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Upgrading old Mac Pro to 8800 GT graphics?

This is irrelevant....

Most of those "Apple failures" happened while Apple was under older management. I'd say their entire product line in the mid 1990's was dismal. (Anyone remember the lame Performa 6xxx towers of that era, for example? Video card built onto the motherboard with insufficient RAM and no expandability/upgrade options at all!)

Furthermore, some of your "failures" are HIGHLY questionable. The Newton, a failure? Maybe you better tell some of the folks who STILL use the things today - despite them being YEARS out of date and totally unsupported! In the "grand scheme", I'd ultimately say ALL PDAs were failures - because the public now demands those capabilities rolled into their cellphones or music players. But the Newton started it all.

And yeah, the Apple Lisa was a huge failure -- but that goes WAY WAY back in the history of computing. That was a big risk to take at the time. It's one that could have paid off big, but didn't work out. One could say the original Macintosh was a similar risk. Would Apple have been better off today if they never built THAT product, and just stuck with the (at the time) popular Apple //e and //gs products?

And finally, Apple removing "computers" from their name is simply an acknowledgment that products like the iPod are a big part of their revenue stream today. Sony doesn't call themselves "Sony Computer", despite selling lots of VAIO notebooks, monitors, printers, and other such computer products.


Colossus said:
I hear ya. I can type up a huge list of Apple products and point my finger to a long list of Apple failures due to their proprietary properties. What the heck, I feel brave, lets start with the Apple Pippin, Apple Newton, Apple Cube, Apple Lisa (the Lisa sales flopped so bad Apple had to dump 2,000+ units in a nearby landfill in Logan, Utah), Macintosh TV, 20th Anniversary Macintosh (TAM), and the biggest red flag of them all is when Apple changed their name/logo from :apple: Apple Computers to just :apple: Apple. Yep at the Cupertino site and many other locations the word 'computers' was pulled. I remember when the Mac Mini came out and you had two video card choices, not anymore. I'm off my soap box now. I hope we do get a new NVIDIA video card option for the 2006 Mac Pros. Nuff said.
Click to expand...
 
kingtj said:
Many different video card performance comparisons have been done.
I'm sure you could find some relevant info over on www.barefeats.com.

Personally, I don't agree with all the hostility against the X1900XT cards. I got one shortly after I bought my original Mac Pro 2.66Ghz machine - and I'm still using it daily. I even moved it over into my new Mac Pro 2.8Ghz box for right now. It's a faster/better card than the 2600, and FAR better than that lame nVidia 7300.

Yes, they have a lot of overheating issues. But THAT problem has many solutions. #1, you increase the fan speed of the fan that cools the card slots, using a freeware utility called "SMC Fan Control". #2, you either make sure the X1900XT card is kept free of dust buildup on its own cooling fan/heatsnk, or you buy a better replacement for it like the Accelero products (for about $30) and bolt that on. #3, Apple started selling a 2nd. revision of this card not too long after problems were first reported. Many people who initially complained about issues got their first rev. card swapped for a newer one by Apple, and that solved their problems.

Oh, and #4, you could even flash a PC version of an X1900XT 512MB card to an OS X version if you really wanted to. Instructions are out there on the net, and when I read them, it appeared it was even doable right from inside the Mac Pro itself. These cards are still found on eBay all the time for under $150 or so. (I point this out because I'd rather spend $120 or $130 on a PC version of the X1900XT off eBay and put in the effort to flash it for OS X than blow the money on a 2600HD card that doesn't perform nearly as well.)
Click to expand...

I agree the card has served me well. It plays CS:S under bootcamp at over 190 fps, Halo at 122, unreal tournament 2004 around 350, UT3 around 45-60(everything on high) and Crysis around 35-60 fps on medium/high settings. Using the stock cooler i managed to overclock the memory about 35% and the gpu about 22%.

The only thing i hate about it is ATI's inability to make any form of competent driver. And the fact that the card went obsolete about a month after i got it. But that was to be expected from the graphics card market. It is now a year and a half out of date and the new wave of video games just beat the card into its grave. Everything else on the computer still pulls its weight without protest. That is why i want out of this card so badly.

It did fry at one point but that wasn't caused by the card itself. Vista decided to screw with all of my fans somehow and they would not run.
 
Newton starting it all, I agree, started it all for a PDA with GUI. Furthermore, you contradicted yourself by saying "ALL PDAs are Failures", but before this statement you tried to support those that are still using Newton. Introducing a product for the very first time always has its "big" risk. You stated "products like the iPod are a big part of their revenue stream today'", which is true. Thats my point, Apple has a change in direction, computers are no longer at the top of their priority list. Calm down and don't take a blog entry so personal. Peace. Now back to the rant "WHERES MY NEW NVIDIA GRAPHIC CARD!!!!!!!


kingtj said:
Most of those "Apple failures" happened while Apple was under older management. I'd say their entire product line in the mid 1990's was dismal. (Anyone remember the lame Performa 6xxx towers of that era, for example? Video card built onto the motherboard with insufficient RAM and no expandability/upgrade options at all!)

Furthermore, some of your "failures" are HIGHLY questionable. The Newton, a failure? Maybe you better tell some of the folks who STILL use the things today - despite them being YEARS out of date and totally unsupported! In the "grand scheme", I'd ultimately say ALL PDAs were failures - because the public now demands those capabilities rolled into their cellphones or music players. But the Newton started it all.

And yeah, the Apple Lisa was a huge failure -- but that goes WAY WAY back in the history of computing. That was a big risk to take at the time. It's one that could have paid off big, but didn't work out. One could say the original Macintosh was a similar risk. Would Apple have been better off today if they never built THAT product, and just stuck with the (at the time) popular Apple //e and //gs products?

And finally, Apple removing "computers" from their name is simply an acknowledgment that products like the iPod are a big part of their revenue stream today. Sony doesn't call themselves "Sony Computer", despite selling lots of VAIO notebooks, monitors, printers, and other such computer products.
Click to expand...
 
OZMP said:
i'm not happy either, i bought my MacPro to replace my dual G5 mid-late last year, and didnt get the 1900(thank god) as i was waiting for something newer... and now THIS!!!

I guess the question is, Are there real-life examples of how the 7300/2600/8800 compare?
Maybe a 2600 could be a worthwhile upgrade afterall.

Cheers.
Click to expand...

Are you a gamer? The 2600 blows chunks as a gaming card. Better than the 7300, but barely.
 
Neverwinter Nights 2 shipping Feb 26 and no new graphics card, go figure.

NN2 requirements in case anyone was curious. Mac OS X v10.4.11, 10.5.1 or later, Intel Mac running at 2.0GHz or faster, 1GB RAM, 6.5GB hard disk space, ATI Radeon X1600 or Nvidia GeForce 7600 or better with at least 128MB VRAM and DVD drive.
 
OZMP said:
i'm not happy either, i bought my MacPro to replace my dual G5 mid-late last year, and didnt get the 1900(thank god) as i was waiting for something newer... and now THIS!!!

I guess the question is, Are there real-life examples of how the 7300/2600/8800 compare?
Maybe a 2600 could be a worthwhile upgrade afterall.

Cheers.
Click to expand...

Barefeats has an updated comparison out today:

http://www.barefeats.com/harper8.html
 
syth said:
Are you a gamer? The 2600 blows chunks as a gaming card. Better than the 7300, but barely.
Click to expand...

Yep,
guess its time too look into re-flashing an x1900, are they still readily available new?

Do the currently sold by Apple x1900's have the same issues? I am assuming being currently sold they are the revised edition.

Cheers.
 
Just install the regular 8800 GT and stick with Windows XP / Vista for now.
I'm doing that and it's been fine ever since.
Just pisses me off that I buy this machine to get power and all I get is incompatibility BS w/ the Mac OS.


Only bad thing about the XP 32bit (The most stable windows for now), is the memory. I'm trying to get this pass the 2GB limit but I can't seem to. I tried the /3GB in boot.ini but nothing has changed.

The PC in the Mac commercials should say something about this... lol.

All this show off mac but technically, windows is handling things better w/ the upgrades us consumers are constantly looking for.
Apple's attitude seem to be, "Take it or leave it" attitude.

http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?messageID=6305521#6305521

Found that post and apple just shut it down. Pretty funny.
 
digiegg-
i read on blizzard forums about a hack where you can run a PC GPU under OSX but you need your stock card in there too boot. Does any one know more on this?

Google didn't tell me anything tho.

Can anyone recommend a PC 8800 that will allow me to reflash it with the EFI32 firmware when(if) its released? I've read that some have more storage than others? refer: https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/434092/

Cheers.

edit: here are my options from my local helpful walk in store:
instock: http://www.scorptec.com.au/search/?q=8800&cat=35&s=461&m=&min=&max=&avail=&instock=true
order: http://www.scorptec.com.au/search/?q=8800&cat=35&s=461&m=&min=&max=&avail=&init=1
 
digiegg said:
Just install the regular 8800 GT and stick with Windows XP / Vista for now.
I'm doing that and it's been fine ever since.
Just pisses me off that I buy this machine to get power and all I get is incompatibility BS w/ the Mac OS.


Only bad thing about the XP 32bit (The most stable windows for now), is the memory. I'm trying to get this pass the 2GB limit but I can't seem to. I tried the /3GB in boot.ini but nothing has changed.

The PC in the Mac commercials should say something about this... lol.

All this show off mac but technically, windows is handling things better w/ the upgrades us consumers are constantly looking for.
Apple's attitude seem to be, "Take it or leave it" attitude.

http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?messageID=6305521#6305521

Found that post and apple just shut it down. Pretty funny.
Click to expand...

I see they've locked that thread the tossers.

Here's my idea for a new ad:
Enters a very trendily dressed PC guy - no glasses. Then the Mac comes in with Emo hair and flares and sandals with socks.

'Oh Hi I'm a PC'
'um Hi I'm a mac'
'Um looking good PC'
'Oh thanks yes, I just put the latest 9800gtx card in, very dapper heh?, um you're looking a bit out of date Mac'
'Yes, I'm stuck with 3 year old cards I'm afraid, all a bit old and out of fashion'.
'But you're only 2months old!'
'Yes but I've built in obsoletion, ow - my knees just gone! - do you have a pair of glasses I can borrow, everything is a little blurry'
'um, no, I don't need them anymore, I've seriously high- resolution graphics now'.
'oh...'
 
StructAural said:
I see they've locked that thread the tossers.

Here's my idea for a new ad:
Enters a very trendily dressed PC guy - no glasses. Then the Mac comes in with Emo hair and flares and sandals with socks.

'Oh Hi I'm a PC'
'um Hi I'm a mac'
'Um looking good PC'
'Oh thanks yes, I just put the latest 9800gtx card in, very dapper heh?, um you're looking a bit out of date Mac'
'Yes, I'm stuck with 3 year old cards I'm afraid, all a bit old and out of fashion'.
'But you're only 2months old!'
'Yes but I've built in obsoletion, ow - my knees just gone! - do you have a pair of glasses I can borrow, everything is a little blurry'
'um, no, I don't need them anymore, I've seriously high- resolution graphics now'.
'oh...'
Click to expand...


lol nice one. I love it. Man.. they really have to start looking into this thing... consumers want upgrades constantly!!!
 
This further proves that steve jobs is a liar. When the Mac Pro was released, he talked big, flapped his gums and flexed his ego about how much space and expansion is possible with the intel based towers.

So why the f**k is he not delivering on his statements from back then? How f***ing long has it been since the Pro has been released and why arent there any graphics cards available? This thread has been going on for a while now.....and I dont see *ANY* statements from apple on this FAILURE.
 
Colossus said:
Somebody should make a video and post it on YouTube. That would be great.
Click to expand...

I was thinking the same. If it was done well it give Apple a very large kick up it's arse. It would spread like wild fire and suddenly we might see apple taking a bit more note of what their customers actually want.

In fact, anyone know how to organise a donation fund via PayPal that we can use to commission it ourselves?
 
lloyd709 said:
I was thinking the same. If it was done well it give Apple a very large kick up it's arse. It would spread like wild fire and suddenly we might see apple taking a bit more note of what their customers actually want.

In fact, anyone know how to organise a donation fund via PayPal that we can use to commission it ourselves?
Click to expand...

You guys are taking this way too seriously. Someone at Nvidia f**ked up, Apple wasn't aware of it, they are now, the problem's going to be fixed, end of story. It is not a big deal in the large scheme of things, and only effects a tiny minority of Apple's customers. Time to move on and get upset about something really important.
 
Blogger said:
You guys are taking this way too seriously. Someone at Nvidia f**ked up, Apple wasn't aware of it, they are now, the problem's going to be fixed, end of story. It is not a big deal in the large scheme of things, and only effects a tiny minority of Apple's customers. Time to move on and get upset about something really important.
Click to expand...

Spot the guy working for Apple!!!!!!!!!!
 
I don't believe you really work for Apple! But I'd be very surprised if at least one the contributors to this thread wasn't on their payroll.

There is a lot more to this than just the graphics card. It's the abuse of market position and arrogance that Apple is starting to show that is the issue here. If we as customers just accept it then they will just screw us more and more.

I don't believe for a minute Nvidia f**ked up. I think the only reason they might be working on a card is because of the fuss we made. I think there is still a very realistic chance we will never see this card - that will only become an even bigger chance if we all calm down!
 
lloyd709 said:
I don't believe you really work for Apple! But I'd be very surprised if at least one the contributors to this thread wasn't on their payroll.

There is a lot more to this than just the graphics card. It's the abuse of market position and arrogance that Apple is starting to show that is the issue here. If we as customers just accept it then they will just screw us more and more.

I don't believe for a minute Nvidia f**ked up. I think the only reason they might be working on a card is because of the fuss we made. I think there is still a very realistic chance we will never see this card - that will only become an even bigger chance if we all calm down!
Click to expand...

Not me. In fact I don't like to work at all, I think work is unnatural! Also any blind loyalty to any corporation that's only responsibility is to its shareholders is plain stupidity.

Having said that, I don't see any abuse at all. What abuse? What arrogance? They've said that it will be fixed. It's patently obvious it was Nvidia's fault, because if it was Apple's the ATI 2600 card wouldn't
work in 2006/7 Mac Pros, and it does. Apple subcontracts out video card development to ATI and Nvidia, and Nvidia screwed up. Why else do you think it was Nvidia's Director of PR that first contacted Engaget to say that there would be a fix?

Cheers!
 
Blogger said:
You guys are taking this way too seriously. Someone at Nvidia f**ked up, Apple wasn't aware of it, they are now, the problem's going to be fixed, end of story. It is not a big deal in the large scheme of things, and only effects a tiny minority of Apple's customers. Time to move on and get upset about something really important.
Click to expand...


it comes down to us not getting what we paid for... my next machine could very well end up being a hackintosh lol
 
Actually it maybe Apples fault. If Apple didn't order the 32 EFI on the 8800 cards from NVIDIA, then NVIDIA only manufactured what they were obligated/contracted to do for Apple, and that's producing the 64 EFI video cards.

Since Apple has the knowledge (one would hope) that 64 EFI and 32 EFI cannot be fitted on the same chip set, I point my finger to Apple. But Apple could of had or have intentions to order the 64 EFI first and the 32 EFI second. We really don't know who dropped the ball, my bet is on Apple doing the ball dropping here. I'm not saying NVIDIA is not responsible, but it's very possible. I think Apple love's to dangle that carrot in front of us.

Its all about licensing and the proverbial red tape.
 
I don't see why we shouldn't be getting EFI64 update for the older Mac Pros. It's not incompatible. But it's typical Apple. When the new model is out, they forget the older one still exists.
 
Colossus said:
Actually it maybe Apples fault. If Apple didn't order the 32 EFI on the 8800 cards from NVIDIA, then NVIDIA only manufactured what they were obligated/contracted to do for Apple, and that's producing the 64 EFI video cards.

Since Apple has the knowledge (one would hope) that 64 EFI and 32 EFI cannot be fitted on the same chip set, I point my finger to Apple. But Apple could of had or have intentions to order the 64 EFI first and the 32 EFI second. We really don't know who dropped the ball, my bet is on Apple doing the ball dropping here. I'm not saying NVIDIA is not responsible, but it's very possible. I think Apple love's to dangle that carrot in front of us.

Its all about licensing and the proverbial red tape.
Click to expand...

Well of course we just don't know, but I think the fact that it was Nvidia that came out of the woodwork first to offer the news that there would be a fix is telling. Why would they do that if they weren't responsible?

I don't object to speculation about what happened or who was responsible at all. It's just that after reading speculation without any supporting evidence, some people here seem to leap to the conclusion that this speculation is undisputed fact and get angry. That's what seems kind of silly to me.

Cheers!
 
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