Vision Pro 2 May Now Be in Production Ahead of Launch Later This Year

[jimscard]

Apple hasn't come up with a compelling reason to buy the first one, so what's the use of building a successor.

There are plenty of businesses that have very compelling use cases and have deployed AVPs.

Clearly, there’s enough to take it to the next level.

There’s a lot of money to be made from spatial computing devices that have nothing to do with consumers or games or any of the like.

 

[Larry-K]

No question mark required....

Yep, not a question, just a statement.

 

[svish]

Don't know when the next one will be released. Not expecting anything to change other than an upgrade to M5/M4 chip. Will be nice if Apple can reduce the price and expand its availability.

 

[antonrg]

Here's what will make this product fly (in my limited opinion of how things work)
1) Get rid of the front EyeSight. It's over developed and adds unnecessary weight.
2) Work with the best developers to create a "PRO" AR creators studio app. Make this thing MAKE sharable AR experiences.
3) Bang out a ton of media, not just a few movies from Disney or AT+, work all 3D Movies into this experience.
4) Make watching media WITH others who are wearing this, in person, or from other remote locations.
5) Make it $2000 or less.

OK that could work for many, including myself actually. Until then, that's a no from me.

 

[subjonas]

But what about the rest of the family? They can't see the theater on your face. Is the AVP demographic mostly single people, or for folks that don't interact much with other house members? This isn't an attack or sarcasm, I'm seriously asking because that's a major drawback of the AVP to me. Besides the price, AVP is very isolating...unless that's what you want.

Do individuals in families never watch media alone? I’m sure many do as there are different tastes, different schedules, etc. A laptop, phone, headphones, any personal device—are all isolating, that’s the inherent nature of a personal device. There are times and places to use them.

 

[Ianblackburn]

Here's what will make this product fly (in my limited opinion of how things work)
1) Get rid of the front EyeSight. It's over developed and adds unnecessary weight.
2) Work with the best developers to create a "PRO" AR creators studio app. Make this thing MAKE sharable AR experiences.
3) Bang out a ton of media, not just a few movies from Disney or AT+, work all 3D Movies into this experience.
4) Make watching media WITH others who are wearing this, in person, or from other remote locations.
5) Make it $2000 or less.

That’s a pretty good list. I’d add sports to it - if they can get to a point of having live immersive sports (I know that’s very challenging) then it’s a game changer (literally). It was a shame they lost out on coverage rights for the FIFA Club World Cup because that could have been an interesting opportunity (having said that, that tournament is looking like a flop currently), but really any live immersive sports would be really cool to see.

 

[JosephAW]

It’s like owning the original iPhone, it’ll be obsolete by the third generation

 

[NeonNights]

Do individuals in families never watch media alone? I’m sure many do as there are different tastes, different schedules, etc. A laptop, phone, headphones, any personal device—are all isolating, that’s the inherent nature of a personal device. There are times and places to use them.

Yes, but with those other personal devices I don't go in a closet to use them, which is the feeling of putting on AVP to watch a movie -- you shut out everyone else. It is different when you're watching something personally yet still open and available to interact with the dog or people around you. It is interesting to me how certain aspects of AVP are antisocial (this coming from an introvert), or some would prefer to see it as private or an escape from their surroundings.

 

[surferfb]

Yes, but with those other personal devices I don't go in a closet to use them, which is the feeling of putting on AVP to watch a movie -- you shut out everyone else. It is different when you're watching something personally yet still open and available to interact with the dog or people around you. It is interesting to me how certain aspects of AVP are antisocial (this coming from an introvert), or some would prefer to see it as private or an escape from their surroundings.

You don't shut everyone else out though (unless you want to). I have watched TV shows on it sitting next to my wife while she does something else. I can see her, hear her, she can ask questions, I can respond.

Only difference is instead of watching a show on the TV, the entire wall the TV is on is the TV.

 

[turbineseaplane]

You don't shut everyone else out though (unless you want to). I have watched TV shows on it sitting next to my wife while she does something else. I can see her, hear her, she can ask questions, I can respond.

Only difference is instead of watching a show on the TV, the entire wall the TV is on is the TV.

Eesh .. I'm a friend and I really enjoy your opinions and passion on topics, but I'll be honest..

I really want no part of living like that with my spouse/sig. other, etc

Maybe a function of my age, I don't know ...

My friend groups have all started (as of last year) going "no phones allowed" when we hang out and it's been revelatory and a major positive move. I want less of this tech stuff getting in the way of my actual human interactions, not more.

Of course, to each our own, but hopefully that counter view shines at least a small light on why many of us have such profound disinterest in all angles of the AVP concept.

 

[surferfb]

Eesh .. I'm a friend and I really enjoy your opinions and passion on topics, but I'll be honest..

I really want no part of living like that with my spouse/sig. other, etc

Maybe a function of my age, I don't know ...

My friend groups have all started (as of last year) going "no phones allowed" when we hang out and it's been revelatory and a major positive move. I want less of this tech stuff getting in the way of my actual human interactions, not more.

Of course, to each our own, but hopefully that counter view shines at least a small light on why many of us have such profound disinterest in all angles of the AVP concept.

I'd just say there's a time and a place for everything. We're a "no phones at the dinner table" family; that doesn't mean I never use a phone. Same sort of thing here.

I never use the AVP in front of my almost 4 year old. Even in instances where it'd help me focus - if there's a chance he runs into the office then I stick with the old-fashioned monitor. Same if my wife and I want to watch something together - that's on the TV. But, if I'm watching a show my wife has no interest in (like, pretty much any sporting event), she'd actually prefer me to use the AVP so she doesn't get distracted while she reads her book or scrolls reddit or whatever. I can still see her, hear her, and if she wants to have a conversation then I pause the show and take it off - not much different than pausing the TV to have the conversation.

My only point was I think there is the misconception that if you're wearing the device you might as well be in a sealed chamber with no interaction with the rest of the world. That couldn't be further from the truth - the device doesn't actually isolate you unless you want it to.

 

[turbineseaplane]

the device doesn't actually isolate you unless you want it to.

A good clarification I appreciate you making 👍

 

[Rychiar]

But what about the rest of the family? They can't see the theater on your face. Is the AVP demographic mostly single people, or for folks that don't interact much with other house members? This isn't an attack or sarcasm, I'm seriously asking because that's a major drawback of the AVP to me. Besides the price, AVP is very isolating...unless that's what you want.

I'm single so I love it lol. But even still does everyone really watch tv together all the time? sure maybe some stuff but kids go to bed early and many times husbands and wives have different interests 🤷‍♂️ ya can always buy more AVPs lol

 

[Baslea]

It's not like AVP1 didn't flop as hell...

 

[OGdrknight]

I’m game if they could reduce the size and weight with lower cost version, but that is wishful thinking I guess..

 

[teejaysplace24]

The AVP typifies Apple’s longstanding lack of self-awareness. After the runaway success of iPod/iPhone, Apple decided it didn’t want to be a niche company and has largely focused its attention on things that deliver mass returns, while relegating erstwhile core products — desktop Macs and pro software — to hobbies. The problem with the AVP is that it’s very much a niche product that Apple has conceived for and marketed to mainstream consumers. So rather than being a useful tool for, say, 3D designers, its primary function is to create a virtual desktop experience, which has very little practical use to almost anyone. So several years in, we are still asking the question: who is this for and why would they pay for it?

The obvious solution is for Apple to focus its attention on, as @turbineseaplane said, 1st and 3rd party software and turn the AVP into an actual professional device, rather than just something that uses “Pro” in its name for marketing purposes. The problem, as I see it, is that would require Apple to understand the AVP as a niche product whose sales appeal, for the considerable future, is going to remain limited. It would also require them to redeploy considerable development resources to areas, such as pro software, that it has long ago abandoned. The Apple of 25 years ago would have understood how to accomplish that. Whereas the Apple of today only understands the formula that’s made it rich: release superficial updates, sell more units, repeat as often as possible. If that’s truly all Apple is willing to do, then the AVP is already a failed product.

 

[Richard700]

Serious question: can anyone here provide actual feedback from using the AVP? Looking for real world feedback on whether or not it is useful or a magical improvement over iPad / Macs? Looking for input from those that are actually using it. I ask, because I might dabble with it on v2, but only if others are seeing real purpose in it.

I received mine a week after launch - I've only bought one other Apple product at launch (iPad).
I was initially impressed with the concept and execution for a first try at a truly different way of interfacing with a computer. My first interaction with computer interfaces started 60 years ago with punch cards, later a teletype machine, then command line interface on a CRT, and then a graphical interface on a flat panel (taken for granted now, but it was a shock at the time to go from a CRT to Apple's first flat screen monitor).
The state of currently available software is not quite up to a virtual interface yet. There were some programs and demos that preview the potential of what it could be in the future.
I could use it to replace my computer, but to just do the same stuff on the Vision Pro just doesn't make sense for me and my work flow right now.
I do really like it for media consumption. Spatial video is great, 3D movies are great, even regular video.
Apple TV has a Metallica concert in spatial video, and it was incredible.
It does get uncomfortable after a couple of hours.
The battery does run out of power after a movie (I usually watch while plugged in, or attached to an additional battery pack).
It could have higher resolution screens and/or higher res pass thru cameras to totally complete the illusion of reality.

 

[richinaus]

So glad most people on macrumors don’t actually dream and create products with a vision.

 

[subjonas]

Yes, but with those other personal devices I don't go in a closet to use them, which is the feeling of putting on AVP to watch a movie -- you shut out everyone else. It is different when you're watching something personally yet still open and available to interact with the dog or people around you. It is interesting to me how certain aspects of AVP are antisocial (this coming from an introvert), or some would prefer to see it as private or an escape from their surroundings.

Headphones absolutely shut out everyone else. Some like AirPods do have pass through, but that only solves half the problem. The other half is that others don’t know if you can hear them or not. Apple tried to solve both halves of the problem with the VP by adding pass through and Eyesight. So you can choose to use it in isolation or use it still connected to your environment. You can see everyone and everything around you, and like with other personal devices, you can stop looking at your content at any moment and make eye contact with anyone in your vicinity. Your eyes are represented virtually but functionally it’s the same as wearing scuba goggles. The goggles don’t block any senses/communication, but they can be strange and even off-putting for some, and of course not appropriate in all situations (but neither is having one’s laptop or phone out appropriate in all situations). So then it’s not really a question of isolation but more of social etiquette, which for new technologies can take time to establish (eg. texting used to be considered much more impersonal than it is today, and phablets used to be considered silly but now normal). Some people find the VP socially acceptable in more situations than others, but only time will tell what the mainstream decides (if the VP ever goes beyond a niche).

 

[richinaus]

Headphones absolutely shut out everyone else. Some like AirPods do have pass through, but that only solves half the problem. The other half is that others don’t know if you can hear them or not. Apple tried to solve both halves of the problem with the VP by adding pass through and Eyesight. So you can choose to use it in isolation or use it still connected to your environment. You can see everyone and everything around you, and like with other personal devices, you can stop looking at your content at any moment and make eye contact with anyone in your vicinity. Your eyes are represented virtually but functionally it’s the same as wearing scuba goggles. The goggles don’t block any senses/communication, but they can be strange and even off-putting for some, and of course not appropriate in all situations (but neither is having one’s laptop or phone out appropriate in all situations). So then it’s not really a question of isolation but more of social etiquette, which for new technologies can take time to establish (eg. texting used to be considered much more impersonal than it is today, and phablets used to be considered silly but now normal). Some people find the VP socially acceptable in more situations than others, but only time will tell what the mainstream decides (if the VP ever goes beyond a niche).

Spot on.
Of course its levels of isolation. My partner and I watch TV with AirPods in for a better sound experience [and noise cancelling]. Watching the same thing on a headset with passthrough still engaged is barely any different.

Also here is the thing I find concerning. If people think their communal family time is watching content on a screen then this makes me sad. We just watch programmes and movies we want to watch to wind down. Eating dinner at the table, and having a conversations about the day etc is much better than sat on a sofa watching a screen and talking about that. During that time there are no phones, headphones or any other technology.

Choose the right time to engage with the tech, rather than assuming it is isolating, as it isn't. A phone is not that much different doom scrolling with headphones on, or sitting at work looking at a monitor with headphones on.

 

[Howard2k]

I can’t imagine this product being a bi-annual upgrade. Who could afford that?

Do you upgrade all of your other Apple devices every time a new one is released?

 

[johnsawyercjs]

Well, if i didn't break a wall by running fast and blind against it, it'll probably be advisable, to backup some further distance and running up again faster against the now even thicker wall? - NOT really!

Turn on your passthrough cameras!!

 

[lilkwarrior]

I remain convinced there’s no way Apple expects this product to continue to cost more than the average American’s monthly take home pay.

…Majority pf Apple’s prosumer products like the Vision Pro aren’t for the “average Anerica” and are priced accordingly for well over a decade.

Pro Display XDR, Mac Pro, Mac Studio, iPad Pro, iMac Pro, and Macbook Pro certainly aren’t for them either

 

[lilkwarrior]

Yes, but with those other personal devices I don't go in a closet to use them, which is the feeling of putting on AVP to watch a movie -- you shut out everyone else. It is different when you're watching something personally yet still open and available to interact with the dog or people around you. It is interesting to me how certain aspects of AVP are antisocial (this coming from an introvert), or some would prefer to see it as private or an escape from their surroundings.

…A headset if fundamentally a personal and private device as a huge pro instead of con.

You can always mirror what you’re seeing on an Airplay device

Being a mixed reality device with pass through of what’s going around you, there is not proven interacting with your dog and aware of your surroundings while using it unless your canvases obscure what’s going on around you with the device intelligently allowing reality to pass through if people/things overlap with your experiences.

 

[surferfb]

…Majority pf Apple’s prosumer products like the Vision Pro aren’t for the “average Anerica” and are priced accordingly for well over a decade.

Pro Display XDR, Mac Pro, Mac Studio, iPad Pro, iMac Pro, and Macbook Pro certainly aren’t for them either

But Displays, iPads, Macs and MacBooks don't start at $3500. Individual products, sure, but not the product line. That's my point.

The product line starts much much lower. If the cheapest Mac you could get started at $3500 and the price never went down, you would have significantly fewer developers making apps for Mac because the addressable market would be tiny.

If Apple expects Apple Vision to be as big as a deal as iPads, then they can't start at $3500. If Apple is content with Apple Vision being as big of a deal as the Pro Display XDR, then sure. But I don't think Apple is investing all of this time, money, and resources to make devices (and spending significant money and resources on content that is exclusive to those devices) that are as popular as the Pro Display XDR.