Windows Laptop Makers 'Worried' About New MacBook Air Impacting Sales

[NT1440]

Truthfully, anything over, say $500 is going to be more computer than 99% of people that buy a computer will ever need.

Truth. I’m asked all the time for computer suggestions and I lay it out this way:

Given your needs for a web browser and MS Office, literally anything you buy will work. HOWEVER, sub $750 (just for a ballpark number) you’re looking at a lower quality of chassis made from plastic that will inevitably break or chip in some way (gotta love the old plastic anchors for display lids that rip out in 3 years). So if you don’t care about the physical aspect of the machine, buy whatever you want and I’ll throw an SSD and some RAM. If you want something that will be in great shape after 5 years, adjust your price point.

 

[djrobsd]

You guys are missing something very important here. Corporations, by and large, still use Wintel machines because their IT departments are too lazy to make the transition to Apple. A lot of the security software that corporations use does not support Macs, although I would argue that Macs are much more secure out of the box and don't need a bunch of bloated security products like PC's do.

Until Apple can convince corporate IT execs that Macs are easy to remotely manage and secure, they still have a long uphill climb. And as long as lots of corporations are using PC's exclusively, their users will probably buy PC's for their personal machines as well.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

It has increased this year, and increased substantially over the last 5 years, ten years and twenty years.

You need to acquaint yourselves with the facts.

Increased SUBSTANTIALLY in the last 15 years as they went from under two million per quarter increasing steadily up until 2011 where they stopped increasing and stayed steady between 4-6 million per quarter.

In the last 5 years, they’ve sold consistently in a range between 4 and 6 million per quarter, with three quarters in that time where they went slightly under and 3 quarters where they went over. The “over” was in the last year or so, so it remains to be seen if we’re really seeing a trend upward or if these spikes settle back in the 4-6 million range. If they sell over 4 million EVERY quarter this year, then that’s more, but still not substantially more as they’ve been selling over 4 million for most of the last 5 years.

Substantially, would be… I guess, 6 million per quarter? As that would be clearly well above the historical range.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

True. Every time I want to wake up with Touch-ID and I use my nose, it doesn’t work. But weirdly it works every time I use my right index finger.

I get your point that it might be broken if someone doesn’t have a right index finger, but there’s a hack that will fix that (different finger).

Thing is, you CAN formally enter a nose and it’ll read it pretty well. Or any other body part that’s suitably rounded in the same way that a finger is. SCIENCE!!

 

[steve09090]

You guys are missing something very important here. Corporations, by and large, still use Wintel machines because their IT departments are too lazy to make the transition to Apple. A lot of the security software that corporations use does not support Macs, although I would argue that Macs are much more secure out of the box and don't need a bunch of bloated security products like PC's do.

Until Apple can convince corporate IT execs that Macs are easy to remotely manage and secure, they still have a long uphill climb. And as long as lots of corporations are using PC's exclusively, their users will probably buy PC's for their personal machines as well.

Which is an interesting point. I know of several (cool) IT companies that use Mac as their main system. You're right that there are too many "traditional" nerd IT's out there that will always use Windows. My brother is one of them. Too scared to give Apple a go and claims Windows is superior and won't even consider Mx Chips as an alternative.

 

[mi7chy]

Which is an interesting point. I know of several (cool) IT companies that use Mac as their main system. You're right that there are too many "traditional" nerd IT's out there that will always use Windows. My brother is one of them. Too scared to give Apple a go and claims Windows is superior and won't even consider Mx Chips as an alternative.

Three key things that keep MacOS out of companies except for smaller mom and pop shops are lack of user and device management with Microsoft Active Directory, software compatibility and cost.

 

[slx]

You guys are missing something very important here. Corporations, by and large, still use Wintel machines because their IT departments are too lazy to make the transition to Apple. A lot of the security software that corporations use does not support Macs, although I would argue that Macs are much more secure out of the box and don't need a bunch of bloated security products like PC's do.

Until Apple can convince corporate IT execs that Macs are easy to remotely manage and secure, they still have a long uphill climb. And as long as lots of corporations are using PC's exclusively, their users will probably buy PC's for their personal machines as well.

Right out of the box, MacOS comes with firewall disabled, not exactly the best security practice The Macs are a pain in the rear to manage, and IT departments have to manage and treat them as mobile devices and leverage MDM solutions for Mac management, that's not always very convenient. And it's harder to control and manage Macs, which is a major issue for corporate IT, and well managed Wintel machines are quite secure and easy to manage. Though for small businesses or personal use, Mac might be a better and more secure option.

 

[DanVM]

You guys are missing something very important here. Corporations, by and large, still use Wintel machines because their IT departments are too lazy to make the transition to Apple. A lot of the security software that corporations use does not support Macs, although I would argue that Macs are much more secure out of the box and don't need a bunch of bloated security products like PC's do.

Until Apple can convince corporate IT execs that Macs are easy to remotely manage and secure, they still have a long uphill climb. And as long as lots of corporations are using PC's exclusively, their users will probably buy PC's for their personal machines as well.

Which is an interesting point. I know of several (cool) IT companies that use Mac as their main system. You're right that there are too many "traditional" nerd IT's out there that will always use Windows. My brother is one of them. Too scared to give Apple a go and claims Windows is superior and won't even consider Mx Chips as an alternative.

Many people are attached to the Apple ecosystem because of the integration between their devices. The same can be said about Windows and MS enterprise / business ecosystem, that goes from on-premise to cloud, from office suites to ERP's and management tools. There is no other company that's even close to what MS offers. Maybe is not that IT is lazy or nerd, but MS being better.

 

[steve09090]

Many people are attached to the Apple ecosystem because of the integration between their devices. The same can be said about Windows and MS enterprise / business ecosystem, that goes from on-premise to cloud, from office suites to ERP's and management tools. There is no other company that's even close to what MS offers. Maybe is not that IT is lazy or nerd, but MS being better.

I totally get the MS is geared up for an enterprise system. It runs MS Office so well. Not every company needs Office, so being tied to MS is a decision and it’s not only because any MS prowess. Hard to deny there isn’t a bias, but also understand why that bias exists.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

Three key things that keep MacOS out of companies except for smaller mom and pop shops are lack of user and device management with Microsoft Active Directory, software compatibility and cost.

Lucky for Apple, there are plenty of “smaller mom and pop shops” in the Fortune 500

 

[slx]

Lucky for Apple, there are plenty of “smaller mom and pop shops” in the Fortune 500

The mom and pop shops would buy a few macbooks and run them till they fall apart, for like 5-7 years, and the F500 guys would buy and leas tens and hundreds of thousands on a steady 3 year upgrade cycle...

 

[NT1440]

Three key things that keep MacOS out of companies except for smaller mom and pop shops are lack of user and device management with Microsoft Active Directory, software compatibility and cost.

Yes, small businesses are just clamoring for active directory. I’ve been consulting this year and as soon as I see Server 2008 I nope the **** out of there.

The idea that mom and pop shops have any kind of IT knowledge aside from hiring someone to set them up and never maintaining it until their 10+ year old server “in the back room” dies, is laughable.

 

[iBreatheApple]

You obviously don’t own one of each.

Spoiler alert, I actually do.

There is no subliminal message here; it’s a genuine question.

 

[Velli]

Spoiler alert, I actually do.

There is no subliminal message here; it’s a genuine question.

I understand where you’re coming from. But I do believe the gap is bigger than ever, M1 felt like a giant leap even coming from a previous Mac, while the experience from my Windows is an updated version of the same bs. I recently got a new Thinkpad, and there is zero difference in overall experience compared to my 2015 Thinkpad. It doesn’t even feel faster (though it probably is).

I think the reason they are more worried now is that in their mind, a Mac was a high end computer that they could make a cheap copy of. With the M1 Apple is now doing things that they can’t simply copy. They can’t switch to ARM because then they blow their one big advantage, the X86 Windows ecosystem. They are stuck. They will not catch up in three years, they will fall further behind. That’s the difference - they were always behind, but Apple was never really pulling away. That might very well happen, if not now then in 3-5 years.

In shorter words, you dont “worry” about where you are now, you worry about where you think you are going to be.

 

[Velli]

Many people are attached to the Apple ecosystem because of the integration between their devices. The same can be said about Windows and MS enterprise / business ecosystem, that goes from on-premise to cloud, from office suites to ERP's and management tools. There is no other company that's even close to what MS offers. Maybe is not that IT is lazy or nerd, but MS being better.

In my company with around 300 employees that’s 100% not true. It is 100% because the IT department don’t know Macs well enough, and don’t want to hire someone who do. They said so directly. They just want to do what they are used to do. That’s corporate IT for you, the IT department decides how the users should work, not the other way around. And it’s BS.

 

[sudo-sandwich]

'eh that's mobile games. a class into itself. when you say 'video game' i bet 90% of people think of arcade, console or pc before mobile.

the mac could be profitable to make games for if apple wanted it to.

To 90%, or maybe more like 75%, video game = phone game.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

To 90%, or maybe more like 75%, video game = phone game.

Going by sales, it would = Minecraft or GTA, both of which are on phones.

 

[mi7chy]

They dominate the overall video game market (in terms of both users and revenue) with the iPhone, but they actively make it suck to play games on a Mac. Probably cause it's not profitable enough for them to care.

To me mobile gaming is dead since I haven't bought nor touched a mobile game in ages. Last mobile game I bought was Dead Cells out of curiosity to compare with Steam version. Going forward it makes more sense to only buy the Steam version since it works on both PC and Mac vs mobile only.

 

[NotApplicable]

I’ve worked for some of the largest corporations and small/midsize Silicon Valley startups.

Never had to use a Windows machine. Guess I’m lucky!

Edit: but I’m a software engineer and Windows is trash for development so it’s not surprising.

 

[DanVM]

I totally get the MS is geared up for an enterprise system. It runs MS Office so well. Not every company needs Office, so being tied to MS is a decision and it’s not only because any MS prowess. Hard to deny there isn’t a bias, but also understand why that bias exists.

There are many cases that being tied to MS ecosystem is because it's the best option, and not necessarily about bias. The same can be said from Apple, Google or any other company.

 

[mi7chy]

I’ve worked for some of the largest corporations and small/midsize Silicon Valley startups.

Never had to use a PC.

Which industry since it's not semiconductor, IT/data center, banking/finance, telecom, ISP, military, manufacturing, auto, architecture, medical, etc.

 

[NotApplicable]

Which industry since it's not semiconductor, IT/data center, banking/finance, telecom, ISP, military, manufacturing, auto, architecture, medical, etc.

Tech

 

[mi7chy]

Tech

What area of tech? Something along the line of Slack, Discord, Airbnb, etc.?

 

[NotApplicable]

What area of tech? Something along the line of Slack, Discord, Airbnb, etc.?

Not consumer products/services like that, more infra/b2b saas

 

[DanVM]

In my company with around 300 employees that’s 100% not true. It is 100% because the IT department don’t know Macs well enough, and don’t want to hire someone who do. They said so directly. They just want to do what they are used to do. That’s corporate IT for you, the IT department decides how the users should work, not the other way around. And it’s BS.

That's how IT works for your company. I work IT and we have no issues at all with Apple or Windows devices, and I have seen many companies doing the same. But at the same time, there are cases where what users ask doesn't makes sense. So IT has to decide in a way that may not be popular with a group of users. In my experience, we had no issues neither with MS or Apple devices. But at the same time, I think MS has better management tools and better integration with their apps and ecosystem. So I can understand why many companies decide to stay with MS.