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Try this link, just sit and watch the animation.
http://producten.hema.nl/

On my Mac it takes around 5-6 seconds to load, a loading circle pops up (do mind that it takes 5 seconds the first time this site is visited, the second time it is already cached and it will load instantly)
On a similar Windows PC at work (with slower internet) it loads in an instance, no loading circle.

Activity monitor will show CPU peaks for Safari up to 118%
(Camino is even worse: peaks of 128% )
On a Windows PC it will not peak any higher than 30%

I don't have a PC to test with, but while it does peak pretty high, it averaged about 45% or so until the very end. Also, just because it loads faster at your work on a slower connection doesn't mean that the intermediate connections are the same speed between your house and work. If you test it on the same network, it might give different results. It took me like 10 seconds for it to download.

I do agree though, Flash sucks on Mac OS because Adobe hasn't optimized it. We're running similar hardware, so it shouldn't be too hard for them to get it to run the same. It could be a Safari issue, but I don't know.
 
I don't have a PC to test with, but while it does peak pretty high, it averaged about 45% or so until the very end. Also, just because it loads faster at your work on a slower connection doesn't mean that the intermediate connections are the same speed between your house and work. If you test it on the same network, it might give different results. It took me like 10 seconds for it to download.

I do agree though, Flash sucks on Mac OS because Adobe hasn't optimized it. We're running similar hardware, so it shouldn't be too hard for them to get it to run the same. It could be a Safari issue, but I don't know.

FYI, my work laptop (T7500 @ 2Ghz) maxed around 7% when loading that site.
 
FYI, my work laptop (T7500 @ 2Ghz) maxed around 7% when loading that site.

Yeah, I'm not arguing that 45% is what it should have been. I know it shouldn't take nearly that much on my hardware.

Also, I didn't mean that it was just a Safari issue, in case anyone gets the wrong idea about that. It could be an issue with how plugins interact with their host applications, but more than likely it's Adobe.
 
What this allows you to do is write multiple times to the same disc, so you don't waste a disc by only putting a little data on it then closing it.

Tiling windows is actually quite useful. It's certainly not a necessity on Mac OS X with Expose but it helps manage window clutter in one application that has multiple windows open, for instance, so you can see all the windows at once. Though I'm not a switcher I'd find this useful enough to use it occasionally.

ok i get the whole finalising thing now.. makes sense.

by tiling - is that (on windows) where you right click the task bar and go "tile vertically/horisonatally?" i HATE that feature. it resizes all of your windows.. OSX has features that get around that.
 
Cons: Closed hardware, apps are allowed to steal focus, lack of commercial support (eg. nobody's made Blu-ray playback software).
Pros: Everything else :D
 
Try this link, just sit and watch the animation.
http://producten.hema.nl/

On my Mac it takes around 5-6 seconds to load, a loading circle pops up (do mind that it takes 5 seconds the first time this site is visited, the second time it is already cached and it will load instantly)
On a similar Windows PC at work (with slower internet) it loads in an instance, no loading circle.

Activity monitor will show CPU peaks for Safari up to 118%
(Camino is even worse: peaks of 128% )
On a Windows PC it will not peak any higher than 30%

Cute animation! My mac loaded it in 3 seconds. 100 megabit internet connection 2.66 octad Mac Pro. My processors all went up to about 10% average and stayed there - they were all at about 3% average before I loaded the page.
 
Seriously, why would I want to cut and paste an application when I can move the damn thing?
This whole cut and paste thing is a non-issue...well at least for me.


There are however a few things I kinda dislike:

- Non-consistency in closing windows/apps
Some programms/utiltilies like calculator and system preferences close when clicking the red button.
I know there's a good reason for that: with multi-window apps only the window closes, with one window apps the whole programm closes when closing the window.
But it just isn't comfortable in practice, I often find myself closing the System Preferences (window) and opening them numerous times...and I work with OSX for longer than 5 years.
Closing the window only has to close the window, not the whole app.

- Often mentioned: Flash on a Mac sucks, but it isn't Apple fault.

That's it.
I may come up with more cons...

I got used to clicking on the Application name in the menu bar, then Quit, rather than using the window buttons to close out of an entire Application.
 
Cons: slow startup time of every piece of software. Apple should copy prefetch technology that MS is using in Vista/7. Windows7 is incredibly fast at opening programs compared to Leopard (the same MacBookPro late08).
 
I got used to clicking on the Application name in the menu bar, then Quit, rather than using the window buttons to close out of an entire Application.

Yes, that's what I am saying.
That's exactly why I don't like it the Calculator app to close when I hit the red button, when I am expecting it only to close its window.

I stil make this mistake over and over again, because I am used to purposely quit an app only from the menubar or right-clicking the dock icon.
And I am used to the behavior that clicking the red button will only close a window.

At my work I make this mistake (accidentally quit an app) less often, because I'm aware that I am working on a Windows PC, where you quit an app by clicking the red cross...

OSX has to be consistent.
Closing a window only closes a window, not an entire app.
 
Cute animation! My mac loaded it in 3 seconds. 100 megabit internet connection 2.66 octad Mac Pro. My processors all went up to about 10% average and stayed there - they were all at about 3% average before I loaded the page.

???
That's odd.
Google "Flash sucks OSX" or something similar and you will find many Mac users complainig about the high CPU usage.
 
uuhh, yes you can.. Go->Connect To Server (or :apple: + K), type in FTP:\\IP
Nice. One thing to cross off my list.

wow never knew people actually used this feature, what does it even do?? toast allows you to not 'finalise'
If I'm writing data to a disc, say for incremental backups such as yearly taxes, more than likely I won't be filling a 700MB disc up all at once. A multi-session CD allows me to add data to the CD at different times until full since it keeps the session "open". In Windows it's just a checkbox when you're burning. In OS X, there's no easy way to allow for a multi-session disc. And having to spend money on Toast just to have multi-session is silly.

uumm, righto. mines fine. im a fast typer and i dont need to 'slow down' for it, must be your keyboard. maybe there is sticky residue behind it
[Maybe] it's a feature that Apple recently introduced and you have an older Mac. This feature is so people don't activate caps lock by accident. Lame.

Open up a text editor and type on any letter as fast as you can and it will work fine. Now use a moderate speed on the caps lock key and it won't activate.

and windows actually does? to play a BD in windows you have to first 'decode' the disc with AnyDVD-HD to your HD then watch it.
No, you do NOT have to decode Blu-ray to your HDD to play it. AnyDVD-HD is for ripping Blu-ray discs. PowerDVD will play it no problem straight from disc.
http://www.cyberlink.com/products/movie-playback/powerdvd/overview_en_US.html

get a full size keyboard, wala!! you have a 'proper' delete key
Sure. I'll just tape it onto my laptop?

I'm not arguing against cut and paste, I'm simply saying, as I did before, that Apple has probably chosen to leave it out until they figure out what to do with it because it functions differently with files and folders than it does with text. You can't argue that.
I'm not arguing that. I'm arguing that it doesn't matter because you can always undo it.

You really have to leave undo out of the argument. Undo is a separate system function.
This makes no sense. There's no rules that say if you accidentally cut something you didn't mean to then you have to live with it and not use undo. It absolutely belongs in the argument because it renders your arguments a moot point.

I agreed that Mac OS X is inconsistent when it comes to quitting the application. It's inconsistent in many places, like Windows and like almost everything with a GUI.
Exactly. Who cares if it's inconsistent? It's useful. And there's ways to undo mistakes.

As for your cons:
Tiling Windows - I don't think I'd use it. At most I'm using a few windows at a time.
Just to clarify for those that don't know, tiling windows is not the same as Exposé. Tiling windows will resize all the opened windows to fit perfectly on your desktop with no overlaps and without you having to do it manually. It's great when I'm moving files around (usually to various network drives/directories) and have multiple Explorer windows open. Most people don't know about, and it's not needed most of the time but it's very handy when you do need it.

Caps Lock - What computer are you talking about?
2008 Mac Pro and 2008 MacBook Pro. The caps lock key is gimp'd by Apple.

Further, what exactly is the use of caps lock? I've never found that key to be very useful. If I need a word in caps, I hold shift and type. I have big hands and I'm a touch typist, so I don't need to use my pinky if I don't want to. Why would anyone need to type in caps for any extended amount of time? If you give me a reason I'll be happy to acknowledge it.
First of all, the caps lock key is there (and prominent) for a reason. That should be your first clue on it's importance. Here are various reasons to use caps lock:
  • Engineering and architectural drawings use all caps (required). Often the notes on a drawing can be many paragraphs long.
  • Typing long acronyms. It's faster to hit caps lock and type the acronym than to hold down shift, especially if the acronym isn't easily typed in the first place.
  • Not sure but some programming languages need caps lock?
  • Passwords. Some use caps lock and hit shift for lowercase which allows for more caps without having to hit shift all the time. Suprisingly, hitting shift while in caps lock doesn't make the letter lower case on my Mac. Good one Apple.
  • Manual writers, graphic artists doing printwork, lawyers, authors, basically anyone that has to deal with text and needs to write more than a few letters in caps would use caps lock.

Full Screen Button - Um Apple, if you're listening, please don't do this. I don't need my UI to be cluttered with another button I won't use. Thanks. When I used Windows I used maximize, now I don't miss it at all.
Are you kidding me? Adding another button up there with the red, yellow and green buttons will CLUTTER your UI?

Button Size - Is there any chance you're talking about an Apple Pro app? For some reason they do that and get away with it. This one is really the fault of the software developers, not OS X specifically.
Don't care whose fault it is. But it's pathetic that Apple can't get it's own pro apps to be uniform with its OS.

Forward Delete - You know I can see the usefulness in this, but I never use it on my full size keyboards. I know a lot of people do...I don't know why one would end up needing to forward delete often enough to complain about it.
What if I remapped your computer to where normal delete was Fn+delete and forward delete was just "delete". Would that annoy you?

Forward delete and normal delete do pretty much the same thing. Windows users are used to being able to use whichever method, depending on where the cursor is dropped. To suddenly lose the ease of bidirectional delete is annoying.
 
Nice. One thing to cross off my list.

:):)

If I'm writing data to a disc, say for incremental backups such as yearly taxes, more than likely I won't be filling a 700MB disc up all at once. A multi-session CD allows me to add data to the CD at different times until full since it keeps the session "open". In Windows it's just a checkbox when you're burning. In OS X, there's no easy way to allow for a multi-session disc. And having to spend money on Toast just to have multi-session is silly.

that seems fair enough then, why you are living in the past is beyond me :rolleyes:


[Maybe] it's a feature that Apple recently introduced and you have an older Mac. This feature is so people don't activate caps lock by accident. Lame.

i have a question; caps lock is there to either keep ON caps or keep OFF caps.. why would you want to be hitting it consecutively?? wouldnt you just use Shift for that??

Open up a text editor and type on any letter as fast as you can and it will work fine. Now use a moderate speed on the caps lock key and it won't activate.

not near my laptop atm, its an original MBP - new but old.. keyboards are the same (up until the last revision anyway)

No, you do NOT have to decode Blu-ray to your HDD to play it. AnyDVD-HD is for ripping Blu-ray discs. PowerDVD will play it no problem straight from disc.
http://www.cyberlink.com/products/movie-playback/powerdvd/overview_en_US.html

haha ok i guess i was a bit off - dont know where i heard that from.. too much reading. is powerdvd free??


Sure. I'll just tape it onto my laptop?

didnt know u had a lappy sorry - wireless KB anybody??
 
If you guys are talking about the delay that Apple added to the caps lock then yes, that's true. It's documented somewhere too. I read about them doing it in the developer forums and sure enough 10.5.x (I forget the value of x) introduced a delay. I think it's 300 or 400 milliseconds. And if you type even 40wpm it can be quite annoying. At 15 or 20 wpm I guess it may not be too bad. It's a bad idea in general tho! So is the eject key delay.


Lame, lame, lame!!! Don't dummy-proof my keyboard!
 
If you guys are talking about the delay that Apple added to the caps lock then yes, that's true. It's documented somewhere too. I read about them doing it in the developer forums and sure enough 10.5.x (I forget the value of x) introduced a delay. I think it's 300 or 400 milliseconds. And if you type even 40wpm it can be quite annoying. It's a bad idea! So is the eject key delay.

wasnt aware there was one, thanks.

i notice no lag between when i hit the CAPS concurrently.. even at quite fast speeds (i play drums) - it still responds as it normally would. im running 10.5.5, did it only come out in 10.5.6??

Lame, lame, lame!!! Don't dummy-proof my keyboard!

or at least have the option to turn it off!

oh, i like the eject key idea...
 
wasnt aware there was one, thanks.

i notice no lag between when i hit the CAPS concurrently.. even at quite fast speeds (i play drums) - it still responds as it normally would. im running 10.5.5, did it only come out in 10.5.6??

Could be. I'm not sure exactly.



or at least have the option to turn it off!

oh, i like the eject key idea...

Yeah, that would be the ticket! Have "Lama Levels" for clutsy typists! :D
 
Could be. I'm not sure exactly.

fair enough - ill report back when i FINALLY update to 10.5.6 (download limits suck)


Yeah, that would be the ticket! Have "Lama Levels" for clutsy typists! :D

not like apple to do something very 'useful' (in that sense) with their OS now is it..

oh i have some clutsy (we call it ditsy) friends, maybe i should ask them what they think about it..
 
I'm a newbie, so I probably don't understand everything yet.

Pro:

1. Expose
2. Connectivity (peripherals and network) though with vista I also have great experiences with connectivity.
3. Ease of use (though I have no issues with Vista/XP)
4. Some system settings are a tad basic, which is bliss and annoying at the same time. From the system pref screen you can find almost eveything with just a few clicks and thats wonderful.

Dislike (or lack of understanding^^)
1. Dock gets cluttered. i keep mine trimmed, but colleagues have 25+ items in the dock :confused:
2. Apps dont close if you close the window. (instead they go to the dock). So you have top close the app through the menu (minor gripe)
3. Some apps/processes stay TSR. Plex for instance keep hogging a bit of memory, as does ituneshelper if you quit the app. I don't know how to kill those pesky leftovers.
4. Tiny tiny tiny gripe (and thats more because I use windows a lot): I think the red/orange/green bullets to max/min/close windows are counterintuitive. Also, Double clicking on the top bar of a window should max/minimize a window just like windows.
5. Some system settings are a tad basic, which is bliss and annoying at the same time. For instance, clamshell/power settings feel limited ("feel" because maybe I shouldnt want more?).

#3 is perhaps more an example of bad programs then anything else.
#4 is on the one hand my brains being wired windows, but also because I really dont understand why you have three choices when they basically could be done with 1-2. (Min max with double click bar, close to dock with a bullet?)
#5 is more a pro than a con, but it does feel basic... then again, why would I want to go under the hood?


In general I prefer OSX over Vista, which I also like (I never ran into issues with Windows, but I am a poweruser). And for someone who is less savvy it's a handsdown winner (the controlled hardware environment is part of the strength).
 
???
That's odd.
Google "Flash sucks OSX" or something similar and you will find many Mac users complainig about the high CPU usage.

I'm not sure if Flash is multithreaded or not, but if it is, it's not odd that 8 processors went up 7%. That's a lot of processing power being used. It should take about 7% of one of those processors. 7% on each processor is similar to 56% of one.

I'm not arguing that. I'm arguing that it doesn't matter because you can always undo it.

There's no rules that say if you accidentally cut something you didn't mean to then you have to live with it and not use undo.

If it requires undo to fix something in one case, and not in the other it is inconsistent.

Exactly. Who cares if it's inconsistent? It's useful. And there's ways to undo mistakes.

Exactly. It is useful. If you'll recall, I've actually said that I'd like it. I have consistently said that the reason I believe Apple has not implemented it is because the current form of implementation is inconsistent.


2008 Mac Pro and 2008 MacBook Pro. The caps lock key is gimp'd by Apple.

It's probably built into the hardware and it probably does suck.

First of all, the caps lock key is there (and prominent) for a reason. That should be your first clue on it's importance. Here are various reasons to use caps lock:
  • Engineering and architectural drawings use all caps (required). Often the notes on a drawing can be many paragraphs long.
  • Typing long acronyms. It's faster to hit caps lock and type the acronym than to hold down shift, especially if the acronym isn't easily typed in the first place.
  • Not sure but some programming languages need caps lock?
  • Passwords. Some use caps lock and hit shift for lowercase which allows for more caps without having to hit shift all the time. Suprisingly, hitting shift while in caps lock doesn't make the letter lower case on my Mac. Good one Apple.
  • Manual writers, graphic artists doing printwork, lawyers, authors, basically anyone that has to deal with text and needs to write more than a few letters in caps would use caps lock.

I've done printwork, and I've never needed to use caps like that. I can't think of a modern programming language that would need it. I can see the architectural aspect (I almost majored in architecture) although I don't recall additional notes being in all caps, though it makes sense that they would be. For the record, I use all caps on my invoices, but I still just hold shift. I do agree that it's retarded that you can't uncaps with shift. That might be the reason I stopped using it. I do recall using it far more often before owning a Mac.

Are you kidding me? Adding another button up there with the red, yellow and green buttons will CLUTTER your UI?

No, I'm not kidding you. Three buttons is enough. If everyone requested a button for this and that feature we'd have no room for titles anymore. Each button takes up roughly 23 pixels. My laptop only has a 1280px wide screen. On an app like Safari 4 with the tabs at the top, that's lost space. Why not, as I have mentioned in the previous thread, make it so that option click full screens?

What if I remapped your computer to where normal delete was Fn+delete and forward delete was just "delete". Would that annoy you?

I'm not saying that it wouldn't be annoying, but tell me this: which one do you use more often? To need forward delete, you'd have to have moved the cursor back. Why not delete on your way back? That should alleviate some of the problem.

Forward delete and normal delete do pretty much the same thing. Windows users are used to being able to use whichever method, depending on where the cursor is dropped. To suddenly lose the ease of bidirectional delete is annoying.

I don't know what to tell you. Maybe there's a way to map it to another key.
 
Interesting how many criticisms of OSX boil down to "it isn't Windows." Apple has chosen to do things differently than Microsoft, on purpose. Some of us actually regard this as a virtue, which why we choose to use OSX instead of Windows. And before anyone says "but Windows has more features," I'd respond that Microsoft's mania for cramming features (frequently with little thought about how they work) into their products is one the reasons some of us prefer Apple's more consistent and more judicious approach.
 
Interesting how many criticisms of OSX boil down to "it isn't Windows." Apple has chosen to do things differently than Microsoft, on purpose. Some of us actually regard this as a virtue, which why we choose to use OSX instead of Windows. And before anyone says "but Windows has more features," I'd respond that Microsoft's mania for cramming features (frequently with little thought about how they work) into their products is one the reasons some of us prefer Apple's more consistent and more judicious approach.

THANKYOU!!!!! this is exactly what i have been thinking. we use OSX to get away from M$ junk, because its different and takes a different perspective. people think M$'s OS's are a 'benchmark' for all other OS's. ITS NOT TRUE - although we do benchmark pretty much all previous things compared to new things.. cars, partners, countries, computers, stupid mortals.. ( :p )

*otherstuff*
It most certainly isn't for filming your golf swing. If the PC camera can work that much better for you, why not use it? Hell, if you're that concerned about your golf swing, why don't you go out and buy a camera with some manual control? Or, you could probably trick the iSight. Add a lot more light to the shot. However, I'd be willing to bet that if you can't get a fast enough shutter outside in daylight, it's probably not going to happen. I'd imagine to stop a golf shot, you'd probably need something like 1/500 and the iSight probably doesn't do that.

actually, if you use QuickTime Pro, and go into the Preferences, "Recording" tab select the iSight camera, you can choose the "Quality" of the device.

• Good(MPEG-4): crap
• Better(H.264): crap
• Device Native: GOOD! it captures raw data and there is really no lag at all, might be great for Mad Macy. (results in LARGE files though)
 
The Finder is something I don't like on the mac. I never minded it too much until I used Windows 7 for a week. I really like how it saves your windows arrangements and has so many options for moving and copying files.

Finder Never remembers your windows arrangements. There are only a few places I want coverflow, and I'm constantly changing them. It also seems slower to me.
 
The Finder is something I don't like on the mac. I never minded it too much until I used Windows 7 for a week. I really like how it saves your windows arrangements and has so many options for moving and copying files.

Finder Never remembers your windows arrangements. There are only a few places I want coverflow, and I'm constantly changing them. It also seems slower to me.

That is annoying. If I remember correctly, there's a preference for it, but it doesn't work.
 
Interesting how many criticisms of OSX boil down to "it isn't Windows." Apple has chosen to do things differently than Microsoft, on purpose. Some of us actually regard this as a virtue, which why we choose to use OSX instead of Windows. And before anyone says "but Windows has more features," I'd respond that Microsoft's mania for cramming features (frequently with little thought about how they work) into their products is one the reasons some of us prefer Apple's more consistent and more judicious approach.

I would agree but Apple is missing some simple key features as I mentioned before. This is just like the iPhone's copy and paste. Apple makes you wait too long for something so simple.
 
i notice no lag between when i hit the CAPS concurrently.. even at quite fast speeds (i play drums) - it still responds as it normally would. im running 10.5.5, did it only come out in 10.5.6??
I've had my Macs since 10.5.2 or so and it has always had the slow caps lock. Consider yourself lucky if you don't have this "safety feature". Perhaps its a combo hardware/software thing for 2008+ Macs.

If it requires undo to fix something in one case, and not in the other it is inconsistent as I have been pointing out.
Again, so what if it's inconsistent? Can you get back to square one if you screw something up with C&P? The answer is yes.

You don't think it's likely that someone could cut something, copy something else, and outrun their undo buffer?
No, I don't think it's likely unless they're a total n00b. And if they're a n00b, they'll just have to learn.

The concept of cut/copy 'n paste isn't rocket science. You don't need a degree to figure it out. Even a n00b would learn how it works fairly quickly. To not have a useful feature in order to "protect the n00b" is stupid (just like the caps lock issue). So what if you make a mistake and lose a couple of sentences? It's not the end of the world.

I've done printwork, and I've never needed to use caps like that.
Take a look at some magazine covers. Plenty of caps on Golf Digest for example:
http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&q=golf digest&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wi

For the record, I use all caps on my invoices, but I still just hold shift.
For anything more than a few letters that's not very efficient when 1 finger is holding down shift. Doesn't matter how fast you are. 10 fingers is faster than 9.

No, I'm not kidding you. Three buttons is enough. If everyone requested a button for this and that feature we'd have no room for titles anymore.
Adding one button doesn't suddenly open the floodgates to 20 more buttons. Full screen is probably in the top 5 requested features from switchers. Adding one more button for full screen would help the switchers and still keep the Apple loyalists happy with their way of doing things.

Why not, as I have mentioned in the previous thread, make it so that option click full screens?
It's a step in the right direction, but I don't like having to have a modifier. Would you like it if they changed X to quit and + to be full screen and make you option+click to revert back to current Mac style?

I use both Windows and OS X. Features that I like in Macs I want in Windows and vice versa. Options and efficiency are what I desire in an operating system. Why does it have to be either/or, us/them? Some people like that OS X and Windows are different. I, on the other hand, wish they were combined with the best traits from one another.

I'm not saying that it wouldn't be annoying, but tell me this: which one do you use more often? To need forward delete, you'd have to have moved the cursor back. Why not delete on your way back? That should alleviate some of the problem.
I wouldn't cursor back just to forward delete. I'd use back delete in that case.

I usually use forward delete when I'm adding something (sentence or word) in the middle of an already written paragraph. I do this a lot in emails where I write something, re-read it and the wording is off so I add and/or remove words/sentences to clarify. Sometimes it's back delete, sometimes it's forward delete depending on where I need to add and/or remove the words/sentences.
 
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