14-Inch and 16-Inch MacBook Pros: Everything We Know

[hot-gril]

18 USB-C/TB3 devices here. Everything from my mirrorless camera to my tablet and external drives.
0 USB A devices, it has been 4 years. You replaced the cable or replaced the device by this stage.

It is 2021, professional laptops need modern connections.

P.S. Professionals also don't need SD readers, SD cards died and we use CF Express cards. Even when SD was still a thing, you couldn't plug it into the CF, XQD, or CFast slot on your pro camera.

Yes, if you go out of your way to find USB-C devices (more $) or have a job that requires upgrading your camera or whatever periodically so it has USB-C anyway. You even had to buy USB-C to Lightning cables separately until recently.

Like I said, it's not a big deal since USB ports in general are rarely needed on the go (unlike HDMI), just don't see why they couldn't keep one -A port alongside the -C ones, esp in 2016 when -C had just been created and was at ~0% adoption.

 

[dinobear]

SD card slot built in would be AMAZZZZZZING. Probably the thing that would be used by the largest audience. HDMI and other things are nice, but SD slot should be required.

 

[hot-gril]

Literally millions of android phones use usb c all the iPad Pros use usb c every new iPhone comes with usb c cable literally every single new thunderbolt product uses usb c. The level of ignorance your comment is on is ridiculous please keep your comments to yourself from now. Stop trying to keep old usb A alive you and everyone else complaining about an adapter are the reason we still need adapters to support you and your dumb kind not wanting to go with the new superior port.

The reason there are adapters is that USB-A devices were made before USB-C even existed. But you've convinced me to stay with USB-A even longer

 

[Stephen.R]

or have a job that requires upgrading your camera

The vast majority of cameras will just have a micro or mini USB port on them. A new USB-C to micro-USB cable is.. about $8. Or an adapter is $7 for four. You don't need to upgrade your camera just to use a USB-C port.

 

[hot-gril]

The vast majority of cameras will just have a micro or mini USB port on them. A new USB-C to micro-USB cable is.. about $8. Or an adapter is $7 for four. You don't need to upgrade your camera just to use a USB-C port.

I thought the implication was that the camera had a faster data transfer speed because of a USB-C connector on its end. If it's just the same as before, there's no benefit in getting the new laptop for it. In 2016, I froze my entire setup, not buying anything new, and nothing has compelled me to change that until (soon) the 2nd gen ARM Macs.

 

[Mr.PT]

Sounds like you just have terrible dexterity and no muscle memory because that has not once happened to me. And you are not going to tell me that having a row of fixed keys compared to a row that allows for unlimited key options is better. That’s the same as saying that the design of the old phones like the palm treo or a blackberry before the iPhone is better than the design of an all touch screen layout. Steve already proved this concept with the iPhone. Virtual keys supersede fixed keys. The problem is dumb people like you that don’t want to move forward. But yet you love and don’t complain about your iPhone that doesn’t give true tactile feedback and has an entire virtual keyboard. Stop bashing the Touch Bar cuz you can’t seem to figure out how useful it is.

Well, I think problem is deep embedded muscle memory. Personally like and use touchbar a lot: love the flexibility and feel some interactions work better with slider control, like light and sound.
However can’t consider interaction with a laptop and it’s particular needs comparable to a Phone or Tablet, specially considering heavy professional use within specifics apps (maybe a reason why “ full touchscreen” iPad got a keyboard, now even with a touchpad and why we won’t get a touchscreen MBP or iMac.
Though I managed to get my muscle memory “untrained” as to avoid touchbar area while using specific apps, I understand some users can get real bad interaction cause of this. I would be surprised if Apple dumps it, as we see this touchscreen tendency sprawling everyday, even to areas, like car interface, where looking at a touch UI might not be a good idea...

 

[Mr.PT]

That integrated garbage runs at less than half the wattage of any equivalent and can out pace many dedicated graphic cards and it’s the first of its kind. It is by no means garbage. Nobody is even coming close to what Apple has done and if they scaled it like they will it will be more powerful and energy efficient than anything the competitors push out. Nobody is coming close to wattage to power ratio like Apple. You are trying to compare things that need to be plugged into a wall and generate excessive heat that the “garbage” integrated Apple silicon runs circles around and does it with all day battery life there is nothing that compares at the moment pound for pound. Before you go bashing get educated on what you talk about because you just sound stupid.

Problem lies where and how all that mighty power will be used. For fully put to use the new silicon powers, my personal needs are heavily dependent in full Metal adoption by developers in the apps I use (not to mention the ones I would like to use, which today are heavily optimized for the nvidia CUDA cards, but the unwillingness to use Bootcamp prevents me of...)

 

[Stephen.R]

I thought the implication was that the camera had a faster data transfer speed because of a USB-C connector on its end. If it's just the same as before, there's no benefit in getting the new laptop for it. In 2016, I froze my entire setup, not buying anything new, and nothing has compelled me to change that until (soon) the 2nd gen ARM Macs.

USB-c is just a connector it tells you nothing explicitly about the speed of a transfer.

your post suggested to me that you had a post-2015 Mac laptop (and thus tb3/USB-c ports only) and found type-c to type-a adapters a hassle/confusing/expensive.

if you have a camera and a laptop that are both pre USB-c then use them. If you upgrade one or the other or both to a newer device, it’s at most a different USB cable to use them together. It may be faster but that’s more likely to be due to faster memory card format in the camera than the type of USB port it uses (unless your existing camera is pre-usb3!?)

 

[hot-gril]

USB-c is just a connector it tells you nothing explicitly about the speed of a transfer.

your post suggested to me that you had a post-2015 Mac laptop (and thus tb3/USB-c ports only) and found type-c to type-a adapters a hassle/confusing/expensive.

if you have a camera and a laptop that are both pre USB-c then use them. If you upgrade one or the other or both to a newer device, it’s at most a different USB cable to use them together. It may be faster but that’s more likely to be due to faster memory card format in the camera than the type of USB port it uses (unless your existing camera is pre-usb3!?)

Yes, USB-C is only the connector, but a USB-C connector could potentially carry more bandwidth than a micro-USB connector depending on the protocol (or could be the same).

My personal computers are pre-2016, but I have a work laptop that's 2016, so I still have to deal with the dongle world. I've got no big problem adapting between USB-C and A, just would prefer having at least one A port. The only real problem is the HDMI and DP adaptors; they're so finnicky.

 

[hot-gril]

SD card slot built in would be AMAZZZZZZING. Probably the thing that would be used by the largest audience. HDMI and other things are nice, but SD slot should be required.

The only thing I use the SD slot for is to keep a permanent microSD card inside my Mac, using an adapter that sits flush, for extra space. For the actual intended use case of the slot, I don't understand, can't you just connect the camera with USB to your Mac?

 

[jlc1978]

That is wrong. Apparently you did not grasp what Touch UI fixed versus what it didn‘t.
Jobs/Apple fixed the socalled smartphone, with its cramped keyboards due to lack of keyboard real estate.

I'm not so sure they fixed anything relative to typing.

Apple did a lot of really smart things with the iPhone, and I agree getting rid of the physical keyboard was an overall plus; but it didn't improve the typing. The predictive input, for example, is a nice feature, but still requires looking ta the keyboard.

The whole concept of a keyboard OTOH is based on keys that NEVER change, so that you can type on them without looking at them once you learned them.

The Blackberry, with it's small keyboard, was quite easy to type on with two thumbs and once you got used to the layout could type quite fast with minimal glances to the keyboard. The iPhone's, OTOH, lack of tactile feedback makes typing without looking problematic. Graffiti, on the Palm, was a lot faster once you learned it and didn't have to look at the input square.

This is why keyboards are so very effective when writing; still way more effective than anything else known.

Exactly, and why virtual keyboards on any device are not as functional when you want to type and not just enter a few words.

 

[jlc1978]

Professionals also don't need SD readers, SD cards died and we use CF Express cards. Even when SD was still a thing, you couldn't plug it into the CF, XQD, or CFast slot on your pro camera.

Professional photographers maybe; but other professionals can use SD cards or, with a NiftyDrive, microSD as a backup and additional storage location that remains with the Mac and doesn't require a dongle that needs to be removed when putting the Mac in a bag.

 

[jlc1978]

Like I said, it's not a big deal since USB ports in general are rarely needed on the go (unlike HDMI), just don't see why they couldn't keep one -A port alongside the -C ones, esp in 2016 when -C had just been created and was at ~0% adoption.

Depends on your use case. I use USB ports all the time when on the road, but HDMI very rarely and in those cases an adapter works just fine. At any rate, I doubt apple would bring back HDMI since that looks users into one video format at the expense of other ports that can handle different formats with a simple adapter. As much as I would like an SD slot I doubt that comes back; their push to use the cloud would tend to mitigate their interest in adding storage capability.

But as with everything Apple who knows until the device is released.

 

[rafrafdesign]

Wow... Apple listening to its customers?
Yes, if it comes with a normal USB, a Magsafe and an SD card, then I am ordering one ASAP! I have been holding on my Late 2013 Macbook Pro... to a point that I have been looking at buying a Windows laptop this year.
Anyway, this would be awesome news!

 

[ruka.snow]

Professional photographers maybe; but other professionals can use SD cards or, with a NiftyDrive, microSD as a backup and additional storage location that remains with the Mac and doesn't require a dongle that needs to be removed when putting the Mac in a bag.

iCloud Drive, a s3 bucket, or a external SSD will serve better. A SD card is not a backup, it’s a flimsy old format waiting to die on you. If you want a slot on the thing it shoi be CF Express type A(same size as a SD card but reliable and durable) or a type B which is still small but used by more brands.

 

[thekev]

This is a straw man argument, he’s neither saying Apple needs to take a loss or that other companies charge more for less. The 16” pro has a much higher starting price than it did historically, seemingly because they decided to only offer models with dedicated graphics from 2016. As Apple Silicon integrated graphics are much better than Intel integrated graphics, Apple have the option to delete the dGPU on a future Apple Silicon model and pass that saving on to the consumer to reduce the starting price back to what it was previously.

They offered the 15" retina in 2012 for $2200. Before that, the 15" models with TN panels started at $1800-2000 with dedicated graphics. Apple basically charges whatever they feel like on the higher end models. I think it's somewhat decoupled from the cost of construction once you get away from the Their margins on those are probably much higher once you move past the 13" model or add cto upgrades.

 

[Falhófnir]

They offered the 15" retina in 2012 for $2200. Before that, the 15" models with TN panels started at $1800-2000 with dedicated graphics. Apple basically charges whatever they feel like on the higher end models. I think it's somewhat decoupled from the cost of construction once you get away from the Their margins on those are probably much higher once you move past the 13" model or add cto upgrades.

Kind of, pricing seems to more closely follow Apple's consumer-facing logic, not the internal cost of development, bill of materials etc etc. So stuff like an upgrade from 256GB to 512GB costing $200 or 32GB RAM costing $400 over 16GB. I do think, though, the move to dedicated graphics only is why the 15/16" models since 2016 had such a significant base price jump.

The retina model settled back in at $1,999 starting price after 2012, when the Unibody was discontinued and an iGPU only retina model was introduced - though that did represent a permanent uplift of $200 as the Unibody had started at $1,799 as you mentioned. With the 2016 models, basically they only replaced the $2,499 (2015) model with dedicated graphics (giving it a $100 price cut but initially halving the storage to 256GB), while the $1,999 (2015) model was left on sale until 2018 but not replaced.

So now, with Apple Silicon, the opportunity is there to reintroduce that iGPU model/ $1,999 price point even if the model with the Apple GPU (Lifuka) continues like for like at $2,399. Whether or not they choose to do this I guess depends on whether the extra sales end up being worth it. A computer built around a SoC should be much simpler and cheaper to make than one with both an expensive Intel CPU and AMD GPU, even if it is a cutting edge SoC. I'm sure Apple won't sell themselves short, but if they target the 14" to take on the price of the current $1,799 (13") MacBook Pro, a scaled up 16" version at $1,999 seems quite a reasonable proposition.

 

[jlc1978]

iCloud Drive, a s3 bucket, or a external SSD will serve better. A SD card is not a backup, it’s a flimsy old format waiting to die on you. If you want a slot on the thing it shoi be CF Express type A(same size as a SD card but reliable and durable) or a type B which is still small but used by more brands.

You missed my point. None of those solutions can fit flush with the case, allowing you to leave it in even when in a bag. I’ve never had an SD, or CF for that matter, die on me, unlike flash drives. Not saying it can’t but any memory is susceptible to failure. One advantage to SD is the ability to use a small adapter to flush mount a microSD card. CF is a bit expensive as well.

I still do regular cloud and Time Capsule backups but rely on SD for hourly and file change backups.

As for cloud backups, not everyone has internet 24x7.

 

[Googlei]

Waiting for this to be released as I definitely need an upgrade from my Mid-2015 16 Inch Macbook Pro. Woudn't mind the 13inch, but the powerful new M1 Chips of the upcoming models, as well as the lack of touch-bar makes it worth it. No point getting a 16 Inch Intel version at the moment. Still deciding whether I want the 14inch or 16 inch, but that probably depends on job prospects and how the economy recovers after Covid.

 

[MowgliWolf]

I’m probably 18 months or more away from an upgrade. The 2015 dg is still damn good for my needs (music production, DJing, some light isometric RPG games etc) but I have to say, these rumours are rather exciting! I’m going to be watching this space with great interest

 

[Googlei]

Would be great if these rumors are true. I have been holding on to my maxed MBP 2012 15'' Retina waiting for something I could be happy with for another 8 years. Last 3 years I really wanted a reason to buy a new MBP but none of the updates got me excited to buy. I held off when the butterfly keys were an issue, I held off when the touch bar was mandatory, I was disappointed at the lack of ports and lack of mag safe, and the internals never really excited me ether. I really wanted to jump on the M1 MBP but held off due to touch bar. If the new MBPs are without touch bar, have mag safe, and a sd card reader it will have everything I was hoping for!! Finally something worth upgrading to and spending a ton of money on.

My thoughts exactly! Though i'm currently using a mid-2015 model, so not quite as old.

 

[Hoby]

I certainly hope that with all of this other retreating from their high horse about ports and touchbar, they finally add touchscreens to all the laptops. It just works so naturally for so many basic interactions.

Even better if they also add:

• Lidar to the camera, FaceID while they're at it
• Hand tracking to enhance the touchscreen
• Some kind of 2-in-1 action

 

[09872738]

they finally add touchscreens to all the laptops. It just works so naturally for so many basic interactions.

I hope they don‘t. Adds cost plus additional layers for touch, decreasing screen quality in the process, and first and foremost: its absolutely unergonomic on a laptop.
Certainly wouldn‘t want to smear all over my valuable display with my greasy fingers anyway.

 

[dyvog]

It's the same as the day they introduce a new product... only with no shipping delays.

Really? That's interesting. I'd like to get the "last Intel Mac" but am interested in whatever potential price reductions they may apply between now and then. Or, less likely, perhaps an additional upgrades.

 

[MallardDuck]

Really? That's interesting. I'd like to get the "last Intel Mac" but am interested in whatever potential price reductions they may apply between now and then. Or, less likely, perhaps an additional upgrades.

Unfortunately I suspect we've already seen the last intel MBP's. That means if we need intel workloads, it's either stick with aging hardware, or buy a second machine.