Upgrading old Mac Pro to 8800 GT graphics?

[giantrobot]

I agree with most of you guys about the 32bit and 64bit cards. The previous gen mac pros can do the 64-bit processing so I dont see a reason why apple couldnt make a 32bit 8800gt card or update the firmware for the mac pro to support 64-bit efi 8800gt cards.

But in a business sense I think for apple and its share holders would benefit from this move since each newer released mac pros are tied down to a couple/newer specific cards. Because by doing this it puts the mac pro in line with the rest of the products (imac,macbooks,macbook pros).

By in line I mean it makes the consumer/businesses to upgrade the entire mac pro because of the influence of the cards. This is true even with the iMac and MacBook pros. If the mbp had the ability to upgrade the GPU every year Im sure half the market will just by the cheaper solution and buy the new GPU instead of the whole new mbp.

Basically CPU upgrade is not too crucial yearly but GPU is.

I have no doubt in my mind that this entire upgrade issue is business driven. They want people to buy these new Mac Pros that are not significantly different from the old Mac Pros.

This is a bad decision with regards to the Mac Pro. Everything in the Mac Pro could have been offered as an upgrade kit. From the motherboard to the new processors. The EFi should have been a free upgrade patch. Most people would have simply bought the new model with the upgrades built in but Apple would have created alot of consumer good will. Instead, Mac is effectively trying to sell a product to a very specific market that is not much different than the product the market already owns by effectively crippling the older product rather than introducing a product that is better on its own. Its basically cannibalizing its own customer base to squeeze out a few more bucks.

From a PC users perspective, this is so ludicrous that its hard to believe that a company would even think of doing this. It should have such an alienating effect on its customer base that it would be the equivalent of product suicide. I dont know how else to put this... but Apple thinks Mac Pro users are stupid.

 

[jemo07]

From a PC users perspective, this is so ludicrous that its hard to believe that a company would even think of doing this. It should have such an alienating effect on its customer base that it would be the equivalent of product suicide. I dont know how else to put this... but Apple thinks Mac Pro users are stupid.

I feel like they they we are all stupid, look at the Mac Book Pro and the disk drive upgrade path... look at their product line, Mini > iMac > MacPro tremendous product gap and all of them, including a MacPro and use once appliance that the only technological upgrade is disks and memory, after that you have to but a new one.

This is all starting to smell really rotten and how ever came up with this idea forgot that in the work of general uses processors (intel) there is alot more choice and they can't hid behind their curtain of smoke.

Look at what they did with Aperture, sure there is an upgrade path, but you have to upgrade the application and the OS just to update the Camera support. Now I am not complaining about the new Aperture 2.0/2.1 as it was a welcome upgrade, but having to do this was not only costly, but also Leopard still has issues that I did not have with Tiger. The whole approach was terrible since the company that controls both th OS an the Application is forcing you to an upgrade down your trout... basically using strong arm tactics behind a pretty decoration from marketing.

The more I look into it, the more I convince my self that it was a major mistake to invest thousands (like 10K) into a platform that is becoming obsolete 4 months after purchase. Not only that, but I have major issues since the last security upgrade that have made my workflow useless and Aperture is not usable....

Let's hope for the best.

Regards,

JM

 

[lampliter]

If the PC consumer had only 1 choice(well 1 isn`t a choice)of graphic card for a brand new 3000 dollar,say Dell computer.Mac users would take every opportunity and making sure they get the point across to the poor PC souls that their machines are so inferior to mac.So why is it we can not express dissatisfaction when the shoe is on our foot.I`m not saying all mac users are like that but if the majority keeps with this unintelligent way of seeing their surroundings then there will be no need for improvement.Any suggestion of criticism towards mac is always meet with an almost mob mentality and a how dare you type answer.If we can all agree that everything on the planet not mac is off no use and not worthy,then we should be able to agree if we just allow ourselves to be compared to a PC than maybe we might learn something.How can things such as saying I was ripped off by apple be fixed if we won`t even entertain the fact.I WAS RIPPED OFF BY APPLE.Sorry if seeing this blows some minds here.If you put on the black turtle neck I promise everything will go back to normal,but if you put on the blue turtle neck,I can only show you the truth.

 

[MacFanBoyIIe]

Mac Pro Poll

I'm curious so I created this poll:

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/462790/

Please vote and feel free to comment. Thanks!

 

[OZMP]

from blizzard's mac tech:

It is our hope that Apple will ship the 8800GT as an upgrade card for the first gen Mac Pros. It is a topic that has seen regular discussion between us and them since the new models shipped. In fact, we were just at Apple HQ talking about it (among other things) in person yesterday.

While I can't share yet what they had to say about it, when the final resolution is obtained we will be sure to post it here, as we know plenty of Mac Pro + X1900 users that are looking to upgrade and they will want to know the final answer.


http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=5591121034&sid=1

 

[MacFanBoyIIe]

from blizzard's mac tech:

It is our hope that Apple will ship the 8800GT as an upgrade card for the first gen Mac Pros. It is a topic that has seen regular discussion between us and them since the new models shipped. In fact, we were just at Apple HQ talking about it (among other things) in person yesterday.

While I can't share yet what they had to say about it, when the final resolution is obtained we will be sure to post it here, as we know plenty of Mac Pro + X1900 users that are looking to upgrade and they will want to know the final answer.


http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=5591121034&sid=1

Well, that's encouraging. But, when does it become too little, too late? Isn't the 8800 about to be out-of-date?

 

[ungraphic]

Well, that's encouraging. But, when does it become too little, too late? Isn't the 8800 about to be out-of-date?

At this point I'd expect the 9800GT. If not, I'd expect the 8800 for around $250. I can buy the 8800GT for PC for $200 from a shop here in Toronto, there is absolutely no reason to charge over $300 for it this late and the fact that the 9800GT sells for $350:

http://www.pcvonline.com/productDetails.aspx?id=6846

 

[Lord Blackadder]

Well, that's encouraging. But, when does it become too little, too late? Isn't the 8800 about to be out-of-date?

I think people tend to asssume that the latest from the GPU manufacturers is the current performance baseline. I disagree - I think that GPU manufacturers are among the worst offenders in terms of taking planned obsolescence to ridiculous lengths.

Just because Nvidia and ATI crank out 2, 3 or even 4 new high-end cards per year doesn't mean we have to buy them or the developers should optimize games for them to the detriment of the mid-price cards or last year's high end models - in other words the cards most of us have.

So I wouldn't scream bloody murder if Apple came out with an 8800GT for the earlier Mac Pros - but they should try to keep the prices at least a bit more reasonable.

 

[pprior]

from blizzard's mac tech:

It is our hope that Apple will ship the 8800GT as an upgrade card for the first gen Mac Pros. It is a topic that has seen regular discussion between us and them since the new models shipped. In fact, we were just at Apple HQ talking about it (among other things) in person yesterday.

While I can't share yet what they had to say about it, when the final resolution is obtained we will be sure to post it here, as we know plenty of Mac Pro + X1900 users that are looking to upgrade and they will want to know the final answer.


http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=5591121034&sid=1

The fact that there is still "talking" going on tells me all that needs to be known - it WILL NOT happen.

If they were going to do it, the decision would have already been made a long time ago.

 

[Frozonecold]

The fact that there is still "talking" going on tells me all that needs to be known - it WILL NOT happen.

If they were going to do it, the decision would have already been made a long time ago.

Alternate theory: They will make the 8800GT compatible with the early Mac Pros but they are trying to get as many early Mac Pro adopters to buy a new Mac Pro as possible first.

 

[jemo07]

The fact that there is still "talking" going on tells me all that needs to be known - it WILL NOT happen.

If they were going to do it, the decision would have already been made a long time ago.

Now, as much as I have been complaining here, this is not necessarily true. It could be something as whom takes the bill for this... or which platform... there are so many variable that I can think of here. We just don't know what they are talking... let's just hope that the talk still imply the how and when they will deliver something.

JM

 

[Lord Blackadder]

Sometimes I wonder where gaming on the Mac would be without Blizzard and Aspyr...if they didn't wheedle Apple about stuff like this we'd all still be using Radeon 9800 PROs.

 

[BornAgainMac]

The information I learned from this thread has taught me not to go with the Mac Pro. For me, the main selling point for the Mac Pro after raw speed and monitor separation was the graphics card and the ability to upgrade it.

 

[ungraphic]

Sometimes I wonder where gaming on the Mac would be without Blizzard and Aspyr...if they didn't wheedle Apple about stuff like this we'd all still be using Radeon 9800 PROs.

It probably would have been near non-existent on PPC. Wait no, non-existent....not like there was much else.

 

[Colossus]

Let's not forget Transgaming, Inc. for creating Cider. All the EA games utilizes Cider for all thier Mac Games. Blizzard and Aspyr are Macs huge providers.

Sometimes I wonder where gaming on the Mac would be without Blizzard and Aspyr...if they didn't wheedle Apple about stuff like this we'd all still be using Radeon 9800 PROs.

 

[Frozonecold]

At least the x1900xt is the best card for pro apps Yeah, I am using that as my justification. In some ways my 3Ghz Mac Pro w/ x1900xt is better than your 2.8Ghz w/ 8800GT.

 

[jemo07]

At least the x1900xt is the best card for pro apps Yeah, I am using that as my justification. In some ways my 3Ghz Mac Pro w/ x1900xt is better than your 2.8Ghz w/ 8800GT.

Is yours working? I have my sitting in the closet? I always got a crash when in CS3 doing a batch.... I do allot of batch since I do Panos in HDR..... I am working with the HD 2600 XT which is not MUCH better than the 7300 in Aperture.

JM

 

[MacFanBoyIIe]

.....I am working with the HD 2600 XT which is not MUCH better than the 7300 in Aperture.

I use iPhoto with my 7300. Is Aperture performance better or worse than iPhoto with the 7300 (was thinking of trying another app since I can't upgrade video cards right now)?

 

[contoursvt]

I always buy stuff from PC Village. Great store. I go to the Scarborough location. Anyway I figured I'd mention that I know them too...not that it helps this conversation

At this point I'd expect the 9800GT. If not, I'd expect the 8800 for around $250. I can buy the 8800GT for PC for $200 from a shop here in Toronto, there is absolutely no reason to charge over $300 for it this late and the fact that the 9800GT sells for $350:

http://www.pcvonline.com/productDetails.aspx?id=6846

 

[knome]

I always buy stuff from PC Village. Great store. I go to the Scarborough location. Anyway I figured I'd mention that I know them too...not that it helps this conversation

Originally Posted by ungraphic
At this point I'd expect the 9800GT. If not, I'd expect the 8800 for around $250. I can buy the 8800GT for PC for $200 from a shop here in Toronto, there is absolutely no reason to charge over $300 for it this late and the fact that the 9800GT sells for $350:

http://www.pcvonline.com/productDetails.aspx?id=6846

Can anyone confirm that this is an actual 9800GTX? I want to buy one right away and considering nvidia hasn't officially released it yet, i'm a little wary. Any problems getting it into the US?

 

[Salavat23]

Can anyone confirm that this is an actual 9800GTX? I want to buy one right away and considering nvidia hasn't officially released it yet, i'm a little wary. Any problems getting it into the US?

Strange.

They showed a picture of an 8800 GTS G80 card.

Something is weird...

 

[dreamof3d]

I use iPhoto with my 7300. Is Aperture performance better or worse than iPhoto with the 7300 (was thinking of trying another app since I can't upgrade video cards right now)?

Even though I too want an upgrade, my x1900xt doesn't even whimper with those apps. Even Pixlemator with core image editing, real-time pinch, bulge, light tunnel, etc, work perfect. Sometimes you can hear the fan speed increase a little in real-time editing. Motion, Borris Red, no problems

 

[jemo07]

I use iPhoto with my 7300. Is Aperture performance better or worse than iPhoto with the 7300 (was thinking of trying another app since I can't upgrade video cards right now)?

I don't know, never used iPhoto, just Aperture .

There is little difference using Aperture between the two cards. I think that it's related to the driver, but I have not doug too much into the subject. I what just glad to get some work done.

JM

 

[jjahshik32]

I have no doubt in my mind that this entire upgrade issue is business driven. They want people to buy these new Mac Pros that are not significantly different from the old Mac Pros.

This is a bad decision with regards to the Mac Pro. Everything in the Mac Pro could have been offered as an upgrade kit. From the motherboard to the new processors. The EFi should have been a free upgrade patch. Most people would have simply bought the new model with the upgrades built in but Apple would have created alot of consumer good will. Instead, Mac is effectively trying to sell a product to a very specific market that is not much different than the product the market already owns by effectively crippling the older product rather than introducing a product that is better on its own. Its basically cannibalizing its own customer base to squeeze out a few more bucks.

From a PC users perspective, this is so ludicrous that its hard to believe that a company would even think of doing this. It should have such an alienating effect on its customer base that it would be the equivalent of product suicide. I dont know how else to put this... but Apple thinks Mac Pro users are stupid.

You have to understand though, the mac pro is not made for the average consumer but mostly for bussinesses and professional business level. I'm sure apple makes a killing at huge businesses in need of 50-100 mac pros every 1-2 years. Even small businesses can afford to upgrade to a new mac pro every 1-2 years if necessary to jump to the higher end graphics card (which I doubt and maybe even the G5 is still more than capable).

Most people that I see that complain are consumers for personal/hobby/gaming reasons, while the people that I do know or that does tell me about the graphics nvidia 8800gt is not a problem are the silent business people who actually use it for the mac pro's full potential's power that saves them time to make a living. This is why the nvidia quadro fx card is able to be used in both the 06 and 08 mac pros.

I'm sure the professionals will agree with me that the 2.66Ghz 4 core mac pro will still do a bang up job with a nvidia quadro fx card in any of the pro apps they are using and wait until they can purchase a mac pro that is substantially faster to save them massive amounts of time. But I guess if your a professional and need a more demanding machine then I guess your option is to sell the 2.66ghz 4 core mac pro and just opt for the newer 8 core mac pros with the nvidia quadro fx card anyways.

And you will hear from alot of people that prefers the nvidia 8800gt card as to the quadro because its so much cheaper but then those people fits in the consumer for personal/hobby/gaming to save money to get a newer/faster card as to the similar priced x1900 and avoids the much faster quadro fx which performance much faster in pro apps.

 

[primetimex]

All this debate about pre-early '08 Mac Pro's not being upgradeable (yes that includes my MacPro purchased Nov'07) reminds me of the PC.

Even the venerable AGP slot equipped PC can still have a good video card - remember the 7800+ video card from Gainward?

As a long time PC user who has bought a MP in hopes of a complete switchover it is sad to see that Apple has not really changed in all these years and logn time MP users getting ripped in terms of upgrade.

It seems after all that PCs are still your best bet if you want flexibility in terms of hardware and software - tempered vs. Mac's OSX security and much polished OS.