Waiting for the 2018 MBP

[skogkatt]

Have you guys seen these ones?


ASUS ZenBook Pro 15 https://www.asus.com/Laptops/ASUS-ZenBook-Pro-15-UX550GD/
HP Envy 13 Laptop http://www8.hp.com/us/en/campaigns/envylaptops/overview.html

C'mon Apple, your move now

 

[leman]

ASUS ZenBook Pro 15 https://www.asus.com/Laptops/ASUS-ZenBook-Pro-15-UX550GD/

This looks totally like a 2016 MBP clone, just slightly larger on all sides to fit the larger ports. They even copied the cooling system design and the tapered bottom part of the case...

 

[John-117]

This argument makes no sense. Radeon Pro 500 series were also not "available" prior to the MBP 2017 refresh -- they were announced simultaneously. But I'm sure you understand that these chips had to have been available to Apple before this time? Availability or announcements of mobile graphics chips really means very little until they sit in an actual laptop, since these chips typically are not sold directly to consumers.

None of this indicates or counter indicates that MBP 2018 will have Vega Mobile chips, neither does the availability of the X chips really. I have not seen any indication anywhere that the Vega Mobile chips would be delayed. I do notice however, that AMD have been pretty timely with some other product launches, like the Ryzen 2000 series for example.
[doublepost=1526460500][/doublepost]

They tend to refresh specs to current standards, for CPU and GPU at least. It's a bit unclear what might happen this year, since there are a few options for the CPU parts that Apple uses. It's reasonable to expect that all models get two more CPU cores. For GPU it's also unclear. AMD announced a Vega Mobile in Jan, but there's of course no word on whether it will make it into MBP 2018. It might and it mightn't. Beyond that there may well be other minor updates, probably nothing big.

The 400 and 500 series were both on public roadmaps from AMD leading into late 2016 and early 2017. There are currently no roadmaps with mobile Vega parts that would be candidates for the TDP of the MacBook Pro.

The 500X series, that was announced in April, only see performance improvement from driver optimizations that may not make a difference in macOS. There are no other known available components from AMD. If Apple were to have access to components ahead of other OEMs it looks like they would be getting the 500X series.

If there are unannounced mobile Vega parts that Apple has under wraps with AMD all the better. Without any better public information I would just want to caution folks from expecting anything better than another Polaris rebadge. I would jump on a Coffee Lake & Vega refresh but don't think we'll be seeing the pair this year. Happy to be wrong though!

 

[TheralSadurns]

Have you guys seen these ones?


ASUS ZenBook Pro 15 https://www.asus.com/Laptops/ASUS-ZenBook-Pro-15-UX550GD/
HP Envy 13 Laptop http://www8.hp.com/us/en/campaigns/envylaptops/overview.html

C'mon Apple, your move now

And they use DDR4... but ALSO cap it at 16GB

 

[koyoot]

There is coming Vega 12 chip, that has actually 1792 GCN cores(28 CU's) and 4 GB of HBM2.

 

[leman]

The 400 and 500 series were both on public roadmaps from AMD leading into late 2016 and early 2017. There are currently no roadmaps with mobile Vega parts that would be candidates for the TDP of the MacBook Pro.

AMD did announce a mobile Vega chip at the CES though, if I remember correctly. Ther was even the CEO showing the chip.

 

[MrGunnyPT]

There is coming Vega 12 chip, that has actually 1792 GCN cores(28 CU's) and 4 GB of HBM2.

What's the TDP?

 

[leman]

What's the TDP?

It will be flexible anyway, depending on how the chips are binned and extra processing. In case of the 2016 MBP, AMD managed to drastically reduce the Regular TDP of the chip without sacrificing performance.

 

[MrGunnyPT]

It will be flexible anyway, depending on how the chips are binned and extra processing. In case of the 2016 MBP, AMD managed to drastically reduce the Regular TDP of the chip without sacrificing performance.

It's a wait and see scenario, my concern is the keyboard because things are spinning out of control at this point

 

[schalliol]

I just can't see Apple releasing a new laptop with the exact same keyboard. Even if Apple thinks it's just fine, with the PR, they will have to make a change before the next version.

 

[MrGunnyPT]

I just can't see Apple releasing a new laptop with the exact same keyboard. Even if Apple thinks it's just fine, with the PR, they will have to make a change before the next version.

They gotta fix it somehow.. And I mean like really fix it

 

[John-117]

There is coming Vega 12 chip, that has actually 1792 GCN cores(28 CU's) and 4 GB of HBM2.

Still not sure if that'll end up only being a desktop release. Most of the info gleaned from the linux driver points to a desktop card but I would be very happy if that were not the case.

 

[Ener Ji]

Still not sure if that'll end up only being a desktop release. Most of the info gleaned from the linux driver points to a desktop card but I would be very happy if that were not the case.

You bring up a good point. If it is 28 CUs, that's just half the size of a Vega 56, right? Vega 56 uses 150W+, so a chip exactly half the size should take roughly 75W. Apple could underclock it and perhaps undervolt it to save some more power, but it still seems difficult to imagine a 28CU Vega variant squeezing into the roughly 25-30W that Apple has to spare for GPU power on the current generation 15" MBP.

A 28CU chip will probably need to be produced on a 7nm process before it could fit in a MBP. That won't be possible at least until next year, and perhaps not until 2020. On the other hand, if the Vega discrete chip comes with just 16 CUs, then we could be in business this year.

 

[schalliol]

Reading all this, the main thing I take away is: Let's have a BFB!
[big $#$%! battery]

That gives the most options (when using low GPU cycles, ultra-long battery life, and reasonable when you are using it). Heat would still be a concern beyond just power, as I imagine these high consuming GPUs generate a lot of heat.

 

[wxkkeup]

Have you guys seen these ones?

ASUS ZenBook Pro 15 https://www.asus.com/Laptops/ASUS-ZenBook-Pro-15-UX550GD/

I am distraught at the fact that ASUS thought that it is 'just fine' to re-color the Apple's MacBook Pro page for their online marketing scheme.

WHAT THE HECK, ASUS ?! Like, I understand that Apple's marketing technique is flawless but that doesn't give them the right to just.. copy-and-paste the entire website and simply re-color it.
[doublepost=1526503625][/doublepost]Their animation of the cooling system is like, almost exactly the same, like what the hell ??

 

[leman]

You bring up a good point. If it is 28 CUs, that's just half the size of a Vega 56, right? Vega 56 uses 150W+, so a chip exactly half the size should take roughly 75W. Apple could underclock it and perhaps undervolt it to save some more power, but it still seems difficult to imagine a 28CU Vega variant squeezing into the roughly 25-30W that Apple has to spare for GPU power on the current generation 15" MBP.

Don't take the desktop TDP too seriously. This is all subject of binning, configuration and optimisation. For example, the desktop Polaris 11 with 14 CU is 75Watt, AMD and Apple managed to pack the same chip with full 16 CUs at 35Watt, only losing about 25% in performance.

Not to mention that power/performance ratio is not linear. Given what we saw from integrated Vega performance, Vega seems to have very good performance at lower clocks (just like Polaris did), so if they run the chips though the same die thinning post process step AMD used to make the Polaris GPU in the MBP, I can easily imagine 35W Vega with 28CUs at the performance level between 1050Ti Max-Q and 1060 Max-Q. Lets also not forget that HBM2 is more efficient than GDDR5, and memory speed is a major limiting factor in the 2016/2017 GPU performance.
[doublepost=1526505846][/doublepost]

I am distraught at the fact that ASUS thought that it is 'just fine' to re-color the Apple's MacBook Pro page for their online marketing scheme.

They didn't copy just the website, they literally copied the entire laptop. And the cooling system

 

[hajime]

I just can't see Apple releasing a new laptop with the exact same keyboard. Even if Apple thinks it's just fine, with the PR, they will have to make a change before the next version.

In that case, will they delay the release to few months later?

 

[wxkkeup]

In that case, will they delay the release to few months later?

I have the same concern, but they should have already known about this problem since the release of butterfly V2.. and have had plenty of time to work on it.

I believe in them.. but if they don’t fix this in time for a WWDC release announcement, then I will never feel the same.
[doublepost=1526517032][/doublepost]All trust will be lost.

 

[han_del_]

Have you guys seen these ones?


ASUS ZenBook Pro 15 https://www.asus.com/Laptops/ASUS-ZenBook-Pro-15-UX550GD/
HP Envy 13 Laptop http://www8.hp.com/us/en/campaigns/envylaptops/overview.html

C'mon Apple, your move now

Yes, and I passed them both up for the MBP : )

I find that other laptops look great in photos but when I check them out at the store they're nowhere near as nice as a MBP. I also don't like that they keep legacy ports, which is only going to slow down the move to USB-C.

 

[hajime]

Is it true that 32GB MBP is not going to happen this year?

 

[Mackan]

Biggest CPU upgrade since 2012.

13" is gonna get a Quad Core and 15" most likely will get a Six Core setup on the high models while keeping Quad Core on the "entry" version.

Knowing Apple's greed from a decade of history, the entry 13'' will stay dual core, while high end might be available in quad core. Same strategy for the 15'' inch regarding quad core and six core, as you say.

Knowing even better, the 13'' will stay dual core altogether for another year or two. For Apple, product differentiation and maxmizing profits have more priority than offering attractive choices for the consumers. People are forced to look at PC alternatives instead.

In that case, will they delay the release to few months later?

If they are releasing updated models at WWDC, they must have been in mass production already.

 

[TheralSadurns]

Is it true that 32GB MBP is not going to happen this year?

Unless they pull a MacBook Pro Plus out of the hat... it's VERY unlikely to happen...

 

[sputnikBA]

That Asus Zenbook page is ridiculous. I can absolutely picture their design brief being “we want to be the Apple of Windows. Make the page more like Apple’s”

...followed by later revision requests of “no, no - not enough, please make it more like Apple”

Spoiler: comparison

MacBook Pro & Zenbook Pro homepages
https://www.apple.com/macbook-pro/
https://www.asus.com/Laptops/ASUS-ZenBook-Pro-15-UX550GD/

tech specs pages
https://www.apple.com/macbook-pro/specs/
https://www.asus.com/Laptops/ASUS-ZenBook-Pro-15-UX550GD/Tech-Specs/

 

[CmdrLaForge]

Have you guys seen these ones?


ASUS ZenBook Pro 15 https://www.asus.com/Laptops/ASUS-ZenBook-Pro-15-UX550GD/
HP Envy 13 Laptop http://www8.hp.com/us/en/campaigns/envylaptops/overview.html

C'mon Apple, your move now

Both have too large bezels

 

[Michael Jordan]

TBH I'm super scared that Apple is not being able to pull it off to announce a better keyboard for the MPBP at WWDC. It just.. In the timeframe it just doesn't make any sense to me. We already know what their main objective is this year (stability, security for OS) at WWDC and there haven't been any leaks yet that indicate a better and more improved Macbook Pro.. I guess we will have to wait and see.