Verizon iPhone to Start Mass Production, Apple Working on 5th-Gen iPhone

[Sticman]

Verizon is over-rated, they want premium prices for their old CDMA technology, plus their data network is slow, i would never buy a smartphone from Verizon, unless their network was as fast as ATT's and you could make phone calls simultaneously while surfing the web without Wi-Fi.

Verizon may be over-rated for YOU, but as you know service quality is very Geography-dependent. For those of us who live in an area where Verizon service is better than AT&T, it is not overrated.

As the Wall Street Journal reports today, Consumer Reports has (consistently) rated Verizon's network superior to that of AT&T. There are many places where AT&T is better than or at least as good as Verizon. That ain't the case here in the San Jose area, where my Verizon phone consistently has good service and I have at most one bar on my iphone.

Apple is simply making a good business decision to prevent itself from losing more ground to Android and to selling to consumers who want Verizon.

 

[marksman]

WHOOSH yourself. I addressed the advertising angle, but apparently I have more of a clue how that industry works than you do. You are obviously the clueless one that knows nothing about co-op advertising programs. This is NOT a indication of Verizon control. This is just status-quo for the manufacturers co-op advertising programs. IT PROVES NOTHING.

Actually it proves a lot. You just to refuse to understand/accept it.

His points are right on the money when it comes to the reasons why Apple and Verizon may never join forces. They both want extreme control over the process and experience. That makes them very unlikely/nearly impossible as partners.

The reason they have this kind of advertising is because Verizon demands it. Not to mention Co-Op advertising does not normally work how you say. It tends to more often to be specific named products getting ad placement in a retailer's ad space. Not having the retailer re-badge the product and take all the credit for its existance. What he said is right, it is much more of an oem product, with Verizon re-purposing them and marketing them as their own. If it was a normal co-op advertising partnership the phones would be marketed as come get the HTC MonoCup X at Verizon. Not come get the new Verizon MonoCup X.

This has been the hurdle from day one when Apple and AT&T first announced there would be a partnership. Verizon was just not in tune with what Apple wanted to do. There is no evidence that a necessary and significant culuture shift has taken place there to make such a partnership any more likely now.

Could it happen? Sure it could, since it is in the best interests of both sides. However both sides want control of the process, and neither side is keen on giving up that control... and thus why it is unlikely to happen.

Verizon's fear is the commodization of cell phone providers that Apple is potentially causing to happen. So they want to fight to keep their brand and business front and center and not simply be the aquaduct that carries Apple's water.

This is the same battle they won against Motorola, Samsung, HTC and the rest.

Apple's entire business is their brand, and they are not likely every going to give that up. So on paper the two sides are worlds apart, because they are in the same place, and to reach one another they have to travel around the entire world to get back to where they are now.

 

[Geckotek]

I have to resort to laughing when other people completely ignore the reality of how products are advertised but you go ahead and bury your head in the sand pal. It still does not change reality.

The only person burying their head is you. You need to research how advertising co-op dollars work. Verizon isn't advertising the Droid because they forced it on the manufacturers, they do it because the manufacturers prefer to give advertising dollars to Verizon to do the advetising.

Go look at how Sprint and T-Mobile and Best Buy and so many other retailers run their advertising before you come back here and post again. Stop posting uninformed drivel please.

 

[MonkeyET]

I suppose my worry is that the new phone, on a new network, if its actually true, will have its problems that will take time to work out. I would suspect that in two years the new LTE networks will be up and running, and have some of the bugs worked out. Wait, two years until a reliable network change and two year contract? I'm thinking I might head out and purchase an iPhone tomorrow. My Verizon contract does end on the 16th...

 

[Geckotek]

Actually it proves a lot. You just to refuse to understand/accept it.

His points are right on the money when it comes to the reasons why Apple and Verizon may never join forces. They both want extreme control over the process and experience. That makes them very unlikely/nearly impossible as partners.

In the past I would agree with you, but if you look at any of the current Droid devices it's obvious that Verizon is loosening its grip. And we all know if they want the iPhone they will have to play it on Apple's terms....and I think they will.

The reason they have this kind of advertising is because Verizon demands it.

Really? And you know this how?

Not to mention Co-Op advertising does not normally work how you say. It tends to more often to be specific named products getting ad placement in a retailer's ad space.

Hmmmm....like maybe an Android smartphone?

Not having the retailer re-badge the product and take all the credit for its existance.

I'm not referring to the badging...but in the wireless industry, yes...this is how it has been for a long time.

What he said is right, it is much more of an oem product, with Verizon re-purposing them and marketing them as their own. If it was a normal co-op advertising partnership the phones would be marketed as come get the HTC MonoCup X at Verizon. Not come get the new Verizon MonoCup X.

But it's obvious that Verizon can't do that with the iPhone. Nobody would believe it. So this arguement is pointless.

This has been the hurdle from day one when Apple and AT&T first announced there would be a partnership. Verizon was just not in tune with what Apple wanted to do. There is no evidence that a necessary and significant culuture shift has taken place there to make such a partnership any more likely now.

I disagree, the current Droids are nowhere near as modified as past Verizon smartphones were.

Could it happen? Sure it could, since it is in the best interests of both sides. However both sides want control of the process, and neither side is keen on giving up that control... and thus why it is unlikely to happen.

Once again I disagree. I think Verizon is a different place than it was a few years back.

Verizon's fear is the commodization of cell phone providers that Apple is potentially causing to happen. So they want to fight to keep their brand and business front and center and not simply be the aquaduct that carries Apple's water.

This part I agree with, but I think it's just a matter of time either way.

This is the same battle they won against Motorola, Samsung, HTC and the rest.

Apple's entire business is their brand, and they are not likely every going to give that up. So on paper the two sides are worlds apart, because they are in the same place, and to reach one another they have to travel around the entire world to get back to where they are now.

On paper yes, but things change and I've already seen proof of change from Verizon. Apple on the other hand isn't likely to give in.

You have a few good points, but I think you are ignoring the fact that wireless carriers have presented devices as their own creation for quite some time. I used to work in the industry and I can recall a couple of models from as long ago as 20 years ago that were like this. But Apple has brought about a new paradigm. And yes, Verizon didn't want to be a part of that, but I'm thinking they can't help but be enticed by the realization that the average iPhone user brings a higher ARPU.

And even if I accepted the argument, I'm not sure how Verizon's attempt to combat the iPhone with the marketing and branding of the Droid does anything to prevent them from carrying an iPhone and marketing it as a stand-alone Apple product that Verizon carries....like they do some of their other devices.



The original argument was that Verizon's advertising was an attempt at some draconian control over the manufacturers, which isn't the case and what I've been arguing against all along. All it is is a marketing campaign to battle the iPhone.

 

[iMaggot]

They're already hard at work to make the next iPhone WORSE than the previous one!

/s

Hey you never know, Look at what they do to the Apple TV

 

[xraydoc]

Just announce the damn Verizon iPhone already (if it's real) or deny its existence once and for all. I need to either hold out a few more months for a VZW iPhone or invest myself in my Android phone. But Apple is just beginning to irritate this long-time and otherwise loyal customer.

I wont change carriers - spent too long with AT&T which has done nothing but get worse where I live and work (in both my experience and the experience of friends and co-workers). VZW, on the other hand, has been highly reliable where I live and work.

It has to be VZW or nothing. I'm a doctor, and where I'm located, AT&T is too unreliable for me. Too many missed and dropped calls over the last 2.5 years on my iPhone 3G, 3GS and 4. I have a Verizon HTC Incredible currently and haven't dropped a call since I got it.

I'd much prefer to use an iPhone and give my money to Apple instead of Google, but right now I've got no choice. And unfortunately for Apple, the HTC Incredible isn't a bad device at all.

 

[kdarling]

... i would never buy a smartphone from Verizon, unless their network was as fast as ATT's and you could make phone calls simultaneously while surfing the web without Wi-Fi.

So, you're saying that you would never have bought the first EDGE-only iPhone model, because it was far slower than 3G phones and couldn't do simultaneous voice and data? Fair enough.

To what do you attribute its success, then? Certainly it wasn't the radio.

 

[bradl]

Just announce the damn Verizon iPhone already (if it's real) or deny its existence once and for all.

Or how about the media actually get the answer from a reliable source instead of using questionable/unreliable sources and 'analysts'. For example, This latest VZW sphiel can be quelled with 2 words:

China. Telecom.

You know.. big CDMA network over in China? Already has the iPhone 3G (s)?

Story

South China Morning Post

It's sad that everyone here things CDMA = Verizon or CDMA = Sprint, and that Apple + CDMA = Verizon. Apple has already proven that wrong by releasing a CDMA phone for China, and it's actually interesting that those models are coming up for a hardware refresh as well.. Coincidence??? I don't think so.

2012 will be the target for any thing capable of Verizon's needs, despite what the WSJ, or anyone in the media says.

Disclaimer: I know that the stories above come from other analysts, and I already told Mr. Kettle that he's blacker than my grandfather (his nickname was 'Black', because he was BLACK). But there you have it.

BL.

 

[Geckotek]

Or how about the media actually get the answer from a reliable source instead of using questionable/unreliable sources and 'analysts'. For example, This latest VZW sphiel can be quelled with 2 words:

China. Telecom.

You know.. big CDMA network over in China? Already has the iPhone 3G (s)?

Story

South China Morning Post

It's sad that everyone here things CDMA = Verizon or CDMA = Sprint, and that Apple + CDMA = Verizon. Apple has already proven that wrong by releasing a CDMA phone for China, and it's actually interesting that those models are coming up for a hardware refresh as well.. Coincidence??? I don't think so.

2012 will be the target for any thing capable of Verizon's needs, despite what the WSJ, or anyone in the media says.

Disclaimer: I know that the stories above come from other analysts, and I already told Mr. Kettle that he's blacker than my grandfather (his nickname was 'Black', because he was BLACK). But there you have it.

BL.

1) WSJ corrected their article to clarify that it's not just a CDMA iPhone. They are specifically reporting that Apple is building an iPhone for Verizon. (right or wrong....this is what they are reporting)

2) Apple most definately has NOT built a CDMA iPhone for China. Where did you get this idea? Apple has NOT sold a CDMA iPhone yet....for anybody.


The iPhone currently being sold in China is a GSM phone sold on China Unicom. But as your articles hint, there's a good chance China Telecom might get a CDMA iPhone. I think this is very possible if not probable. China Telecom is poised to surpass Verizon as the largest CDMA carrier in the world as they continue adding 3million CDMA users per month. (Gotta love the ppl that claim CDMA is dead.)

 

[MonkeyET]

Just announce the damn Verizon iPhone already (if it's real) or deny its existence once and for all. I need to either hold out a few more months for a VZW iPhone or invest myself in my Android phone. But Apple is just beginning to irritate this long-time and otherwise loyal customer.

I wont change carriers - spent too long with AT&T which has done nothing but get worse where I live and work (in both my experience and the experience of friends and co-workers). VZW, on the other hand, has been highly reliable where I live and work.

It has to be VZW or nothing. I'm a doctor, and where I'm located, AT&T is too unreliable for me. Too many missed and dropped calls over the last 2.5 years on my iPhone 3G, 3GS and 4. I have a Verizon HTC Incredible currently and haven't dropped a call since I got it.

I'd much prefer to use an iPhone and give my money to Apple instead of Google, but right now I've got no choice. And unfortunately for Apple, the HTC Incredible isn't a bad device at all.

I hear what you are saying regarding your needs, but I am leaning towards understanding here. From what I have heard, AT&T was the only one willing to go along with Apple to get their new device out. If they decided to run with it, have some problems, and work on those problems, how can you blame them?

I, too, would love a Verizon iPhone, but I don't blame Apple. They aren't the ones spreading the rumors. I would say that Verizon is creating more issues by responding that they are NOT getting the iPhone. They are only creating the implication that they are hiding something to come. If they ignored the question I would be less inclined to believe it may come to pass. Then again I could see Verizon doing so to entice people to sign up with them because they THINK the iPhone is gonna come to Verizon.

All I can say is that come January I will either have a pre-order or a Verizon iPhone in my hand; if not AT&T here I come.

 

[Geckotek]

I would say that Verizon is creating more issues by responding that they are NOT getting the iPhone. They are only creating the implication that they are hiding something to come. If they ignored the question I would be less inclined to believe it may come to pass. Then again I could see Verizon doing so to entice people to sign up with them because they THINK the iPhone is gonna come to Verizon.

All I can say is that come January I will either have a pre-order or a Verizon iPhone in my hand; if not AT&T here I come.

One of 3 things is going on here:

1) Verizon wants the iPhone and they either aren't in discussions w/ Apple but are willing to be so they take this stand to push Apple
2) Verizon wants the iPhone and they are in discussions w/ Apple and they are responding this way to get the upper hand in the negotiations
3) Verizon and Apple already have a deal and if this is the case, there's no way Steve will let Verizon make the announcement. Most likely this is a contractual agreement so when asked, this is the only way they can respond

 

[JAT]

So, you're saying that you would never have bought the first EDGE-only iPhone model, because it was far slower than 3G phones and couldn't do simultaneous voice and data? Fair enough.

To what do you attribute its success, then? Certainly it wasn't the radio.

Verb tense really does matter in the electronics industry. Claiming views held this year are invalid due to events 3 years ago is hardly worthwhile. Too many generations change what we can get.

What is with the strawman popularity??

 

[loganmickel]

Have you guys ever noticed?

When I first bought the original iPhone the advertising always showed Cingular in the top corner, when the 3G came out it said AT&T in the corner. Take a look at www.apple.com/iphone. What do you see in the corner? Absolutely nothing because, they are allowing other phone companies to use the iPhone. It's as simple as that.

 

[ajagor92]

Hey guys, just thought I'd chime in with something I've heard and see what ya'll think about it.

I live in Atlanta and the Senior VP of AT&T frequents my place of work with his family. They're great people and are always willing to help all of us out with free phones, etc.

I was talking to him a month or two ago and he told me casually that the iPhone was supposed to come to Verizon in March. Not sure how valid his information was but I do know that he just moved here a few months ago to take on this position.

 

[charlituna]

Absolutely nothing because, they are allowing other phone companies to use the iPhone. It's as simple as that.

"Other phone companies" also means all the ones not in the US. It does NOT equal anything this is claim of a Verizon iphone"

I was talking to him a month or two ago and he told me casually that the iPhone was supposed to come to Verizon in March. Not sure how valid his information was but I do know that he just moved here a few months ago to take on this position.

Given that this is another carrier I doubt he is in a position to know and is probably repeating water cooler talk. I wouldn't bank on it. Especially since coverage would require a new device and either it would be the iphone 4 (thus Verizon is always a model behind) or wait for the iphone 5 which will most likely continue the summer release schedule

 

[Geckotek]

"Given that this is another carrier I doubt he is in a position to know and is probably repeating water cooler talk. I wouldn't bank on it. Especially since coverage would require a new device and either it would be the iphone 4 (thus Verizon is always a model behind) or wait for the iphone 5 which will most likely continue the summer release schedule

I'm actually fairly certain that if we do see a CDMA iPhone, it will be on a different release cycle. This does a few things for Apple:

1) Eases manufacturing timelines
2) Provides additional hype/media coverage throughout the year
3) Allows them to give one carrier or another exclusivity on a feature release (AT&T to start, but they could switch it up as business needs change)

 

[alent1234]

Hey guys, just thought I'd chime in with something I've heard and see what ya'll think about it.

I live in Atlanta and the Senior VP of AT&T frequents my place of work with his family. They're great people and are always willing to help all of us out with free phones, etc.

I was talking to him a month or two ago and he told me casually that the iPhone was supposed to come to Verizon in March. Not sure how valid his information was but I do know that he just moved here a few months ago to take on this position.

and an AT&T exec would know the state of Apple/VZ negotiations

 

[kdarling]

and an AT&T exec would know the state of Apple/VZ negotiations

If the exec knew when exclusivity ended, he could have a pretty good idea of a possible timeline.

 

[MonkeyET]

Now that my Verizon contract has officially expired, the rumors are getting on my nerves. Confirm or deny and I will wait or jump to where I can get an iPhone. DUDE...

 

[Geckotek]

Now that my Verizon contract has officially expired, the rumors are getting on my nerves. Confirm or deny and I will wait or jump to where I can get an iPhone. DUDE...

I would think if they were 100% sure the iPhone wasn't coming, we'd see a denial from Apple so they could get the holdouts to jump over to AT&T. This has been an indication to me all along that at the very least they were in some sort of talks.

Unfortunately, we won't see any confirmations until Steve is ready to announce it.

 

[twoodcc]

well i sure hope that this happens. but yeah, i'll believe it when i see it. but i don't see why apple wouldn't want to do this anyways. i hate at&t more and more everyday

 

[linux2mac]

AT&T sucks for me in my region. All of my Verizon friends have solid connections. I am always getting dropped calls. I do not ever recall a friend with Verizon reporting a dropped call in my area. I will gladly switch!

 

[alent1234]

If the exec knew when exclusivity ended, he could have a pretty good idea of a possible timeline.

just because the apple/at&t contract expires doesn't mean verizon will get the iphone

 

[charlituna]

just because the apple/at&t contract expires doesn't mean verizon will get the iphone

Very wise words. After all, where's the CDMA ipad (which has no contract stopping them).

And where's the tech to support a CDMA or CDMA/LTE iphone. Sure there's lots of rumors of a tri band chip or even putting in two sim cards but it's just rumors. Nothing has really turned up to support these notions. Heck there hasn't been any talk about how difficult it would be to have an iphone that supports ATT and T-Mobile. Or whether Apple is talking exclusive with ATT for GSM (via only supporting said company) and exclusive with Verizon for CDMA, or simply unlocking the whole dang thing and letting it be anything goes.