diamond.g
macrumors G5
The problem is the unbricking process. You should be able to buy a GSM phone and just stick your SIM in it and not have to worry about any sort of activation. It should just work!
AT&T has 48 hours to answer iPhone pricing complaints
- Thread starter jjk454ss
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The problem is the unbricking process. You should be able to buy a GSM phone and just stick your SIM in it and not have to worry about any sort of activation. It should just work!
slippery-pete
macrumors 68020
Article
Interesting article:
http://money.cnn.com/2009/06/10/tec...enge.fortune/index.htm?postversion=2009061009
Couple of points from the article:
"Here's why. When you sign up for AT&T (T, Fortune 500) service and buy an iPhone, Apple (AAPL, Fortune 500) actually gets about $500 -- that's $200 from you, $300 from AT&T. "
"AT&T is willing to pitch in for your iPhone purchase for a couple of really important reasons. One, iPhone users rack up fat monthly bills for Internet service, so AT&T knows it will quickly make its money back. Two, AT&T is the only U.S. carrier with the right to carry the iPhone -- which has helped it to steal those high-value customers from other carriers. "
People act like it takes AT&T the full 2 years to make their money back, but that is not the case. At&t will make their $$$....even if they subsidise only after 12 months.
Interesting article:
http://money.cnn.com/2009/06/10/tec...enge.fortune/index.htm?postversion=2009061009
Couple of points from the article:
"Here's why. When you sign up for AT&T (T, Fortune 500) service and buy an iPhone, Apple (AAPL, Fortune 500) actually gets about $500 -- that's $200 from you, $300 from AT&T. "
"AT&T is willing to pitch in for your iPhone purchase for a couple of really important reasons. One, iPhone users rack up fat monthly bills for Internet service, so AT&T knows it will quickly make its money back. Two, AT&T is the only U.S. carrier with the right to carry the iPhone -- which has helped it to steal those high-value customers from other carriers. "
People act like it takes AT&T the full 2 years to make their money back, but that is not the case. At&t will make their $$$....even if they subsidise only after 12 months.
scaredpoet
macrumors 604
If that were the case, everyone would be paying higher prices. NO one would get an iPhone for the upgrade prices quoted now. You'd probably have to add about $125 to the upgrade prices, and that's what you'd pay.
Not going to happen. If Apple waited another year, the Pre would've stolen the limelight all this time. Instead, people are up in arms about the price while still handing over their money for the iPhone, while the Pre has already become yesterday's news. As an Palm loyalist in a previous life, I kinda feel sorry for them.
The fault here is the consumers. I know, consumers don't like to hear that they're to blame, even though they often are. They have short attention spans, and expect to get as much as possible for as little as possible, right now. In the world of cell phones, this is a rock and a hard place, and AT&T and Apple are squarely wedged in-between.
In a way, this is actually good publicity, and a testament to the fact that the iPhone is still a hot item even going into year 3. If the iPhone was petering out, few would give a damn about the price.
bbotte
macrumors 65816
That's my point, just make one price for upgrade and new customers, or make it a 1 year contract. Nobody will buy the new Phone for $300or $400? I paid $500 for my first one, not only that I bought 2!
goosnarrggh
macrumors 68000
And if they do that, you can call their customer service and tell them that they didn't live up to the terms they advertised at the time of purchase. If you activate in-store, you can even make sure, with the CSR's help, that the contract wasn't extended before you ever leave the store.
AT&T would not go back on a clearly stated policy they've actually put down on paper and an agreement you've signed your name to, because to do so would leave them open to a false advertising class action lawsuit which, quite frankly, they'd have no chance of winning.
scaredpoet
macrumors 604
Actually it is. AT&T can't and won't put 100% of your phone bill payments towards paying back the subsidy. They have other bills to pay.
It's kinda like taking out a loan on a car. You cannot expect to stop buying food or paying rent and utilities and pour 100% of your income into that car loan. You must budget in all of your costs, and usually means not getting a new car until you've paid off your current one (or taking a sizable financial hit if you do) . Likewise, AT&T has to pay electric bills, backhaul, network costs (existing and expansion), payroll, and get its subsidy back from you. At the same time, they must show profitability or risk their investors cashing out or agitating to replace management with an even more profit-centric group of people (meaning more $$$ from you). This is why they cannot just write off the subsidy in three months or so.
In reality, it actually takes about 18 months to recoup a subsidy if you're at a certain price level. And some of us (myself included) will note that we're eligible for the discounted upgrade pricing in about 18 months, not 24.
bbotte
macrumors 65816
Actually here is a great opportunity to make themselves look better in their customers eyes. We already can't have MMS with the upgrade next week for either phone! They already dropped the ball on that, and Apple made a few jokes about AT&T in the freakin' Keynote. Clearly Apple is frustrated with them also. Why would Apple extend "the contract" they have if it is getting negative feedback because of AT&T? AT&T can turn around and say hey, our bad, our leadership sees how important you customers are to the FUTURE beyond next June. We will honor the price set by Apple and ourselves. This is when a CEO can either kill or help the company.
slippery-pete
macrumors 68020
18 months? Your saying At&t only makes money on customers for the last 6 months of their contract?
There are some(myself included) who are eligible for the subsidised price after a year....so, At&T is losing money on this customer base?
but they are out to make a profit, and by signing a contract you are all but guaranteeing them an income unless you want to risk your own credit rating. why the hell should AT&T give up that income for iphone users and not anyone else? and its not just about getting money back on the phone, its about making profit to pay their staff, upgrade their network... run the company.
all these people complaining remind me of the people that take their car to part ex it for a new one and complain that the dealer will only give them 2/3 of the value if they sold it privately. those people don't seem to have any understanding on how a business works.
scaredpoet
macrumors 604
Either you're purposefully being obtuse, or you completely failed to get the meaning of my post. But that's fine, the point has been made for those who will reasonably listen.
You're either at a price point where AT&T has earned more money off of you than the average customer, or some other factor (manager override at an AT&T store, you paid full price last time, etc.) has intervened. But again, you missed the point of my post (possibly intentionally, but whatever).
slippery-pete
macrumors 68020
I got the point of your post....Just disagreeing that it takes them 18 months to earn the subsidy back. Thats all, nothing more
uberamd
macrumors 68030
I didn't think it was possible for people to get any dumber, then I read this article. Holy crap. This shouldn't even be a discussion. If AT&T is going to slash prices of the iPhone by $200 for those cry-baby idiots who think they are elite customers and don't get how subsidies work, I want AT&T to cut my iPhone by $200, yes AT&T, I want it for free. Why? Because I paid you back all the money I owed you, aka the extra $200, and since they get $200 in savings, I want that too! Anyone see how idiotic that reasoning is.
These 8,000 tweeting illiterate crybabies need to crawl back into the hole they came out of, they aren't done yet.
These 8,000 tweeting illiterate crybabies need to crawl back into the hole they came out of, they aren't done yet.
freediverdude
macrumors 6502a
Like Slippery-Pete was saying, it DOES NOT take 2 years for AT&T to make back the extra money they paid to Apple for your phone. If you're paying a $100/month cell bill, within 6 months to 1 year they've made that money back plus much more. At 12 months, you've already given them $1200 + $199 or $299. I myself have given them $1500 for a phone plus service for the past year. I think they've made some profit 
All you people who are sitting there and calculating out x dollars over 2 years and saying we haven't paid off our phones- that's YOUR OWN calculation, NOT AT&T's calculation. AT&T has made a profit, and everything is negotiable.
If I finished my contract, and continued to pay for 2 MORE years going month-to-month without a contract (which I have done with other phones), would AT&T then say "oh, you've already paid your subsidy for the next phone"? No, of course they wouldn't. The rate plan is the rate plan, regardless of the subsidy. The subsidy part is completely negotiable, and separate from the monthly rate plans.
All you people who are sitting there and calculating out x dollars over 2 years and saying we haven't paid off our phones- that's YOUR OWN calculation, NOT AT&T's calculation. AT&T has made a profit, and everything is negotiable.
If I finished my contract, and continued to pay for 2 MORE years going month-to-month without a contract (which I have done with other phones), would AT&T then say "oh, you've already paid your subsidy for the next phone"? No, of course they wouldn't. The rate plan is the rate plan, regardless of the subsidy. The subsidy part is completely negotiable, and separate from the monthly rate plans.
uberamd
macrumors 68030
Ugh, AT&T is making a profit???? OH NO!!!! Companies aren't allowed to make profits, lets get them!!!!Like Slippery-Pete was saying, it DOES NOT take 2 years for AT&T to make back the extra money they paid to Apple for your phone. If you're paying a $100/month cell bill, within 6 months to 1 year they've made that money back plus much more. At 12 months, you've already given them $1200 + $199 or $299. I myself have given them $1500 for a phone plus service for the past year. I think they've made some profit
All you people who are sitting there and calculating out x dollars over 2 years and saying we haven't paid off our phones- that's YOUR OWN calculation, NOT AT&T's calculation. AT&T has made a profit, and everything is negotiable.
If I finished my contract, and continued to pay for 2 MORE years going month-to-month without a contract (which I have done with other phones), would AT&T then say "oh, you've already paid your subsidy for the next phone"? No, of course they wouldn't. The rate plan is the rate plan, regardless of the subsidy. The subsidy part is completely negotiable, and separate from the monthly rate plans.
If I get a Windows mobile smart phone, say the Moto Q9h, it costs $200 for the new contract price. Same as the iPhone. So, we can subtract $30 for the iPhone data plan since its not an iPhone after all, can't we? And we save $360 a year, ~$1 a day. OH, but wait... you want data after all, so AT&T wants $20/mo for a data plan for the Motorola phone. So you pay how much less for that in comparison to the iPhone a year? $120 less, over the year. Wow... Yet, why is it that I don't see the Moto Q9h community in an uproar because they can't break their contracts, that they signed mind you, and upgrade early?
Pathetic really.
This is ridiculous.
Why do 3G owners think they are special? You signed a 2-year contract. You didn't fulfill it. You knew there would be a new model next year.
AT&T has no obligation to you but to provide the service you signed up for. Period. Original iPhones owners are getting the new prices because we PAID FULL PRICE 2 years ago and didn't get ANY subsidies. Did we bitch about 3G owners paying 1/3-1/2 less when 3G came out?
They do all their customers this way as it is standard industry practice. Cry and moan all you want, but that's how it is. You guys are acting like you've never been on a phone contract before. Somehow you're special and regular phone users are not? AT&T has made no error and are simply doing their standard practice that is standard ACROSS ALL THEIR PHONES. They have NO REASON to respond within 48 hours. Case closed.
Why do 3G owners think they are special? You signed a 2-year contract. You didn't fulfill it. You knew there would be a new model next year.
AT&T has no obligation to you but to provide the service you signed up for. Period. Original iPhones owners are getting the new prices because we PAID FULL PRICE 2 years ago and didn't get ANY subsidies. Did we bitch about 3G owners paying 1/3-1/2 less when 3G came out?
They do all their customers this way as it is standard industry practice. Cry and moan all you want, but that's how it is. You guys are acting like you've never been on a phone contract before. Somehow you're special and regular phone users are not? AT&T has made no error and are simply doing their standard practice that is standard ACROSS ALL THEIR PHONES. They have NO REASON to respond within 48 hours. Case closed.
I've trying to find the right thread in which to whine so this one seems as good as any.
I'm only whining because I really want the new phone but I just can't swing it. Even the subsidizes price is too much for me right now, so at least it's not a hard decision. I know I can sell my 3G on Ebay, and that will help, but..
We have two sides here - first is yes, we singed a contract and that is valid. But we also bought a phone with hardware that simply cannot run some 3.0 features, features that arguable could have and should have been included on the 3G.
Also, the proposed date to upgrade seems to be a year from when the contract started - but I added a line to my plan, a few months after I got my 3g which pushes back that date by that many months. I think my year should at least start from the original date, as it's that one that pertains to this line and this phone.
Done now, thanks for listening.
I'm only whining because I really want the new phone but I just can't swing it. Even the subsidizes price is too much for me right now, so at least it's not a hard decision. I know I can sell my 3G on Ebay, and that will help, but..
We have two sides here - first is yes, we singed a contract and that is valid. But we also bought a phone with hardware that simply cannot run some 3.0 features, features that arguable could have and should have been included on the 3G.
Also, the proposed date to upgrade seems to be a year from when the contract started - but I added a line to my plan, a few months after I got my 3g which pushes back that date by that many months. I think my year should at least start from the original date, as it's that one that pertains to this line and this phone.
Done now, thanks for listening.
Unibody8764
macrumors newbie
they should have some sort of exhchange program for iphone3G owners so they can buy the 3gS at subsidized price.
someone exchanges their good-condition iphone 3G, they can buy the 3gS at 199/299 because att will get their money back from your first subsidy after selling your old iphone 3G off to a new customer.
it'd be great, lets them keep the old version of the iphone at a lower price point every year, and lets old customers upgrade every year.
someone exchanges their good-condition iphone 3G, they can buy the 3gS at 199/299 because att will get their money back from your first subsidy after selling your old iphone 3G off to a new customer.
it'd be great, lets them keep the old version of the iphone at a lower price point every year, and lets old customers upgrade every year.
Past practice (The iphone3g).
When released in 2008, users were able to upgrade without ETF issues and start a new 2 year contract.
anjinha
macrumors 604
And then when Verizon does the exact same thing (and they will, that's how subsidies work for ALL carriers) what will you do?
BINGO!
Such is the way of the world now days. I'll bet these people didn't read the papers they had to sign to start their service. "Sign on the bottom, please." "Okay!"
I think it irritates me more because I research pretty muich all of the techy stuff I buy - computers, TV, phone, video games - and I tend NOT to be a 0day buyer. Meanwhile, someone who was told by their cousin "Bro, you gotta get the iPhone!" "Okay!" and not really know what they are getting themselves into.
gibbz
macrumors 68030
Because the original iPhone was not subsidized.
uberamd
macrumors 68030
These people are having a VERY hard time understanding that aren't they.
They'll whine and hope the iPhone goes to T-Mobile, then when it does, they'll all jump ship. Then when T-Mobile does the same thing with a new iPhone, they'll whine and hope the iPhone goes to Sprint, then when it does, they'll all jump ship. Then when Sprint does the same thing with a new iPhone, they'll whine and jump ship back over to AT&T, and then start the whole thing all over agian. A few may even try their hand at moving out of the country to try Vodafone, Rogers, T-Mobile or O2, only to find out they do the same thing too. Then I guess they're screwed.
So? New and improved BlackBerries, Nokias, Palms and Windows Mobile phones are coming out all of the time with better hardware and features that the old phones aren't capable of, and AT&T isn't ripping up contracts for them either.
Apple made the phone, not AT&T. If you have issues with the 3G hardware and 3.0 features, take it up with Apple, but don't demand that AT&T throws money out the window for you.