VM Windows gaming on M series MBP? eGPU?

[Rico Muerte]

Hi guys,

So currently my 2 x daily machines are a 5,1 cMP (2 x 3.46, 64Gb, 580), & a 2012 non retina MBP (2.6 i7, 16Gb).
Obviously both much older machines & limited as to what OS they can run natively.
Ive been wanting to get a Windows machine for gaming & learning some modding/game making...I really dont want to have 2 desktops & a laptop.

My question is this - would the current top of the line M series MBP have enough performance to run Windows via VM (assuming there is no better/more efficient way of running windows currently?), AND be able to game via Windows/VM?
Would eGPU support be available for the VM Windows?

Im considering buying the current top of the line M3 & having that as my only machine (keeping the MBP as a backup/spare, but getting rid of the 5,1).
I would expect/hope to get at least 5-10 years out of the machine...

Also just for clarity, I am in no ways a "pro" user & would not need that much power/performance normally, it's purely to run Window/games via VM as well as possible.

Thanks in advance

 

[leman]

My question is this - would the current top of the line M series MBP have enough performance to run Windows via VM (assuming there is no better/more efficient way of running windows currently?), AND be able to game via Windows/VM?

If Microsoft improves the performance and compatibility of their ARM to x86 translation layer, maybe. I wouldn't' count on it though.

Would eGPU support be available for the VM Windows?

No.

 

[Barbabenno]

You can do gaming, but it depends on your expectations and the kind of games you want to play. I've played Windows games in a VM using Parallels on an M1 Macbook Air, and that works if the games have fairly modest graphics requirements. I could play Wolfenstein New Order fine (although there was one graphically buggy area at the beginning).
Not all Windows games will run.
There are compatibility lists on the Internet, such as https://www.applegamingwiki.com/wiki/M1_Parallels_Windows_compatible_games_list

 

[dmr727]

Crossover has worked surprisingly well for me (you're gonna want Parallels, but I'd imagine the performance to be the same), with surprisingly good performance on older games (Fallout, Skyrim, etc) using my M1 MBA. I'd imagine a decked out M3 MBP will meet your modding/coding needs pretty comfortably.

Both Parallels and Crossover offer a 14 day trial, so you'll have a chance to test out whatever software you're looking to use before making any kind of commitment.

 

[MRMSFC]

To your first question:

The short answer is : No.

The long answer is: It’s complicated.

I have had some success using UTM to run Windows 98 and XP to run some old old games that I own and have ripped the assets off the CDs.

I have also had some success running less intensive games through Parallels and Crossover.

With that said, it has been very spotty with compatibility and I have had to troubleshoot quite a bit. And that’s not counting the performance hit from running the layers of emulation.

And to your second question about external GPU support:

The answer is flat no.
The M series does not support external gpus.

For your money, I would suggest that you’re better off building a mid-range PC, and using a MacBook Air for your needs.

The game performance would be similar, and you stated that you don’t need pro performance for your Mac.

 

[haralds]

I use Parallels Desktop on my M1 PowerBook 13" (16GB/2TB) and M1 Ultra Studio (64HB/4TB) running Windows 11. I use both Steam and GOG. The performance is quite good for even some modern games. I've even run Balduar's Gate 3 on low settings. Not great, but it worked. It's not as good as the native version released later. Make sure you have at least 16GB of RAM.

I've also used Crossover and Whisky, which outperform Parallels in a few circumstances.

We do development targeting Windows, macOS, iOS, and Android. Most of the developers use Mac with Parallels Desktop and they perform well. I have not run into any ARM64 Windows X64 app issues that people claim. Their translation looks just as efficient as Roasetta2.

Have a look at YouTube. Several videos are showing Macs running Windows games, testing framerates, etc.
Mac is not a replacement for a high-end gaming machine, but it looks like a midrange machine for most Windows apps. Microsoft now fully supports Windows 11 on a VM on macOS.

 

[vigilant]

Hi guys,

So currently my 2 x daily machines are a 5,1 cMP (2 x 3.46, 64Gb, 580), & a 2012 non retina MBP (2.6 i7, 16Gb).
Obviously both much older machines & limited as to what OS they can run natively.
Ive been wanting to get a Windows machine for gaming & learning some modding/game making...I really dont want to have 2 desktops & a laptop.

My question is this - would the current top of the line M series MBP have enough performance to run Windows via VM (assuming there is no better/more efficient way of running windows currently?), AND be able to game via Windows/VM?
Would eGPU support be available for the VM Windows?

Im considering buying the current top of the line M3 & having that as my only machine (keeping the MBP as a backup/spare, but getting rid of the 5,1).
I would expect/hope to get at least 5-10 years out of the machine...

Also just for clarity, I am in no ways a "pro" user & would not need that much power/performance normally, it's purely to run Window/games via VM as well as possible.

Thanks in advance

That's a multi-headed dragon you are trying to build so let me break this down for you.

For the vast majority of what people do running Windows on an Apple Silicon Mac shouldn't be an issue. I had an M1 MacBook Air that was faster than my "lab tablet" a Surface Go 3, and was beating the rest of the Surface product line at that time when running Geekbench in Windows.

Let's take gaming out of the picture for a moment though, because depending on how you define it, your mom playing Solitaire technically makes her a gamer.

Depending on what you are trying to do, have you validated that there are no Mac tools to let you do that for the Mac? CrossOver has come a very long way, and I'd have to think that for any gap in performance you find in a virtualized version of Windows maybe able to be overcome by using CrossOver. Especially since CrossOver supports using Apple's Rosetta translation layer to accelerate running Windows code on the Mac.

In terms of your question on eGPU that's a harder one to answer. Theoretically sure... assuming of course Apple's hypervisor framework allows for a single piece of hardware it "COULD" be done if your VM solution of choice supports it. But again, you'd be using Microsoft's translation layer, which isn't bad for day to day use, can't say for certain how it would do for any modern gaming.

With that said, there's plenty of videos online of people trying to play video games in Parallels alone. I saw one where with CrossOver someone was getting what appeared to be great frame rates from Cyberpunk. But your mileage may vary.

For gaming with CrossOver, I have to imagine they are using Valve's Proton compatibility layer which has been keeping people on the Steam Deck very happy. For that matter, you may want to look at Steam Deck.

 

[venom600]

For the moment, forget Parallels. It doesn’t support DirectX 12. You want to use Crossover 24, which supports D12 and even older 32bit games. They have a demo, but if you want something free that uses the underlying Wine technology, try Whisky. It works very well for what it is. Andrew Tsai on youtube has a fantastic channel that deals specifically with running games on Apple Silicon.

 

[ader42]

Been running Win11 under VMWare on an M1 Max for a few Steam games such as Satisfactory which runs fine.