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Verizon sales people are anti iPhone. What gives?
- Thread starter willimammoth
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The funny thing is that every time I go into my local Verizon store, the first thing I see is a huge iPhone 4 poster and a big display right in the middle of the store. I have never heard a salesperson say say anything negative about the iPhone.
if you fail at that you probably fail at a lot of things, first off a CDMA iPhone doesn't even work on 95% of the world
Actually what he said makes perfect sense. Why should I care if my phone works in Iceland or Turkey if I never expect to go? Unless I am planning an outing to the deserts of Nevada I am fine almost anywhere in the US.
Wrong.
I travel internationally over ten times per year. According to a United Airlines Pilot I know, there are nearly 200 international flights out of the USA per week. Of those approx 46% of the passengers are business travelers like myself.
In my company alone 23 of us use company issued AT&T iPhones that perform nicely when outside of the USA.
Nonetheless I have friends with Verizon iPhones that work equally well in the states where they live.
Exactly. As a regular consumer who never flies, it's easy for me to simply assume that "nobody flies that much out of the country" but I would obviously be wrong.
There's really no way of knowing unless you fly yourself, but it's easy to assume business oriented people fly all of the time.
Actually (factually) you are incorrect. The majority of citizens in the United States, do not regularly (or ever) travel overseas. This is likely true for the majority (clearly not all) of citizens of most of the countries around the world.
I travel a lot domestically and sometimes internationally for work. Nonetheless, I'm well aware that while there are hundreds of thousands of people like me in the US, the majority of Americans do not travel overseas for a variety of reasons. I do not have any sort of presumptuous judgement about this sort of thing, it's just something that is statistically true for most people around the world.
Same Experiences in the NW
I have had similar experiences at different Verizon kiosks in Vancouver, WA and Portland, Or. It has been so bad that one Verizon salesman told me (this was about two weeks ago) that he had friends that worked for Apple and that the iPhone 5 wouldn't be out for another 6 months at least! I could tell that was BS and instead of being completely annoyed that the guy was lying to me, I was more curious about this anti-iPhone fervor that seemed to be prevalent amongst Verizon sales people.
I asked one sales girl what kind of phone she had and she said iPhone. But then she said that although she really liked it, she had heard such great things about Android that I should get one.
I too have the original Droid and it died a little over a month ago. I decided to bite the bullet and use my insurance because I didn't want to buy a new phone just weeks before iPhone 5 came out. It must be that Verizon gives better commissions for Android devices. That is the only thing that explains the behavior to me!
I have had similar experiences at different Verizon kiosks in Vancouver, WA and Portland, Or. It has been so bad that one Verizon salesman told me (this was about two weeks ago) that he had friends that worked for Apple and that the iPhone 5 wouldn't be out for another 6 months at least! I could tell that was BS and instead of being completely annoyed that the guy was lying to me, I was more curious about this anti-iPhone fervor that seemed to be prevalent amongst Verizon sales people.
I asked one sales girl what kind of phone she had and she said iPhone. But then she said that although she really liked it, she had heard such great things about Android that I should get one.
I too have the original Droid and it died a little over a month ago. I decided to bite the bullet and use my insurance because I didn't want to buy a new phone just weeks before iPhone 5 came out. It must be that Verizon gives better commissions for Android devices. That is the only thing that explains the behavior to me!
Verizon is going to be pissed at Apple for this iteration, and it's why they're now siding with Samsung in the courts.
The iPhone 5 will have HSPA+, and for whatever network supports that, it will be listed as "4G." However, Verizon is not "4G" unless you're using their LTE network.
Basically, AT&T will advertise that they have the "4G" iPhone 5 while Verizon only has a "3G" iPhone 5.
The iPhone 5 will have HSPA+, and for whatever network supports that, it will be listed as "4G." However, Verizon is not "4G" unless you're using their LTE network.
Basically, AT&T will advertise that they have the "4G" iPhone 5 while Verizon only has a "3G" iPhone 5.
Hello everyone. Let me help you guys out. I sell phones, and have been since the release of the iPhone 4S. The reason why Verizon people are anti iPhone is profitability. Apple's pricing that they charge the carrier vs. The amount that you the consumer pay for the device does no favors for anyone except Apple. The iPhone is why we can't have unlimited data, why there are now 30 dollar upgrade fees, why you can no longer get a new every 2 credit, why they charge obnoxious prices on the basic phones, and why you have to wait a full 2 years before you can upgrade again. GSM phones are actually cheaper to make, which explains why you don't see much of these changes happening on other carriers. The Verizon and Sprint are the most expensive devices to make. Sprint offers unlimited data and overall cheaper pricing, but there is a serious drop off in service, especially when you aren't in metropolitan areas. Realistically, there should be a 3 year contract on iPhones. An extra year to turn the profit would solve everything.
Confirmed - northern Colorado Verizon rep was bashing iphone and trying to convince me to go with Android. He mentioned the iOS and hardware is old and Apple is losing ground in popularity. He also said 9 out of 10 people prefer Android phones over Apple lol.
Wrong. Unlimited data, or refusing to offer unlimited data, is solely a carrier decision. Smartphone users, regardless of the brand, use more data than feature phone users and that both scares the carriers (capacity issues) and delights them (charging more for less = profit!). The iPhone made the smartphone a mainstream product, and ONLY in that sense can you "blame" Apple. But then, maybe if Verizon would have maintained a proper upgrade path for CDMA early on, then they might not be in their current predicament.
WRONG. There were $30 upgrade fees before Apple came along. The "upgrade fee" is a cash grab by Verizon and other carriers to charge for "all the effort required" to activate a new phone. But in reality "all that effort" involves punching a few keys on a keyboard, or scanning a barcode... or in the case of the iPhone... nothing, because activation is handled by Apple through iTunes.
If anything, Apple can only be blamed for making it painfully obvious that the "upgrade fee" or "activation fee" is a complete sham.
Again, WRONG. This is solely a Verizon decision. And if it was because of Apple, then Verizon could've easily excluded Apple products from the NE2 program.
Oh, so Apple is now in a position to dictate what OTHER people charge or non-Apple products? Funny.
Right, Apple invnted the 2-year contract... which was in place before Apple was ever selling phones.
This is a textbook example of the misinformation that greed-driven salespeople are feeding customers.
The truth is, Apple does provide a commission model for carriers, and those rates are negotiated between Apple and the carriers. But Apple has more leverage than Samsung, Nokia, LG, HTC and others, because Apple has their own sales channel and could probably opt to sell the phones exclusively at Apple stores and online if they wanted to. As a result, they often can (and do) negotiate lower commissions than the average Android device. The result is that Verizon/AT&T/Sprint/T-Mobile sales people get something for every iPhone they sell, but it's not as much as an Android/Blackberry/Windows phone.
The common reactionary tactic to this by most less-ethical salespeople is to instead push whatever phone gives them the highest spiff that week. If Verizon isn't selling enough Droid RAZR MAXXes that month, you better believe that all of a sudden, the salespeople will talk up the Droid RAZR MAXX as being the best phone in the universe. Next week, that "best phone ever" will be the HTC One. Next week, the Nokia Lumia 920. Next week: the Blackberry Z10.
You can guess what this means: they have no actual concern about what is actually the right phone for you. To them, the "right phone for you" is whatever will pad their paycheck the most that day. If you've already made a decision on an iPhone, or other phone that won't give them as a big a commission, then they see their job as being to dissuade you from getting that other phone, and getting this phone, instead. Even if you're going to hate that phone.
And if the salesperson is a REAL slimeball, they'll gladly throw in outright lies to scare you into making the decision they want. And it'll sound exactly like the "Apple is the cause of everything you don't like about cell phone contracts" garbage quoted above.
If you MUST buy your phone at a Verizon/AT&T/Sprint/T-Mobile store:
- Stick to your guns.
- Don't believe a SINGLE word the salespeople tell you unless you've verified it yourself.
- Read EVERYTHING before you sign anything.
- Check your receipt before you leave, and check to make sure you have everything you intended to buy, no more, no less.
- At home, log into your account online and check your rate plan. Most store sales reps are not only under pressure to sell specific phone models, but also have to meet a quota on "feature upsells." This is where they try to sell you another line of service, or add insurance, or a text messaging or tethering package if you don't have one. It doesn't always happen, but, there have been cases where a salesperson in danger of not hitting their numbers (and getting penalized for it) will add features to your account even if you say no, or will do it without even asking, so that they can meet their quotas.
At the end of the day, I don't blame the salespeople. They're following rules that the carriers have set up. Some are stuck there because that's their only skill set, and others are just playing the game and earning all the money they can. But let the buyer beware: if you've already made up your mind about whatever model of smartphone you want to buy, and want to avoid the possibility of getting shafted, you should order it online (or if iPhone, go to an Apple store).
And if you haven't made up your mind what phone you want, then you really should do your research online before you buy anything, or visit a store, but JUST look around, and make no commitments to buy anything until you've decided for yourself.
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MacRumorZ!
Hey, at least he searched. If he had started a new thread about this, some Jenius with a capital J would chime in about how there was already a thread about it...
Then the old thread would be rehashed anyway, along with the new (possibly locked thread). So we'd have two threads for the NEXT time someone searched, and they'd only be able to respond to the old one.
This guy just saved a bunch of steps and zombified the old one now, all so he could tell us how Apple is the cause of cancer and the reason for terrorism.
Hooray?
Well duh. I think this salesperson alluded to where all the extra "costs" were going pretty well in his post: zombie plague research.
By charging carriers (just think about that word "carriers") more for the iPhone, and forcing salespeople to push products no one needs, just to make a buck, Apple prepares them for the coming zombie apocalypse by sharpening their sales skills!
Think about it: in a zombie outbreak, only the strong will survive.
And you have to be EXTREMELY strong to sell a Blackberry Fail or a Windoze 8000.
Thanks for prepping the world Apple!
Wrong. Unlimited data, or refusing to offer unlimited data, is solely a carrier decision.
True. Verizon has decided that since they are making less profit from the iPhone, they would try to make it up with the 3% of smartphone users on their network that go over 2GB. You kinda helped my point there.
WRONG. There were $30 upgrade fees before Apple came along.
Wrong. The $30 upgrade went in place on April 22, 2012. Verizon released their iPhone 4 in February 2011.
Again, WRONG. This is solely a Verizon decision. And if it was because of Apple, then Verizon could've easily excluded Apple products from the NE2 program.
But if people are still gonna buy the iPhone anyway, does that really solve the problem? They have to gain profitability from somewhere right?
Oh, so Apple is now in a position to dictate what OTHER people charge or non-Apple products? Funny.
Didn't say that. Again, they have to gain a profit from somewhere.
Right, Apple invnted the 2-year contract... which was in place before Apple was ever selling phones.
Just recently, within the last couple of weeks actually, Verizon changed from offering upgrades from 20 months to 24 full months now. Why? The reason 2 year contacts exist is so you, the consumer, get a better deal upfront while the carrier makes a nice profit on the back end. Most phones take 12 months before the carrier begins to turn a profit. The iPhone, however, takes......you guessed it 20 months. Again, it's all about profitability.
Verizon/AT&T/Sprint/T-Mobile sales people get something for every iPhone they sell, but it's not as much as an Android/Blackberry/Windows phone.
You're wrong about this one too. Most corporate store sales reps get paid based off of the features and not the unit itself. This actually makes it in a lot of cases more advantageous for the rep to sell you an iPhone, as often times, there are features and accessories that are iPhone specific, thus, helping them reach their goals. Most indirect retailers (Target, Best Buy, etc) are not paid commission, and if they are, it's usually an even playing field for them. Basically, they get the same amount selling you a 64GB iPhone as they would a flip phone.
The common reactionary tactic to this by most less-ethical salespeople is to instead push whatever phone gives them the highest spiff that week. If Verizon isn't selling enough Droid RAZR MAXXes that month, you better believe that all of a sudden, the salespeople will talk up the Droid RAZR MAXX as being the best phone in the universe. Next week, that "best phone ever" will be the HTC One. Next week, the Nokia Lumia 920. Next week: the Blackberry Z10.
Somewhat true. Often times, again depending on where you go, the sales rep has the ability to play around with the pricing, and ultimately give you a really good deal, while still hitting their sales goals. Due to the lack of profitability on the iPhone, if that person is struggling, they may need to lean you elsewhere. Again, it depends on where you go.
All in all, I'm not suggesting that Apple is making all these rules. What I'm saying is Verizon is a very will ran company, and they will do nothing that is not in their favor. All of these changes that have transpired have been due to the ever growing popularity of the iPhone on there network. Fun fact: the iPhone was originally supposed to be exclusive to Verizon, but when Apple and Verizon sat down and Apple gave Verizon their numbers, Verizon backed out of the deal. It wasn't profitable enough. In the last 2 years that Verizon has had the iPhone, we've seen all sorts of changes that have either cost consumers more money, or have made buying a smartphone less advantageous. And as far as the sales representatives go, more often then not, we actually are trying to help you. We want you to leave happy so we can continue to get your business, as well as have you refer all of your friends and family to us. Yes, there are some shady people, but those people get weeded out very quickly. Besides, it's 2013 now. We are smart enough to realize that you can do all of your fact finding online.
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Apple is somewhat losing ground. The sales of the Galaxy S3 jumped when they announced the iPhone 5. I wouldn't say 9 out of 10 though.
True. Verizon has decided that since they are making less profit from the iPhone, they would try to make it up with the 3% of smartphone users on their network that go over 2GB. You kinda helped my point there.
WRONG. There were $30 upgrade fees before Apple came along.
Wrong. The $30 upgrade went in place on April 22, 2012. Verizon released their iPhone 4 in February 2011.
Again, WRONG. This is solely a Verizon decision. And if it was because of Apple, then Verizon could've easily excluded Apple products from the NE2 program.
But if people are still gonna buy the iPhone anyway, does that really solve the problem? They have to gain profitability from somewhere right?
Oh, so Apple is now in a position to dictate what OTHER people charge or non-Apple products? Funny.
Didn't say that. Again, they have to gain a profit from somewhere.
Right, Apple invnted the 2-year contract... which was in place before Apple was ever selling phones.
Just recently, within the last couple of weeks actually, Verizon changed from offering upgrades from 20 months to 24 full months now. Why? The reason 2 year contacts exist is so you, the consumer, get a better deal upfront while the carrier makes a nice profit on the back end. Most phones take 12 months before the carrier begins to turn a profit. The iPhone, however, takes......you guessed it 20 months. Again, it's all about profitability.
Verizon/AT&T/Sprint/T-Mobile sales people get something for every iPhone they sell, but it's not as much as an Android/Blackberry/Windows phone.
You're wrong about this one too. Most corporate store sales reps get paid based off of the features and not the unit itself. This actually makes it in a lot of cases more advantageous for the rep to sell you an iPhone, as often times, there are features and accessories that are iPhone specific, thus, helping them reach their goals. Most indirect retailers (Target, Best Buy, etc) are not paid commission, and if they are, it's usually an even playing field for them. Basically, they get the same amount selling you a 64GB iPhone as they would a flip phone.
The common reactionary tactic to this by most less-ethical salespeople is to instead push whatever phone gives them the highest spiff that week. If Verizon isn't selling enough Droid RAZR MAXXes that month, you better believe that all of a sudden, the salespeople will talk up the Droid RAZR MAXX as being the best phone in the universe. Next week, that "best phone ever" will be the HTC One. Next week, the Nokia Lumia 920. Next week: the Blackberry Z10.
Somewhat true. Often times, again depending on where you go, the sales rep has the ability to play around with the pricing, and ultimately give you a really good deal, while still hitting their sales goals. Due to the lack of profitability on the iPhone, if that person is struggling, they may need to lean you elsewhere. Again, it depends on where you go.
All in all, I'm not suggesting that Apple is making all these rules. What I'm saying is Verizon is a very will ran company, and they will do nothing that is not in their favor. All of these changes that have transpired have been due to the ever growing popularity of the iPhone on there network. Fun fact: the iPhone was originally supposed to be exclusive to Verizon, but when Apple and Verizon sat down and Apple gave Verizon their numbers, Verizon backed out of the deal. It wasn't profitable enough. In the last 2 years that Verizon has had the iPhone, we've seen all sorts of changes that have either cost consumers more money, or have made buying a smartphone less advantageous. And as far as the sales representatives go, more often then not, we actually are trying to help you. We want you to leave happy so we can continue to get your business, as well as have you refer all of your friends and family to us. Yes, there are some shady people, but those people get weeded out very quickly. Besides, it's 2013 now. We are smart enough to realize that you can do all of your fact finding online.
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Apple is somewhat losing ground. The sales of the Galaxy S3 jumped when they announced the iPhone 5. I wouldn't say 9 out of 10 though.
I don't really see how. Carrying the iPhone was entirely Verizon's choice; if they didnt like the terms, they could've continued to say no. Sprint would've loved that, I'm sure.
You're right; before that it was $18. But correlation does not infer causation in this case: a more commonly-accepted reason for the fee change was because AT&T upped their fees, first. Collusion-like rate and fee increases between the top two wireless carriers DO have a hisotircal trend that can be tracked. "Because of Apple," not so much.
What problem? That Verizon's $110.9 billion in revenue for 2011 wasn't big enough for them? Some problem. Sorry, Apple isn't putting them in the poor house, at all. All the fee increases have been a cash grab to see what the market will bear. If you want to blame a single model of phone for everything that Verizon has done that is anti-consumer, than either you've drank the Kool-Aid, or have a comission to earn.
Your arguments also fail to explain why carriers like T-Mobile and Sprint don't feel the need to enact such onerous policies and fees even though they too, are selling iPhones.
No, I'm actually very much right about wireless carrier employees getting commissions on activations, and it does vary by which model of phone they sell.
You're contradicting yourself by saying the above, and then claiming my statement is false.
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I never had this happen. Actually when I go into a verizon store they usually try to get me/whoever I am with to buy an iphone. Seems they do the same for everyone as there are usually a few others in the store and they all either tell them about the iphone or ask what they are interested in and go from there.
I skimmed the thread. But when I worked for Verizon we'd basically get paid more commission from top tier Android phones. iPhone was one of the worse especially since at the time it wasn't LTE. Accessories played a big roll, it was actually a complicated system.
If a SALES PERSON is trying to convince you to buy a different product then another its because the SALES PERSON will benefit. Why will would they (me at one time) bother? Lol
I would have preferred to sell only iPhones. Less returns, easier to explain, less to worry about. Only thing I liked about it were all the accessories, but all we sold was absolute crap accessories for some reason!
If a SALES PERSON is trying to convince you to buy a different product then another its because the SALES PERSON will benefit. Why will would they (me at one time) bother? Lol
I would have preferred to sell only iPhones. Less returns, easier to explain, less to worry about. Only thing I liked about it were all the accessories, but all we sold was absolute crap accessories for some reason!
Of course phone salesmen are paid by manufacturers to push customers towards phones brands like Samsung.
http://www.asymco.com/2012/11/29/the-cost-of-selling-galaxies/
There's a special term for the commission, but I can't remember it. Brightpoint, the phone wholesaler and distributer has a page on their website showing commission rate offered by manufacturers for each phone.
Edit. It's a spiff.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spiff
http://www.asymco.com/2012/11/29/the-cost-of-selling-galaxies/
There's a special term for the commission, but I can't remember it. Brightpoint, the phone wholesaler and distributer has a page on their website showing commission rate offered by manufacturers for each phone.
Edit. It's a spiff.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spiff
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