Waiting for Skylake MBP thread

[ekwipt]

Is the Clevo build to order the same as the razer?

http://www.xoticpc.com/sager-np9870s-clevo-p870dmg-p-8798.html

What a beast of laptop

 

[TechZeke]

Is the Clevo build to order the same as the razer?

http://www.xoticpc.com/sager-np9870s-clevo-p870dmg-p-8798.html

What a beast of laptop

Not sure how this is even comparable. This a 2-3" thick, 10.6 lb behemoth with 2 hours of battery life. Not a powerful thin-and-light like the Razer, XPS, or rMBP.

Can't imagine this even remotely appeals to the same audience.

 

[Dean Yu]

Is the Clevo build to order the same as the razer?

http://www.xoticpc.com/sager-np9870s-clevo-p870dmg-p-8798.html

What a beast of laptop

Not sure if squeezing desktop components into laptops brings any benefits other than minimum speed bump. Its SSDs are dope though. RAID 0 950 pro...

 

[NJPT]

Cannonlake is scheduled for H2 2017, but who knows if or when the appropriate mobile chips will come out for Kaby Lake.

This has been discussed ad nauseum before, but there's simply no way Apple is waiting for Kaby Lake to update the MBP line. Production roadmaps leaked to Benchlife show Kaby Lake U series chips with GT3e not arriving until weeks 6-18 of 2017, meaning the earliest a Kaby Lake 13" MBP could arrive would be February 2017. GT4e chips appropriate for 15" MBPs weren't even on the roadmap, indicating at least some time after that.
Source: http://wccftech.com/intels-10nm-can...ies-q3-2016-kaby-lakes-desktop-chips-1h-2017/

Meanwhile, we have info from Ming-Chi Kuo that new MacBook models of some kind are arriving by June. Digitimes and Economic Daily News have both claimed new thinner 13" and 15" models by the June-July timeframe. Digitimes and Economic Daily News are hit or miss when it comes to accuracy, but Kuo is extremely reliable. At this point, all indications logically point to Apple releasing Skylake MBPs around WWDC.

 

[Uni Grad]

This has been discussed ad nauseum before, but there's simply no way Apple is waiting for Kaby Lake to update the MBP line. Production roadmaps leaked to Benchlife show Kaby Lake U series chips with GT3e not arriving until weeks 6-18 of 2017, meaning the earliest a Kaby Lake 13" MBP could arrive would be February 2017. GT4e chips appropriate for 15" MBPs weren't even on the roadmap, indicating at least some time after that.
Source: http://wccftech.com/intels-10nm-can...ies-q3-2016-kaby-lakes-desktop-chips-1h-2017/

Meanwhile, we have info from Ming-Chi Kuo that new MacBook models of some kind are arriving by June. Digitimes and Economic Daily News have both claimed new thinner 13" and 15" models by the June-July timeframe. Digitimes and Economic Daily News are hit or miss when it comes to accuracy, but Kuo is extremely reliable. At this point, all indications logically point to Apple releasing Skylake MBPs around WWDC.

I'm really hoping that they DO release it this WWDC, however those expected thinner 13" and 15" models could just be Retina MacBooks. It's stated that those are thinner than MacBook Airs, so it could just be new rMBs.

 

[itsamacthing]

Apple's required to maximize shareholder wealth and right now the iPhone is their gravy train. Not the notebook of desktop..

I agree with you. I'd go for a 17 but am sure the 17 MBP is dead. So I hope they just remove the bezels on the new MBP to give a 16" I don't care about thinner lighter I need the power, the present version is thin enough. If they can do both fine. But to those willing to sacrifice performance for thinner/lighter you are the trolls and need to go to the MBAir area.

That's brilliant, I didn't think about that.. They can remove bezel and give us 16!!! Love this idea!! Fingers are crossed

 

[ENGINEjark]

anyone know if this razor core will work with current MacBooks that has thunderbolt 2 ?? or is it only for thunderbolt 3? which would suck... I would love that eGPU with Macbook. That would be spectacular!

 

[WRONG]

Looks like after all, Apple did make an April's Fool to all us...
"Ehy, I really can't wait to see how Apple will celebrate its 40 years anniversary! It's going to be amazing"

A pirate flag and a party with beer.
Yeeeeeeh....

 

[nolorian]

Meanwhile, we have info from Ming-Chi Kuo that new MacBook models of some kind are arriving by June. Digitimes and Economic Daily News have both claimed new thinner 13" and 15" models by the June-July timeframe. Digitimes and Economic Daily News are hit or miss when it comes to accuracy, but Kuo is extremely reliable. At this point, all indications logically point to Apple releasing Skylake MBPs around WWDC.

Don't forget that Mark Gurman said that new MacBooks are coming at WWDC, or even earlier (April or May).

 

[soulforsoup]

My bets are on WWDC. Could tie in with any new features OSX will have.

 

[Dean Yu]

This has been discussed ad nauseum before, but there's simply no way Apple is waiting for Kaby Lake to update the MBP line. Production roadmaps leaked to Benchlife show Kaby Lake U series chips with GT3e not arriving until weeks 6-18 of 2017, meaning the earliest a Kaby Lake 13" MBP could arrive would be February 2017. GT4e chips appropriate for 15" MBPs weren't even on the roadmap, indicating at least some time after that.
Source: http://wccftech.com/intels-10nm-can...ies-q3-2016-kaby-lakes-desktop-chips-1h-2017/

Meanwhile, we have info from Ming-Chi Kuo that new MacBook models of some kind are arriving by June. Digitimes and Economic Daily News have both claimed new thinner 13" and 15" models by the June-July timeframe. Digitimes and Economic Daily News are hit or miss when it comes to accuracy, but Kuo is extremely reliable. At this point, all indications logically point to Apple releasing Skylake MBPs around WWDC.

I heard the KabyLake GT4e HQ chips have 256 MB of DRAM. Do they really? Cannot imagine what will change after DRAM being doubled...

 

[mjs402]

Don't forget that Mark Gurman said that new MacBooks are coming at WWDC, or even earlier (April or May).

Erma gerd. I read about this awhile ago but it scares me a bit if I'm honest. If they shrink the MacBook Pro to below the Air, how the hey are we going to put an Iris Pro 580 in the larger model!? I want my Iris Pro 580 and TB3 damn it Apple.

 

[Serban]

anyone know if this razor core will work with current MacBooks that has thunderbolt 2 ?? or is it only for thunderbolt 3? which would suck... I would love that eGPU with Macbook. That would be spectacular!

The razer core will be compatible only with the all upcoming Mac models (macbooks, imac, i hope they will update the mac mini and mac pro as wel this year)

 

[koyoot]

I heard the KabyLake GT4e HQ chips have 256 MB of DRAM. Do they really? Cannot imagine what will change after DRAM being doubled...

They will have 2x128 MB with double the bandwidth, because it will work like dual channel. So If we have currently 50GB/s on EDRAM KabyLake will have 100 GB/s. Also this feature can be used for VR as a operating cache for each display, for reduced latency. It will be similar thing for GT3e, however that GPUs will have 2x64 MB of EDRAM with 100 GB/s.

Biggest change in the GPUs of KabyLake is the architecture which without the increased bandwidth on EDRAM brings 20% higher performance in the same core count. I think overall, GT3e and GT4e should be 40% faster than Skylake counterparts.

 

[Dean Yu]

They will have 2x128 MB with double the bandwidth, because it will work like dual channel. So If we have currently 50GB/s on EDRAM KabyLake will have 100 GB/s. Also this feature can be used for VR as a operating cache for each display, for reduced latency. It will be similar thing for GT3e, however that GPUs will have 2x64 MB of EDRAM with 100 GB/s.

Biggest change in the GPUs of KabyLake is the architecture which without the increased bandwidth on EDRAM brings 20% higher performance in the same core count. I think overall, GT3e and GT4e should be 40% faster than Skylake counterparts.

Can we expect some performance upgrade from Iris Pro 580? Will it be as radical as the difference between Iris 5100 and Iris pro 5200?

 

[koyoot]

Can we expect some performance upgrade from Iris Pro 580? Will it be as radical as the difference between Iris 5100 and Iris pro 5200?

I do not know what you are asking about .

Do you ask about performance difference between GT2 and GT4e? Or between Skylake GT4e and KabyLake GT4e?

If the second option, as I have written, I think 72 core GT4e KabyLake GPU will be around 40% faster than GT4e Skylake(Iris Pro). We do not know the core counts, yet, they may be even higher, with better architecture, and higher bandwidth. So the differences can be bigger. But if we talk about new architecture and higher bandwidth on the same core count it should be 40% faster, but that is my estimate, because we do not know how increased bandwidth also will affect the performance of new architecture of the GPUs.

 

[Dean Yu]

I do not know what you are asking about .

Do you ask about performance difference between GT2 and GT4e? Or between Skylake GT4e and KabyLake GT4e?

If the second option, as I have written, I think 72 core GT4e KabyLake GPU will be around 40% faster than GT4e Skylake(Iris Pro). We do not know the core counts, yet, they may be even higher, with better architecture, and higher bandwidth. So the differences can be bigger. But if we talk about new architecture and higher bandwidth on the same core count it should be 40% faster, but that is my estimate, because we do not know how increased bandwidth also will affect the performance of new architecture of the GPUs.

With a slight overclocking and, most importantly, 128MB DRAM, Iris Pro 5200 excels 5100 by a considerable margin.....
So I was wondering if dual-channel 256MB DRAM can bring same level of performance upgrade (pre-DRAM to DRAM) for Kabylake GT4e, and you are right anyway
However I think the compute unit count will be the same, which is 72 CU. Maybe a little clockspeed boost?

 

[j1104638]

The razer core will be compatible only with the all upcoming Mac models (macbooks, imac, i hope they will update the mac mini and mac pro as wel this year)

To be fair, you never know.

For example, hotplug does not work with Apple Thunderbolt Ethernet adapter in Windows (7, haven't tried 10 yet) and Linux - you need to turn rMBP off, plug it in, and then back on. Plugging it in in Linux (at least in Fedora) while running recently led to kernel panic.

Booting Fedora with Apple Thunderbolt Display leads to wrong display being wrongly initialized and you end up hanged forever while booting. Plugging it in while running, on the other hand, lets ethernet through but does not activate the display itself.

AFAIR, the problem is that Apple's Thunderbolt implementation is a little different to the standard specification and Linux guys are tired of fixing bugs of the differences appearing here or there because Apple didn't adhere to the standard contrary to other producers like Lenovo.

What I'm trying to say is that most likely Razer Core will fulfill its main function - e. g. allow hardcore playing in Windows and/or hardcore computing in Linux on the eGPU. But the aesthetics of it functioning might be much worse than non-Apple (and I'm not saying it should be exactly Razer) PCs and laptops - there might be no hot plug, it might be impossible to run external display and internal display simultaneously etc.

 

[koyoot]

With a slight overclocking and, most importantly, 128MB DRAM, Iris Pro 5200 excels 5100 by a considerable margin.....
So I was wondering if dual-channel 256MB DRAM can bring same level of performance upgrade (pre-DRAM to DRAM) for Kabylake GT4e, and you are right anyway
However I think the compute unit count will be the same, which is 72 CU. Maybe a little clockspeed boost?

I genuinely have never heard of OC'ing the Intel iGPUs. Interesting

 

[hakonik]

Most egpu solutions that are on the way are either proprietary or at least require some small tinkering from the computer manufacturer in order to work. So the situation seems to be that if Apple for some reason does not want a 3rd party tb3 egpu box to work, then it simply will not. At least without hacking or cramped experience (no hotplug etc.). And the Apple's moneymaking possibilities for making an own egpu box or settling a deal with 3rd party producer are good. It may not be big money but takes only small effort, margins are good and such box can be sold for iMac and maybe MacMini users as well.

Unlike before, the current top igpu (Iris 580 Pro) seems to be so good that better performance would only be required for gaming, video editing, 3d, VR and maybe some smaller niches. MBPs are mostly sold for slightly lighter work (photography, design, audio, dev, showing off in Starbucks etc.). Apple is not interested on gamers, at least on OSX. Video editing and cad/3d work is not something that users do on the go that much and those people have used to plug external hard drives and carry all kinds of gadgets anyway. Also VR currently and in near future needs more than just a laptop or discreet glasses to work. So having an egpu would not be that big a deal for those on the need of more graphics processing power than igpu can offer. For them the possible dgpu might still be not enough.

My point is that it might be best_for_Apple to keep their lineup slim and focus on making the laptops slimmer and making small, but easy money with egpu boxes on the side. Of that few, most would still think that the dgpu Apple is offering is not enough and rather have an egpu box instead. I personally don't mind about the size that much and I hope that there will be dgpu option.

So my official guess for the high end MBP are:
- Iris 580 and no option for dgpu
- Apple will use Skylake Xeon processors, since the price is about the same as for i7, but they have more "Pro" credibility in it and make the comparison between PC offerings and Mac more difficult.
- 2xUSB-C/TB3, Audio and SD stays. Hopefully HDMI and one old style usb as well.
- magsafe stays or they will have similar safety detach one way or another.
- thinner bezel = 16" screen or smaller dimensions than previously. I hope for the former but would bet for the latter.

- Apple's own egpu unit sold separately, comes bundled with a AMD Polaris (maybe 1-3 options). Or they have a deal with AMD having the egpu unit that will only work with a very limited selection of gpus. I would bet the latter, since egpu is a nerdy techy stuff and Apple may not want to have their skin tarnished with such.


P.S. Competitors are pushing VR and Apple is looking quite uninnovative in every other field as well, unless they come out with something big. iDevices are not enough by themselves to fool people think they are somehow special if they have one. In the long run Apple needs all the creative people that use the Macs for maintaining their brand, even if the Macs form just a small portion of the sales. All Apple computers are in need of a refresh simultaneously. Maybe there is something big coming?

 

[NJPT]

I'm really hoping that they DO release it this WWDC, however those expected thinner 13" and 15" models could just be Retina MacBooks. It's stated that those are thinner than MacBook Airs, so it could just be new rMBs.

This is true, but I'd say those reports of 13" and 15" models thinner than MBAs can mean only one of two things:
1. Either those models are MBPs (most likely), or;
2. MBPs are being renamed to MBs.

It's incredibly doubtful Apple plans to release both 15" MBs and MBPs, as Apple has never shown interest or indicated it sells 15" laptops in enough volume to justify having two separate lineups of them (such as MBs and MBPs). I mean, they have a hard enough time keeping one lineup of 15" laptops alive (hence the 350+ pages of this thread).

 

[Hey Mac]

No, please, no super-thin rMBP...
I imagine it with something like 2 usb-c ports and that's it!!

 

[doitdada]

No, please, no super-thin rMBP...
I imagine it with something like 2 usb-c ports and that's it!!

It's a portable computer, not a hub.

 

[Alakagom]

It's a portable computer, not a hub.

And you got Macbook for exactly that

Pro size is perfect as it is now, removing the bezels would have changed whole game and everyone would view it as complete redesign alone.

 

[Serban]

i want slimmer and lighter, and yes with an option external GPU. that will be perfect for all the macs, all the macbooks, mac mini and even for the imac