It would be different materials - carbon nanotubes, graphene for e.g. offer better properties at the same "nm" and will require different processing techniques thus making it expensive right now in terms of capital investment for mass production. We will see the shift occurring when the cost of extreme UV and X-ray lithography exceed investment required in new materials and processing techniques.
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Waiting for the 2019 MBP [Merged]
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I wouldn’t expect anything before June 2019 in terms of new MBPs - anything announced in the next 6 months will be a MacBook/ MacBook Air. I think 7nm is the smallest confirmed node, a few companies are experimenting with 5nm but at that size you can no longer use pure silicon, that makes producing the chips more complex and thus making them in commercial quantities more expensive. When Intel do finally get 10nm up and running that will definitely give a big boost to thermal and battery consumption properties of their chips, but as with Kaby Lake over Skylake it’s not the only way of doing so.
The only MBP potentially worth waiting for is the (presumed) redesign in 2020.
While I can appreciate a few parts of the 2016-18 models, having owned a number of them overall I think them an abysmal failure.
And given how badly Apple failed with the 2013 MP and the 2016 MBP redesigns, it seems far more likely that Apple will fail again with the next redesign of both the MP and the MBP. And it didn't have to be that way.
While I can appreciate a few parts of the 2016-18 models, having owned a number of them overall I think them an abysmal failure.
And given how badly Apple failed with the 2013 MP and the 2016 MBP redesigns, it seems far more likely that Apple will fail again with the next redesign of both the MP and the MBP. And it didn't have to be that way.
I see no reason to wait for the 2019 MBP either.
The current ones are pretty much as high as you can get power-wise in this chassis. Even the highest i7 & i9 CPU's can't really utilize all their power. And 32GB Ram is plenty and more than plenty for most. And usually not really utilized either unless you run VM's or hardcore 3D animation/ vizualization.
I can imagine 2019 just to be a very minor specbump at WWDC if at all. Maybe Apple skips it altogether until the real 2020 redesign.
Because if Intel comes out with their 10nm late 2019 (finally!), that means Apple needs at least few months until they can get it into their products.
So it's more realistic that the 10nm CPU's will be with the 2020 redesign.
However we don't even know if 2020 will be the actual redesign. Because these current ones came late 2016, almost 2017... it could mean Apple may wait until 2021 for the actual redesign. They probably have plenty on their hands with redesigning the Mac Pro and iMac's too.
The current ones are pretty much as high as you can get power-wise in this chassis. Even the highest i7 & i9 CPU's can't really utilize all their power. And 32GB Ram is plenty and more than plenty for most. And usually not really utilized either unless you run VM's or hardcore 3D animation/ vizualization.
I can imagine 2019 just to be a very minor specbump at WWDC if at all. Maybe Apple skips it altogether until the real 2020 redesign.
Because if Intel comes out with their 10nm late 2019 (finally!), that means Apple needs at least few months until they can get it into their products.
So it's more realistic that the 10nm CPU's will be with the 2020 redesign.
However we don't even know if 2020 will be the actual redesign. Because these current ones came late 2016, almost 2017... it could mean Apple may wait until 2021 for the actual redesign. They probably have plenty on their hands with redesigning the Mac Pro and iMac's too.
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I’m still veering back and forth but I’m starting to think if the MBA replacement is any good I might go with that to keep a toe in the Mac ecosystem while going Windows for a main/ work machine - the thing that’s really pushing me in that direction now is that I’m not sure I want to be investing nearly £3,000 in a machine that might then be left behind by a transition to ARM. I’m waiting on further news as regards that but if there are any more rumours I just don’t think I want to pump that sort of money into a Mac before the transition.
I was interested in the X1 extreme myself. I thought I'd give you my thoughts on it
1) The X1 Carbon (which it is very likely to be based off design wise as was the P1), has a lot of criticisms which in my opinion makes it worse than the XPS series. It doesn't seem like it has that "Lenovo" quality of the T series that people rave about in terms of robustness, heat/management, quality etc. There are reports on the owner threads on forums.notebookreview.com of even the paint chipping which I think is unacceptable.
2) The heating issues on the X1 carbon is likely to be worse in the Extreme (now jumping from 15w Quad to 45w six core) seeing as someone mentioned they are sticking to their tripod CPU cooler and two screw GPU heatsink
3) The battery size on these is 80Wh, falling very short of the 97Wh of the XPS 9570.
I wouldn't say the XPS 9570 is without it's own flaws, but I think it is likely to be better than the X1 Extreme. I also believe Dell has better customer service than Lenovo now (which has fallen off going by what people have said).
I agree. That is why I am waiting for reviews first, and of course, regular user posts about X1 extreme.
Maybe in USA, but not in my country. Dell has the worst service in my country from all other PC OEMs. If X1 extreme has thermal problems, I'm gonna purchase P52 and be done with it. P52 won't have those issues, but it is really heavy
I'm not thrilled with the current prices given all the concerns floating around. but I don't really know if the situation is going to get much better next year.
it seems like dongle hell, keyboard uncertainty, anemic graphics, thermal concerns with the chassis, dodgy t2 chip issues, and price premium for a touchbar I didn't ask for are all here to stay.
sometimes it feels like apple is just testing to see how much people are willing to accept to avoid a windows laptop.
it seems like dongle hell, keyboard uncertainty, anemic graphics, thermal concerns with the chassis, dodgy t2 chip issues, and price premium for a touchbar I didn't ask for are all here to stay.
sometimes it feels like apple is just testing to see how much people are willing to accept to avoid a windows laptop.
I don't think the situation will get much better. It's pretty clear to me that Apple is designing these machines for a certain class of creative professionals (simple Youtube Videos, image edition with filters, basic web design, blog writing, business writing, etc.) and business executives whose needs are different from mine. Despite the complaints on these boards, the machines are selling well and Apple's own customer satisfaction surveys show that they're meeting their target.
If things really were much better in Windows land I'd go there, but it's not. I still can't find any PC laptop, no matter how much I'm willing to pay, that has a trackpad as nice as the one on a MBP. Even the premium Surface line has weird Windows update issues and plenty of reports of hardware failure and a screen that flickers when it's trying to adjust its brightness automatically. Neither can I find Windows editors, novel writing software, image editors, automation solutions, and a whole host of productivity tools as nice as the ones on Macs. It's the software and decades of productivity shortcuts and scripts and accumulated knowledge that's keeping me on Apple, and I know I'm not Apple's core customer. So I just have to keep buying Apple generation after generation.
Same, when it comes down to business the tolerance for Apple not getting things right is very less. Apple needs to decide if it wants to support it's professional users or only pander to the masses with pretty devices, if the latter Apple should drop all this "Pro" nonsense as it's very far from that in 2018.
Apple is on it's 3rd cycle of this design, yet is still seemingly incapable of getting things right. Why Apple simply doesn't produce a competent computer line-up is beyond me as there's clearly a healthy market. TBH it's hardly surprising why so few Mac's are now used professionally...
Q-6
On paper the x1 looks very nice, but I do think waiting until we see what reviewers have to say about it.
Especially giving if you go to the X1 Carbon forums there are tons of complaints with overheating, flexing, etc. You put a hex core in pretty much the same base design and I'm sure heat is going to be an issue. The vents are on the bottom of the case, which if setting on your lap is going to get quiet toasty. Reminds me of the HP Spectre X360 that I returned because it caused 3rd degree burns!
That won't happen. How will all the "It's not a Pro machine, only my specific usage scenario is worthy of being called 'Pro'" whiners know which MacBook to buy if they remove the Pro label?
I think they missed a huge trick by having only an 80 Wh battery when the 9570 has a 97 Wh battery personally.
TBH when Apple removed "MacBook Pro" from the display I was delighted as it's little more than a sad 80's sales & marketing trope.
Apple should simply offer entry level, Ultraportable, mainstream & professional/prosumer systems. Focus on designing the best they can, knock off trying to only deliver variations of the MBA including their desktops. All this thinner for the sake of it is just resulting in compromised underperforming hardware, with diminished usability.
Q-6
The battery size is unlikely to contribute to poor thermals to the point it is worth downsizing. The X1 Extreme’s designs however are out and the way they have mounted the CPU/GPU, it’s not looking promising unfortunately.If that smaller battery means better thermals, then that wouldn't be a miss. Dell xps has terrible thermals. Still waiting to see if Lenovo did their job properly or not
HP Zbook Studio G5 could be interesting (though in the UK they only have the 4 cell battery for some reason, while USA enjoy the 6 cell variant).
I recently decided to hand my 2014 MBP down to my wife (who barely uses a laptop) and replace it with a new one. In visiting the Apple store to have a look, I was appalled. Seems to me Apple has become so consumed with thinness and simplicity that they are now making machines that, so far as they are labeled "Pro" are not fit for purpose. For me, it would be dongles, dongles, dongles and constant worry about my own clumsiness or our pets as Apple has even got rid of the brilliant Magsafe.
Apple's design fetishes have become so pervasive and so compulsive that the idea of waiting for next year's or some future year's model will probably result in evaluating machines that are even more sleek and dumbed down.
So I did the unthinkable: I ordered not one, but two mint condition 15" rMBP's nicely equipped. I'll use one, give the other to my wife, and "exercise" the older one occasionally to keep the battery nice "just in case.". Price point for these was about $1500 each from reputable vendors. Mine were "mint" condition, 16gb RAM, 512gb SSD, discrete graphics. I think I saved money buying these two vs. buying one new machine (accepting that the new machine would have a 1TB drive rather than a 512GB).
Apple's design fetishes have become so pervasive and so compulsive that the idea of waiting for next year's or some future year's model will probably result in evaluating machines that are even more sleek and dumbed down.
So I did the unthinkable: I ordered not one, but two mint condition 15" rMBP's nicely equipped. I'll use one, give the other to my wife, and "exercise" the older one occasionally to keep the battery nice "just in case.". Price point for these was about $1500 each from reputable vendors. Mine were "mint" condition, 16gb RAM, 512gb SSD, discrete graphics. I think I saved money buying these two vs. buying one new machine (accepting that the new machine would have a 1TB drive rather than a 512GB).
If you are unhappy with the direction Apple is going, is it worth still investing in their ecosystem?
If he’s got a machine that suits his needs then why on Earth not? Apple changed direction on making iPhones thinner to accommodate more of what they wanted to include, the 7 was thicker than the 6, the 8 thicker than the 7 and the X thinner still. All is not set in stone here...
I did the exact same thing today, bought the 2015 rmbp. I believe it was the last macbook chassis design steve had a hand in designing in 2012. I do feel that the 2016 tbmacbooks have gone a different direction. It was such a jarring change. Back when i transitioned from
A 2010 mbp to a 2014 rmbp, the transition was seamless. It was really what made me fall in love with apple.
I do have some small hope that they go back to a sense of “it just works”; ports, keyboard and all. But im not holding my breath, i love the apple ecosystem but having to deal with painful adjustments makes me feel that ill have to look elsewhere for my needs soon.