WSJ: Jony Ive Became 'Dispirited' After Apple Watch and Sometimes Failed to Show Up to Meetings

[Blackstick]

None of this is too surprising. Ive was balanced out by Jobs - and with one side of the scale missing, you lose the special sauce equilibrium.

I actually look forward to Apple pressing on with the staff Ive built, and see what they’re capable of without their editor. Those of you who think Apple will be Ive’s first customer at his new firm have never penned an executive’s separation statement to the press/Wall Street.

 

[grayfield]

I believe that Ives's has had a negative effect on the core original macintosh focus on an intuitive interface. I frequently want to say to Ives, "Elegant dose NOT always equal useful" ( hiding the Save Attachment button in Mail until you mouse over it is a pet peeve. Yes without it the window is more sparse and "elegant", but if you don't know it's there you're SOL.
Read The Humane Interface, Jeff Raskin's book on designing the original mac interface. It is really a deep and insightful book on human perception, its strengths and serious weaknesses. He also lays out the design philosophy that made Windows such a pain to work with. Unfortunately under Ives a growing number of Windows design theory mistakes began to creep into the Mac interface. He lost his way.

 

[Adam Warlock]

I don't think firing Scott Forstall was the wrong decision in the bigger scope of things. It seems like he was causing more problems than he was worth, and I doubt anyone is worth the massive social drain on everyone around him.

Steve Jobs was, no?

 

[apolloa]

I should add though, my Apple Watch series 1 has been invaluable to me, I was taken to hospital a few weeks ago as I got heart palpitations and it wouldn’t stop. It finally went back down,
But I couldn’t feel it beating fast yet my watch told me it was!
I have been using it since to keep an eye on my heart rate..

So I appreciate Ive May have wanted a fashion device, to me I’d rather have it as that health device as it’s certainly been proving its worth to me.

And when I need a new model? I’ll just see if I can get a cheap series 4 on sale.

The Apple Watch is my favourite Apple device since the iPhone 4, although I use my XR all the time..

 

[pika2000]

Assuming this is true.
Every Single quote had proved my suspicious to be right for the past few years.

1. Steve Left Apple as Jony having the ID, and Scott Forstall having HI. It was extremely important to separate the two. Because while they might seem similar, they are inherently different.

2. The Best people, especially product people are pain in the ass to manage, that is the quote from Steve. That is why it was Tim's Job to solve the dispute between Ive and Forstall, not to pick a side.

3. Trying to go for higher profits and sales while neglecting Market Share. I think Apple is lucky to have its current market share. But I presume if Steve was alive and has 100s of billions of cash and had no idea what to do with it, he might actually lower the profit margin from a ridiculous Net 20% to loser to 10% to 15%. Which was the margin they operate on before iPhone. Somewhere along the line they got to 20%. and they become greedy. And now they are somehow fixed on the 20% Net Margin.

4. Ive is obviously burn out. And like I said, having the operation guys telling him he can't do something because of production limitation, etc. Will eventually kill what ever design senses he had.

5. Ive cant perform without Steve Jobs. Or without someone lifting up from time to time like Steve would used to motivate every one in Apple. And this moral issues has obviously filtered down, once reason why you see a lot of executive leaving Apple, at a rate much higher than past Apple history.

6. Tim Cook is absolutely **** with people. He is not good at picking people. And that is from the first Apple Retail guy from Dixon to recent Angela Ahrendts. Although I am now starting to think it might not even have been Angela Ahrendts fault. The Apple Store Expansion delay might have been an operational and finance huddle within the company.

7. While I think the Apple Watch at its current price is actually quite "low", that Gold version was insane. Ive without Steve is like Messi without Iniesta and Xavi.

8. Tim is now caring more about the process, and not the product.

9. There is already huge discontent with MacBook Pro. As a matter of fact 2016+ MBP has been the worst product in Apple history, mentioned by many who followed Apple since it was Six Colour. Apple is now safe now and still doing OK not because they are good, but because their competitor is even worst. That is both Android and Windows. ( Microsoft WSL 2 will likly steal many Devs over )

10. The adoption rate of new Mac user has been slowing down. And if there are still 50% new to Mac it just mean lots of users are leaving the Mac ecosystem. I don't know how this is not alarming.

If Tim Cook doesn't want to lower price of iPhone, how about giving AppleCare+ for free with each iPhone? Stop trying to look at numbers like ASP, unit sold. Start by making best product and services.

1. Cook was already doing the CEO's job even when Jobs was at the helm. Jobs specifically called on Cook to take care of things. That is the facts. Your speculations had no basis.
2. Jobs was the one that gave Ive and his team a "God-mode" authority in Apple. Forstall's exit was already explained by many articles, nothing to do with what you are saying.
3. Apple's pricing actually was not that too farfetched for what they are. It's just the bloggers and youtubers mindset that keep sounding the "expensive" impression. Jobs himself wasn't focused too much on marketshare. He canceled out all the Mac clones, made the iPod Apple only at first, etc.
4. Ive and his design team had almost complete authority to decide on things. Cook is a collaborative person, thus he tried to appease Ive. Read the article, how Ive wanted the Apple watch to be a fashion accessory, thus Cook allowed the gold and branded Apple watches.
5. On the contrary, moral was actually quite low with Jobs. Plenty of interviews about this. Jobs is not an easy person to work with. Sure, he's charismatic, but his social skills left many unimpressed to say the least. Cook, on the other hand, brought moral of Apple to a new height. Moral of Apple is not just the moral of Jonny Ive, Apple is now a huge company with a ton of people.
6. The Dixon guy was Cook's mistake, I agree. But that doesn't mean he's doing a poor job period. Cook acted quickly by getting the guy out, and moved on. Plenty of other picks to be great choice for Apple under Cook.
8. That's why he has other executives in charge of that. A CEO that is micro managing a huge company like Apple is not a good CEO. This is also why Steve Jobs, despite having the CEO title, let Cook do the CEO functions.
9. Well, maybe Ive has something to do with that?
10. Mac is slowing down, while PCs are going negative. That's the reality of the market with the disruption mobile. Cannot look at a statistic just from one point of view. Why do you think Apple decided to bet on mobile? Even Jobs saw the signs on the wall (also note his truck and car analogy).

 

[x-evil-x]

I'm no Cook fan, but its hard to deny that he's taken Apple to new heights that Jobs never did, where as Ballmer did the opposite.

id say he coasted off of the Steve era with plenty of pipeline products left behind from Steve. Setup for greatness pretty much.
I think the cook apple era just started last few years. What he has done the last two years has Apple feeling rocky and stocks showed it. It’s not so easy when two of the biggest people that where “Apple” are gone now.

 

[Winni]

$1,000? Rolex watches are more like $8,000-$10,000.

Only the "cheap", "entry-level" Rolexes...

I've seen fake (!) Rolexes that already did costs 25,000+ -- they used Breitling internals instead of original Rolex clockworks, and of course the rest was made of expensive materials as well. Basically, just the Breitling clockwork was fake. It was an extremely expensive "Blender" as we call those fake watches in Germany, but a "blender" nonetheless.

 

[pika2000]

but not at the forefront of design.

the last great iphone designwise was iphone 4 to iphone 5s. then a big decline happened...

Says who?
Every other Android phone copied the notch look. Sure, some is making it into a hole, but a notch is a notch.
And design is not just the overall look of the phone. Apple arguably started the aluminum trend, and then they started the glass back trend. While everybody is still doing aluminum, Apple has moved on to stainless steel. The rest are still doing chins on their phones, so I'd say Apple is still at the forefront.

The only thing I can say Apple is conservative is colors. I blame this mostly on the paradigm set by the US market. Being a US company, Apple is quite conservative with color options, compared to the Chinese nowadays that have multitude of rainbows of colors on their phones.

 

[asiga]

No matter if Ive feels low enthusiasm for nowadays Apple, I also feel low enthusiasm for Ive's current interests. Yes, he did the industrial design, and the HI, but that was in the past. If you love the Mac, all Ive "contributions" to the Mac in the last 10 years have been quite bad (destroy Aqua, and bring nonsense iOS candy to the Mac, just to name two). I still keep a G5 running Tiger, and when I start it, I say "now, this is why I chose the Mac".

 

[Winni]

Don't forget about the Mac Pro 2013. It's an amazing piece of design, but it failed miserably at being the type computer it was meant to be.

It's a mega-cool QUIET(!) workstation for software development and heavy duty office work. I have the trash can at work and it's a beautiful machine for what I need it for. However, I can imagine that it would be the wrong choice for a lot of people that need an -- internally -- extensible computer. You know, just as in "dull, beige boxes"... Or like those old Mac Pros, that were also truly amazing (and extensible) powerhouses.

Basically, the 2013 Mac Pro was just a more powerful, round Mac Mini. And the 2019 Mac Mini runs circles around it for less money -- but doesn't look nearly as cool as the trash can.

 

[pika2000]

When you think about it, the iPhone wasn't exactly revolutionary in terms of raw specs. What Apple excels in doing is knowing how best to put all these parts together to offer a better user experience.

I have not seen that change.

It's idolatry, the idol-worship syndrome. Many sees Steve Jobs as a deity. With him gone, people are denying the person replacing him just because, even if nothing has changed company-wise.

 

[ksec]

I don't think firing Scott Forstall was the wrong decision in the bigger scope of things. It seems like he was causing more problems than he was worth, and I doubt anyone is worth the massive social drain on everyone around him.

I would probably have done the same thing were I in Tim Cook's shoes.

And that was Maps, which somehow Scott Forstall was to blame, and he has less than 2 years to work on it, with resources that was less than a tenth of Google Maps. And for Apple to fix that problem, it wasn't until somewhere in 2015 that had to reboot the whole thing.

There were lots of people supporting Scott Forstall within the company. including the HI team.

But Apple's profit margins have actually decreased. So it stands to reason that the chief reason why Apple products are more expensive is that they simply cost more to make. And products like the iPhone X are more expensive to make because of the way they are designed, which suggests that Apple is not averse to taking design risks, even when they result in lower margins.

Apple's Profit Margin Gross or Net, have NOT decreased. It is still standing at 22% Net Margin, highest in many industry and highest also in volume ( comparatively speaking ).

But that's precisely the point of a profit-maximising company. Apple serves a way larger market than it did 10 years ago. It's one thing to be able to make a single great product, it's another to be able to mass-produce it in the millions so the people who want one will actually be able to buy one.

The old days form Folklore, Operation were there to solve and help make those products to mass produce. The design team make something within the budget, ( There has aways been budgeting as shown in internal memo many years ago ) and operation will need to figure out away how to get it done. Now it reads to me as the other way around, Operation are telling Design nothing can be done.

And for Profit maximising, is precisely what the video Steve Jobs was talking about.

 

[Remy149]

Without Steve, that secret recipe just ain’t the same...

People like you keep saying this but the Apple products I’ve bought in the last 2-3 years are the best tech products I’ve ever owned.

 

[mytdave]

I see pros and cons here. Design is an important area to Apple, more so than other tech companies, who for the most part lack anything truly innovative. At the same time, Apple has for many years now been overly consumed by "form over function," which is also a problem. Maybe this shake up will help in that regard.

On the other hand, I can understand the frustration (and the outright danger) of having a finance and operations heavy board of directors. That has killed many a company when the focus shifts to the bottom line instead of innovation. This can be particularly dangerous for Apple because their success relies almost exclusively on innovative products.

Hopefully Ive will be happy in an environment where he can pursue his purist design tendencies. Apple on the other hand apparently needs to look at balancing out the board with some more product focused people, and while they're at it maybe eliminating some that are just political hacks and really know nothing about business.

 

[Remy149]

So is this part supposed to be in favour of Jony Ive or against him?

In hindsight, the killer app for the Apple Watch is health tracking, and making it an elite fashion accessory makes little sense when it's still a computer at the end of the day with a limited shelf-life.

I love my Apple Watch, but considering that I will likely have to upgrade it every 3 years on average, it makes little sense to get anything beyond the entry-level sports model.

The article seems to want to paint Apple as being the problem for Jony Ive wanting to leave, yet it highlights some of the worse decisions made by Jony Ive, and doesn't really paint him in a very flattering light either.

Ironically I like the Apple Watch so much because it works as a great piece of tech and also as a nice piece of fashion. I used to own multiple watches and now thanks to easy to change bands can wear an Apple Watch with anything.

 

[TheFluffyDuck]

Only now is the apple watch what it should have been from the start. Health and fitness focus, and internals that can match the required function. The first apple watch would never have been approved by Steve Jobs. That thing ran like a three legged hippo. Even the 2nd gen was barely functional. Untill the current generation at least it was ALWAYS faster to just get out your phone, defeating the purpose.

 

[pika2000]

No matter if Ive feels low enthusiasm for nowadays Apple, I also feel low enthusiasm for Ive's current interests. Yes, he did the industrial design, and the HI, but that was in the past. If you love the Mac, all Ive "contributions" to the Mac in the last 10 years have been quite bad (destroy Aqua, and bring nonsense iOS candy to the Mac, just to name two). I still keep a G5 running Tiger, and when I start it, I say "now, this is why I chose the Mac".

I started to feel "low" on Ive's design ever since Apple unveiled the iPhone 5c cases (the ones with the holes on them). Then come the iPhone 6/6S design with the ugly non-color matched white antenna bands. I guess the timing matched with Ive growing tired. So does this mean the re-designed antenna bands on the iPhone 7 onwards (to hide the ugliness a bit) was not an Ive thing? If that's the case, well I guess it's time for Ive to move on.

 

[loby]

This was sadly inevitable after Cook became CEO. Apple has increasingly focused on pleasing shareholders, which means operational efficiency, quarterly projections, short-term ROI and minimal risk. Apple got where it is because it was willing to take bold risks and lead the market in design and innovation, but Cook isn't a leader, he's just a caretaker. A very skilled caretaker, who can keep the boat sailing indefinitely, but not someone who can take them somewhere new and uncharted.

Ive was the CEO Apple needed after Jobs' death.

Ive is a designer, not a C.E.O., big difference. That is why Jobs picked Cook.

Today people think that anyone can be a C.E.O., politician and even a President...not true.

I am not a fan of Cook, but he is a C.E.O. and a good one. I don't care for his politics, the apple culture that he is creating nor is pushed on everything and everywhere that is apple (had to sit in an apple theatre for two hours waiting for repairs...too much a push to shape people's minds). Apple make products and services for people to buy. Just stay there and let people make up their own minds about the other things.

He is doing what a C.E.O. is suppose to do. This is why Apple as a company is prospering and the bucks are coming in. Shareholders are happy. This is what a C.E.O. does.

Again, not a fan of Cook, but he does a good job.

 

[cinq2]

This was sadly inevitable after Cook became CEO. Apple has increasingly focused on pleasing shareholders, which means operational efficiency, quarterly projections, short-term ROI and minimal risk. Apple got where it is because it was willing to take bold risks and lead the market in design and innovation, but Cook isn't a leader, he's just a caretaker. A very skilled caretaker, who can keep the boat sailing indefinitely, but not someone who can take them somewhere new and uncharted.

Ive was the CEO Apple needed after Jobs' death.

Great post, though I don't agree with the last sentence.
Ive is a genius but unbalanced. He needed his Jobs.
Tony Fadel & Scot Forstall come in mind as appropriate CEO's and I'd like to see likes of Gianandrea or Srouji being considered in a later time. Or Federighi.

No matter what the background of the CEO will influence the company. Cook understands Ops and has slowly created Apple in his image. Designers to report to COO? Oh give me a break.

Engineer for next CEO please.

 

[x-evil-x]

lol - hopefully no more moderator-encouraged passive-aggressive insults coming my way for suggesting Ive's "tiredness" was code for having had enough of Cook's BS. Been trying to tell y'all for a few years now.

The great yoda has spoken.
Listen to him you will
[doublepost=1561981543][/doublepost]

but not at the forefront of design.

the last great iphone designwise was iphone 4 to iphone 5s. then a big decline happened...

ThAt new flat iPad design though. It’s glorious and a polished iPhone 4/5 design. We need it for the phones.

 

[ksec]

3. Apple's pricing actually was not that too farfetched for what they are. It's just the bloggers and youtubers mindset that keep sounding the "expensive" impression. Jobs himself wasn't focused too much on marketshare. He canceled out all the Mac clones, made the iPod Apple only at first, etc.

Comparing to Pre iPhone and Post iPhone, That is the difference between 10% to 15% Net Margin on low volume product to 20% on High Volume product. Jobs wasn't focus on Marketshare, he was focus on making profits and long term survival. When he was back the battle between Mac and PC were gone. Mac lost, and iPod is what revived Apple. Steve is focused on sustainable Market Shares. Not market shares / shipment in itself. Although arguably iPhone current do have a sustainable market shares. ( The problem is whether it is sustainable in the future. )

Apple has always been about value. From Mac to iPhone, but specially in the past 3 years, Mac, and iPhone aren't offering as much value as they were. It is not that I cant afford at 1099, or even $2099 if they had solid battery. But they are not adding enough value, from TouchBar to

10. Mac is slowing down, while PCs are going negative. That's the reality of the market with the disruption mobile. Cannot look at a statistic just from one point of view. Why do you think Apple decided to bet on mobile? Even Jobs saw the signs on the wall (also note his truck and car analogy).

The sale of Mac has been very steady, despite PC market decline, by if you count 50% of Mac purchase as new user as stated by Apple, and Apple's active Mac user base, it means people are leaving the Mac ecosystem, at a rate quicker then previously predicted.

1. Cook was already doing the CEO's job even when Jobs was at the helm. Jobs specifically called on Cook to take care of things. That is the facts. Your speculations had no basis.

Speculation of what?

5. On the contrary, moral was actually quite low with Jobs. Plenty of interviews about this. Jobs is not an easy person to work with. Sure, he's charismatic, but his social skills left many unimpressed to say the least. Cook, on the other hand, brought moral of Apple to a new height. Moral of Apple is not just the moral of Jonny Ive, Apple is now a huge company with a ton of people.

Job was not a easy person to work with does not mean the moral is low. People are challenged to make best work. Count the amount of executive left during Jobs era, and count the amount of executive left during post jobs era. Of course many were arguing because they have been at Apple for so long they decided to leave, but this story now put a different spin into it.

 

[joueboy]

This is obviously Tim Cook and his minion creating this lies of information. They know when Ive leaving Apple will create a backslash to the company.

 

[Ghost31]

No, no, no! This is BAD!
Who is going to do the voiceover to the next products video presentations?

On a more serious note, if true, he will be heavily missed. His genius is behind almost every Apple product I handle and wear and love. This is going to be worse than losing SJ.

Wonder if this his genius is behind the charging port on the Magic Mouse

 

[oftheheavens]

An "airtight Pelican case"?
Afraid bad design would smell?

Another way to ensure it wasn’t opened in transit.

 

[Webster's Mac]

I have to say, regarding the apple watch, except for the most ardent Apple fans, most people saw that high end apple watches were not going to be popular, even amongst the rich and ultra rich. Why buy a watch for that much and have it only last a few years ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I have the first generation apple watch and it barely functions, only after 4 years, can you imagine someone dropping a 1,000+ or more on a rolex and it only lasting a 4 years? Not likely.

The thing with other expensive watches (Swiss) is that they are never outdated. A self-winding mechanical watch always has unique charm whether it’s 1 year old or 80 years old. Apple Watch can become outdated just like any other computer/smartphone