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So whats that eSATA-looky-like thingy on the MacBook pro? Okay so Apple calls it an 'Expansion Port' but the guy in the Apple Store says its an eSata port.
its an express card slot

which you can buy an esata card that goes into and has two esata ports that you can use.
which i have, and its beautiful.
 
Unintelligent? Please. More like stupid design on Apple's part. Why should I have to perform surgery and pull the entire system apart to replace the optical drive? On PC notebooks you just power down, remove the battery, loosen a single screw and pull the drive out.
By "stupid design", you appear to be talking about slot-loading drives vs. tray-loading drives.

Oddly enough, PC notebooks just now seem to be moving towards this "stupid design" that Apple notebooks have had for the last umpteen years.

My roommates' $2000 new Dell Studio XPS whatever has a slot-loading drive, and guess what? You have to perform surgery and pull the entire system apart to replace the optical drive.

HDMI has been standard on PC notebooks for a couple of years now. It was part of the Santa Rosa spec even on the PC side.
Standard? If you walk into a Best Buy or Circuit City and look at the rows of PC notebooks there, it's still the exception to find one with HDMI. :rolleyes:
 
Yes on any brand.

You just showed your complete lack of experience with non-Apple systems ;)

Most well built PCs conform to certain standards.

Replacing the optical drive consists of loosening a single screw on the bottom and simply pulling the drive out. Compared the complete system surgery required by a Mac.

Replacing the HDD on a PC generally requires removing two screws and lifting up a cover, giving you full access to the drive. You pull the tab lifting the drive out. Unlike Macs, the casing is held on by standard screws and not some obscure Torx size that can only be found in expensive tool kits.

Upgrading the RAM is the same as the HDD. You generally use your fingernail to lift the metal tabs to the sides and the RAM pops out. Re-inserting the RAM is usually a simple process of sliding in and pushing down.

To remove the battery for all of these procedures you just need to slide a lock on the bottom to the side. No need for getting a coin out and using it. You just drop the battery back in and it locks back in place.
Sounds like every Dell I've had to fix. I can't even touch the Apple laptops.

It's depressing when nearly every PC laptop comes with HDMI or an ExpressCard slot.
 
I am a big believer in that. The only problem is that I don't see the big difference in quality for the $449 and the entry $1099 that I mentioned.

Why doesn't Apple offer a longer warranty if they last so much longer? Like I said, I have had my desktop HP Windows XP for 5 years. It still works and doesn't really slow down until I get more than 2 heavy sites open at once and it is still a minimal drop off in speed. So all of this about them lasting for 2 years is bogus.

Someone mentioned the additional programs I need to buy for a Windows machine. The only other software I really "need" would be Word since it is the dominant player in the computer world and makes sending things easier on my end. I can get the student edition with Word, Excel and Power Point for $79 so I am still paying half of what I would for the MacBook.

The difference between them is the fact that the Dell machine comes with an out of date Celeron processor, a screen with the same resolution as the Macbook but bigger in size, only 1 GB or Ram, only Wireless G, no Bluetooth, and Vista Home Basic which is quite spartan, a smaller battery, plus the lack of in store support, etc, lack of software such as iLife and depending on the machine, worse quality often times.

You have to decide for yourself if you feel those upgrades are justified by the higher price. Also, you can get Office for $125 and if you are interested in a getting a Mac, you should probably heavily consider refurrbs which are just like new, but products that have been returned. Apple then conducts an inspection to make sure everything is working and then the savings are passed on to you. They're very good deals as well. As I said, only you can decide if the upgrades are worth it.
 
Well it looks like all the facts, are pointing you. In the direction of the dell.
So go on and buy it.
Your beginning to smell like a troll
 
Oh mosx, just when I thought you had finally gotten hit by a car and left us Apple Fanboys to dwell in our pretentiousness, you have come back to turn this simple 1 page thread into a soon 15 page monster "Mac Vs PC" thread.

Oh how I loathe you.

By "stupid design", you appear to be talking about slot-loading drives vs. tray-loading drives.

Oddly enough, PC notebooks just now seem to be moving towards this "stupid design" that Apple notebooks have had for the last umpteen years.

My roommates' $2000 new Dell Studio XPS whatever has a slot-loading drive, and guess what? You have to perform surgery and pull the entire system apart to replace the optical drive.


Standard? If you walk into a Best Buy or Circuit City and look at the rows of PC notebooks there, it's still the exception to find one with HDMI. :rolleyes:

Both things are extremely true. Right on the dot, correctemundo.

Except the HDMI thing is partially right, it's true that it's not as standard as MOSX think but at the same time they're not extremely hard to find.

Anyways, moving on...

PC manufacturers use Slot-Loading drives too, not as much as apple, but most of their "Stylish" and "Chic" looking laptops do like the Dell Studio Laptops and the XPS lines.

Can you remind me what Apple also HAPPENS to strive for in the looks department? :eek:

And since you like "proof" so much MOSX

Here are all the "chic" Dells that use Slot-Loading Drives:
http://www1.ca.dell.com/content/pro...op_studio_15?c=ca&cs=cadhs1&l=en&s=dhs&~ck=mn

http://www1.ca.dell.com/content/pro...op_studio_17?c=ca&cs=cadhs1&l=en&s=dhs&~ck=mn

http://www1.ca.dell.com/content/pro.../xpsnb_m1330?c=ca&cs=cadhs1&l=en&s=dhs&~ck=mn

http://www1.ca.dell.com/content/pro.../xpsnb_m1530?c=ca&cs=cadhs1&l=en&s=dhs&~ck=mn

LOOK EVEN INSPIRONS!
http://www1.ca.dell.com/content/pro...-inspiron-13?c=ca&cs=cadhs1&l=en&s=dhs&~ck=mn

OH AND LOOK AT THE SERVICE MANUALS FOR ONE OF THE SLOT-LOADING LAPTOPS! http://support.dell.com/support/edocs/systems/xpsM1330/en/sm/optical.htm#wp999869
Ha look not just one screw and a pull out. More like 2 hours of tearing the bitch apart and then replacing it.

Oh, just watch how fast he turns this into the "DELL DOESN'T ACCURATELY REPRESENT ALL PC MANUFACTURERS" just like how he kinda did with that Vista survey on that forums which only had 800 people vote, rather than the 203492384093289 (mosx excellent estimation skills) MILLION that use Vista.
Go read up about what a survey does, buddy, because I think your thinking census and I'm thinking Arby's. :)

And yes the MBP lacks connections like HDMI, eSata,ect. But we all know Apple's been milking the design for years now, and a complete overhaul of the MBP is imminent, along with the MB, so lets see what comes out of the redesign :cool:
 
Oh mosx, just when I thought you had finally gotten hit by a car and left us Apple Fanboys to dwell in our pretentiousness, you have come back to turn this simple 1 page thread into a soon 15 page monster "Mac Vs PC" thread.

Oh how I loathe you.



Both things are extremely true. Right on the dot, correctemundo.

Except the HDMI thing is partially right, it's true that it's not as standard as MOSX think but at the same time they're not extremely hard to find.

Anyways, moving on...

PC manufacturers use Slot-Loading drives too, not as much as apple, but most of their "Stylish" and "Chic" looking laptops do like the Dell Studio Laptops and the XPS lines.

Can you remind me what Apple also HAPPENS to strive for in the looks department? :eek:

And since you like "proof" so much MOSX

Here are all the "chic" Dells that use Slot-Loading Drives:
http://www1.ca.dell.com/content/pro...op_studio_15?c=ca&cs=cadhs1&l=en&s=dhs&~ck=mn

http://www1.ca.dell.com/content/pro...op_studio_17?c=ca&cs=cadhs1&l=en&s=dhs&~ck=mn

http://www1.ca.dell.com/content/pro.../xpsnb_m1330?c=ca&cs=cadhs1&l=en&s=dhs&~ck=mn

http://www1.ca.dell.com/content/pro.../xpsnb_m1530?c=ca&cs=cadhs1&l=en&s=dhs&~ck=mn

LOOK EVEN INSPIRONS!
http://www1.ca.dell.com/content/pro...-inspiron-13?c=ca&cs=cadhs1&l=en&s=dhs&~ck=mn

OH AND LOOK AT THE SERVICE MANUALS FOR ONE OF THE SLOT-LOADING LAPTOPS! http://support.dell.com/support/edocs/systems/xpsM1330/en/sm/optical.htm#wp999869
Ha look not just one screw and a pull out. More like 2 hours of tearing the bitch apart and then replacing it.

Oh, just watch how fast he turns this into the "DELL DOESN'T ACCURATELY REPRESENT ALL PC MANUFACTURERS" just like how he kinda did with that Vista survey on that forums which only had 800 people vote, rather than the 203492384093289 (mosx excellent estimation skills) MILLION that use Vista.
Go read up about what a survey does, buddy, because I think your thinking census and I'm thinking Arby's. :)

And yes the MBP lacks connections like HDMI, eSata,ect. But we all know Apple's been milking the design for years now, and a complete overhaul of the MBP is imminent, along with the MB, so lets see what comes out of the redesign :cool:
I hope you haven't forgotten the Pismo.
 
I am a big believer in that. The only problem is that I don't see the big difference in quality for the $449 and the entry $1099 that I mentioned.

Why doesn't Apple offer a longer warranty if they last so much longer? Like I said, I have had my desktop HP Windows XP for 5 years. It still works and doesn't really slow down until I get more than 2 heavy sites open at once and it is still a minimal drop off in speed. So all of this about them lasting for 2 years is bogus.

Someone mentioned the additional programs I need to buy for a Windows machine. The only other software I really "need" would be Word since it is the dominant player in the computer world and makes sending things easier on my end. I can get the student edition with Word, Excel and Power Point for $79 so I am still paying half of what I would for the MacBook.

Then go buy a Dell. Why keep telling us how great the price is and how much the Macbook is a ripoff? Thanks for the info.. Now go to Best Buy and get that Dell. You don't have to convince us why the Dell is such a great bargain. I'm sure most don't care.
 
I haven't had the opportunity to post here in awhile. Unfortunately the other thread was closed for no reason. So I'll make my return here ;)



How do you know this? Actually, if you go to the Dell site, you'll see that the Inspiron 1525 (likely the model the OP is referring to) uses the same Santa Rosa chipset and Penryn based processors the MacBook does.

So they're both using out-dated chipsets and Penryn processors.

You can actually get a 13.3" Inspiron with the same specs as the $1299 MacBook for less than the entry MacBook ;)

DVD writer is standard.



Not true.

The cheapest Apple notebook ships with the X3100, which already performs worse than the generation before it making it outdated already, and it does not even ship with a DVD writer or an optical drive that could be upgraded by the user.

Not to mention the MacBooks (and Pros) lack standard connectivity options, like HDMI and eSATA.

Apple and OS X developers also have a knack for throwing CPU cycles at applications rather than optimizing them for speed, so those "fast" Core 2 Duos are not running at peak efficiency the way they would under Windows.

I mean, really, any notebook that ships with integrated Intel graphics is outdated by default. The current X4500 runs at 1/3 the speed of previous generation dedicated graphics when paired with the same CPU, and Apple's Intel GPU drivers have always been downright terrible, except for the GMA 950 (thanks to the way the GMA 950 works in hardware).



Apple's components are "quality"? The MacBook cracks on the palmrest thanks to the magentic latch, it cracks on the bottom due to heat thanks to the cooling system, it cracks on the back around the vents thanks to the heat, it discolors due to heat, the optical drives die left and right and you can't replace them!

An $800 HP will be built better than a MacBook and have graphics that outperform it by a large margin, along with the ability to play blu-ray movies (with an upgrade) and even modern games!

While I think Lenovo Thinkpads are great pieces of gear, pretty much every other PC manufacturer is quite lacking in build quality and reliability. Over the past 5 years I've worked on/with Gateway, HP, Dell, and IBM/Thinkpad. These are business class btw, not the cheap crap you buy at Best Buy.

None of them come close to the build quality of Apples, except the Thinkpads.

As far as the C2D's not running as efficiently under OSX as they do in Windows; have you read any benchmarks? Better yet, have you performed any? I have. OSX is faster than Vista. Sometimes a little, sometimes a lot. Even on the same exact machine. It's also generally faster (again, on the same hardware) than XP is.

I haven't been here very long, but have many years logged in the PC world. It's clear to see why the other posters here seem to generally dislike you. You're not remotely constructive or helpful, and are at best a poor troll. Why is that? PPC hold out fan boy? Or Windows fanboy?
 

Yay, mosx is back! :)

BTW, I'm currently considering this laptop, for all of you Macbook lovers. http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=8892825&type=product&id=1211587727985 For $1450, it has a 17" screen, and its graphics card leaves the 17" MBP in the dust. 1920 x 1200 resolution, 4GB ram standard, 7200 RPM HDD, ect. It's a Gateway, and yet it has positive reviews everywhere.

Macs are underspecced, period. I can get all those specs for the price of a top-of-the-line Macbook. Who cares about how thin and light the Macbook is? You can't use it on your lap, or you'll lose your fertility and get second-degree burns. So weight doesn't really matter. Right now, I'm looking at an undervolting program called coolbook which will do what Apple's engineers couldn't - make my Macbook cooler by reducing voltage (and therefore power consumption) to its actual stable minimum. It's amazing that an independent developer could do something better than Apple - or maybe not.
 
Yay, mosx is back! :)

BTW, I'm currently considering this laptop, for all of you Macbook lovers. http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=8892825&type=product&id=1211587727985 For $1450, it has a 17" screen, and its graphics card leaves the 17" MBP in the dust. 1920 x 1200 resolution, 4GB ram standard, 7200 RPM HDD, ect. It's a Gateway, and yet it has positive reviews everywhere.

Macs are underspecced, period. I can get all those specs for the price of a top-of-the-line Macbook. Who cares about how thin and light the Macbook is? You can't use it on your lap, or you'll lose your fertility and get second-degree burns. So weight doesn't really matter. Right now, I'm looking at an undervolting program called coolbook which will do what Apple's engineers couldn't - make my Macbook cooler by reducing voltage (and therefore power consumption) to its actual stable minimum. It's amazing that an independent developer could do something better than Apple - or maybe not.

Well aren't you special. Maybe you can join a Gateway board now.
 
And how stream-lined it is in comparison to any Dell I've used. Don't get me wrong, Dell machines are alright, but they're chunky in comparison.

I appreciate my MacBook so much more, simply because it's on a specifically put together system so it'll work. Time Machine is a godsend, even though I've never had to make use of it - my use of Windows has made me thankful for having a constant back-up available.

No viruses, iWork (well, pages) is just what I need, iLife is great to have available to me, FCE I will make more use of, and all the programs I normally used on XP are available, Skype, MSN, torrents, iTunes, Last.fm, plus many more. I've no reason to go back, it's taken me a while, but I have no need for another machine anymore - I have a games console, I'm sorted. The OS is enjoyable to use, it's not fiddly, it's just right.
 
Yay, mosx is back! :)

BTW, I'm currently considering this laptop, for all of you Macbook lovers. http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=8892825&type=product&id=1211587727985 For $1450, it has a 17" screen, and its graphics card leaves the 17" MBP in the dust. 1920 x 1200 resolution, 4GB ram standard, 7200 RPM HDD, ect. It's a Gateway, and yet it has positive reviews everywhere.

Macs are underspecced, period. I can get all those specs for the price of a top-of-the-line Macbook. Who cares about how thin and light the Macbook is? You can't use it on your lap, or you'll lose your fertility and get second-degree burns. So weight doesn't really matter. Right now, I'm looking at an undervolting program called coolbook which will do what Apple's engineers couldn't - make my Macbook cooler by reducing voltage (and therefore power consumption) to its actual stable minimum. It's amazing that an independent developer could do something better than Apple - or maybe not.

You'll need specs that high just to run Vista. :D
 
Just people that have to haul it from work to home or school.

ya i can vouch for that one.
my backpack with my calc, english, architecture and notebook (wich is a good 3in filled with papers) weighs im guessing 20lb's. with my mbp its like another 5lbs.

im pretty sure its more than 25 because people try and pick it up and they can't and have to get a good hold and good position,
man i hate these books (they are huge).
 
No additional software needed (you can't do anything with Windows out of the box). An equivalent suite of software to do what iLife does costs hundreds.

Not true.

iTunes and iPhoto are the only useful apps in the iLife suite. iTunes on Windows is definitely lacking and slow thanks to Apple's shoddy Windows software porting division. Vista has built-in photo organizing software that is every bit as good as iPhoto. You can also get freeware alternatives like Picassa, which many regard as better than iPhoto. You can also get HP's free "Photosmart Essentials" which does everything iPhoto does, including the "photo books" and all of that. But with the added benefit of being able to print out those photo books on YOUR OWN paper and in your own styles! You buy the book and insert the pages.

iMovie '08 is not very good at all. iDVD is okay, but generally people don't care about fancy menus and such. In fact, I have yet to talk to someone in a real world situation (even in an Apple store) that likes DVD menus.

Garageband is essentially useless. If you're recording instruments you want higher quality and more capable software anyway.

A far more productive OS that can potentially save you thousands over a course of several years (simplicity, logic, and ease of use).

Neither Vista nor Leopard is easier to use than the other. They're both equal in terms of "ease of use". Leopard is not "more simple". On the surface, Leopard seems to have some advantages. Such as easier software installs. But uninstalling software in Leopard generally leaves behind a mess of .plist files in various folders that you have to hunt down and destroy, even if you do use AppDelete or AppZappper.

I also find Windows to be far more "logical" than OS X in some instances. Alt-Tab for instance. In Windows it takes you directly to the window you want. In OS X it just takes you to the application, then you have to use another keyboard combination/shortcut to get to the desired window.

I don't mean to sound like a fanboy, I'm not, I just think Windows is a joke, and I laugh at people who compare Macs to PC's.

And I laugh at people who think Windows is a joke. OS X is far behind Windows in many aspects. Let me know when OS X has system wide hardware acceleration for video please. Something Windows has had in various forms since the 1990s.

Heh, Windows had that before Mac OS had pre-emptive multi-tasking. Kind of funny ;)

Now that is the type of information I was looking for. Very good info.

I don't see how it would make such a huge difference in "portability" between having a 13.3 or 15.4 in a bag to carry with me. But I do see a big difference when looking at a 13.3 and 15.4 screen. If I was concerned with portability, I would just use my iPhone for everything or get a 8.9 inch portable which is the size of a book.

The MacBook isn't as much smaller as a PC as the Apple faithful would like you to believe. I have a "fat" 15.4" HP and the MacBook. The MacBook weighs 5lbs and is only a cm or so smaller in each direction than the HP. The HP weighs 6lbs (with the higher capacity, but not bigger, battery and dedicated graphics). When I have it in a bag (most bags are designed for 15.4" anyway) I can't tell the difference between the two.

When I'm using it on my lap, the HP has a HUGE advantage in terms of heat. All Macs lack efficient cooling. As a result, the bottom of the case can COOK. Its amazing how hot it gets even with reduced performance settings and not doing anything other than chatting and browsing. The HP stays cool though, thanks to the fan on the bottom pulling air up and pushing it out the back, compared to the MacBook's exhaust only fan with no circulation and no vents in the casing except around the fan.

To get a more proper comparison it would be better to compare a Macbook to an XPS m1330 in which case the Macbook is often slightly cheaper or around the same price

Sigh. Its always ridiculous when people try to bring up this argument. Its completely inaccurate. The XPS is a system you buy because you care about vanity and because you want a portable.

The MacBook is generally the most popular MacBook and the one people buy because its the ONLY Apple notebook they can afford. As I've said many times before, nearly all people do not walk into an Apple store and see the MacBook and think "hmm its cheaper AND smaller" they look at the 15.4" and say "wow I can't afford this. But I can afford the smaller one".

Its perfectly reasonable to compare a standard notebook PC to a MacBook because, again, people are not buying it for its size. They are buying it because it is all they can afford.

And for $50 more than the middle MacBook, you get dedicated graphics with the XPS anyway. So its still well ahead of the MacBook.

The Macbook is considered a premium computer and as such it should be compared to premium computers.

Oh please. Whats premium about the MacBook? It's lacking standard connectivity (HDMI, eSATA, VGA/S-Video without adapters, full size ExpressCard, memory card readers), the casing is prone to cracking from regular use and heat, its prone to discoloring due to regular use and heat, and it uses integrated graphics. No "premium" computer would EVER have integrated graphics. Even the old last generation iBook still has better graphics than the current MacBook!

And it's pretty clear that mosx is a troll...

Don't resort to school yard insults just because you don't like hearing the truth.

By "stupid design", you appear to be talking about slot-loading drives vs. tray-loading drives.

Oddly enough, PC notebooks just now seem to be moving towards this "stupid design" that Apple notebooks have had for the last umpteen years.

My roommates' $2000 new Dell Studio XPS whatever has a slot-loading drive, and guess what? You have to perform surgery and pull the entire system apart to replace the optical drive.

Dell and their "premium" designs are the only ones that use slot loaders.

Every one else, including Dell's "regular" notebooks, HP, Gateway, custom makers, Asus, etc. all use standard tray loaders that can be replaced by the end user.

Standard? If you walk into a Best Buy or Circuit City and look at the rows of PC notebooks there, it's still the exception to find one with HDMI

Not true. Any PC in Best Buy, CC, Fry's, etc. with dedicated graphics will have HDMI outputs. You can even pick up a $750 HP with integrated graphics (ATI 3200) with an HDMI output and blu-ray. Again, HDMI was part of the Santa Rosa spec. It was up to the manufacturers to opt out of including it.

The difference between them is the fact that the Dell machine comes with an out of date Celeron processor, a screen with the same resolution as the Macbook but bigger in size, only 1 GB or Ram, only Wireless G, no Bluetooth, and Vista Home Basic which is quite spartan, a smaller battery, plus the lack of in store support, etc, lack of software such as iLife and depending on the machine, worse quality often times.

Two things. First, at least Dell gives you the option of buying a system at that price. What if that is all someone needs or all they can afford? At least PC manufacturers give you the choice of being able to pick and choose what hardware you want for what price. With Apple you either have to buy an expensive system that is not worth it (entry MacBook) or go up to a level ($1299) where you can get what could be considered a gaming PC.

At least Dell, HP, Gateway, and many others offer systems at all price ranges. Theres no reason for someone to spend $1100 on a computer if they only want to do a small amount of things. With integrated graphics, 1GB of RAM, and no DVD writer, that entry level MacBook is no better than that $450 Dell anyway. Except the Dell WOULD have a DVD writer!

Second thing, why bring up iLife? Again, iLife is essentially useless. iTunes is good in OS X, but not in Windows (Apple's fault). iPhoto is good, but there are better and free alternatives out there for Windows. Most people will never use iMovie, iDVD, or Garageband outside of opening it up and seeing what it looks like. I personally rather have the option of paying $100 less and not having iDVD, iMovie, and Garageband installed. Or let me spend $200 less and have NO iLIfe apps. Let me download iTunes for free and spend $25 to get iPhoto.

Most people still don't live around an Apple store either. I live in southern California and the closest Apple store is a good 70 mile round trip.

With PCs, however, you do get 24/7 support. It doesn't close on the weekends.

Except the HDMI thing is partially right, it's true that it's not as standard as MOSX think but at the same time they're not extremely hard to find.

You'd be hard pressed to find a system with dedicated graphics that does NOT have HDMI output and is a current generation model.

PC manufacturers use Slot-Loading drives too, not as much as apple, but most of their "Stylish" and "Chic" looking laptops do like the Dell Studio Laptops and the XPS lines.

Can you remind me what Apple also HAPPENS to strive for in the looks department?

And since you like "proof" so much MOSX

I already said that Dell and their "premium" lines are using slot loaders. No other respectable manufacturer does.

Oh, just watch how fast he turns this into the "DELL DOESN'T ACCURATELY REPRESENT ALL PC MANUFACTURERS" just like how he kinda did with that Vista survey on that forums which only had 800 people vote, rather than the 203492384093289 (mosx excellent estimation skills) MILLION that use Vista.
Go read up about what a survey does, buddy, because I think your thinking census and I'm thinking Arby's

Of all of Dell's sales, how many XPS and Studio systems are sold?

Exactly. I bet Dell sells less XPS and Studio systems than Apple sells Macs

Oh and 800 people voting on a survey does not represent the tens of millions of Vista users ;)

None of them come close to the build quality of Apples, except the Thinkpads.

Heh, you think Apple's build quality is good? THen tell me, why does the MacBook Pro have yellowing screen issues still? Why does it still have sound issues (electronic sounds coming out of the headphone/speaker jack)? Why does it warp from heat? Why does it bend and scratch? Why does the case start to separate due to heat? Why does the MacBook still have cracking issues on the palmrest? Why does the MacBook crack on the bottom due to heat? Why does it crack around the vent due to heat? Why does it turn yellow on the bottom due to heat? Why does it turn yellow around the vents due to heat?

As far as the C2D's not running as efficiently under OSX as they do in Windows; have you read any benchmarks? Better yet, have you performed any? I have. OSX is faster than Vista. Sometimes a little, sometimes a lot. Even on the same exact machine. It's also generally faster (again, on the same hardware) than XP is.

Have you watched your CPU use at all? Play a DVD in OS X versus Windows. Browse the web and watch Firefox or Safari's CPU use in OS X versus Windows. Look at Flash performance in OS X versus Windows.

ANd yes, I have run benchmarks. First of all, games. Even on the pathetic GPUs that Apple includes in the MacBooks, games tend to run twice as fast in Windows versus OS X. I've run Handbrake on both my HP and my Mac. MacBook: 2.16GHz Core 2 Duo 3GB of RAM. HP: 2GHz Core 2 Duo, 3GB of RAM. Handbrake finished faster on the HP by a few seconds.

But I'm not just talking about raw speed (its painfully obvious to anyone who monitors CPU usage that OS X and 3rd party OS X software eats up more CPU cycles than Windows), I'm talking about application loading time as well. Thanks to the way Windows Vista works, all of my most frequently used software loads instantly on a fresh boot. I click the FF icon and its there. I click AIM and its there. I click MSN and its there. Even iTunes. I click it and it opens nearly instantly. In OS X after a fresh boot I have to wait several seconds for each application to open.

I haven't been here very long, but have many years logged in the PC world. It's clear to see why the other posters here seem to generally dislike you. You're not remotely constructive or helpful, and are at best a poor troll. Why is that? PPC hold out fan boy? Or Windows fanboy?

Its funny when Apple fans resort to school yard insults when they can't handle hearing the truth.

I was actually an Apple fanboy. I loved my Mac. Then I started experiencing OS X's crashing problems. Then about 3 months after I got my first MacBook I noticed that, for half the price, I could have gotten something with a similar processor, 17" screen, twice the memory, twice the HDD space, and a GeForce Go 7600. My MacBook couldn't even choke out a good 30fps in a then 3 year old game at medium settings at 800x600, yet a system costing half as much could run the same game (UT2k4) at native display resolution, max settings, solid 60fps. I realized then that I was a fool for buying into the Apple Hype and that I made a huge mistake buying my MacBook. I should have taken that refund that Apple offered.

Yay, mosx is back!

Yup ;) Had family visiting and was busy.

BTW, I'm currently considering this laptop, for all of you Macbook lovers. http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage....=1211587727985 For $1450, it has a 17" screen, and its graphics card leaves the 17" MBP in the dust. 1920 x 1200 resolution, 4GB ram standard, 7200 RPM HDD, ect. It's a Gateway, and yet it has positive reviews everywhere.

Thats an awesome system. I'd buy it if I was in the market right now. That just blows away all of the Macs out there and it costs half as much as the MacBook Pro 17"!

I can get all those specs for the price of a top-of-the-line Macbook. Who cares about how thin and light the Macbook is? You can't use it on your lap, or you'll lose your fertility and get second-degree burns.

Heh heh I like that.
 
I was actually an Apple fanboy. I loved my Mac. Then I started experiencing OS X's crashing problems. Then about 3 months after I got my first MacBook I noticed that, for half the price, I could have gotten something with a similar processor, 17" screen, twice the memory, twice the HDD space, and a GeForce Go 7600. My MacBook couldn't even choke out a good 30fps in a then 3 year old game at medium settings at 800x600, yet a system costing half as much could run the same game (UT2k4) at native display resolution, max settings, solid 60fps. I realized then that I was a fool for buying into the Apple Hype and that I made a huge mistake buying my MacBook. I should have taken that refund that Apple offered.

Right............ Please tell me where I can get a 17" laptop with 320gb HDD with 4gb Ram with a dedicated video card for $650. Congratulations on finding the "deal of a lifetime"!
 
iMovie '08 is not very good at all. iDVD is okay, but generally people don't care about fancy menus and such. In fact, I have yet to talk to someone in a real world situation (even in an Apple store) that likes DVD menus.
Here are two real world situations:

1. My world is digital, but I have to interact with older family members that don't have a computer (and have zero interest in getting one). About 2x a year, I spend about 15 minutes making an iDVD of all of the iPhoto galleries and iMovies I've made and shared with the rest of the family via MobileMe.

The menus come in handy because it'd be pretty crappy to go "here's a DVD with 600 pictures from 23 different events that happened over the last 6 months -- all lumped together because I didn't understand how easy it was to keep them divided up so you could easily browse through them by event".

2. Our CIO videotaped us moving our data center, used iMovie to edit it down to on 10 minute long movie, and then used iDVD to burn a copy for each of us to get at the project celebration dinner.

But uninstalling software in Leopard generally leaves behind a mess of .plist files in various folders that you have to hunt down and destroy, even if you do use AppDelete or AppZappper.
And this is different from the mess left in the Windows registry how? At least OS X system doesn't load each orphaned .plist into memory every time the system boots like Windows does with the registry.

The MacBook isn't as much smaller as a PC as the Apple faithful would like you to believe. I have a "fat" 15.4" HP and the MacBook. The MacBook weighs 5lbs and is only a cm or so smaller in each direction than the HP. The HP weighs 6lbs (with the higher capacity, but not bigger, battery and dedicated graphics).
I think it's great that HP and Dell are finally making notebooks as thin and light as Apple has been doing for the last 5 years. :)

the casing is prone to cracking from regular use and heat, its prone to discoloring due to regular use and heat, and it uses integrated graphics.
Hmmm. That was a complaint heard frequently during the first generation of MacBooks (and Apple replaced the discolored cases). Haven't heard mass complaints of that in the last year or so.

Dell and their "premium" designs are the only ones that use slot loaders.
You might want to check out Sony's VAIO CR series and Gateway's T Series. In addition to Dell, they appear to be using Apple's "stupid design".

Side note, is Vostro one of Dell's "premium designs"? They have them too.

Not true. Any PC in Best Buy, CC, Fry's, etc. with dedicated graphics will have HDMI outputs. You can even pick up a $750 HP with integrated graphics (ATI 3200) with an HDMI output and blu-ray. Again, HDMI was part of the Santa Rosa spec. It was up to the manufacturers to opt out of including it.
Having just walked thru Best Buy with a friend about a week ago, looking at laptops, I can tell you that more than 50% of PC laptops on display DO NOT HAVE HDMI on them.
 
I was in Best Buy a few hours ago and saw this person/poster(get a life) claim most laptops at Best Buy have HDMI. That is another lie by this guy. I even asked a sales guy there and he said nope only a few of the laptops they carry have HDMI in the store, but they can order anything I wanted. I told him I was happy with my Mac and he said he was a Mac user also. BTW those PC's are god awful ugly(I know you shouldn't buy a computer for the looks, but dang).
 
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