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Other Why the iPhone Fold will Fail

darkridedp said:
I'll lead with I have no desire for a folding phone, nor one of the huge slabs that others seem to prefer. However, I can remember a time when I bought all manner of expensive Sony products back in the 80s and 90s that I coveted, didn't need, and ended up rarely using because they were finicky, fragile or they were quickly left in the dust by the next coveted thing.

I have no idea what Apple considers a successful product, but considering that they take about 50% of the revenue in the entire mobile phone industry, 75% of the operating Profit and do that selling only about a quarter of the phones sold, they have more leeway to figure it out.

One note on the original post, Apple has invested Billions in Corning, and they make incredibly flexible VtG ion-exchange glass so I doubt this thing will have a plastic screen.he outer surface can be plastic even with ultra-thin glass underneath. Samsung explicitly identifies its foldable protective film as PET plastic.
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The outer screen surface is generally plastic. Samsung, for instance, explicitly identifies its foldable protective film as PET plastic.

Apple’s profitability gives it room to experiment, but it doesn’t establish demand for a foldable.
 
Pbwallstreet said:
Why do you and people like you have what looks like an emotional response to someone talking about how they think a potential Apple product will fail? What is it that got you to take time out of your busy life to engage in a discussion I started?
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I'll tell you straight up. YOU annoy me. I'm not invested into the Apple world to be annoyed by future problems. I'm annoyed by you tbh.
 
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Pbwallstreet said:
Because of the folding capability, and this is a big deal, it has to have a PLASTIC SCREEN. Plastic is noticeably inferior to glass from an optics standpoint, including reflections, and it will have a crease.
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Not sure how you missed the news that ultra-thin bendable glass has been a primary component in better foldable smartphone displays for years. Here's a good primer:


Sure the topmost layer will be some type of plastic, and there are plastic layers on which the illuminated image layer and the touch-sensitive layer are applied (since applying those to the glass layers runs the risk of those layers cracking, but not because the glass will crack, since it won't), but the plastic layers aren't the only ones in the screen, they're part of a sandwich of layers that together add up to the whole screen. The glass layers are there to provide rigidity, a more solid feel, optical flatness, and some crease reduction. The topmost plastic layer is there to provide at least partial protection for the glass layer under it from simple scratches that could weaken the glass. Unfortunately it's true that the plastic layers are what's mainly responsible for the crease that can get worse over time. Maybe that problem will be fixed over time with better plastic formulations.
 
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johnsawyercjs said:
Not sure how you missed the news that ultra-thin bendable glass has been the main component in foldable smartphone displays for years. Here's a good primer:


Sure the topmost layer will be some type of plastic, but that's to provide at least partial protection for the topmost thin glass layer from simple scratches that could weaken the glass. Unfortunately it's true that this plastic layer is what's mainly responsible for the crease that can get worse over time. Maybe that problem will be fixed over time with better plastic formulations.
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because OP is an idiot
 
apple contributor said:
I feel more like that: iphone air flopped because it was compared to its siblings. But its a good phone in general. If i got it, i would have loved it.
I think the same will happen with the foldable device. It will be a good device in general tho.
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iPhone Air didn’t do well because it was a thinner candy bar phone, had mono speaker, one camera, USB speed was lacklustre, battery life acceptable (not great) and it was not priced correctly.

iPhold in comparison brings something new to the table. If iPhone Air can have FaceID, I suspect it maybe possible that iPhold may get it or maybe version 2.0.

You get two devices in one iPhone plus iPad mini in a pocketable formats that is thin. iPhone Air just is thin that’s it with the omission of other things.
 
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Pbwallstreet said:
The outer screen surface is generally plastic. Samsung, for instance, explicitly identifies its foldable protective film as PET plastic.

Apple’s profitability gives it room to experiment, but it doesn’t establish demand for a foldable.
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You are out of your mind. None of what you mentioned matters. None of what you ever mention matters. The demand that you can't see or are being cagey about is there. It will always be there too. And the reason is bigger screen. Period.
 
I predict they will sell at least according to the goals Apple set up and make them more than enough money to warrant it’s future development.

All these threads that’s been popping up also makes me understand why it’s hard to find people to do modelling, it’s a skill with low supply.
 
One thing is for sure: Apple is milking the iPhone for all it's worth: iPhone E, iPhone, Pro, Pro Max. Now we also have the Air, we will have a folding one and apparently the 20th anniversary version will be even more different.

Throw everything at the wall and see what sticks?
 
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I think this folding iPhone (Ultra or Duo, who cares…) will work like a timebomb for John Ternus. This absolutely bizarre idea belongs to Tim Cook, who got inspired by some people who liked foldable phones in Asia. But Asia is no America, and no Europe for sure.

I don’t believe people are eager to have even larger phones or folding phones at all, as well as we are getting to the point of big economic crisis and “right turn” for whole Europe, including UK, which will start around next year and will get to the tipping point around 2029. In this political and economic landscape NO ONE will need more foldable phones, no matter from Apple, Samsung, Google or even Lenovo-Motorola. They are super expensive and impractical, just like AVP. And people will only be getting poorer.

Though I am worried how it is gonna influence Apple stocks, I don’t like these “innovative” experiments because of how volatile stock price can become. Apple needs to stick to what sells, not to what “theoretically sells less but gives more $$$”
 
Pbwallstreet said:
I always find this interesting that some people seem to think that people want a larger screen such as a double size jumbo smartphone screen X2. People are not asking for this. Some people like it. Some people have bought into foldable smartphones. But after 7 years, it is still only 2% of the global smartphone marketshare. That's reality.
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To be fair: no one asked for a touchscreen when Apple released the first iPhone. We were all used to Blackberries and similar phones.

I'm not in the market for a an Ultra/Duo or whatever it will be called so I'm not defending it. I would just like to point out that "people not asking for something" means very little.

I do wonder exactly what (if anything) people are asking for in the current range of iPhones? Very little I think. It's a mature product. You have the world's data on a screen in your hand and you can query it from pretty much anywhere. That's why the yearly upgrades are often limited to a slightly better camera, a color and a faster chip.

What else is there to add?
 
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Zensō said:
At under 2% of the total market, foldables absolutely qualify as “niche”. As to whether that remains true in the future is anyone’s guess.
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A small percentage of a huge market still results in huge numbers. Percentages have to be put in context to have meaning.

"My business grew 100% year over year" could mean that you only had one customer last year and now you have 2.
 
Pbwallstreet said:
Just making things up. AR/VR has been around for what, decades? Spatial computing was not entirely new/an Apple invention either.

Also, there is very little evidence that price was a key factor in AVP not taking off.
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My guess is that price was a huge part in AVP not taking off. In this day and economy a device that expensive is out of range for most people. Judging by the initial success and sales of Neo, I think we can conclude that a huuuuuuuge part of the market doesn't have AVP money to spare.

I know it's impossible, but if AVP had been $499 then it would have been an impulse buy for many customers. $499 you can recover from if you don't like it. $3499 is a completely different ballpark.
 
johnsawyercjs said:
Not sure how you missed the news that ultra-thin bendable glass has been a primary component in better foldable smartphone displays for years. Here's a good primer:


Sure the topmost layer will be some type of plastic, and there are plastic layers on which the illuminated image layer and the touch-sensitive layer are applied (since applying those to the glass layers runs the risk of those layers cracking, but not because the glass will crack, since it won't), but the plastic layers aren't the only ones in the screen, they're part of a sandwich of layers that together add up to the whole screen. The glass layers are there to provide rigidity, a more solid feel, optical flatness, and some crease reduction. The topmost plastic layer is there to provide at least partial protection for the glass layer under it from simple scratches that could weaken the glass. Unfortunately it's true that the plastic layers are what's mainly responsible for the crease that can get worse over time. Maybe that problem will be fixed over time with better plastic formulations.
Click to expand...
How does this “affect” in a positive way the customer? It will not bend at your fingernails pressure? The crease is not visible? I think this is a spec false hype for the normal people, facts never lie, the inner display remains more fragile than the outer one
 
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