I'm due an upgrade now for my 2014 MacBook Pro but until they come out with a keyboard that isn't terrible I holding out or going to windows. I just don't get why apple has made this design choice for the pro device as I'm sure most of us would be happy to have an extra 3mm of thickness and have keys that have some movement back.
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Waiting for the 2018 MBP
- Thread starter benface
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How do all of you people wanna go Windows? That's a serious question. For me, also owning an iPhone, iPad, Apple Watch, Apple TV, etc. and using MANY macOS only apps I could simply not pull it off. Factor in a lot of the usability features that make using Windows such a pain like the lack of Time Machine, Tabs in Explorer, Hierarchical Column View in Explorer, Expanding Folders in Column View in Explorer (so that you can see the contents of multiple folders at once instead of just one). These things would drive me insane.
Plus no FCPX, no BBEdit, no iWork, no Mail with features like MailDrop that I use all the time to send big attachments without having to think about it... the list goes on ad infinitum.
So yeah... rather than just say it... have you people REALLY thought this through? I like the XPS 15 hardware myself, for example. But for the reasons listed above there's simply NO WAY IN HELL I switch to Windows.
I was going to but I saved the money towards the price increase that might accompany the 2018 Macbook Pro. Sorry.
That's your problem right there, you're "sure" of something that you have no way of knowing.
FWIW I would guess that just as many users like the new keyboard better and especially that the vast majority doesn't care either way.
I think the point where I'd stand on the matter is, the amount of people who disliked the 2014 keyboard would be far less than those who disliked the 2016 keys. So if we ignore whether one prefers 2014 or 2016 keys we may have for example a situation as follows:
2014 keyboard:
95% happy
5% unhappy
2016 keyboard:
75% happy
25% unhappy
Even if of the 75%, if majority preferred the 2016 to 2014, the problem is that to do this, you had to alienate a lot of users.
I can't remember ever reading of people having issues with the old keyboard. Now don't get me wrong, that doesn't mean one should not improve it - let's say, a camera, which even when most camera technology on iPhones are complaint free, they still work to improve it. However, the keyboard change is conflicting with another goal which is thinness. We aren't changing the keyboard with the ultimate goal for it to be a better typing experience, but to make the laptop thinner and then try make the best typing experience with the thinness in place.
Is the thickness that much of a problem? The laptops were so thin and light as it was - and I would have no problem with it getting thinner or lighter if it didn't affect other area's of the laptop. I think such compromises are better suited to a laptop which suffers from being bulky or heavy compared to the competition.
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People were just used to the old keyboards. Why complain about something when there is no alternative? Now there is an alternative and some users complain, most don't. You just have no data on how many prefer the old keyboards and how many prefer the new ones.
I used dome keyboards, then I tried something new, mechanical. Despite being used to dome, I was happy with the mechanical keyboards and stuck to them.
Prior to 2014 MacBook, I used non-chiclet keyboards so the 2014 MacBook was different then. However I had a pleasant experience.
It isn't just people refusing to change, sometimes people don't have good experiences - and we have to accept Apple or any company can make mistakes. We even had butterfly v2 to try overcome some of the issues of v1, and I'm sure there will be more iterations to come before it holds the same status as the 2014 and earlier keyboard. One day they'll get there, but it's sad that such a key part of the laptop has to go through this teething period.
There's no real problem. Some people don't like the shallower key travel, while many more seem to either love it or don't particularly care. It's also a little bit louder than previous generations, but I wouldn't go as far as saying it's actually too loud. Compared to regular desktop keyboards it isn't at least.
It is not only a perception/preference problem, liking o not liking the new keyboard.
It is also a problem of reliability.
The new keybord seems to be more prone to failing than the previous design. Just look at this forum, only here we have dozens of threads of people having non working keyboard that lead to have their MBP repaired or entirely swapped even multiple times...
It is also a problem of reliability.
The new keybord seems to be more prone to failing than the previous design. Just look at this forum, only here we have dozens of threads of people having non working keyboard that lead to have their MBP repaired or entirely swapped even multiple times...
more people are buying the computers so more complain, pretty simple. I have seen this site change a lot over the years in terms of complaints, and all I can say is every new Mac I get is better in terms of design and build quality than the last.
Love the thinness and the keyboard - best Mac ever for me. But I can also understand why others don't like it - but you can't please them all.
It is supposed, that in each new generation/version of machines, we should go forward...
With all I read here and in other similar topics too, I am not sure if this path is really a good evolutionary course...
I don't believe it is a matter that some people will always complaint in any case. Or that some people will feel unsatisfied in any case.
Maybe it is about the high expectations of such machine?
But I don't find it so reasonable to still talk about keyboards, trackpads, ports etc, in 2017-2018.
I mean, if I would expect to hear about problematic situations, I suppose this would concern newer technologies...
If we still talk about the convenience or quality etc, of standard subsystems, then something seems to go wrong.
Apple may believes that formulates the laptop trends, but it should listen to its users, and also not just make changes to tell that something changed....anything should be really grounded and beneficial for a good reason...
With all I read here and in other similar topics too, I am not sure if this path is really a good evolutionary course...
I don't believe it is a matter that some people will always complaint in any case. Or that some people will feel unsatisfied in any case.
Maybe it is about the high expectations of such machine?
But I don't find it so reasonable to still talk about keyboards, trackpads, ports etc, in 2017-2018.
I mean, if I would expect to hear about problematic situations, I suppose this would concern newer technologies...
If we still talk about the convenience or quality etc, of standard subsystems, then something seems to go wrong.
Apple may believes that formulates the laptop trends, but it should listen to its users, and also not just make changes to tell that something changed....anything should be really grounded and beneficial for a good reason...
I don't think that they changed anything for the sake of simply changing it. Reasons for making it thinner are clear, and since there's no performance loss then why not? USB-C is also pretty clear, even if a bit inconvenient currently.
And I don't think we should judge by a forum/reddit if an issue is truly serious or not. Sure, it can be an indication, but oftentimes it's only natural that people with problems go on forums to complain. You'll never see threads that say "I love the new Macbook" as frequently as some complaint threads and that's human nature. Doesn't mean ignore everything negative, but definitely take it with a pinch of salt.
No reason for making both line of laptops thin and underpowered.
There is a clear performance loss in making the MBP so thin. Making it thicker you could have used more powerful hardware: better CPU better GPU bigger battery
And using USB-C for powering the laptop means inferior hardware...no 50 60 80 TDP GPU
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I am in the same boat. I can live with the "way too large" trackpad (affects palm rejection) but the keyboard destroyed my productivity due to it getting stuck a lot. I don't even have the problem of pain/loud clicks as others have, because I am a soft typist.
Even on the 2013 model, this is really no problem. My son has it and he is constantly editing 4k videos. I hear that one can do this on the new iPads, too.
By chance was playing some 4k vide earlier on my 2014 model and there was a large CPU load fans spinning up etc. Those machines will play 4k - but I would not describe it as 'no problem'.
I would like to wait but we never know when we die so I ordered one.
Yeah but this is how it's always been on Macbooks. Previous models didn't have the most powerful components possible either. In relative terms they've always been at the same level, which is also true now.
So if Apple's goal is to keep the performance where it is now, then making it thinner makes sense when you can.
Well for starters I am not 100% into the Apple ecosystem so it's less of a change for me. I do have a iPad but it's just a web browser really for me. Don't get me wrong I still think macOS is better than windows 10 and I have enjoyed the speed and stability of it for the last 11 years since I became a Mac user but windows 10 is equally as quick these days but maybe not quite as table or secure. I'm a software developer and mainly C# (FYI for those who aren't dev's MS has open sourced a lot of .Net so you can develop on linux and Mac) so I don't really make use of the creative apps and I also prefer MS office on Mac or windows to iWork.
My biggest problem with the current MacBook Pro is like others have said the keyboard isn't designed to be a great keyboard it's designed to be thin and I think this is not sometime the pro machine should be focused on. They have the MacBook and MacBook Air for making the thinnest machine possible.
Getting away from a midrange GPU means either a VERY thick and heavy machine or possibly a 17". Even Razer only gets a GeForce 1060 into their 14" Razer Blade - their Blade Pro does have a GeForce 1080, but that's an 8 lb 17" machine (it's beautifully built like a Mac, and impressively thin and light for its size) with a 250 watt power adapter, and it's over $4000.
Some of the 17" workstations also get higher-end GPUs in, although the 15" versions are limited to the same level of GPU Apple uses.
Essentially everything else that uses upper-level GPUs is very thick, heavy, generic Sager and Clevo gaming hardware. These machines are poorly built, over 8 lbs for a 15" (some of the 17" versions are actually heavier than the 21" iMac), and have no battery life. Some of them actually use TWO power adapters.
Apple probably has no philosophical objection to building something like the Razer Blade Pro, but they just think it wouldn't sell a ton of units and isn't worth the development effort. Even the Razer Blade Pro is not all that much lighter than a 21" iMac once you include the adapter ... I don't think Apple would ever build a junky 15" gaming machine an inch and a half thick, just to get a big GPU in there
Some of the 17" workstations also get higher-end GPUs in, although the 15" versions are limited to the same level of GPU Apple uses.
Essentially everything else that uses upper-level GPUs is very thick, heavy, generic Sager and Clevo gaming hardware. These machines are poorly built, over 8 lbs for a 15" (some of the 17" versions are actually heavier than the 21" iMac), and have no battery life. Some of them actually use TWO power adapters.
Apple probably has no philosophical objection to building something like the Razer Blade Pro, but they just think it wouldn't sell a ton of units and isn't worth the development effort. Even the Razer Blade Pro is not all that much lighter than a 21" iMac once you include the adapter ... I don't think Apple would ever build a junky 15" gaming machine an inch and a half thick, just to get a big GPU in there