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Those two sentences seem contradictory. For people who are very price conscious, they will still perceive a Mac as too expensive.

One has to kind of know that part of what you're paying more for is the operating system and whole unique package.

Most people will just buy the cheapest computer on the shelf, and wind up with a Chromebook or Windows S Mode and not even understand what it is.
Exactly. People don't research or know about hardware. Just because I don't want to pay the prices for bigger screen MacBooks, doesn'e mean I should buy garbage and then complain about slowness etc... I'm just fine around $1k for a 17" PC Laptop with decent specs that do what I need. I don't need all that power from MacBook Pro or even Air. I just wish they made Airs or lower spec Pros with bigger screens for less $$$. They need to have lower budget ranges like with their other products.
 
Nobody (or nearly nobody) selects a Windows - Intel machine for the performance of its CPU and the quality of its operating system. They choose it because it supports their software, or because the rest of the company already uses these, or because they can remote control these PCs the way they want to. And this did not change with a new MacBook Air, be it a superb machine with extraordinary performances.
I choose it because the price for a bigger screen is reasonable, and it has the specs I need. What % of people even scrape 10% of the power of MacBooks?
 
Regular people buying "only" 256GB base model probably couldn't care less -- let alone be aware of -- "SSD-gate". They are unlikely hard-core users that would notice such things.

People in this forum are not "regular". That didn't sound right. :p
Some definitely aren't. I'm almost thinking some MacBook threads should be private and require income verification. The arguments here would be so much different if everyone here had infinite funds. Of could hardware wise Macs pummel PC, but what % here even use 10% of that. So why pay so much when I can get a $1k range bigger screen PC laptop that does what I need?
 
The average sales price for a Mac is around $1,400. Industry average sales price for a Windows PC is around $500.

Almost all of the Mac's current 9% market share is in over $1,000 PCs, which is a segment that's less than 20% of PCs sold. Meaning when people buy high quality PCs they choose Macs at least half the time.

I find this mind-blowing, but it looks right to me. There are an awful lot of cheap Windows boxes being sold, and I don’t think there are many PC manufacturers who focus on high-quality products. You can try and buy a high-quality product from Dell, but a lot of Dell’s products are cheap boxes, and when you buy something more expensive from them you’re not guaranteed a better product.
 
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quality often seems considered more on how the exteriors look to the eyes.
There have been lots of people who had failing Macbooks in one way or the other, and there are lots of people who keep their $300 Windows laptop for a decade or maybe (much) longer without any problems at all

Apple products often look nicer though and my next laptops will likely be Macbooks too (in a decade or so ;) ), but it's not that you are guaranteed that you will be getting something that will last you a lifetime when you buy something expensive, and it's also not guaranteed that something inexpensive will fail sooner than something very expensive. Especially if the very expensive also means very slim
 
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You guys are missing something very important here. Corporations, by and large, still use Wintel machines because their IT departments are too lazy to make the transition to Apple. A lot of the security software that corporations use does not support Macs, although I would argue that Macs are much more secure out of the box and don't need a bunch of bloated security products like PC's do.

Until Apple can convince corporate IT execs that Macs are easy to remotely manage and secure, they still have a long uphill climb. And as long as lots of corporations are using PC's exclusively, their users will probably buy PC's for their personal machines as well.
Too lazy, you've got to be kidding! It's dollars, period. Transitioning to a new architecture costs money, LOTS of money.
They will never convince IT of that unless they deliver the tools to do the rewrites, and not even Microsoft has been able to do that well. That's why there's so much old VB code still in use!

Apple turned their back on IT by changing from Intel, so not even VM's are adequate for running old apps.

And btw, it's ALWAYS dollars and budgets for corp IT. You should see how much some software actually costs...
 
The average sales price for a Mac is around $1,400. Industry average sales price for a Windows PC is around $500.

Almost all of the Mac's current 9% market share is in over $1,000 PCs, which is a segment that's less than 20% of PCs sold. Meaning when people buy high quality PCs they choose Macs at least half the time.
Ah...the old False Analogy fallacy.

A lot of people who buy high end PC do so because they already have thousands or tens of thousands invested in PC software already. They ain't gonna by a Mac. It would cost them a lot of $$$ to buy Mac versions of the same PC software. In some cases, the Mac version is inferior. *cough*Excel*cough* People who have little software investment will switch as the wind blows.

I've have a dozen L-series lenses. I also own an old (ancient) 20D. I ain't gonna spend $1500 on a new Nikon camera; I'd spend $1500 on a new Canon instead. If I brought the latest Nikon camera, I'd have to spend 20x ($30-35K) that in NIKKOR lenses to match what already invested in Canon lenses. Ain't gonna happen.
 
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Ah...the old False Analogy fallacy.

A lot of people who buy high end PC do so because they already have thousands or tens of thousands invested in PC software already. They ain't gonna by a Mac. It would cost them a lot of $$$ to buy Mac versions of the same PC software. In some cases, the Mac version is inferior. *cough*Excel*cough* People who have little software investment will switch as the wind blows.

I've have a dozen L-series lenses. I also own an old (ancient) 20D. I ain't gonna spend $1500 on a new Nikon camera; I'd spend $1500 on a new Canon instead. If I brought the latest Nikon camera, I'd have to spend 20x ($30-35K) that in NIKKOR lenses to match what already invested in Canon lenses. Ain't gonna happen.

Nothing in my post was an analogy, just reasoned inferences from known facts. Apple clearly has the largest share of the over $1,000 PC market, and their share is clearly growing regardless of whether some minority of existing high end customers are locked in to Windows or Linux.
 
Some definitely aren't. I'm almost thinking some MacBook threads should be private and require income verification. The arguments here would be so much different if everyone here had infinite funds. Of could hardware wise Macs pummel PC, but what % here even use 10% of that. So why pay so much when I can get a $1k range bigger screen PC laptop that does what I need?

It looks like Apple isn’t building Macs for you. They are building for Creative Professionals in which the extra cost of a Mac is a fraction of 1% of their income, but the benefits of faster workflows and better screens, trackpads and build quality adds significantly to their productivity and income.

Apples Mac margins are far higher than other PC makers because they build for people who value their PCs performance and quality. They don’t make plastic fantastic laptops with compromised screens and low build quality for people who only care about cost because they aren’t full time computer professionals who will earn back that extra cost easily. Or who are buying for a corporate group made up of near minimum wage customer service staff.

And obviously creative professionals are using a lot more than 10% of the Macs capabilities most of the time. The question is do they need 100% of those capabilities? It’s like that building contractor you see driving always a big pickup truck to the job site when it’s only carrying a set of tools that easily fit in the back of a Prius. You never see that one day a week when they need to pickup a washer/dryer abd an oven or a thousand pounds of lumber.

When you need to export a large project for your client, the difference between taking a half hour and five minutes is a huge deal. Especially when on deadline and the first export was done wrong.
 
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Exactly. People don't research or know about hardware. Just because I don't want to pay the prices for bigger screen MacBooks, doesn'e mean I should buy garbage and then complain about slowness etc... I'm just fine around $1k for a 17" PC Laptop with decent specs that do what I need. I don't need all that power from MacBook Pro or even Air. I just wish they made Airs or lower spec Pros with bigger screens for less $$$. They need to have lower budget ranges like with their other products.

I mostly just don’t want to have to run Windows. I consider it a very expensive software license for macOS.
 
People in the market for a Wintel laptop are not interested in a mac, and vice-versa...

Some people are dedicated to Wintel machines — gamers, people who need specific Windows-only MS Office functionality, developers who need access to x86 and DirectX, people who need specific Windows software.

But there are still a lot of people who have the choice — most Office users, vloggers, graphic designers, many coders.

It just goes to show. I think a lot of people who have a choice would prefer to use an elegant and simple operating system, whose parts “just work” when called upon.
 
It looks like Apple isn’t building Macs for you. They are building for Creative Professionals in which the extra cost of a Mac is a fraction of 1% of their income, but the benefits of faster workflows and better screens, trackpads and build quality adds significantly to their productivity and income.

Apples Mac margins are far higher than other PC makers because they build for people who value their PCs performance and quality. They don’t make plastic fantastic laptops with compromised screens and low build quality for people who only care about cost because they aren’t full time computer professionals who will earn back that extra cost easily. Or who are buying for a corporate group made up of near minimum wage customer service staff.

And obviously creative professionals are using a lot more than 10% of the Macs capabilities most of the time. The question is do they need 100% of those capabilities? It’s like that building contractor you see driving always a big pickup truck to the job site when it’s only carrying a set of tools that easily fit in the back of a Prius. You never see that one day a week when they need to pickup a washer/dryer abd an oven or a thousand pounds of lumber.

When you need to export a large project for your client, the difference between taking a half hour and five minutes is a huge deal. Especially when on deadline and the first export was done wrong.
You have to consider that PC makers cover a wider range of customers compared to Apple. At the same time, most of them also have line of high end devices. In my line of work, most of my customers use ThinkPads, and some of them use high end models. When you check on the specs, they use high quality materials and components, like carbon fiber + magnesium, 4K OLED screens and the typing experience of the spill resistant keyboard is better than Macs. They even pass military tests (https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/thinkpad-milspec). These are not cheap devices.
 
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I don’t, but at the same time, I can probably count on one hand the number of times I have actually used the touchscreen on those laptops over the past 3 years.

And I feel that really explains these vendor’s attitudes towards their products, vs Apple, and why I am ultimately all in with Apple.

For Apple, they don’t sell me a product or a feature. They sell me a solution. My ipad comes with an OS that is optimised for touch and direct input. Apps are similarly designed that way. You don’t just throw me a touchscreen device and expect me to find ways to make it work. I buy an ipad knowing that it’s going to work great in that regard right out of the box, because everything from the software to the apps to even the hardware and form factor is built around enable said experience.

But for windows laptops, the touchscreen is “optional” in a “it’s there if you want it, take it or leave it”. There is zero effort or incentive to improve the touchscreen user experience. Window’s support is token at best, software is non-existent, the screen wobbles, and so not many people do end up making full use of it.

And I guess that’s really my attitude towards technology these days (which I find has also influenced the way I work). I don’t want a product. I want a solution, and I am ready to pay for those who can provide me with one. Right now, that company is Apple.
Well, you are debating computer functionality vs computer performance - in case you weren't aware. You severely under value a touchscreen, but get giddy about how quiet your MAC is. I use both. There are pros and cons of each, but in terms of actual capabilities, once again, Apple is far behind. The keyboard and screen is better on my X1, but I'm more of a MAC OS fan.
 
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