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Waiting for the 2018 MBP

Having just purchased a new 17.3" notebook with hex core 8750H, Apple may just have it's hands full. My first observations are the increased power draw and extremely rapid increase in temperature under even moderate loads.

This 17.3" is classed as being a thin & light for it's class, equally Asus had to implement 12V primary fans to and a 3rd fan to restrain the thermals. Although the notebook has a 1070 GTX dGPU and 32Gb Ram, the cooling system is partially shared...

I'm litterly still taming W10 :p, equally reviews are documenting over 70W for the 8750H and well over 100W for the i9 8950HK. Once I have all set up I'll be able to see CPU PL1 & PL2 and what exactly the CPU is pulling.

Same as Asus, Apple's engineering will overcome, however the demands of the hex core CPU's are certainly greater than their 7th Gen predecessor's. My other 17" with 7700HQ rarely pulled more than it's PL1 limit of 45W even under full Turbo on all cores.

Has to be said seeing a notebook boosting past 4GHz is highly impressive :cool:

Update: The i7 8750H is pulling over 86W under Prime95 Small FFT with a PL2 limit of 90W. My other 17" notebook Bench's at 730CB under Cinebench R15, while the GL703GS with the i7 8750H is benching at over 1260CB @ 3.9Ghz on all cores, now that's officially fast...

Undervolt applied, rest all stock, nor on a powered cooling pad

Q-6
 
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Falhófnir said:
It’s extremely unusual to get a new screen in MacBooks between re-designs, Apple like to really milk the economy of scale dry for formfactor related components. Of course it might well be that no new MBPs will appear at WWDC because they are cutting this problematic design cycle short and accelerating a new formfactor to appear later in the year, in which case the 120Hz screen could be a flagship feature of the new model.
Click to expand...


I'd like to add a counterpoint. In... I think 2007 they moved the classic MBP (PowerBook G4 style aluminum casing) from CCFL backlight to LED. This happened in between redesigns, i.e. before the release of the Unibody MBPs. Granted... this was 10 years ago...
[doublepost=1528024316][/doublepost]
Queen6 said:
Having just purchased a new 17.3" notebook with hex core 8750H, Apple may just have it's hands full. My first observations are the increased power draw and extremely rapid increase in temperature under even moderate loads.

This 17.3" is classed as being a thin & light for it's class, equally Asus had to implement 12V primary fans to and a 3rd fan to restrain the thermals. Although the notebook has a 1070 GTX dGPU and 32Gb Ram the cooling system is not shared...

I'm litterly still taming W10 :p, equally reviews are documenting over 70W for the 8750H and well over 100W for the i9 8950HK. Once I have all set up I'll be able to see CPU PL1 & PL2 and what exactly the CPU is pulling.

Same as Asus, Apple's engineering will overcome, however the demands of the hex core CPU's are certainly greater than their 7th Gen predecessor's. My other 17" with 7700HQ rarely pulled more than it's PL1 limit of 45W even under full Turbo on all cores.

Has to be said seeing a notebook boosting past 4GHz is highly impressive :cool:

Q-6
Click to expand...

Which machine did you buy, exactly? I will NOT go the windows route... but since I generally value your opinion I am genuinely curious what you went for!
 
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Queen6 said:
Having just purchased a new 17.3" notebook with hex core 8750H, Apple may just have it's hands full. My first observations are the increased power draw and extremely rapid increase in temperature under even moderate loads.

This 17.3" is classed as being a thin & light for it's class, equally Asus had to implement 12V primary fans to and a 3rd fan to restrain the thermals. Although the notebook has a 1070 GTX dGPU and 32Gb Ram the cooling system is not shared...

I'm litterly still taming W10 :p, equally reviews are documenting over 70W for the 8750H and well over 100W for the i9 8950HK. Once I have all set up I'll be able to see CPU PL1 & PL2 and what exactly the CPU is pulling.

Same as Asus, Apple's engineering will overcome, however the demands of the hex core CPU's are certainly greater than their 7th Gen predecessor's. My other 17" with 7700HQ rarely pulled more than it's PL1 limit of 45W even under full Turbo on all cores.

Has to be said seeing a notebook boosting past 4GHz is highly impressive :cool:

Q-6
Click to expand...
I did wonder if they really could add in 2 more heat-generating cores and still retain the thermals of the previous models in practice - given the chips in the iMacs strain against the cooling solution already this could be a big hiccup for those machines, and of course as you say there is likely very little wiggle room with such slight notebooks...

TheralSadurns said:
I'd like to add a counterpoint. In... I think 2007 they moved the classic MBP (PowerBook G4 style aluminum casing) from CCFL backlight to LED. This happened in between redesigns, i.e. before the release of the Unibody MBPs. Granted... this was 10 years ago...
[doublepost=1528024316][/doublepost]

Which machine did you buy, exactly? I will NOT go the windows route... but since I generally value your opinion I am genuinely curious what you went for!
Click to expand...
Ok, I wasn’t really into computers at that time (indeed I was only ~ 12) but interesting to know! I guess it depends on if they can get a panel that will literally slot in with all the connectors in the same place and everything, but just has the higher spec - that way they wouldn’t have to re-tool the assembly line which I’m guessing would be the costly bit?
 
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TheralSadurns said:
I'd like to add a counterpoint. In... I think 2007 they moved the classic MBP (PowerBook G4 style aluminum casing) from CCFL backlight to LED. This happened in between redesigns, i.e. before the release of the Unibody MBPs. Granted... this was 10 years ago...
[doublepost=1528024316][/doublepost]

Which machine did you buy, exactly? I will NOT go the windows route... but since I generally value your opinion I am genuinely curious what you went for!
Click to expand...

Asus ROG GL703GS, mine is a S7BS which is a regional equivalent. For heavy computational workloads, as one of the other OEM's puts it "Full Ignition" :cool::cool::cool:

My other 17.3" is an Acer Predator 17, which has proved over and over to be performant and reliable. The new hex core CPU's are just too much of a lure :p Once I've the OS set up to my liking then I'll put the GL703 through it's paces...

Still have my eye on an i9+ (Intel Optane) equally it's not going to be thin light and that extra 900 MHz comes at a high price :p

Update: The i7 8750H is set up with a PL 1 of 45W and a PL 2 of 90W, with Prime95 Small FFT spiking as high as 86W with undervolt applied. Cinebench R15 for my other 17" scores 730CB, with no throttling, the GL703GS with i7 8750H scores an impressive 1261CB, which has to be said is officially fast for a notebook :cool:

All stock, no powered cooling pad, undervolt applied W10 1803, regular startup

Q-6
 
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Queen6 said:
I'm litterly still taming W10 :p, equally reviews are documenting over 70W for the 8750H and well over 100W for the i9 8950HK. Once I have all set up I'll be able to see CPU PL1 & PL2 and what exactly the CPU is pulling.
Click to expand...
If that's indeed the case, then I smell a Mac Pro type fiasco all over again.
 
CodeJoy said:
If that's indeed the case, then I smell a Mac Pro type fiasco all over again.
Click to expand...

In all fairness we have to wait and see. As much as I don't care for the 2016 MBP design there's no doubting the cooling system is far more effective than any of it's predecessors.

Controlling the thermals in Windows is reasonably straight forwarded, however PL1 & EDP limits are hardwired generally needing a BIOS update. With the GL703GS I was able to loop Cinebench R15 with a continuous result of 1256CB with the temps being well below the line, however the 8750H CPU will dial down frequency under massive synthetic load such as Prime95 Small FFT, due to hitting PL2 time & EDP limits.

Apple's bigger challenge may be the power limit imposed by USB-C charging, with CPU's boosting up to over 80W. As for cooling only Apple really knows how much overhead it has in the current chassis. If the TDP is inadequate for the new CPU & GPU combination system will throttle or Apple will limit performance.

Q-6
 
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hajime said:
What is POS OS?
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He’s basically calling it a steaming pile ;) which I think, in fairness is a bit of an exaggeration - Windows is functional and in a handful of ways actually superior to MacOS in my experience. Both are probably about equally stable overall, both have their moments. Windows runs better on less powerful hardware, whereas MacOS has become a bit of a resource hog in recent editions (4gb ram is surprisingly capable on Windows machines, whereas it’s actually beginning to struggle if you want to do more than a couple of simple things, or one more intensive thing simultaneously with macs.)
 
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While the MacBook Pro seems to be in stock in the US Apple Online Store, this is not the case with most European ones. In the stores I looked up, none of the MacBooks were actually in stock, and CTO orders actually seem to take two to three weeks, which is a lot longer than usual. I still think that's no coincidence.
 
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Poki said:
While the MacBook Pro seems to be in stock in the US Apple Online Store, this is not the case with most European ones. In the stores I looked up, none of the MacBooks were actually in stock, and CTO orders actually seem to take two to three weeks, which is a lot longer than usual. I still think that's no coincidence.
Click to expand...

Hopefully Bloomberg was wrong. I doubt it, but well see in 18 hours. If Apple sweeps the keyboard issues under the rug, it would make many customers/potential customers upset.

If this is the direction Apple is really heading under Tim Cook's command, it will make me think twice if i want to be part of this company.
I guess (someone correct me if i'm wrong) that if Apple doesn't say word about MBP/MB's refresh or keyboard issues. The Apple stock might drop due bad press?
 
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Poki said:
While the MacBook Pro seems to be in stock in the US Apple Online Store, this is not the case with most European ones. In the stores I looked up, none of the MacBooks were actually in stock, and CTO orders actually seem to take two to three weeks, which is a lot longer than usual. I still think that's no coincidence.
Click to expand...
Maybe there is a price droppig only.
 
Michael Jordan said:
God, I’m already picturing this WWDC keynote in my head.

First those numbers about how many people are on ios and mac os. Things are going great. We sold more phones and macs than ever before. But we are not gonna tell you anything about the ****** keyboards in the macbook pro because we dont really care. The iPads have changed the way we educate in schools. Kids love it. Here are some numbers. Blablabla. So much creativity. Don’t get me started about AR Kit. The 1 year anniversary. So much stuff made already with ARKit, its great. It has changed peoples lives. Then comes a video of ARKit.


Then ios:
First Apple Maps, which comes now with newer and better features nobody cares about and contains stuff Google Maps already has.

Then there is Siri, which is slightly smarter and is now able to respond to you in a slightly less ******** way but still quite ****. Oh yeah this ‘Siri’ update is coming this fall. When? Not telling you because we at apple don’t really know either, but we kinda had to release it due to amazon alexa and google ai.

Then animoji:
People love animoji. People made entire videoclips with them. Its great. Heres a compilation of animoji music videos flying around on the web. Oh yeah and were releasing 6 more skins this fall. You’ll love it.

Then there is mac os and specially for all you lovely developers out there.... there is Dark mode. Then Craig starts bragging out dark mode for 35 minutes with some lame programmer jokes to keep dem devs happy in the room.

Then icloud, more safe secure and more reliable than ever before. Finally announcing the first 50gb icloud storage for free.

Then one more thing.. people hoping its new laptop but nope..

It’s the iphone se2. Smaller, better, more fantastic than ever before. Then comes jony with some bragging about how difficult the design process was while making it. Only 900 dollars. Available today.

Then some random band comes on the stage. Happy wwddc week everyone!
Click to expand...
damn right
 
Cardino said:
Maybe there is a price droppig only.
Click to expand...

HerbertDerb said:
Hopefully Bloomberg was wrong. I doubt it, but well see in 18 hours. If Apple sweeps the keyboard issues under the rug, it would make many customers/potential customers upset.

If this is the direction Apple is really heading under Tim Cook's command, it will make me think twice if i want to be part of this company.
I guess (someone correct me if i'm wrong) that if Apple doesn't say word about MBP/MB's refresh or keyboard issues. The Apple stock might drop due bad press?
Click to expand...


I mean why would they redesign they keyboard so soon. That would piss all the people that purchased the 16 / 17 models of the macbooks. Its easier to play it off later down the future.
 
somehow I still think Jony Ive's comments will make everything ok. He seemed to genuinely understand the error of the 2016 and 2017 MacBook Pros. At this point I don't care if its out at WWDC since that is almost impossible (unless they (re)release a new product line i.e. PowerBook). I'm just holding myself calm that whatever comes out this year will be good. Or else I'll quit the Apple ecosystem. I can survive the summer but I can't survive past October.
 
The Reasonable One said:
somehow I still think Jony Ive's comments will make everything ok. He seemed to genuinely understand the error of the 2016 and 2017 MacBook Pros. At this point I don't care if its out at WWDC since that is almost impossible (unless they (re)release a new product line i.e. PowerBook). I'm just holding myself calm that whatever comes out this year will be good. Or else I'll quit the Apple ecosystem. I can survive the summer but I can't survive past October.
Click to expand...

Which comments?
 
Gata said:
Which comments?
Click to expand...
The ones shortly after the 2017 MBP launch where he said Apple had heard enough of our complaints regarding the MBP. It wasn't meant in a bad way, he seemed to be saying that Apple had heard our complaints and was sorry. It seemed like a promise that the next version would be fixed.

I'll try to find it gimme a sec
[doublepost=1528082774][/doublepost]Found it!

"Absolutely, all of your feelings and feedback around the MacBook you use, we couldn't want to listen to more," Ive said earlier this week in Washington DC. "And we hear — boy, do we hear."

http://www.businessinsider.com/apple-jony-ive-macbook-criticism-2017-12
 
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Queen6 said:
Asus ROG GL703GS, mine is a S7BS which is a regional equivalent. For heavy computational workloads, as one of the other OEM's puts it "Full Ignition" :cool::cool::cool:

My other 17.3" is an Acer Predator 17, which has proved over and over to be performant and reliable. The new hex core CPU's are just too much of a lure :p Once I've the OS set up to my liking then I'll put the GL703 through it's paces...

Still have my eye on an i9+ (Intel Optane) equally it's not going to be thin light and that extra 900 MHz comes at a high price :p

Update: The i7 8750H is set up with a PL 1 of 45W and a PL 2 of 90W, with Prime95 Small FFT spiking as high as 86W with undervolt applied. Cinebench R15 for my other 17" scores 730CB, with no throttling, the GL703GS with i7 8750H scores an impressive 1261, which has to be said is officially fast for a notebook :cool:

All stock, no powered cooling pad, undervolt applied W10 1803, regular startup

Q-6
Click to expand...

Please update us, this is quite interesting!

If they can’t fit an 8750H in the 15” MacBook Pro due to its extreme thinness and relatively poor thermal solution, they should introduce it in a 17” MBP with enhanced cooling, Vega graphics and an SD slot at around the same thinness. I think many people here would be thrilled at such a prospect. I know I would.
 
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sotorious said:
I mean why would they redesign they keyboard so soon. That would piss all the people that purchased the 16 / 17 models of the macbooks. Its easier to play it off later down the future.
Click to expand...
Well they have. If that’s the logic they went by, there would never be a good time to change the keyboard.
 
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Reddit still seems to think a MBP update is very likely. At this point, I would take a price drop on the 2017s. Haha. Desperation.

It’s already June 4th where I live, so I can’t wait.
 
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