What If There Is No 7S?

[The-Real-Deal82]

I can't see Apple not covering the lower price point. In the UK the lowest price for a new released iPhone is £615. What some are suggesting here is a start price of $850 or £850 relative, and I just can't see Apple turning away a few million customers.

 

[Dented]

You don't need to see technology to have to benefit you enormously. The best technology is invisible.

Give over. The technologies you mention are there to benefit apple on the manufacturing side, not the end user in any tangible way. It's like selling the dropping of the headphone jack as an exciting "new technology" - Apple will tell you that was a necessary bold step to enable some other user benefit, but that has no credibility with the end customer.

Obviously I'm not saying the use of these technologies takes anything away from the user like the removal of a jack - but it doesn't add anything noteworthy either.
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Like I said, I would leave the marketing up to Apple and not you.

They seem to have been "somewhat" successful at it.

I trust that Apple knows what it is doing.

Yes Apple have certainly never taken a misstep in their marketing of iPhones, cough cough 5C, cough cough 4GB iPhone, cough cough original iPhone pricing strategy etc.

 

[craigio85]

Nope you're still not getting it.

The premium iPhone does not have adequate supply. Therefore it starts at around $999. When a smartphone starts around $999, far, far fewer people will be looking to buy it. This purposefully diminishes demand so it's more in line with supply, and when you do this you then must release the 7s and 7s Plus at the typical prices so that the tens of millions of people who can't afford or do not want to afford the premium iPhone, have something else that has new features to go out and buy.

That's the strategy end of story, and it makes sense.
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When you have a device that costs far more to make with far lower yields and availability, you have to up the price substantially in order to tamper demand so you don't have a supply:demand ratio that is catastrophically imbalanced. If they released that phone and it was anywhere near current base prices then they would have tens of millions of furious customers because they would not be able to get one because there wouldn't be one available for them.

I mean ultimately it's incredibly simple, I'm not sure how people don't get it

Everything you say is based on two assumptions. Firstly that any supply constraint will be indefinite and secondly that any prospective iPhone 8 buyer will accept nothing less than having the thing in their hand on launch day. Your whole rationale for the 7s compromise falls down once supply of the iPhone 8 catches up with demand - whatever products Apple launch, they're looking at sales for the next year, not just the eight weeks after launch.

And there's no end of story as this is simply people discussing their opinions.

 

[9594864]

Everything you say is based on two assumptions. Firstly that any supply constraint will be indefinite and secondly that any prospective iPhone 8 buyer will accept nothing less than having the thing in their hand on launch day. Your whole rationale for the 7s compromise falls down once supply of the iPhone 8 catches up with demand - whatever products Apple launch, they're looking at sales for the next year, not just the eight weeks after launch.

And there's no end of story as this is simply people discussing their opinions.

You realize Samsung is the only company supplying their OLED displays and reports suggest like less than 70 million for the entire year? That's no where near enough.

 

[Newtons Apple]

Yes Apple have certainly never taken a misstep in their marketing of iPhones, cough cough 5C, cough cough 4GB iPhone, cough cough original iPhone pricing strategy etc.

You need to get that cough checked out unless you are at the doctor and being checked for a hernia.

I think you just enjoy arguing from reading above. There is no other company as successful as Apple and you think you know better? LOL!

I am done here as you know not what you are talking about.

 

[Dented]

You need to get that cough checked out unless you are at the doctor and being checked for a hernia.

I think you just enjoy arguing from reading above. There is no other company as successful as Apple and you think you know better? LOL!

I am done here as you know not what you are talking about.

I genuinely do have a cough at the moment you know, true story. Thanks for your concern. I happen to love Apple products, I've had iPhones continually since 2008, yada yada - but it's nonsense to believe they're immune from making a mistake and IF (big IF) the 7S theory here is their actual strategy, then I think it will go down as a mistake.

I'm still rooting for the Apple I know to pull the kind of smooth move they have in the past, and wow us with a genuinely new and exciting iPhone that their customers can actually buy in volume. "Amazing OLED wraparound screen. Our greatest iPhone yet. Are you getting it?!"

Makes me lol when people proclaim they're "done" btw. Be done if you're out of things to say, no skin off my nose.

 

[nviz22]

I genuinely do have a cough at the moment you know, true story. Thanks for your concern. I happen to love Apple products, I've had iPhones continually since 2008, yada yada - but it's nonsense to believe they're immune from making a mistake and IF (big IF) the 7S theory here is their actual strategy, then I think it will go down as a mistake.

I'm still rooting for the Apple I know to pull the kind of smooth move they have in the past, and wow us with a genuinely new and exciting iPhone that their customers can actually buy in volume. "Amazing OLED wraparound screen. Our greatest iPhone yet. Are you getting it?!"

Makes me lol when people proclaim they're "done" btw. Be done if you're out of things to say, no skin off my nose.

A 7S isn't a huge mistake because Apple has a market for marginal upgrades and still makes substantial profits. The 6S and 7 were very minimal upgrades on the iPhone 6/6+ concept. Yet, the 7+ was their best work so far and it has done well. The iPhone SE also is a lower price point phone and does well too.

 

[44267547]

Everything you say is based on two assumptions. Firstly that any supply constraint will be indefinite and secondly that any prospective iPhone 8 buyer will accept nothing less than having the thing in their hand on launch day. Your whole rationale for the 7s compromise falls down once supply of the iPhone 8 catches up with demand - whatever products Apple launch, they're looking at sales for the next year, not just the eight weeks after launch.

And there's no end of story as this is simply people discussing their opinions.

Apple placed an order for 70 Million OLED panels with Samsung, which they will supply Apple up to 92 Million OLED panels until 2019. Furthermore, Apple reportedly will be using LG as a future OLED panel supplier after Samsung For the majority of their iPhone line up. Apple will require more than 70 million OLED panels easily.

"Apple is reportedly in talks with LG Display to invest about 2 to 3 trillion won (US$1.75-2.62 billion) into the Korean display maker’s new OLED production lines exclusively dedicated to Apple orders. "

https://www.macrumors.com/2017/07/03/apple-lg-display-oled-iphones/amp/

https://www.macrumors.com/2017/04/03/apple-orders-70m-iphone-panels-from-samsung/amp/

 

[Dented]

A 7S isn't a huge mistake because Apple has a market for marginal upgrades and still makes substantial profits. The 6S and 7 were very minimal upgrades on the iPhone 6/6+ concept. Yet, the 7+ was their best work so far and it has done well. The iPhone SE also is a lower price point phone and does well too.

I think it's likely they will overstate demand for the 7S and still end up dissapointing potential customers for the 8, by spreading themselves so thinly. Like you say, the 7 is already just an iterative update on an iterative update on the 6, I think they were already pushing things with that but it was understandable they'd want to hold back the big ideas (and some pent up demand) for the anniversary year.

A 7S this year is, I think, going to be a big meh to most. And those not chasing the latest and greatest (i.e. the 8) would have been happy with a cheaper 7 anyway, just like any other year. Yes last year's iPhone, and phones like the SE, have a very valid place in the market as an affordable option - but that doesn't appear to be what the hypothetical 7S is pitched at. The 7S seems to be expected as a new flagship iPhone for people who don't want to pay or wait for the actual, obvious, exciting new flagship iPhone, and I just think that is going to go down like a fart in an elevator.

Yes I know there are going to be supply shortages with the 8 but here's the thing - that's apple's problem to solve, and has been apple's problem to solve for quite a few years now as they will have been planning the OLED transition for some time. Expecting the customer to compromise instead doesn't seem that smart.

 

[craigio85]

You realize Samsung is the only company supplying their OLED displays and reports suggest like less than 70 million for the entire year? That's no where near enough.

There have been various reports on numbers, 70 million was a figure quoted in April as the volume Apple ordered in a particular agreement but there had been reports of other orders prior to that. I've never read anything claiming there's a shortage of the component that's given any evidence beyond "analysts suggest" - if there is evidence, i'm happy to inspect it.

 

[KRG]

I think Dented has a point. The iphone has been largely the same design for 3 years now. Releasing another warmed over '7S' as a volume model is a ridiculous idea in my mind. The 'iPhone 8' needs to be the heavily marketed volume model, not some limited production premium model. A slight price bump is acceptable, but they cant price it way out of the market. The current 7 and 7 Plus with a price drop will be more than enough to please the demographic that just wants a new iphone and don't need the latest and greatest. I see ZERO market for a 7S/7S Plus at premium prices..It wouldn't appeal to budget shoppers, nor would it appeal to techies/Apple nuts.

I think there'd be a significant number of people, even Apple fans, inclined to buy a Galaxy S8 before they'd buy yet another warmed over iPhone iteration.

 

[NBAasDOGG]

Let's leave the business to the people who know business.

P.S. The iPhone 8 has numerous technologies never seen in a smartphone before. Let's do two for you: L shaped battery, and multi-stacked logic board

Wow, what a ground breaking technology... L-shaped battery which consists of two compartments to finally reach Samsung-like battery life?

Multi-stacked logic boards are not new and have been around for many years...

 

[HEK]

If there is no 7s, just skip to 8. Easy peasy

 

[nviz22]

Wow, what a ground breaking technology... L-shaped battery which consists of two compartments to finally reach Samsung-like battery life?

Multi-stacked logic boards are not new and have been around for many years...

Samsung like battery life? The Snapdragon models aren't so great battery life wise. Gotta get the "Edge or Plus" with the S7 or S8 series. I think the iPhone 7+ has the best battery life between the two at least in the US, no?

 

[aakshey]

I don't see why should Apple ever have to change the design.

The design has always been changed only to increase the screen size. If that's not needed, the design always stays the same indefinitely.

6S was the biggest upgrade ever made to an iPhone. 7 was a big upgrade too. 6 was almost a downgrade.

 

[9594864]

Wow, what a ground breaking technology... L-shaped battery which consists of two compartments to finally reach Samsung-like battery life?

Multi-stacked logic boards are not new and have been around for many years...

iPhones already surpass battery life of Samsung devices despite Samsung devices having about 500-1000mAh larger cells. You can only imagine how bad it will be for Samsung devices once this L-shaped dual-cell battery lands. It will also charge far faster due to both cells charging simultaneously (different from fast charge).

As for the logic board? No. There is no smartphone that has what Apple is using in the premium iPhone this year with the logic board being stacked as rumored. That's the reality, and maybe you don't like it, but sometimes reality sucks. Logic boards have had front and back chipsets but this one is multi stacked confining the space used massively.
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I don't see why should Apple ever have to change the design.

The design has always been changed only to increase the screen size. If that's not needed, the design always stays the same indefinitely.

6S was the biggest upgrade ever made to an iPhone. 7 was a big upgrade too. 6 was almost a downgrade.

Wow. You have that completely wrong hahah.

The iPhone 6s was without a doubt the absolute worst iPhone update in the history of iPhone, and it remains that way, and likely will for the foreseeable future. It added next to no useful features, and 3D Touch is still extremely niche to this day. The best feature it had was Touch ID 2.

The iPhone 4, iPhone 5, and iPhone 6 were by far the best iPhone upgrades. For these reasons:

Retina Display
Increased screen size
Increased screen size

By far the most impactful and useful feature to a smartphone is an increase in the size of the display. The display IS the smartphone. This iPhone uses the maximal amount of the face they could do, and it is by far the best update to iPhone in the history of iPhone, due to that.

If Tim Cook wants to say something accurate, don't say the obvious 'We think it's the best iPhone we've ever made' instead, say 'This is the best upgrade to iPhone, ever.'

 

[aakshey]

You’re wrong. Period.

An upgrade isn’t an increase in screen size.

Unless a phone comes closer to a desktop computer, there’s no point. 6S was the best upgrade ever. Period.

 

[michael9891]

You’re wrong. Period.

An upgrade isn’t an increase in screen size.

Unless a phone comes closer to a desktop computer, there’s no point. 6S was the best upgrade ever. Period.

This is laughable. Please explain the major upgrades the 6S received that make it "the best upgrade ever".

 

[Thaddeuz]

No, what I asked was what if the OLED model is the iPhone 8+ and the supposed 7S is the regular 8.

Why would they only sell 700-900 dolar devices? They know we would still buy the new thing for even 1200 bucks.

They will always make a cheap and more expensive model. So they can get the most out of customers.

 

[Dented]

This is laughable. Please explain the major upgrades the 6S received that make it "the best upgrade ever".

This is a silly argument on both sides, most iPhone updates are evolution rather than revolution and the 6S was no better or worse in that regard. It addressed some real issues with the previous version (i.e. used stronger materials and put an end to the perception of "bendgate") and introduced a whole new interface element in 3D Touch. The fact that still hasn't taken off isn't the fault of the 6S - it's apple's fault for continuing to withhold it from many current iOS devices (the SE, iPad etc) making it less compelling or essential for developers to support. The 6S also had a much stronger SoC that was much better suited to the bigger screen sizes than Apple's first attempt in the 6, especially for the plus sizes.

If we're going to talk about dissapointing updates, the 7 has to be near the top of that list. A warming over of the same design from two years ago, with a substantial downgrade on the port front - lets face it, if it weren't for Jet Black making it look sexy that would be one forgettable phone.

The 6 may have been a major upgrade in terms of screen size, but it was a lousy design that unfortunately we're still lumbered with. The off centre camera bump is still unforgivable.

 

[michael9891]

This is a silly argument on both sides, most iPhone updates are evolution rather than revolution and the 6S was no better or worse in that regard. It addressed some real issues with the previous version (i.e. used stronger materials and put an end to the perception of "bendgate") and introduced a whole new interface element in 3D Touch. The fact that still hasn't taken off isn't the fault of the 6S - it's apple's fault for continuing to withhold it from many current iOS devices (the SE, iPad etc) making it less compelling or essential for developers to support. The 6S also had a much stronger SoC that was much better suited to the bigger screen sizes than Apple's first attempt in the 6, especially for the plus sizes.

If we're going to talk about dissapointing updates, the 7 has to be near the top of that list. A warming over of the same design from two years ago, with a substantial downgrade on the port front - lets face it, if it weren't for Jet Black making it look sexy that would be one forgettable phone.

The 6 may have been a major upgrade in terms of screen size, but it was a lousy design that unfortunately we're still lumbered with. The off centre camera bump is still unforgivable.

Certainly not silly on my side. He came out with a very bold statement that the 6S was the best upgrade ever. And I'd like to know why he thinks that.

 

[Dented]

Certainly not silly on my side. He came out with a very bold statement that the 6S was the best upgrade ever. And I'd like to know why he thinks that.

It's silly because it's subjective, if he thinks the 6s was the best upgrade ever it's probably because for him it was the best upgrade ever. Plenty of perfectly fair reasons to believe that - 3D Touch, double the ram, faster soc, stronger build, lightning quick Touch ID, bigger storage options, better camera, the Taptic Engine - maybe those aren't things you value but - what does that matter?

 

[JeffyTheQuik]

hmmm...

iPhone
iPhone 3G
iPhone 3GS
iPhone 4
iPhone 4S
iPhone 5
iPhone 5S
Iphone 6
iPhone 6S
iPhone 7

Notwithstanding I have no internal knowledge of Apple's plans, there does seem to be a pattern here.

I do remember back in the iPhone 4 days, there being a "ohhhhh... the iPhone 5 will be the next one!!!" and the 4S came out, much to my disappointment. That was also the first year of the September releases.

But then, about 3 minutes later, I got over it, and my life really wasn't that much affected by a device I use to communicate.

 

[recoil80]

I think everyone here would be happy if Apple released iPhone 8 and 8+ at the same prices as iPhone 7 with OLED, new design and all the stuff we keep reading about.
I'd be happy too, of course, but I'm afraid is not going to happen. I think Apple will release 7s and 7s+ at the usual prices and iPhone edition at a premium price.
Then in 2018 they could go back to the usual "normal" and plus size with OLED and reduce bezels. That would make sense, they'd make a lot of money this year with the edition model and next year they could move every product (including the small SE) to the new design.

 

[aakshey]

This is laughable. Please explain the major upgrades the 6S received that make it "the best upgrade ever".

The 6S was the biggest jump in computing and graphics that has happened to the iPhone in the last 5 or so years. It is the first iPhone with 2 GB RAM and that’s the reason it is is perfectly smooth even today. Whereas an iPhone 6 Plus was slow out of the box and and an iPhone 6 was slow on iOS 9 already. The iPhone 6s has quite some life yet. Whereas it was time to throw away your iPhone 6 2 yrs ago.

Add to that Touch ID 2, 3D Touch, better camera and a lot more.

The only thing they didn’t change was the design. That’s it. In every other way it was the most massive upgrade ever done to an iPhone since 5s.