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MP 7,1 Waiting for Mac Pro 7,1 A1991 (no more)
- Thread starter Mago
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this is great, for years we had to choose between Bluetooth OR full KB, never both at the same time unless 3rd party, in which case the stock KB coming with an iMac purchase would be wasted. This is only a 25 dollars addition and it even comes with Asian language layouts at no charge.In other good news today, they now sell the magic keyboard with a num pad!
Oh pipe down. Whether you need something or not is up to the individual and not you with your personal distinction between enthusiast or professional. Depends what your metric is. If it’s specifically quarter mile times then yes, your Camaro ‘edged’ it. Period.
If Apple aimed it at you then fine, doesn’t mean you do or don't need it.
Well of course we're assuming the iMac Pro will be great, but it is too soon to say. For one I'll have to be convinced about the effectiveness of the cooling system and whether the CPU and GPU are thermally throttled. For my part, I wouldn't buy an all-in-one workstation, neither from Apple nor HP's Z1, even though they look so cool. But of course, not everyone is me.
Indeed. AIO's are fine, until they break. Had to carry my iMac four times to the Apple Store. Vowed that I would never buy another one.
But yeah, it's a nice bit of kit. I'm just hoping the sell the dark keyboard and mouse separately at some point.
Interesting, I schlepped my old white Core2Duo iMac across three continents in an iLugger, hauled in the trunk of a car on unpaved backroads in Africa, subjected it to the gentle probing of airport security, and ten years later it is still going strong.
Running SnowLeopard, which means that Apple has pretty much made it useless and obsolete, and its saving grace is third-party apps like Firefox and Open Office. But the hardware is still running smooth and quiet even under load. The only thing that feels slow now is the HDD.
In fairness, I hardly ever use it anymore, but it sits there on a desk in the guest room, and just keeps going.
Running SnowLeopard, which means that Apple has pretty much made it useless and obsolete, and its saving grace is third-party apps like Firefox and Open Office. But the hardware is still running smooth and quiet even under load. The only thing that feels slow now is the HDD.
In fairness, I hardly ever use it anymore, but it sits there on a desk in the guest room, and just keeps going.
OK let's think about it for a moment. People that would be OK with a non-upgradeable workstation, would also be OK with an upgradeable one. It also goes without saying that the opposite does not stand true. Hence, the mMP will be a superset regarding customer needs. So, if an apple upgradeable/modular workstation is coming what is the purpose of such an AIO machine ?
No, I don't see it. There is only one factor that I can think of; a different price range.
or will be an entirely (for good) different Animal, with maybe dual GPU, dual CPU and 6+ memory sockets.
But certainly the iMac Pro covers and satisfies all the current tcMP user needs (quiet, updated 300W-class single GPU, l8 core Xeon, 4 DIMM sockets), even for less , but is not the tcMP update for those on the edge. its likely HP' Z AIO on apple tuxedo, but not a Z Tower Workstation.
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No, Kronos was developing a Vulkan to Metal transpiler, theoretically Vulkan devs will only need to add some headers and recompile on Xcode.
Has anyone spotted that iMac Pro has non user replaceable RAM?
no, it has 4 full size DIMMs, look at the thermal management image, it showns it at the left side (on backwards).
Note the new KL iMac 5K also has 4 user accessible so-dimm.
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https://9to5mac.com/2017/06/05/imac-pro-ram-and-space-gray-accessories/
Additionally, Apple has confirmed to us that the RAM in the iMac Pro will not be user-replaceable. This shouldn’t come as too big of a surprise given Apple’s other recent products, but nevertheless it means users are stuck with however much RAM they purchase from Apple. Currently, the 27-inch iMac features user-upgradeable RAM, while the 21.5-inch model does not.
Badum tss
Interesting, the iMac pro with 48 PCIe lines available could offer 4x single header TB3 ports (ussualy a TB3 header is shared among 2 ports), using 16 PCIe lines, it also allows 2 NVMe plus a 10GBit Ethernet controller and leaves 4 PCIE lines for WiFi/USB.
This its a deal on a TB3 build arround workstation, you can share a single TB3 header among 6 devices only, you can daisy chain 3/3 1/5 to each port but can exceeed 6 total by header, with single header on a single port you only account the # of device on each port not on each header, it also applies to bus bandwidth.
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This its a deal on a TB3 build arround workstation, you can share a single TB3 header among 6 devices only, you can daisy chain 3/3 1/5 to each port but can exceeed 6 total by header, with single header on a single port you only account the # of device on each port not on each header, it also applies to bus bandwidth.
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this article is not true, maybe wont be officially 'user accesible-replaceable' but as the tcMP CPU its user accesible/replaceable as you remove some screws, its obvious you'll need to remove the iMac Pro's back to reach it.https://9to5mac.com/2017/06/05/imac-pro-ram-and-space-gray-accessories/
Additionally, Apple has confirmed to us that the RAM in the iMac Pro will not be user-replaceable. This shouldn’t come as too big of a surprise given Apple’s other recent products, but nevertheless it means users are stuck with however much RAM they purchase from Apple. Currently, the 27-inch iMac features user-upgradeable RAM, while the 21.5-inch model does not.
Badum tss
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You have to disassemble iMac to get to the RAM, and other parts. You have to take out laminated screen first to get access to parts.
It is not user replaceable.
doesnt seems backlit to me
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I think Apple could include a little plastic windows to easy this, we must create a petition on this.
[doublepost=1496751685][/doublepost]I'm not sure is about this cooling system seems weaker than the thermal core for a ~500W TDP
i think that many people simply prefer the form factor of an AIO.
putting upgradeability/tinkering factors aside, you're faced with owning a computer and a display... or just a display.
a lot of people think the display only is better..
i would guess many more people think AIO is a more practical form factor than those who would think a separate housing is better.
for example-- look how many people around here are against external expansion and insist expansion should be happening inside the computer housing.. aside from display, this is also an all-in-one preference.. i think at this forum in particular you'll find a large group of people who are against an AIO form factor while at the same time, not realizing they're actually arguing for an AIO form factor --- aside from display..
this is (possibly) one of the reasons nMP didn't catch on. it relied too heavily upon external expansion for customizations.. people wanted it to be all-in-one instead.
I didn't say I like the cost (for an iMac form factor) or the idea, just that is seems like a logical step for Apple. I got tired of waiting for Apple to get it's act together so I'm on a PC now.
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Unless you are very lucky, good luck with that. Sent him an email a little over a year ago and I'm still waiting for a reply...
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Just Wonderful. Apple just loves to make things more difficult and expensive for the users and then they don't understand why we complain.
Get used to this, or change platforms. It is that simple for them.
Using our preference towards cMP over tcMP as evidence of preference towards AIO is, I am afraid, wrongly placed. The main benefit of a workstation being in a single tower housing is to minimize distance between critical computing components so that their inter-connection is as fast, as reliable, as efficient as possible. tcMP's usage of Thunderbolt, an external I/O to achieve the same proved to be a failure because of the reliance of 3rd party adoption of the interface didn't happen to the degree that the nMP simply couldn't serve the same needs as the cMP could.
Whereas the iMac form factor, which the iMac Pro takes 100% into itself, is to include not just the core computer but also the primary output device into it. If this was a design 20 years ago perhaps the input devices, the keyboard, would also be stuck on top. The benefits of such approach is space saving, even less risk in cable failure, serviceability and transport, style or even ergonomics. The traditional workstation has swayed away from this form factor for 2 primary reasons: heat envelope that a singular chassis entails, and the not uncommon use-case of the need to keep the computer away from the user's environment. These 2 factors are both important enough to make the iMac Pro a deal breaker in some use-cases, which ironically the tcMP didn't have.
I don't care much for AIOs as well but this machine looks sweet.
I'm waiting for the mMP but I wouldn't count on it being ready early 2018 anyway, so another year+ of waiting I guess.
Space Grey looks nice too, and the new keyboard - bout time. Too bad you can't get those separately.
The iMac Pro design could have changed a bit (I prefer the TBD design myself, but that's just me), but not much, still looks great.
Hardware wise, top of the line.
It will be hard to bet by mMP, Purley maybe?
If the mMP starts slipping (2019+) I guess I'll have to bite the bullet and get one of these. Great display and great hardware, what's not to like.
I do have some concerns regarding the 1 billion colors they claim. Seems it's dithered, no actual different colors.
I'd assume this would be, at this time, a 10bit panel, with HDR and all the bells and whistles.
[doublepost=1496764326][/doublepost]Metal 2 and eGPU are steps in the right direction too.
I'm waiting for the mMP but I wouldn't count on it being ready early 2018 anyway, so another year+ of waiting I guess.
Space Grey looks nice too, and the new keyboard - bout time. Too bad you can't get those separately.
The iMac Pro design could have changed a bit (I prefer the TBD design myself, but that's just me), but not much, still looks great.
Hardware wise, top of the line.
It will be hard to bet by mMP, Purley maybe?
If the mMP starts slipping (2019+) I guess I'll have to bite the bullet and get one of these. Great display and great hardware, what's not to like.
I do have some concerns regarding the 1 billion colors they claim. Seems it's dithered, no actual different colors.
I'd assume this would be, at this time, a 10bit panel, with HDR and all the bells and whistles.
[doublepost=1496764326][/doublepost]Metal 2 and eGPU are steps in the right direction too.
Lets do this!
8-core E5-1600 v5 - likely around $600
32 GB ECC DDR4 - lets go with $500 (2666 MHz doesn't seem to be available yet in ECC, but 2400 MHz is $400)
1TB SSD - Lets say $700?
Vega GPU - Prices haven't been announced (to my knowledge), but how about $500?
PSU - $200
Case - $500
Peripherals - $200
Screen - $1000
That's $4200 as a pretty top end estimate. Several of those estimates could be cut by $100 or so. So say $800-$1000 or about 20%-25% extra worth it to you to not build it yourself or buy from a custom builder where the cost would be closer to the parts, and you have officially supported macOS? Probably. Its a decent deal, if it fits your needs. I'm not going to argue that.
My concern with it really just comes from the high entry point. $5000 sits a long way above a very well configured iMac (which is around $3300). A six core with maybe a 500GB SSD could have come in around $4000-$4500 (Thinking a $200-$300 dollar drop in raw material cost for each leads to a $500-$1000 drop in price). That would have been an easier to swallow step up from the $3300 iMac. But then Apple isn't in the business of making thing easy to swallow.
A $4000 iMac Pro would also leaves a little more space for an entry level Mac Pro around the same price point or a little lower. As it is now, I'm fearful they will go hog wild on the Mac Pro and we'll see a $5K-$6K entry level price. It might be a wonderful machine (Duel Vegas? Xeon Gold processors, maybe two of them standard?), like the iMac Pro seems to be, but it would leave a lot of users in the entry level workstation market out in the cold (which the iMac Pro also does with its IAO form factor and high price point).
Anyway, the iMac Pro is tempting, but having that much firepower tied to a display is just not my style.
These are some big assumption leaps. I can't argue or agree to them, you could be totally off target as well as nail it. I don't know. I just have a constant feeling lately, that apple is trolling us.
No, I don't believe I will. And I don't recall addressing you specifically. Either way -
It's not up for debate that there are some people who *earn a living with their machine & benefit from workstation/server grade hardware to do it* will you dispute that? I think not.
It's also not up for debat that some of us *do not* fall into that category but we enjoy having the performance and power of a Mac Pro at our disposal. Not sure you can dispute that either.
Not sure what your point was in general....those two statements above have nothing to do with what I was talking about. The iMac Pro as a product does not in one single way harm either person in either of those two categories. If anything, it's a sign that Apple is finally moving in the right direction. Something like the iMac Pro is exactly what many have been asking for, and is the perfect machine for many enthusiasts and professionals alike. The hand-wringing and the unhinged anger unleashed in response has been, at best, disturbing. The people who very badly want or need a modular, upgradeable no-holds-barred professional workstation will also get their product...this changes none of that, this impacts them in no way, shape or form.
So, I'd advise you to pipe down instead, if you're simply going to pile on the foot-stomping bandwagon about a product that was never even aimed at you in the first place.
Isn't the latest iMac with Kabylake i7 4.2GHz and Radon 580 5Gb just that?
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If Apple puts a Pro tag on something, the price point is always above the regular consumers desire, right?
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Nope, Apple will stay Apple, and not become another PC. Sorry to blow your bubble..
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I don't think the iMac Pro's price point is going to make much of a difference to the Mac Pro's. Until we actually see what form it takes, it's just speculation on what niche it will fill. The iMac Pro's niche, meanwhile, is pretty easy to understand—for the people who were fine with the AIO form factor (clearly the vast majority of professional users) but wanted even more power, you've got it.
The fact that they belatedly decided to keep going on the Mac Pro suggests to me that they don't think that the iMac Pro is actually going to cannibalize that audience by much. Apple just made the choice of whether it was going to chase that segment in the future; apparently they're still interested.
The fact that they belatedly decided to keep going on the Mac Pro suggests to me that they don't think that the iMac Pro is actually going to cannibalize that audience by much. Apple just made the choice of whether it was going to chase that segment in the future; apparently they're still interested.