Is that true? I've been looking for a definitive answer. I'm guessing you threw bootcamp/windows on it to game. Is the UI lag non-existent in windows? Just a tad curious about whether this lag will be fixed in the near future because my 14 days to returns are running out. I love the form factor too, but I haven't seen/heard any "its a software issue" argument that wasn't based in hope/fan love.
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Why so many people bought the rMBP if most applications are not ready?
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Is that true? I've been looking for a definitive answer. I'm guessing you threw bootcamp/windows on it to game. Is the UI lag non-existent in windows? Just a tad curious about whether this lag will be fixed in the near future because my 14 days to returns are running out. I love the form factor too, but I haven't seen/heard any "its a software issue" argument that wasn't based in hope/fan love.
Sorry for that. It was a reply for someone who posted in this thread that buying the cMBP was idiotic...
Anyway, why didn't you get an aftermarket SSD? Apple's SSDs aren't cheap!
Unfortunately in my city, there is no rMBP to try out.
I tried the laptop for about 10 minutes while I was travelling few weeks ago.
I did notice that after I put it to sleep, it took longer to wake up than my 2010 MBP 17". Anybody knows the reason?
I am interested in the rMBP not because of the display but because of the weight and performance. I don't play games but I do 3D simulations.
With the speck case, a large laptop protective case and other stuffs, I cannot handle carry the MBP 17" anymore. At new work place, I can order a new computer. This is a good chance but the possible "looking bad" issue is holding my purchase.
This is the most honest answer of all.
Apple is the master of smoke and mirrors marketing, hyping devices and computers beyond ones wildest imagination.
I really like Apple, but if they would be realistic and not go overboard with "Magical" "Resolutionary" "This Changes Everything" and on and on, their would be far fewer returns. Far fewer complaints.
People would be happier with their purchases and not expect perfection.
There's no way that Apple can live up to their own hype, and yet with the cult like following they've carefully cultivated... the cadre of apologists will sing praises as though they were in church.
Then there's the obvious. People are buying products with the fruity logo as though their life depends on it.
What an amazing feat.
discount on the 2.6/768/16 so took it and ran!!There is absolutely no lag in windows, nor even in OS X when running full 2880x1880 or lower non HiDPI resolutions. It's the upscaleing (essentially AA) in OS X that causes the lag, and with Lion it's all done on the CPU, which simply can't handle it. I'm actually running the HiDPI 1200p scaled res in OS X, while the lag is definitely worse than at the HiDPI 900p resolution, it really doesn't bother me much, but it is certainty there. Really just depends on what your expectations are, I think many apple users just expect a much more fluid UI. Although it has absolutely no effect on usability, it simply all comes down to your expectation from a very expensive machine. And is why I think it's a non-issue, at least for me.
I bought my rMBP knowing I was only going to use the HiDPI 1200p in OS X, and to expect lag. With ML I'm sure the lag will be much improved when using discrete graphics, but I'm sure there will still be some lag on the integrated. Unfortunately apple has yet to email me my ML code, so I can't speak from personal experience on that.
If your a gamer, and you need a portable machine you really can't beat the rMBP right now. If there was a PC that did, or even matched the rMBP, I would have gone for it instead, even now.
ML does not improve the lag at all. And im sorry you've lowered your expectations in order to enjoy the machine.
To answer the OP's original question, I ordered a RMBP because I travel a lot for my job as a photographer and videographer and the screen looks absolutely amazing. It's also dramatically lighter and is a very fast machine. What's not to love? It's absolutely perfect for what I use it for.
Bryan
Bryan
I am equally sorry that your unrealistic expectations prevent you from appreciating the machine for what it is... PC hardware is my life, I build custom workstations and gaming rigs for a living. I have a great deal of appreciation for good well built hardware, which the rMBP more than delivers. Yes it has software issues, however these issues have no effect, at least for me, on the usability of the machine or my productivity. Like I said before, I bought my rMBP for it's 3D performance, form factor, and battery life. It is this that brings me enjoyment from my machine, scroll lag does NOTHING to prevent me from enjoying my machine. I am not your average apple user or fan, my expectations are not the same as yours. Do I want apple to improve the lag? Absolutely! Do I think the lag makes the rMBP a bad machine, far from it...
EDIT: Apple has been making performance sacrifices in order to meet their design requirements for years. I think this is simply the first time they made a performance sacrifice on the software side. Which every apple user is aware of, unlike hardware sacrifices. But most of you happily accept the hardware apple has provided for years, even to go as far to believe Apple's top priority is in fact performance, which sadly is not the case.
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I haven't had much of a chance to use it, but it's reliable so far, and looks fine to me. My workflow is pretty good too with the high resolution.
That's the problem. You think its "unrealistic" to have a near $3k purchase not stutter and lag during basic operations? Like I said, I'm sorry you had to lower your expectations to enjoy your machine.
Obviously apple has generally been conservative with hardware options but its never affected general user experience, which has always been a main goal of apple. In the case of the RMBP, apple stuffed it with very respectable hardware and yet it performs almost worse than my 2008 macbook in general UI responsiveness. You think stuttering and lag doesn't affect user experience? Really?
Imagine the next iPhone all of a sudden introduced laggy animation and stuttery FPS. Are you gonna come up with excuses for that too?
This is why I'm not in a huge hurry to get one even though I do want it. My 2006 mbp bit the dust last month and I do have a need for a new laptop and a portable powerhouse for CS6 (much of the suite, premiere, after effects, photoshop, illustrator, & more). I think the current available hardware in the rMBP should suit my needs, but I can wait until most or all of the apps I use are updated to properly use the resolution when in a scaled gui mode. I don't know how widespread the image retention issue is in the display so I can also wait until they hopefully mitigate that issue(I experience it on my 1g ipad).
Lol, while I agree with you on that, it is a very expensive machine and because of that we all have the right to high expectations. I say your expectations are unrealistic because this is a first generation device, and because of that I think the product deserves a bit more forgiveness in regards to not being perfect. Apple has done quite a bit with the rMBP, and maybe they bit off more than they can chew with a 2880x1880 panel. I am not justifying the UI lag, it is something that needs to be fixed. However I don't believe the UI lag is enough to consider the machine, in adequate or not deserving of it's price tag (at least the base model...).
I agree that the UI affects the overall user experience, there is no denying that. However that is not what I said; I said that the UI lag, for my work, has not affected the usability or performance of my rMBP. Because this is all that matters to me, it has not affected MY experience. I think only an apple user would define the performance of their machine by UI FPS, I however have other needs which the rMBP fulfills perfectly. The UI lag is a sacrifice I'm willing to make, as there is no other machine on the market that satisfies my needs. I would never buy a cMBP, as I feel there are better options. This is not the case for the rMBP, if you are a gamer that needs maximum portability.
Understand I'm not saying this isn't a problem that needs to be addressed, I'm just saying it doesn't affect ME. You are clearly missing that point. This is my personal experience, and obviously others will disagree. However I do think it is unrealistic you expect such a high degree of perfection, when apple has already delivered in so many other ways, even at $3K you can't expect everything, Apple can only deliver so much. I don't care what you think, this is a software issue. The 650m is more than up to the job of rendering the UI smoothly at HiDPI resolutions, however apple is new at coding for the GPU, hence ML is not an overnight fix. I believe with time the UI lag will be mitigated. If your expecting next gen hardware to be leaps and bounds ahead of current gen hardware, you are ignorantly mistaken...
If you believe I am blindly trying to make excuses for my purchase or even for Apple (a company I utterly despise), you are sadly mistaken. The UI lag certainly exists, and I would like to see it gone, but because it does not affect the usability of the machine it is not something that truly matters to me. I don't need to create excuses for the rMBP, as it already satisfies everything I wanted from it, 3D performance, form factor, and battery life; something I could not have gotten from a PC, and this makes dealing with the UI lag WELL worth it too me. I think you should take a step back and realize others may have a different perspective than you, and value other aspects of a machine more than you. Are you ready to move on yet? I'm not sure why my subjective opinion is so important to you. I'm certainly the odd man out here, considering my view on computer hardware in general. You imply my logic is flawed, however it is your perspective that is skewed...
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Because I used the student discount. With the discount it was cheaper to buy the SSD than it would be to buy the Samsung 830 (which I thought was what is being used by apple) straight from Samsung. Sure I could have gotten it for a little bit less at someplace like newegg, but I decided that for the convenience of it being pre-installed and the ability to just use applecare if something should mess up with the SSD was worth the little bit of extra money instead of buying from a 3rd party.
Have you even used ML? I noticed a huge difference. It honestly felt like the frame rate doubled. The only time I notice "lag" is if I deliberately overload my ram. And when I tried getting ntfs-3G to work (really would rather not pay $20 just to write to ntfs)
All the evidence I've seen points almost strictly otherwise. Maybe ML doesn't improve the lag to a point which seems to you acceptable, but for the most part, I think that we can assume that the lag has been generally improved in ML.
um i have ML installed. so yes, i have used ML. doubled frame rate? don't be ridiculous.
I am dead serious. I perceive it to be about the same difference as going from 25fps to 50fps.
So rather than just saying "it doesn't do anything for the lag" or "don't be ridiculous" - how about you give us some specific examples as to what causes lag on your system? Because it is not a system wide thing. In my usage so far, I have not run into any lag issues with Mountain Lion. Under Lion, I noticed lag the very moment I tried scrolling in Safari.
Well it may have lag on Facebook, but so does my iphone 4s. So no apple has not always put out great devices that are free of some weird issues. Iphone 4 had antenna problems, and dropped calls all the time. So what is your point here? That new products will not/shouldn't have problems of some sort? New technology always has problems.
um, who cares about specific facebook performance. i'm talking about general UI performance. and even more specifically, UI performance of much older macs being better than the RMBP.
I ordered my rMBP today. Reason: my work involves a lot reading and writing papers and code a lot and retina display is really great for it. The reduced weight, improved screen quality and quit fans are also a huge thing for me. Also, I enjoy gaming in my spare time and the rMBP rivals some gaming notebooks in that department. As far as retina-readiness goes, none of software I use is affected by this issue. I also tried the rMBP in the store and I could not confirm any of the constant UI lag people talk about. Sure, it lagged when I tried to mission control switch between 50 safari windows, but that is to be expected. And websites like The Verge visibly lag at any computer with any browser I have ever tried (my current 2009 MBP lagged much worse than the rMBP btw.).
Btw, I spent last 40 minutes in an apple store, doing side by side comparison between the rMBP and my old 2009 MBP. I was looking at non-retina optimized web content only (images). My findings: does retina-optimized content look less blurry on the rMBP compared to non-retina-optimized? Sure it does. Is there a difference between non-retina optimized images between the rMBP and the normal MBP? Sure there is, the rMBP looks much better: better colors, better contrast. It does seem like os x applies a smoothing filter while up scaling a low-DPI image, but the on screen result is in no way inferior to what the classic MBP showed. Of course, it is just my experience and other people might have a different one, but as far as I am concerned, my little experiment confirmed that the claimed rMBP blurriness is nothing more than a psychological effect and in no way a objective fact. I think people simply look at lowDPI images in contrast to very sharp rendered UI and text and thus perceive the images as blurry. Go figure...
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Quite a stretch of logic there.
Because it is realistic to expect a multi-billion, multinational project that involves smashing atomic particles near the speed of light to be functionally flawless from Day 1. A quench? Gee, what a waste of money the project has become!
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You do, apparently.
Stretch of logic to expect a new machine to perform as well/better than older machines? I think you need to look up the definition of logic.
Either way thanks for your completely irrelevant post about absolutely nothing. Yes, smashing atomic particles has much to do with anything were even remotely discussing.