WWDC: New LCD Displays

[CholEoptera36]

You're not the only one out there using this monitor and assuming that you are and that no one has another use besides you is just SILLY!

W

Riiiiiiiiiiight....... I must have said I was the only one using them... NOT. And I'm intitled to my own opinion about over excessively large monitors.

AfterThought - Increase in resolution doesn't mean it's the same for a 30" on your eyes as it is to view a 20". That's just silly. The bigger the monitor size, the larger the resolution. The larger the resolution, the smaller things appear on the monitor. That's in addition to adding size to the display... Would you say it's the same to view 800x600 on say a 12" as viewing it on a 30" display, no matter what the resolution is on the 30? The bigger the size of the display in combination with increased resolution means things ARE spread further apart and smaller. What's the difference between 1024x768 and 800x600? The 1024x768 displays everything much smaller and spread apart further. The more you increase resolution that happens. And having a larger monitor vows for that to be increased even more.

 

[themacman]

Imac G5

I am prety pissed about the imac G5 because i am in hte market is there a posibility it could be at the Expo in france?

 

[Downdivx]

Riiiiiiiiiiight....... I must have said I was the only one using them... NOT. And I'm intitled to my own opinion about over excessively large monitors.

AfterThought - Increase in resolution doesn't mean it's the same for a 30" on your eyes as it is to view a 20". That's just silly.

Quite correct, you are entitled to your opinion. However, to go to a forum and complain because a new monitor is too large and you have to move your head and eyes too much is silly.

W

 

[Arael]

Why do people insist on comparing apples to oranges? Yes, you can get 20" LCDs for under $1k... but those are not widescreen displays. Ditto for 23" displays... compare high end widescreens from Sony, Viewsonic, and others to these new 20 and 23" widescreen LCDs, and make sure you are looking at the ones with the same resolution or better, and suddenly it will be obvious that Apple's prices for these new 20 and 23" widescreen LCDs is actually right spot on with the rest of the industry. Comparing them to cheaper 20" 4:3 ratio displays is not an accurate comparison.

The HP 23in is around $1700 with the same LCD spec.
Well, I guess for some people the apple logo and
the firewire/usb hubs are worth $300.
I just hate that it has only a single input.

 

[CholEoptera36]

Quite correct, you are entitled to your opinion. However, to go to a forum and complain because a new monitor is too large and you have to move your head and eyes too much is silly.

W

Added a little more to it incase you missed it. And lots of people have complained in this thread about the monitors from many different aspects. It's not silly, this happens in all forums.

 

[cr2sh]

Added a little more to it incase you missed it. And lots of people have complained in this thread about the monitors from many different aspects. It's not silly, this happens in all forums.

No.. you see, complaining that a 30" display is too big, is silly.

It is.

No seriously, it is.

It's as if you missed the entire point.

 

[paulypants]

What pisses me off the most is when people say i don't need a g5 (yeah your g4 will do just fine blah blah blah) processor, i'm a student (therefore certain items are just out of reach even with edu discount) I use photoshop, i have a 6mp canon slr, i use cad... for me to have to wait so long for photo's to load up on iphoto or photoshop is ridiculous. My time is precious too, I need to get in and do my work without waiting for long loading times. I can't do this with items that (as perfect as they are) are so costly.... I can wait for os updates but a fast processor and good screen from the same company for a realistic price is not too much to ask. £4000 is just too much (g5 2.5ghz + 23inch). I would go some where else, but somewhere else sucks (and even if the hardware is cheaper the software will slow me down even more than a g4 with all those damn pop ups and viruses and errors and don't get me started on the **** layout)

I don't think your very unique in that you use photoshop and take digital photos etc etc--I am in the same situation as you and I am on a Dual G4
tower--I have no 'long loading times' as you described. You do NOT need a G5 for photoshop and taking digital photos, although you may WANT one.

 

[Cooknn]

G5 Style Speakers

I believe Bose makes a desktop speaker system that looks very compatible with the current design of the g5's and new monitors. I haven't seen 'em up close but online they looked quite similar.

I've got em. They fit perfect with my G5, iSight, etc. Take a look a the Bose Companion 3 Speakers they ROCK

 

[Chaywa]

Good displays

I must say I find myself in the middle on this issue of the new displays. I don't hate them like some seem to but I am also not convinced they are all a good deal. Kind of like when the G5s came out and the 2.0 was the only good deal cause the single cpu's lagged. I think the 20" may not be a good deal compared to other monitors out there but the 23 is comparably priced with added looks and features. Let's not forget these things are framed in aluminum not cheap plastic. There is a premium for style.

I think apple has done well design wise again. They took the look of the G5 and made it a good looking display. To those who are cursing the looks of the new display, remember how many hated the look of the G5 until they saw it in person. Give it a chance. If you still don't like it after seeing it in person, then I bet you also dislike the G5 and neither is for you. The dual 2.0 sitting next to me looks pretty darn good.

I have watched these sites for over a year now and this is my first post. I was in the market for a new display and thanks to this site I knew to hold off and see apple's new offering before I made my decision. I have a hunch that a lot of people who are complaining are not even in the market for a display and were only hoping they would get an insanely great price cut so they could be in the market. For those like me who are serious about buying a new pro-quality display, good luck comparison shopping and enjoy the purchase.

 

[ffakr]

congrats to apple....it is now once again possible to spend over 15,000 dollars on a single workstation without buying any "accessory" upgrades.

strictly speaking,

dual G5 2.5
load the RAM
dual 30" monitors (along w/obligatory gfx card upgrade)
dual 250gig HDDs

I didn't even have to add a fibre-channel card to get it over 15K.

amazing.

I'm lost, is that a snipe? Are you shocked that it costs a lot for a cutting edge desktop w/ 8 Gigs of ram, half a TB of drive, and 2 High Def 30" monitors?

i wonder how clocked-down the 6800 is going to be?

It's an Ultra. That means it should be as fast as any other Ultra (though it could be faster). Each grade of the card follows a frequence set by Nvidia. If Apple release a lower clocked chip, they couldn't call it an Ultra.

 

[Cooknn]

Let's not forget these things are framed in aluminum not cheap plastic.

Excellent point. Since I got my G5, I can't see myself buying a plastic monitor (I'm still hanging with my Viewsonic CRT). I think I'm gonna have to spring for the 23". Guess the new carpet for my condo will have to wait

 

[ffakr]

AfterThought - Increase in resolution doesn't mean it's the same for a 30" on your eyes as it is to view a 20". That's just silly. The bigger the monitor size, the larger the resolution. The larger the resolution, the smaller things appear on the monitor. That's in addition to adding size to the display... Would you say it's the same to view 800x600 on say a 12" as viewing it on a 30" display, no matter what the resolution is on the 30? The bigger the size of the display in combination with increased resolution means things ARE spread further apart and smaller. What's the difference between 1024x768 and 800x600? The 1024x768 displays everything much smaller and spread apart further. The more you increase resolution that happens. And having a larger monitor vows for that to be increased even more.

No, your logic is shaky at best.
You are interchanging two concepts.. resolution in total pixels and resolution in pixel density.. dpi [dots per inch]
the resolution [dpi] on monitors (CRTs) was pretty much set between 72 and 75 dots per inch for a LONG time. Larger monitors simply supported higher resolutions. A 32 pixel wide icon on a 72 dpi 15" monitor is EXACTLY THE SAME SIZE as a 32 pixel wide icon on a 72 dpi 20" monitor. EXACTLY because it's dots per inch.. so the icon is precisely 32/72 inches wide.

If you don't run the monitor at the native resolution, you WILL have a lower dpi but people don't often run LCDs at non-native resolutions because the interpolation makes them look fuzzy and crappy. Do you expect anyone to buy a 30" Apple LCD and run it at 800x600 resolution? Not unless they are rich AND nearly blind.

Now, the 30" (and the 23") ARE a higher resolution [dpi], but not because of the reason you think. They are a higher resolution because they are intentionally designed to be 100 dpi. They are, after all, high definition monitors. I believe SGI made (or makes) a 200dpi LCD.
That doesn't mean that a monitor MUST have a higher resolution [dpi] just because it is larger surface area. The resolution [total pixels] is determined by dpi x the dimensions of the screen. It's not the number of pixels or the physical dimensions of the screen that determine how small stuff looks and how far apart stuff on the screen appears to be.. it's the resolution [dpi].

 

[ffakr]

macwarehouse.com shows a ship date of the 20" in 4-6 days. Do you think this is true? I find it odd, since Apple's online store shows 2-4 weeks..

I believe that Apple's web store bases ship times dynamically from past shipping info.. That is it watches the shipping trend then gives you a number. Whenever a machine/device/software is released, the initial ship time is always some generic default like 2-4 weeks or 4-6 weeks, but that number often changes significantly if the product is actually in stock to ship when announced.

So, it may take 2-4 weeks to ship, or it may ship tomorrow from Apple. You can't trust the shipping times on new apple products.

 

[ffakr]

unrelated

slightly unrelated:

this thread is bringing out a lot of lurkers and switchers..
welcome to the forum. Don't get to stressed by the bickering.. we all really love each other [unless you don't agree with my clearly relevent and accurate posts] ;-)

 

[ffakr]

NVIDIA GeForce 6800 Ultra DDL
This advanced graphics card is required for the new 30-inch Apple Cinema HD Display. [size=large]$599.[/size]

OMFG, are you kidding me? And none of the new Cinemas come w/ the VESA mount adapter? This is insane!!! Well, at least they lowered the price of the ADC to DVI connector.

Are you serious? The resolution on the 30" monitor is so high that a DVI (or ADC) connector doesn't have enough bandwidth to drive them. It's impossible to run them without the special Apple video card because no normal video cards can drive this display.
We'll find out soon enough, but I'm guessing that each DVI channel is rendering part of the desktop.. they probably interlace on the monitor.
They may have gone with NVidia because Nvidia is doing a lot of work with interlaced video again.
I'm not sure what you mean by the monitors don't come with a "VESA mount adapter". The monitors come with a VESA mount plate so you can attach a VESA compliant mount to them. What is a "mount adapter"? You aren't expecting Apple to ship them with a VESA compliant arm are you? I mean, I'd have to say 'OMFG, Are you Serious?' if you were pissed because apple isn't supplying an arm with them. I mean, people buy arms to fit their work enviorment. They shouldn't be cookie cutter, they should fit your setup. Also, most people wouldn't use an arm so it'd be a hell of a waste to bundle them.

 

[Cooknn]

Video Card Q

I've got the 64MB ATI Radeon 9600 Pro in my G5 Dual 2Ghz. Can it even drive the 23" to 1920x1200? I don't need a dual DVI card but would like a 256MB card to beef this thing up. Recommendations?

 

[Bhennies]

I am prety pissed about the imac G5 because i am in hte market is there a posibility it could be at the Expo in france?

Seems to me that the elimination of the 17" display is a sure sign of Apple's product marketing plans. If you want a smaller display than a 20"- you're a CONSUMER in their view and thus must buy an imac. 20", 23" and 30" are for pros only. They're obviously trying to build an even larger bridge between their product lines, which I fear may backfire- UNLESS...(cue headless imac rumor here).

 

[nagromme]

I love these posts

I like all the posts that say:

"Brand X has feature XXXXX just like Apple's display, and they cost $200 less!"

They find ONE, maybe a couple specs that match Apple's and suddenly all the OTHER specs--like pixel resolution as a common example!--don't matter

The logic: I found a display that's not as good as Apple's, and it's cheaper. But there is something in common in the specs, so I will call Apple's displays a rip-off

 

[Capt Underpants]

For all of you who don't like the look of the apple displays on the Apple website, I highly suggest you watch the WWDC keynote. I have to say that, at first, the displays didn't please me, but after watching the keynote and seeing them on stage, my opinion has changed. I can't wait until I get to see the displays in person. I'm sure they will be breathtaking. Here's hoping for a Christmas price drop so I can get one.

 

[Chip NoVaMac]

I like all the posts that say:

"Brand X has feature XXXXX just like Apple's display, and they cost $200 less!"

They find ONE, maybe a couple specs that match Apple's and suddenly all the OTHER specs--like pixel resolution as a common example!--don't matter

The logic: I found a display that's not as good as Apple's, and it's cheaper. But there is something in common in the specs, so I will call Apple's displays a rip-off

i love those that will defend Apple to the death for flawed logic. Today's announcements were met by a 3.59% decline in Apple stock. Obviously many others were hoping for a bit more.

 

[johnnypark1]

New displays in the Apple Stores?

Does anyone know if the new displays are in the Apple stores? I'd like to see a 23" in person before I plop down $1700.

Thanks.

 

[Rower_CPU]

...
Today's announcements were met by a 3.59% decline in Apple stock. Obviously many others were hoping for a bit more.

Actually, this is typical of Apple stock, regardless of what they release - a common phrase is "buy the rumor, sell the news (read: keynote)" when discussing Apple fluctuations around big events.

 

[Chip NoVaMac]

Actually, this is typical of Apple stock, regardless of what they release - a common phrase is "buy the rumor, sell the news (read: keynote)" when discussing Apple fluctuations around big events.

Wish the resources I found could have given me a better indication. But I am sure there is someone here that could say what the Apple stock did last year after the keynote.

It is my impression that the watchers were hoping for something better than new displays.

 

[jsw]

I apologize if this has been asked previously (I was away on a waste of a business trip and missed the keynote - and have tried to catch up on the posts):

Is it possible, using the 6800 and adapters, to connect 3 or 4 non-30" monitors? Or, I suppose, a 30" and two smaller ones? The dual dual DVI suggests that, although the dual ports obviously imply a need for adapters (if "dual DVI" -> "two single DVI" adapters actually exist).

I ask only because I'm not a fan of dual monitors. I hate either having to put one off to the side or having the gap between them at the center of my vision. I'd rather have one (as I do now) or three.

This is a hypothetical question for me, as I can afford neither the 6800 nor additional monitors now, but I was curious if anyone knew the answer.

 

[Chip NoVaMac]

Does anyone know if the new displays are in the Apple stores? I'd like to see a 23" in person before I plop down $1700.

Thanks.

I think the keynote said 3 to 4 weeks.