion, and so many other companies causing societies problem. Sad to see Apple situation might be undone soon because I really like it.

 

[lolOwO]

I can see apples walled garden is going to end. There are so many more deserving targets - We have google search being messed with, algorithm of YouTube and Facebook designed to influence opinion, and so many other companies causing societies problem. Sad to see Apple situation might be undone soon because I really like it.

nah, apple will be fine. theyre not doing anything illegal or immoral in this regard

 

[Stevez67]

Nah if it works for Mac it can work for iPhone. Don’t agree with the current system just because that’s the way apple happened to set it up. You vote with your wallet but you’re also entitled to an opinion

It's not a matter of "if it works for Mac it can work for iPhone." There's just no reason for forcing it to work the same just because it can. It's a fabricated argument based on false equivalency.

 

[Suckfest 9001]

It's not a matter of "if it works for Mac it can work for iPhone." There's just no reason for forcing it to work the same just because it can. It's a fabricated argument based on false equivalency.

Nobody’s arguing for it to work the same “just because it can” we want fair cuts and we want ability to choose app stores or the ability to download/buy apps without needing one. Maybe they can offer a choice where people can stay in the current stream of things and then offer a power user option for people that want something beyond fisher price icons and being handed things on a platter

 

[cupcakes2000]

Nobody’s arguing for it to work the same “just because it can” we want fair cuts and we want ability to choose app stores or the ability to download/buy apps without needing one. Maybe they can offer a choice where people can stay in the current stream of things and then offer a power user option for people that want something beyond fisher price icons and being handed things on a platter

But yet you can have ALL of that with every other phone OS and manufacturer. So buy those. Why try mess with apples model? It’s well liked by way more people than the vocal minority on MR.
I just don’t get this argument. It can’t be cos you like Apple products, because you argue to change the whole differentiator between them and others.
So what is it? It can only be You want a slice of the pie they created without playing by their rules?

 

[Suckfest 9001]

But yet you can have ALL of that with every other phone OS and manufacturer. So buy those. Why try mess with apples model? It’s well liked by way more people than the vocal minority on MR.
I just don’t get this argument. It can’t be cos you like Apple products, because you argue to change the whole differentiator between them and others.
So what is it? It can only be You want a slice of the pie they created without playing by their rules?

Lol no there’s more to the switch than just these issues. I choose to voice an opinion instead of wiping my chin every time apple does something. If others wanna run off to an entirely different platform with its own suite of issues feel free.

This “if you don’t like these details about the product you spent thousands on then just throw away the entire ecosystem and buy something else” argument doesn’t get any stronger with time

 

[cupcakes2000]

Lol no there’s more to the switch than just these issues. I choose to voice an opinion instead of wiping my chin every time apple does something. If others wanna run off to an entirely different platform with its own suite of issues feel free.

This “if you don’t like these details about the product you spent thousands on then just throw away the entire ecosystem and buy something else” argument doesn’t get any stronger with time

You know already, buying in to Apples platforms, what you get and what the deal is, be you a consumer or a dev or both. You know you have a choice as to whether you go with Apple or another. Yet the whining continues incessantly. It just sound spoilt and entitled to be honest, but have away - you’re allowed to voice your opinions.

 

[Suckfest 9001]

You know already, buying in to Apples platforms, what you get and what the deal is, be you a consumer or a dev or both. You know you have a choice as to whether you go with Apple or another. Yet the whining continues incessantly. It just sound spoilt and entitled to be honest, but have away - you’re allowed to voice your opinions.

This is insulting language and you should know better assuming you’re 21 years of age. No thank you I will continue to be “spoilt” and “whine incessantly” because that’s the only way change ever happens. And apparently a bunch of regulatory bodies agree with me on this, but maybe you should write to them to also stop “whining incessantly” and being “spoilt” and “entitled”. 🙄

 

[cupcakes2000]

This is insulting language and you should know better assuming you’re 21 years of age. No thank you I will continue to be “spoilt” and “whine incessantly” because that’s the only way change ever happens. And apparently a bunch of regulatory bodies agree with me on this, but maybe you should write to them to also stop “whining incessantly” and being “spoilt” and “entitled”. 🙄

Buying a product that *you know* doesn’t do what you want it to, then complaining about it everywhere possible is exactly a spoilt and entitled thing to do. This forum is full of it.

Thing is, if the shoe was on the other foot and it was your legitimate business and all and sundry were sticking their noses into it and trying to dictate how you sold your unique product and brand, I’ll bet you would have a different tune.

I get what you mean- I like tinkering, I love open platforms. I self host a bunch of stuff from my home servers and I can’t get enough.
But iPhones are not this. They are not open. Opening them would destroy apples ‘vision’ of one buying into the whole ‘experience’. There are plenty of other cool gadget manufacturers who are more open and offer great handsets. There are other massively similar but infinity more open mobile os’.
They offer exactly what you want. Apple doesn’t. But Apple offers exactly what I and 95% percent of regular iPhone users want.

Unless you have an ulterior motive, and are looking to ‘tap in’ to Apples user base but don’t wish to pay the entrance fees or mind the rules. That’s the only way an augment like yours makes any sense.
This is fine, of course! But just say it -don’t beat around the bush with all the fluff in between.

 

[Suckfest 9001]

Buying a product that *you know* doesn’t do what you want it to, then complaining about it everywhere possible is exactly a spoilt and entitled thing to do. This forum is full of it.

Thing is, if the shoe was on the other foot and it was your legitimate business and all and sundry were sticking their noses into it and trying to dictate how you sold your unique product and brand, I’ll bet you would have a different tune.

I get what you mean- I like tinkering, I love open platforms. I self host a bunch of stuff from my home servers and I can’t get enough.
But iPhones are not this. They are not open. Opening them would destroy apples ‘vision’ of one buying into the whole ‘experience’. There are plenty of other cool gadget manufacturers who are more open and offer great handsets. There are other massively similar but infinity more open mobile os’.
They offer exactly what you want. Apple doesn’t. But Apple offers exactly what I and 95% percent of regular iPhone users want.

Unless you have an ulterior motive, and are looking to ‘tap in’ to Apples user base but don’t wish to pay the entrance fees or mind the rules. That’s the only way an augment like yours makes any sense.
This is fine, of course! But just say it -don’t beat around the bush with all the fluff in between.

I didn’t realize we lived in a world where customer satisfaction is 100% across the board.

You’re not entitled to a product that never changes much like developers weren’t entitled to never changing App Store rules. Apple can’t have it both ways and I’m going to continue criticizing that and you’ll just have to either deal with that or ignore me if all you want to read are people agreeing with each other about everything. you can’t also ignore all these governments and regulatory bodies and neither can apple.

 

[vicmajri]

Today the United Kingdom's Competition and Market Authority (CMA) launched an official investigation into the distribution of apps on iOS and iPadOS devices in the U.K. and the terms and conditions governing the platform.

In September of last year, the authority launched an initial inquiry into developers' complaints about Apple's App Store and so-called "anti-competitive" practices. CMA is now wrapping up its initial inquiry to launch an official investigation under Chapter II of the 1998 Competition Act.

Chapter II relates to a specific company or organization using its domain position within a particular market or industry to limit competition and further enhance its position. In recent months, developers, motivated mainly by Epic Games, have accused Apple of using its dominant position on its platforms and the platform to hinder competition.

The authority says that it has "reasonable grounds" to believe that Apple has broken competition law in some form under the Competition Act of 1998.

The CMA says that its investigation will determine whether or not Apple has a dominant position in "connection with the distribution of apps on Apple devices in the UK – and, if so, whether Apple imposes unfair or anti-competitive terms on developers using the App Store." Andrea Coseclli, the Chief Executive of CMA, says that as the world relies on apps every day, a complaint that Apple is using its position to limit competition and choice calls for "careful scrutiny."

As part of its investigation, the CMA will probe into Apple's 30% commission for in-app purchases. Apple requires developers to use its own App Store in-app purchasing system for purchases made within apps. As part of the system, Apple gets a 30% commission for any purchase made. Developers have voiced concern that the commission is too high, and as a result, Apple announced a lower 15% commission for qualifying, small-indie developers.

Update: Apple provided MacRumors with the following statement regarding the CMA's investigation:


Article Link: UK Antitrust Watchdog to Investigate Apple's App Store Policies [Updated]

Fricking Epic Games. I hope everything is okay for Apple.

 

[Stevez67]

Nobody’s arguing for it to work the same “just because it can” we want fair cuts and we want ability to choose app stores or the ability to download/buy apps without needing one. Maybe they can offer a choice where people can stay in the current stream of things and then offer a power user option for people that want something beyond fisher price icons and being handed things on a platter.

When I was a kid and I would tell my mom "I want," she would say "want in one hand and shyte in the other and watch which one gets full fastest." I think that lesson applies here. I expect apple will appeal any ruling not in their favor all the way to SCOTUS. Legal costs are business expenses and at least partially deductible.

 

[Stella]

I for one see it as a potential problem. Which is why I have the default option selected to only accept apps from the App Store.

I have broken this rule a couple of times.
1. I purchased an animation program, for a bit of fun. It installed all manner of interfering items on the menu, and was phoning home all the time. Deleted, for these reasons.
2. Drivers and support software for an audio interface. I'd have been a lot happier if it could have been accomplished through the App Store, so thumbs down for the vendor. I paid for the hardware, not the drivers.

Once you've set only accept applications from the AppStore, you have no more issues. You shouldn't care if other people choose to install applications from other locations; this does not affect you.

Some applications cannot be modified to work with the AppStore, so that's why an application may not be there and only available outside. There are many applications that fall into this category, maybe including your Audio interface application.

 

[Suckfest 9001]

When I was a kid and I would tell my mom "I want," she would say "want in one hand and shyte in the other and watch which one gets full fastest." I think that lesson applies here. I expect apple will appeal any ruling not in their favor all the way to SCOTUS. Legal costs are business expenses and at least partially deductible.

Well definitely they’re going to do that. Pretty status quo for, well, any defendant really. Samsung appealed the iPhone copying lawsuit many times even though it wasn’t even slightly in their favour

 

[gregmancuso]

A common mobile market works as as long as apps bought in on platform (Apple) can be used in another (Google). They can´t so you should treat each platform as an individual market. Platform as in iOS and Android. Under each platform there should be many market places.

Why? The market for computer software is not Mac software or Windows software. This is no different. And, any app developed using any of the cross platform libraries already can, potentially, work on both iOS and Android. Now, I would bet that most of the players in the cross platform app space already sell license to their apps through their own web sites and don't pay anything to Apple or Google anyway. But, even if they do charge through the App Store or Play Store, the fact there is a build of the same app from the same manufacturer does not mean that your license automatically transfers over. That is an issue we have with some software publishers in the Mac / PC space today, too.

There is a big difference between market and manufacturer or OS platform. The fact that one manufacturer provides an option for alternative storefront or for side loading does not mean that all must.

edit: One other thing - platform compatibility should never be the defining factor for a market. There are cross platform development tools that allow for the apps to do just what you ask (cited above). So, is the market "iOS apps built with Xcode," "iOS built with cross-platform tools but only available on iOS,"iOS built with cross-platform tools and also available on other platforms," etc? And where to iOS apps that the author has authorized to run on MacOS? Is the market now "all things apple?" But, we have Windows that allows certain classes of Android apps to run on PC? So, since the fact is there are many ways for apps for both major mobile platforms to run on various non-mobile platforms there really a "mobile apps" market and a "computer apps" , but rather a single market that covers all installable applications that can run on anything with a CPU.

 

[subi257]

Care to give some examples of that? Apple only controls and restricts what happens on their devices. That's certainly not "overreaching". And not exactly sure what's unfair about Apple being able to take advantage of their own platform that they spend billions of dollars developing, maintaining and updating.

That is exactly my point too.

 

[subi257]

Is Apple trying to protect us or control us? With Apples censorship of free speech and overwhelming push of politically correct content I have to wonder.

Free speech does not apply here, only to government not businesses.

 

[ksec]

This is the complete opposite.

The simplicity and safety of the AppStore is the reason for its HUGE success

I let my daughter spend far far too much on Roblox, most of which goes through the AppStore even though she can get more ‘blox for her buck’ online. She understands this and still prefers the AppStore due to it’s simplicty.

It is funny you mention Roblox because they somehow have their own Store and platform.

 

[ksec]

We created the App Store to be a safe and trusted place for customers to download the apps they love and a great business opportunity for developers everywhere. In the UK alone, the iOS app economy supports hundreds of thousands of jobs, and any developer with a great idea is able to reach Apple customers around the world.

Let's edit this

We created the App Store to be a safe and trusted and only place for customers to download the apps they love and a great business opportunity for developers everywhere. In the UK alone, the iOS app economy supports hundreds of thousands of jobs, and any developer with a great idea is able to reach Apple customers around the world.

i.e This is the only place to reach Apple's Customers. Which put the App developers not in connection with their users.

This is perfectly find until it reaches a point where it isn't. When more than half of the nation's population are Apple's customers.

 

[subi257]

Nah if it works for Mac it can work for iPhone. Don’t agree with the current system just because that’s the way apple happened to set it up. You vote with your wallet but you’re also entitled to an opinion

Exactly, so, people that are not happy with it are free to take their wallet somewhere else...that is the way it is in all other aspects of life....Why does everybody think that this is different because it's Apple? And, opinions....They're like *******s....everybodies got one. One's opinion does not make anybody else's opinion wrong...it's just different and opinion of a business is ruled by the owner a private person, or in the case of a corporation, the board of directors at the will of the real owners....the shareholders.