Waiting for the 2019 MBP [Merged]

[Dave245]

A new iMac design is long overdue - the bezels are too thick here as well for 2019. And they will definitely get 6 or even 8 core CPUs. So it's a probably going to be a good time for a new iMac.

That will be cool if it happens, I’ve waited out the 5K display since 2015 in the hopes that they redesign it but I don’t think I can wait much longer. I would love a new design or at least a big update, everything else has had one, the MacBook Pro got the 2016 design change, the Mac mini and MacBook Air got new designs last year and this year is suppose to be the Mac Pro redesign along with a new pro display, would be good to see a new iMac shown off at the same time/event

 

[Glockworkorange]

The cost difference between a 1TB MBP and 2TB is about $800. Instead, get one of these high-speed adapters for $320 and sell the 500GB 960 EVO that it comes with for $120: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07KK9VLX...olid=3055ORKJNOZ2F&psc=0&ref_=lv_ov_lig_dp_it

Next, put in a 2TB 970 EVO for $500. Net cost is $700 for 2TB vs. $800 for 1TB.

Apple needs to reduce its SSD prices because these adapters are only going to come down in price.

And let me replace the drive easily or give me a slot on the side where I can stick in another PCIe SSD M.2 card.

But you have to carry a drive around with you....

My MBP is shuttling with me everywhere---I don't want to have to carry a drive around with me.

 

[DeepIn2U]

But you have to carry a drive around with you....

My MBP is shuttling with me everywhere---I don't want to have to carry a drive around with me.

Yet you’re carrying dongles any way.

 

[Howard2k]

But you have to carry a drive around with you....

My MBP is shuttling with me everywhere---I don't want to have to carry a drive around with me.

It depends whether you need all your data accessible all the time.

I guess I have about 5TB of data in total, but I don’t need that to be always accessible. I keep some stuff local, some stuff on NAS (which I can also access via VPN), some in the cloud, and some stuff on external drives. I don’t carry those drives with me since I don’t routinely need to access that data. And I sure as hell don’t need to carry even 1TB of that data with me when out and about. Especially at Apple’s SSD rates.

 

[MHenr]

It depends whether you need all your data accessible all the time.

I guess I have about 5TB of data in total, but I don’t need that to be always accessible. I keep some stuff local, some stuff on NAS (which I can also access via VPN), some in the cloud, and some stuff on external drives. I don’t carry those drives with me since I don’t routinely need to access that data. And I sure as hell don’t need to carry even 1TB of that data with me when out and about. Especially at Apple’s SSD rates.

This!

Seriously, 80% of people need to look towards handling their storage instead of carrying around all their storage.
There's no reason to carry around full seasons of GoT and the walking dead, in 4K, at all times.

Home NAS and cloud solutions are so good and cheap nowadays I don't need more than my 256Gb drive available at all times. With gigabit ethernet at home and my office and wifi everywhere (often 4G proves to be faster out and about) it's simply overkill to want so much local storage.

Sure, I don't edit 8K video, neither am I a professional photographer or deal with gigantic files in any professional matter. But neither do most people. The select few that actually need 2TB in a laptop, on the go, are exactly that, a select few.

Spend the 800$ towards a NAS system and stop worrying about local storage.
I use a Synology 218+ with 2 WD Red 6TB drives using RAID1, which cost well below 800$ and offers a lot more options.

 

[Glockworkorange]

Yet you’re carrying dongles any way.

I hook few, if any, things to my laptop

 

[R.P.G]

I know it’s not related to Mac book pro ..but couldn’t stop from posting.
Did anyone tried Lenovo X1 extreme..it’s amazing at right price. Friend from work bought it today after returning MacBook Pro and it’s buzz in office today.

 

[CmdrLaForge]

The main reason for soldering of parts is usually

1) It saves costs
2) The laptop is more reliable (one less connection to go bad. Less QC issues in production too).

Of course, the huge negative of it is upgradability and repairability.

Saves cost ? If so that’s not reflected in any ways in the incredible high prices for the MBPs.

 

[MHenr]

Saves cost ? If so that’s not reflected in any ways in the incredible high prices for the MBPs.

No, it has nothing to do with cost saving. It's got everything to do with it being easier to design a machine with soldered parts than one with "connected" parts.
Soldering just gives them a lot more freedom to put parts where they want to and helps keep size (thickness) down.
The connections may be more reliable, but actually QC in production is the same or even higher.
It's a fantastic pain in the ass if you ask me!

I absolutely hate this trend and find it should only be used on the MBA line.
It's one of the key things that may make me ditch Apple after being a very happy user and (often critical) supporter for over 25 years. So your HD dies, now means your laptop is trash?

The MBA seems to be the blueprint for every computer they design these days. Even though I love such features in a MBA, I despise them in any other model. There is no, absolutely 0, reason for them doing this for performance gain which is where it's at in their pro line.
Pro to me is still upgradeability, user access to key parts, wide choice of ports, no true need for thin or highly stylised machines. They've not done this for years, so I'm not expecting them to do so soon. But that's where they will probably loose me as a customer when I need to buy a new laptop.

Pro users do not care for the thickness of the machines.
They literally don't give a flying **** over the race to lose mm's, if that means trading in functionality.

Look at the heap of trash that is the Mac Pro.
Now compare it with the Power Mac G5.
That was (to me) the last true "pro" machine Apple made, it was also one of the best tower designs ever.
(Watch the keynote for it if you have the time. It's a great Steve keynote!)

Apple has always made strange design choices, but this trend is completely bonkers.
Everyone is complaining about it, has been for a while now, yet they simply do not listen.
I've put up with it for my latest purchase, but it's the last time I've done so.

 

[PeterJP]

Pro users do not care for the thickness of the machines.

I do!

 

[Falhófnir]

No, it has nothing to do with cost saving. It's got everything to do with it being easier to design a machine with soldered parts than one with "connected" parts.
Soldering just gives them a lot more freedom to put parts where they want to and helps keep size (thickness) down.
The connections may be more reliable, but actually QC in production is the same or even higher.
It's a fantastic pain in the ass if you ask me!

I absolutely hate this trend and find it should only be used on the MBA line.
It's one of the key things that may make me ditch Apple after being a very happy user and (often critical) supporter for over 25 years. So your HD dies, now means your laptop is trash?

The MBA seems to be the blueprint for every computer they design these days. Even though I love such features in a MBA, I despise them in any other model. There is no, absolutely 0, reason for them doing this for performance gain which is where it's at in their pro line.
Pro to me is still upgradeability, user access to key parts, wide choice of ports, no true need for thin or highly stylised machines. They've not done this for years, so I'm not expecting them to do so soon. But that's where they will probably loose me as a customer when I need to buy a new laptop.

Pro users do not care for the thickness of the machines.
They literally don't give a flying **** over the race to lose mm's, if that means trading in functionality.

Look at the heap of trash that is the Mac Pro.
Now compare it with the Power Mac G5.
That was (to me) the last true "pro" machine Apple made, it was also one of the best tower designs ever.
(Watch the keynote for it if you have the time. It's a great Steve keynote!)

Apple has always made strange design choices, but this trend is completely bonkers.
Everyone is complaining about it, has been for a while now, yet they simply do not listen.
I've put up with it for my latest purchase, but it's the last time I've done so.

Ironically the new air is actually a little better than the pros in this regard - the battery is removable and replaceable and the ports are modular rather than being part of the main board... no replaceable SSD though!
https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/MacBook+Air+13-Inch+Retina+2018+Teardown/115201

 

[MHenr]

I do!

So you as a pro user prefer a 0,6mm thinner laptop to a laptop that's slightly thicker but has easily upgradeable battery, ram, HDD/SDD and maybe even other parts?
I'm not saying pro users want 10cm thick laptops, I'm saying the focus is on slimming them down and not on being laptops which deserve the "pro" moniker.

For example sacrificing cooling over thinness, is not what I expect from a pro machine.
[doublepost=1548844518][/doublepost]

I know it’s not related to Mac book pro ..but couldn’t stop from posting.
Did anyone tried Lenovo X1 extreme..it’s amazing at right price. Friend from work bought it today after returning MacBook Pro and it’s buzz in office today.

Thinkpads have almost always been very good laptops.
There was a brief periode when Lenovo bought the IBM dept where they were not very good, but they're back on track.

I've used (and still use) Lenovo laptops at work and they are some of the best laptops I've ever used, including Apple machines.
It's just the OS that bothers me

 

[Falhófnir]

So you as a pro user prefer a 0,6mm thinner laptop to a laptop that's slightly thicker but has easily upgradeable battery, ram, HDD/SDD and maybe even other parts?
I'm not saying pro users want 10cm thick laptops, I'm saying the focus is on slimming them down and not on being laptops which deserve the "pro" moniker.

For example sacrificing cooling over thinness, is not what I expect from a pro machine.

Believe it or not the 2016- models are actually considered to have better cooling than the slightly thicker 2012-15 models do. The even thicker Dell XPS machines are also notable for struggling with cooling. Looking at laptops that do have significantly better cooling, you’re talking about gaming laptops that are mostly the best part of an inch thick. So generally I agree that this isn’t something Apple should be compromising on in this sort of machine, but I also don’t think you’d get an awful lot better thermals even if they hadn’t thinned them down so much. Really for a much better solution you’d probably need to go back to unibody dimensions (and this might be no bad thing if they refocus the pro line to really leverage the space and allow for limited upgradability once again).

 

[PeterJP]

So you as a pro user prefer a 0,6mm thinner laptop to a laptop that's slightly thicker but has easily upgradeable battery, ram, HDD/SDD and maybe even other parts?
I'm not saying pro users want 10cm thick laptops, I'm saying the focus is on slimming them down and not on being laptops which deserve the "pro" moniker.

For example sacrificing cooling over thinness, is not what I expect from a pro machine.

There's a clue in your last sentence. It's not what *you* expect from a pro machine.

As an IT&operations manager, I do actually prefer a handy size over expandability or fixability in laptops. We have several desktops for video processing and other heavy lifting. If I would need any of that, I'll go to one of those machines. That's not to say that I could use a plain macbook for the rest of my job. In my previous, startup life, I did plenty of Docker-VMs-software dev-video processing and the like, all on my MBP. I still didn't feel the need to open the machine up.

I now have the opportunity to upgrade my late 2013 MBP to an NVMe SSD. I've got plenty of experience doing that sort of stuff, including flashing the bootrom over SPI. However, I am not looking forward to doing that at all. It would probably take me 2-3 days to investigate and order everything, then maybe a day or 2 to do it. Even if the upgrade was simpler, it still means preparing, selecting components and then doing the upgrade.

At a good freelancer's price per day, it quickly becomes extremely clear that upgrades of laptops are almost never worth it. The cost and hassle of upgrades vs a more portable machine? Give me the latter anytime.

But, including the financial and practical sides may just be what I look for in a 'pro' machine.

 

[lowkey]

Your numbers are way off hyperbole.
Name one 10cm thick laptop!
Do you really think that a replaceable SSD socket only adds 0,6mm? If so you’re quite mistaken.

Go do some homework. What was the last MacBook Pro that offered socketed storage and ram?
How thick was it?
How thick is the current model?
What percentage thinner is the current model?

As a professional, I actually care that my portable computer is lightweight and portable.
I have a desktop that does its job. I have a laptop that does it’s job.

You think that Pros just want heavy laptops?? You’re idea of Pro is way off!

So you as a pro user prefer a 0,6mm thinner laptop to a laptop that's slightly thicker but has easily upgradeable battery, ram, HDD/SDD and maybe even other parts?
I'm not saying pro users want 10cm thick laptops, I'm saying the focus is on slimming them down and not on being laptops which deserve the "pro" moniker.

For example sacrificing cooling over thinness, is not what I expect from a pro machine.
[doublepost=1548844518][/doublepost]

Thinkpads have almost always been very good laptops.
There was a brief periode when Lenovo bought the IBM dept where they were not very good, but they're back on track.

I've used (and still use) Lenovo laptops at work and they are some of the best laptops I've ever used, including Apple machines.
It's just the OS that bothers me

 

[CmdrLaForge]

No, it has nothing to do with cost saving. It's got everything to do with it being easier to design a machine with soldered parts than one with "connected" parts.
Soldering just gives them a lot more freedom to put parts where they want to and helps keep size (thickness) down.
The connections may be more reliable, but actually QC in production is the same or even higher.
It's a fantastic pain in the ass if you ask me!

I absolutely hate this trend and find it should only be used on the MBA line.
It's one of the key things that may make me ditch Apple after being a very happy user and (often critical) supporter for over 25 years. So your HD dies, now means your laptop is trash?

The MBA seems to be the blueprint for every computer they design these days. Even though I love such features in a MBA, I despise them in any other model. There is no, absolutely 0, reason for them doing this for performance gain which is where it's at in their pro line.
Pro to me is still upgradeability, user access to key parts, wide choice of ports, no true need for thin or highly stylised machines. They've not done this for years, so I'm not expecting them to do so soon. But that's where they will probably loose me as a customer when I need to buy a new laptop.

Pro users do not care for the thickness of the machines.
They literally don't give a flying **** over the race to lose mm's, if that means trading in functionality.

Look at the heap of trash that is the Mac Pro.
Now compare it with the Power Mac G5.
That was (to me) the last true "pro" machine Apple made, it was also one of the best tower designs ever.
(Watch the keynote for it if you have the time. It's a great Steve keynote!)

Apple has always made strange design choices, but this trend is completely bonkers.
Everyone is complaining about it, has been for a while now, yet they simply do not listen.
I've put up with it for my latest purchase, but it's the last time I've done so.

Thanks for your thoughtful reply. I see many Windows based Laptops with very similar approaches theses days to Apples approach. I am thinking myself for the very first time since 2002 to move away from Macs going to PCs. Reason is mainly the very high cost and that Apple doesn‘t have any affordable 15“ in their line. I am looking at Lenovos P52 for that. Not cheap but way cheaper than MBPr

 

[maflynn]

Soldering just gives them a lot more freedom to put parts where they want to and helps keep size (thickness) down.
The connections may be more reliable, but actually QC in production is the same or even higher.
It's a fantastic pain in the ass if you ask me!

Repair costs are another factor, just consider the butterfly keyboard, no longer can apple fix the keyboard but rather replace the entire top case of the laptop. While in warranty or part of the repair program that won't cost us consumers anything but Apple was charging something like 600 (700?) for 2016 repairs prior to the institution of the repair program.

Pro users do not care for the thickness of the machines.
They literally don't give a flying **** over the race to lose mm's, if that means trading in functionality.

I care about thickness/thinness in the respect that too thin is a bad thing, circling back on the keyboard as the prime example of thinness gone bad. Also the lack of port selection and while the USB-C can do it all with the right dongle, i find my Lenovo to be a nice mixture of thickness/port selection. i have USB-A, USB-C, SD card reader and more.

Look at the heap of trash that is the Mac Pro.
Now compare it with the Power Mac G5.
That was (to me) the last true "pro" machine Apple made, it was also one of the best tower designs ever.
(Watch the keynote for it if you have the time. It's a great Steve keynote!)

I still remember when the trash can Mac Pro was rolled out and apple fans justified the lack of upgradability saying you don't need those things any more. Seems like many people do.

Apple has always made strange design choices, but this trend is completely bonkers.
Everyone is complaining about it, has been for a while now, yet they simply do not listen.
I've put up with it for my latest purchase, but it's the last time I've done so.

They do push the envelope and many times it works, and other times it doesn't. Just look at the G4 cube, in many ways, the progenitor of the Mac Mini. Yet the G4 Cube failed fantastically (for many reasons).

 

[PeterJP]

Repair costs are another factor, just consider the butterfly keyboard, no longer can apple fix the keyboard but rather replace the entire top case of the laptop.

I think Apple has tried the always-smaller-at-any-cost strategy and has found out that any strategy, taken too far, brings disadvantages. Aside from the reliability issues, it's also bad for their reputation if any random Chinese manufacturer seems to make less disposable devices.

I still remember when the trash can Mac Pro was rolled out and apple fans justified the lack of upgradability saying you don't need those things any more. Seems like many people do.

For desktops, no upgrade path was a complete killer. I hardly know people who bought one and those who did, did so reluctantly. Modularity is key. I hope Apple understands that well enough to offer something realistic, not something closed expandable with a few cables. A CPU upgrade mid-lifetime is such a common scenario that, in my opinion, they should cater for.

 

[Vjosullivan]

----- -----

 

[Macintoshrumors]

No, it has nothing to do with cost saving. It's got everything to do with it being easier to design a machine with soldered parts than one with "connected" parts.
Soldering just gives them a lot more freedom to put parts where they want to and helps keep size (thickness) down.
The connections may be more reliable, but actually QC in production is the same or even higher.
It's a fantastic pain in the ass if you ask me!

I absolutely hate this trend and find it should only be used on the MBA line.
It's one of the key things that may make me ditch Apple after being a very happy user and (often critical) supporter for over 25 years. So your HD dies, now means your laptop is trash?

The MBA seems to be the blueprint for every computer they design these days. Even though I love such features in a MBA, I despise them in any other model. There is no, absolutely 0, reason for them doing this for performance gain which is where it's at in their pro line.
Pro to me is still upgradeability, user access to key parts, wide choice of ports, no true need for thin or highly stylised machines. They've not done this for years, so I'm not expecting them to do so soon. But that's where they will probably loose me as a customer when I need to buy a new laptop.

Pro users do not care for the thickness of the machines.
They literally don't give a flying **** over the race to lose mm's, if that means trading in functionality.

Look at the heap of trash that is the Mac Pro.
Now compare it with the Power Mac G5.
That was (to me) the last true "pro" machine Apple made, it was also one of the best tower designs ever.
(Watch the keynote for it if you have the time. It's a great Steve keynote!)

Apple has always made strange design choices, but this trend is completely bonkers.
Everyone is complaining about it, has been for a while now, yet they simply do not listen.
I've put up with it for my latest purchase, but it's the last time I've done so.

yet here you are on a apple forum, they truly are living rent free

i love my mac, never had any issues with them The majority of us really do not care about the opinions you listed tbh
[doublepost=1548907770][/doublepost]

I think Apple has tried the always-smaller-at-any-cost strategy and has found out that any strategy, taken too far, brings disadvantages. Aside from the reliability issues, it's also bad for their reputation if any random Chinese manufacturer seems to make less disposable devices.


For desktops, no upgrade path was a complete killer. I hardly know people who bought one and those who did, did so reluctantly. Modularity is key. I hope Apple understands that well enough to offer something realistic, not something closed expandable with a few cables. A CPU upgrade mid-lifetime is such a common scenario that, in my opinion, they should cater for.

i totally understand but out of the entire customer base, a small minority of people are actually going to upgrade their desktop components . It made sense for apple to go this route, even if it pissed a few enthusiast on online forums off .Thats the reality of the current times, its not the 2000s anymore . Apple adjusted for the current times and the wave of customers who dont really care for that kind of thing .

 

[Ener Ji]

I heard that Dell may be targeting summer, so you may get your Ice Lake MacBook's in fall this year. I believe Intel has made enough change to the CPU process to make it unlikely they'd be further delayed.

Highly unlikely IMHO. The only Ice Lake chips supposed to be available this year are the low-power U chips, not the higher power 28W and 45W chips that Apple uses for most of the MBP line.

The only thing I wish for is a significantly fatter MBP with better thermal management.

Fatter No, but I will wait for 10nm Intel 8 Core CPU And 7nm GPU. Those and LPDDR4 are my 3 bare Minimum Must haves. Possibly a full Redesigned Chasis it’s so hard to tell when a full Redesign will arrive.

You won't get those things before 2020 (at the very earliest), and by the time they arrive they will almost certainly be in a new chassis.

Internal Apple files revealed that they're looking at AMD Navi dGPU's now, most likely for the 2019 MBP line.

More info here: https://www.overclock3d.net/news/gpu_displays/amd_radeon_navi_gpus_spotted_in_macos_latest_update/1

I'm really excited at the thought of seeing a 7mm GPU in the 2019 models - might finally be time to update my 13" 2014 MBP now! The cherry on top would be a Zen 2 AMD cpu...

A 7nm GPU would be nice, but it's not clear how a mobile Navi will perform relative to the current mobile Vega GPUs. It's possible that mobile Navi will be higher performance replacements for the 450/460, but still slot in below the Vega 20 mobile GPU.

On desktop, Navi is supposed to be a low-end GPU that is primarily aimed at replacing Polaris GPUs in the marketplace (i.e. the Radeon 460/470/480/580 line of GPUs). Best case, Navi replaces or obsoletes Vega 56 by getting close to Vega 56 performance at a lower cost. I expect Vega 64 to remain AMD's highest-end desktop GPU until the GPU after Navi releases. There's a lot less information on AMD's plans for mobile Navi, so it's very much still up in the air.

I'm still not convinced they won't put out a new design this year, (and I hope that they do).

What makes you think they will do this? Do you think they would accelerate their refresh plans because of some of the issues with the 2016-2018 line?

I could see them going 4K before OLED. I mean, having the true "default" resolution (i.e. the one that's exactly half the native resolution) be 1440x900 in 2019 seems so antiquated. They could go 4K and have the 21" iMac's 2048 x 1152 resolution.

I'd love a resolution bump. OLED would be nice, too, if the quality and longevity of the panels is up to "Apple" standards.

Related, I wonder if Apple's "Pro" display (expected this year) will be OLED?

 

[ls1dreams]

There's a clue in your last sentence. It's not what *you* expect from a pro machine.

As an IT&operations manager, I do actually prefer a handy size over expandability or fixability in laptops. We have several desktops for video processing and other heavy lifting. If I would need any of that, I'll go to one of those machines. That's not to say that I could use a plain macbook for the rest of my job. In my previous, startup life, I did plenty of Docker-VMs-software dev-video processing and the like, all on my MBP. I still didn't feel the need to open the machine up.

I now have the opportunity to upgrade my late 2013 MBP to an NVMe SSD. I've got plenty of experience doing that sort of stuff, including flashing the bootrom over SPI. However, I am not looking forward to doing that at all. It would probably take me 2-3 days to investigate and order everything, then maybe a day or 2 to do it. Even if the upgrade was simpler, it still means preparing, selecting components and then doing the upgrade.

At a good freelancer's price per day, it quickly becomes extremely clear that upgrades of laptops are almost never worth it. The cost and hassle of upgrades vs a more portable machine? Give me the latter anytime.

But, including the financial and practical sides may just be what I look for in a 'pro' machine.

Funny you say this because I feel the same as I've gotten older. Used to love upgrading machines and playing around. Now the thought of having to swap out a drive, backup data, clone it, etc just stresses me out. Never thought I'd be one of these people, but I just want things to work now.

 

[PeterJP]

Funny you say this because I feel the same as I've gotten older. Used to love upgrading machines and playing around. Now the thought of having to swap out a drive, backup data, clone it, etc just stresses me out. Never thought I'd be one of these people, but I just want things to work now.

It's not so much the work itself, because that's usually the smallest amount of work. And it's also what makes people underestimate the work involved. Once the new component is in, you have to make it work. If you're swapping the boot drive (as in my MBP NVMe upgrade), you have to reinstall everything, restore backups and you'll still be struggling for weeks because this-and-that app have forgotten their login info or what have you.

It really struck me the last time I tried to use Linux as a desktop OS two years ago. One rolling update later, graphics wouldn't work anymore on one of the most common cards in the industry. Scr** that! A mac just works.

 

[c0ppo]

I now have the opportunity to upgrade my late 2013 MBP to an NVMe SSD. I've got plenty of experience doing that sort of stuff, including flashing the bootrom over SPI. However, I am not looking forward to doing that at all. It would probably take me 2-3 days to investigate and order everything, then maybe a day or 2 to do it. Even if the upgrade was simpler, it still means preparing, selecting components and then doing the upgrade.

That’s funny.
I’ve ordered X1 Extreme. Ordered Samsung 970 EVO 1tb.

X1E arrived, evo arrived. Unscrew 6-7 screws, pop in EVO, put screws back in. 2mins top.

Now I have 1tb for windows 10, and 1tb for Linux.

And if any of the drives die on me, it will take me 2mins to replace that drive. In a really thin and light laptop, with better specs then any MBP.

If your drive dies, what then? If just one key fails, what then?

So no, please, no... Pros don’t want everything glued in. Most of us anyway.

 

[Dave245]

That’s funny.
I’ve ordered X1 Extreme. Ordered Samsung 970 EVO 1tb.

X1E arrived, evo arrived. Unscrew 6-7 screws, pop in EVO, put screws back in. 2mins top.

Now I have 1tb for windows 10, and 1tb for Linux.

And if any of the drives die on me, it will take me 2mins to replace that drive. In a really thin and light laptop, with better specs then any MBP.

If your drive dies, what then? If just one key fails, what then?

So no, please, no... Pros don’t want everything glued in. Most of us anyway.

But not everyone is as tech savvy, I understand what you’re saying BUT for some of us it’s why we pay Apple for the extra Ram, they fit it and any issues it gets taken back to them to fix or if it’s old we buy a new one.

For example my 2011 MacBook Pro has an issue with a weird screen having pink lines going across it and not being able to boot past the Apple logo. It’s an old computer and while it could possibly be fixed, I see more value in buying a new one when needed.

Just my opinion