10.6 Snow Leopard PowerPC Development

[ediflorianus]

Did you find some solution?

Ok thanks . (I was just trying to figure out a method to not loose my hat on my 4 tb drive ) -ongoing project.
BTW there is a good book with the internals of MAC (but it did not help me that much, maybe I'm just "square" headed).
called : mac_os_x_and_ios_internals To the Apple Core (J. Levin). mac_os_x_snow_leopard_the_missing_manual is also pritty comprehensive & good , but more for users than dev's ( by Dav. Pogue).

 

[srp]

Did you find some solution?

I have not yet but I also haven't dedicated much time to it lately. I'll probably give it another whack this weekend and report back with my results.

Sorbet sucks (no offense whoever developed it!) and is a cheesy gimmick and my biggest problem with it is that it changes the version number for no good reason and breaks all kinds of application version checks (among other issues!)

I'm a little worried that Snow Leopard, at this moment, would be too unstable as a daily driver, and I'm better off on 10.5.8 for now. But you ostensibly are using it as a daily driver, so maybe I have no idea what I'm talking about.

 

[mac57mac57]

Sorbet sucks (no offense whoever developed it!) and is a cheesy gimmick and my biggest problem with it is that it changes the version number for no good reason and breaks all kinds of application version checks (among other issues!)

I'm sorry to hear that you do not particularly like Sorbet, but it is a whole lot more than a "cheesy gimmick". It contains tons and tons of 10.5.8 optimizations which, bottom line, make it faster, and on a 20 year old machine, faster is better - it can make the difference between a bad user experience and a good one.

I have found that the combination of Sorbet and the Aquafox browser allow me to do almost every computing task I need to do on my G5 Quad. Bank sites remain sloooow, but workable, and GMail seems to work, but very slowly as well. So, banking and GMail are the two exceptions to "I can do everything on my G5 Quad" line of reasoning.

 

[barracuda156]

and my biggest problem with it is that it changes the version number for no good reason and breaks all kinds of application version checks (among other issues!)

Well, it managed to achieve downsides of developer builds without gaining much…

I'm a little worried that Snow Leopard, at this moment, would be too unstable as a daily driver, and I'm better off on 10.5.8 for now. But you ostensibly are using it as a daily driver, so maybe I have no idea what I'm talking about.

A5 version is fine. Do not expect it to be flawless, but it is generally better than Leopard, as long as you want to use anything modern. (If only archaic software is used, it may not bring much to the table.)

 

[srp]

I'm sorry to hear that you do not particularly like Sorbet, but it is a whole lot more than a "cheesy gimmick". It contains tons and tons of 10.5.8 optimizations which, bottom line, make it faster, and on a 20 year old machine, faster is better - it can make the difference between a bad user experience and a good one.

I have found that the combination of Sorbet and the Aquafox browser allow me to do almost every computing task I need to do on my G5 Quad. Bank sites remain sloooow, but workable, and GMail seems to work, but very slowly as well. So, banking and GMail are the two exceptions to "I can do everything on my G5 Quad" line of reasoning.

Two things can be true at once. Are there optimizations and improvements in Sorbet vs stock Leopard? Yeah, absolutely. Are those optimizations hamstrung by silly design choices like artificially bumping version numbers? Also yes. This is what I'm referring to when I say "cheesy gimmick".

I see no tangible improvement in overall speed of the system compared to 10.5.8 on my G5 Quad. I don't benefit from the WebKit version bump because we use Aquafox anyway as you stated. Certificates are still way too out of date to be useful. The "app store" looks like a bad April Fool's joke. What I do see are lots of applications and games which refuse to launch on Sorbet. It doesn't make any sense to me why they wouldn't just add a helper script making the 10.5.9 version bump optional, because I'm pretty sure that's the only thing breaking compatibility.

I think a maxxed out Quad is actually one of the worst use-cases for Sorbet. Throw it on an old G4 to make Leopard more usable sure. I guess I just don't get the hype. Good thing it's okay for us to disagree.

As a side note, I was able to get 10.6 booting on my Quad. I ended up formatting the partition and re-attempting the restore from the DMG and it worked fine. Later this weekend I'm planning on setting up Xcode and moving my development environment over.

 

[barracuda156]

As a side note, I was able to get 10.6 booting on my Quad. I ended up formatting the partition and re-attempting the restore from the DMG and it worked fine. Later this weekend I'm planning on setting up Xcode and moving my development environment over.

Not sure whether you followed the matter re Xcode, but a quick summary:
1. Do not use some old mismatching versions (somebody suggested that earlier, I recall – that is wrong). The right version is 3.2.6.
2. Official release will install, but won’t work, since quite a number of components are Intel-only. This also concerns Unix tools which it installs.
3. If you intend to use Xcode on its own, without a package manager, you will need to rebuild from source or at least replace with versions from 10a190 a lot of stuff. Building from source can be partly done with Darwinbuild, but it is still pretty painful and will require a lot of manual work. A lazy solution would be to install 10a190 on a small partition and just pull over needed stuff from there on the go.
4. If you use a package manager, largely broken stuff can be just functionally replaced by ports. I did not even bother with flex and bison on my current system, for example, because ports got newer and better versions which work as drop-ins. You still will require a few basic components initially, otherwise you can’t compile a package manager to begin with.
5. If you use my ports, follow this: https://macos-powerpc.org/installation.html

 

[srp]

Not sure whether you followed the matter re Xcode, but a quick summary:
1. Do not use some old mismatching versions (somebody suggested that earlier, I recall – that is wrong). The right version is 3.2.6.
2. Official release will install, but won’t work, since quite a number of components are Intel-only. This also concerns Unix tools which it installs.
3. If you intend to use Xcode on its own, without a package manager, you will need to rebuild from source or at least replace with versions from 10a190 a lot of stuff. Building from source can be partly done with Darwinbuild, but it is still pretty painful and will require a lot of manual work. A lazy solution would be to install 10a190 on a small partition and just pull over needed stuff from there on the go.
4. If you use a package manager, largely broken stuff can be just functionally replaced by ports. I did not even bother with flex and bison on my current system, for example, because ports got newer and better versions which work as drop-ins. You still will require a few basic components initially, otherwise you can’t compile a package manager to begin with.
5. If you use my ports, follow this: https://macos-powerpc.org/installation.html

Do you have a list of any other known quirks or broken stuff? I had some issues using the 2nd port for Ethernet (have to use the first, second shows up as "AirPort" and gets an IP but doesn't load anything), and I also can't seem to connect to my Samba share (working in Leopard) with the error `mount_smbfs: failed to load the smb library: Too many levels of remote in path`

edit: nevermind I found the known issues list. I think the SMB thing is related to the NTFS issue so I'll patch that kext and try again.

 

[barracuda156]

Do you have a list of any other known quirks or broken stuff? I had some issues using the 2nd port for Ethernet (have to use the first, second shows up as "AirPort" and gets an IP but doesn't load anything), and I also can't seem to connect to my Samba share (working in Leopard) with the error `mount_smbfs: failed to load the smb library: Too many levels of remote in path`

edit: nevermind I found the known issues list. I think the SMB thing is related to the NTFS issue so I'll patch that kext and try again.

AHCI kexts are broken, so some fancy PCIe expansion cards may not work and send PowerMac into KP (my Sonnet Tempo, for example). Solution is to remove those two kexts, they are useless anyway. Perhaps very niche problem, but without a solution.

Local network seems not to work to/from 10.6 via Finder. Maybe it was fixed, I just did not get time to debug this kind of stuff.

With Xcode’s Unix tools I recommend using my pkgs (you can also build the same stuff from source, there are ports for those which produce pkg installers). Open an issue in the repo if something does not work with ports, that will be addressed.

 

[Matias_]

For SMB I've found the far2l port to work, although it's less convenient than being able to use it in Finder.

 

[krrsh]

Hi All!

Can't install cs4 suite on A5. Enter password loop.

 

[barracuda156]

Hi All!

Can't install cs4 suite on A5. Enter password loop.

I think this was reported. CS4 installs fine on 10a190, so it is not about OS version being 10.6. At least a couple of other old proprietary apps cannot install or work correctly.
Someone who worked on A5 may be able to address this. @educovas @ChrisCharman Any ideas?

It may be possible as a one-time hack to install it on 10a190 and manually copy all components (cp -pRP on directories should retain permissions and perhaps ownership). You will need to track whatever CS installs, perhaps in ~/Library, Library/Application Support and package recipes.

Otherwise ask help from folks on hackintosh or OCLP boards, they probably have experience with this stuff. Even better if you know someone who was/is writing cracks for proprietary apps.
Finally, if you are motivated enough and nothing else works, you could try debugger and hex editor. Perhaps you may need to track the function which makes the check which fails and edit it to always succeed in the binary. (I have no idea how complex it may be.)

 

[ChrisCharman]

There are some authentication issues on A5, probably as a result of me not fully removing my privileges correctly. I’ll try and have a look at it after Christmas, but i’m at work right now so can’t investigate. If console logs or error reports could be shared here, that would be useful.

 

[barracuda156]

There are some authentication issues on A5, probably as a result of me not fully removing my privileges correctly

Could that also be a reason why BBEdit/TextWrangler helper tools do not work correctly (cannot act under root privileges, so `bbedit ${somefile}` will not allow to save edits, as long as permissions do not allow non-root access)? This looks like a minor thing, but time wasted on manual `sudo chmod` on every needed file and folder adds up, and I do that a lot when fixing ports.

 

[krrsh]

Can't find anything fun there. But image doesn't disappear in finder after eject button. Only reboot helps.

It may be possible as a one-time hack to install it on 10a190 and manually copy all components (cp -pRP on directories should retain permissions and perhaps ownership). You will need to track whatever CS installs, perhaps in ~/Library, Library/Application Support and package recipes.

After copying apps and Library/Application Support from Sorbet it works.

 

[barracuda156]

Can't find anything fun there. But image doesn't disappear in finder after eject button. Only reboot helps.

Disks get ejected as expected, it is just a glitch in Finder not to reflect that. Restarting Finder helps, if you bother that much about this. No need to reboot, of course.

After copying apps and Library/Application Support from Sorbet it works.

Ok, then it is a trivial issue. Everyone normally will have some second system, whether Leopard or 10a190, and it is advisable to have it just in case anyway.

 

[srp]

Has anyone successfully mounted an SMB/NFS share in Snow Leopard? I either get `too many remotes in path` with SMB (or error -36) for a share that works just fine in Leopard, or `mount_nfs` hanging indefinitely with a known good NFS share.

Edit: I was able to get my NFS share working by specifying the `resvport` option when connecting via command line.

Something like:

sudo mkdir -p /mnt/NFS
sudo mount -t nfs -o vers=3,tcp,resvport SERVER:/share /mnt/NFS

Just in case anyone else is struggling with this issue! Now I can move my install images over from my PC - much easier than re-downloading everything over and over.

 

[CooperBox]

I have not yet but I also haven't dedicated much time to it lately. I'll probably give it another whack this weekend and report back with my results.

Sorbet sucks (no offense whoever developed it!) and is a cheesy gimmick and my biggest problem with it is that it changes the version number for no good reason and breaks all kinds of application version checks (among other issues!)

I'm a little worried that Snow Leopard, at this moment, would be too unstable as a daily driver, and I'm better off on 10.5.8 for now. But you ostensibly are using it as a daily driver, so maybe I have no idea what I'm talking about.

I for one cannot agree that Sorbet (Leopard) "sucks". When installing it just after release in 2021 I was very impressed by the improvement over 10.5.8 Leopard on my G4 Imac, and even more so when the supplementary update 1.5 was issued in 2022. Also have difficulty comprehending the "cheesy gimmick" comment, the fact that Sorbet Leopard appeared as 10.5.9 didn't keep me awake at night, and I guess most other users were not put out over this minor identification change either.
Fwiw, I loved OS Tiger on that g4 iMac (with an SSD), then after upgrading memory to 2Gb performed a clean install of Leopard 10.5.8, which ran well with some handy new features but was notably slower than Tiger. A short time later Sorbet Leopard was installed which frankly transformed that ageing iMac, outperforming both Tiger and Leopard.
Sorbet unstable? Not in my experience and never had problems with any apps I wished to install, and now in 2026 it's still in daily use! Incidently I have no affiliation with the developer so just giving my honest views.

 

[barracuda156]

I for one cannot agree that Sorbet (Leopard) "sucks". When installing it just after release in 2021 I was very impressed by the improvement over 10.5.8 Leopard on my G4 Imac, and even more so when the supplementary update 1.5 was issued in 2022. Also have difficulty comprehending the "cheesy gimmick" comment, the fact that Sorbet Leopard appeared as 10.5.9 didn't keep me awake at night, and I guess most other users were not put out over this minor identification change either.
Fwiw, I loved OS Tiger on that g4 iMac (with an SSD), then after upgrading memory to 2Gb performed a clean install of Leopard 10.5.8, which ran well with some handy new features but was notably slower than Tiger. A short time later Sorbet Leopard was installed which frankly transformed that ageing iMac, outperforming both Tiger and Leopard.
Sorbet unstable? Not in my experience and never had problems with any apps I wished to install, and now in 2026 it's still in daily use! Incidently I have no affiliation with the developer so just giving my honest views.

Given that “Sorbet” is literally just the same 10.5.8 with some tweaks here and there, it cannot possibly perform significantly better (or worse) as such. It may have some effects disabled by default, which will create an impression of GUI being more responsive. Obviously, you can achieve the same outcome on 10.5.8 by changing related settings manually.
I did not investigate deeply into how “Sorbet” managed to introduce breakages it did, and perhaps some of those are local and not really caused by the mod itself, but I can say that it is a questionable idea to modify system plists, for example, for cosmetic purposes (to fake the OS version). Whether it breaks some app for an end user depends on apps being in use.

 

[srp]

I for one cannot agree that Sorbet (Leopard) "sucks". When installing it just after release in 2021 I was very impressed by the improvement over 10.5.8 Leopard on my G4 Imac, and even more so when the supplementary update 1.5 was issued in 2022. Also have difficulty comprehending the "cheesy gimmick" comment, the fact that Sorbet Leopard appeared as 10.5.9 didn't keep me awake at night, and I guess most other users were not put out over this minor identification change either.
Fwiw, I loved OS Tiger on that g4 iMac (with an SSD), then after upgrading memory to 2Gb performed a clean install of Leopard 10.5.8, which ran well with some handy new features but was notably slower than Tiger. A short time later Sorbet Leopard was installed which frankly transformed that ageing iMac, outperforming both Tiger and Leopard.
Sorbet unstable? Not in my experience and never had problems with any apps I wished to install, and now in 2026 it's still in daily use! Incidently I have no affiliation with the developer so just giving my honest views.

I never said Sorbet was unstable - in my testing at least, Sorbet was perfectly stable. I have no issues with the stability of the OS or *most* of the pre-included changes and fixes. My issue is, as barracuda states, that they modify a system plist for a non-optional cosmetic purpose, breaking some applications that I use. The real world impact of a lot of those tweaks and changes is barely noticeable on a mid range G4 and imperceptible on a Quad G5, and you can usually tweak a stock Leopard system yourself quicker than the time it would take to set up a brand new Sorbet environment.

Let's be honest - these are basically placebo numbers on a G5 Quad. Sorbet probably does help overall responsiveness on low-mid end G4 systems or systems limited on memory. It also shoots itself in the foot by making a silly cosmetic change non-optional. If you're a YouTuber or just somebody who spins these machines up every month then you're probably not going to run into any issues - it's when you daily drive and start using the OS for development purposes that the cracks start to show. Glad Sorbet is working well for you though