1Password Introduces $2.99/Month Plan for Individuals, With 6 Months Free at Sign-Up [Updated]

[bwoodruff]

I think you make some very fair points and good observations, Ken.

At AgileBits we've intentionally avoided pre-announcing software. We don't announce when it is going to ship until it is ready to go out the door (with few exceptions).

Floris: If you really want to understand what it means I'd urge you to take a look at the other links I've provided.

Sorry, that's why I am paranoid.

Do you sew your money in your mattress too?

--
Ben Woodruff
Positive Experience Architect
AgileBits

 

[horsebattery]

"If we were to be compromised, or somehow turn evil, we don't hold anything of value. Your Master Password, which is used to encrypt your data, is never transmitted to us. "

I just read that as "we have every bit of data in the data file, it's just encrypted so people SHOULD NOT be able to get to it, the only thing we do not have is the master key to make that reading easier. What we have is everything YOU value the most precious data - which is why you use our product - but we just call that 'not anything of value'. Fingers crossed huh!"

Sorry, that's why I am paranoid. Your job is to ensure it's properly encrypted, and that others don't have access to it. My job is to use an app that lets me keep my data, where I know it is; Out of the hands of others.

I love 1Password, have been with it the best I can, and recommended it weekly to others. But knowing your data (encrypted or not) is being moved to another server is a hard pill to swallow. In my eyes, if you guys are willing to make that step now with new customers, it is a decision away to tell old customers in the future to succumb to this new model.
[doublepost=1470265860][/doublepost]

At that point I am in the same position as any hacker. I want to take THAT part out of equation.

Unless they are pushing your vaults onto a server somewhere regardless of whether you opt into the web access functionality, that shouldn't be an issue. That's probably a good footnote to add onto their site actually.

 

[Benjamin Frost]

Indeed, and what has helped to offset losses MS has experienced during that time? The "niche" Office 365 of course.

Not really.

Windows and Office were part and parcel. What has changed is that Microsoft has seen Windows revenue plummeting, so has had to divorce Office from it and change to subscription to try and stem the losses. So far, they are still losing money.

 

[bwoodruff]

Unless they are pushing your vaults onto a server somewhere regardless of whether you opt into the web access functionality, that shouldn't be an issue. That's probably a good footnote to add onto their site actually.

When using the 1Password.com subscription services your encrypted data is indeed stored on our servers.

But we do still offer the standalone license model where you can sync your data with iCloud, Dropbox, or with 1Password's WLAN server. Or, even, not at all (though I wouldn't recommend it).

--
Ben Woodruff
Positive Experience Architect
AgileBits

 

[Primejimbo]

how about we pay once for things that don't need to be paid for multiple times.

They offer that still.

 

[bwoodruff]

Not really.

Windows and Office were part and parcel. What has changed is that Microsoft has seen Windows revenue plummeting, so has had to divorce Office from it and change to subscription to try and stem the losses. So far, they are still losing money.

We're a bit off topic here, if not completely off the rails.

Ben

 

[thisisnotmyname]

Good post, though I would question whether SaaS has been a big boon for business at this stage. I think we will see a lot of companies go bust before consolidation of the industry. All software companies are facing a dilemma with the nature of survival. If updates are not compelling enough due to the maturity of software, how does one make people pay for them?

Perhaps I'm too early, but I see a big crisis coming in software and tech generally. Look at hardware: the smartphone is maturing, and even Apple is having to lower prices. They are in no danger of going out of business, and have a very large cushion to protect them from falling prices, but small software companies have no such protection. The first tech bubble burst in 2000; the next one will precipitate the software crisis, I think.

There's been a lot of that already. Companies that were undercapitalized went bust despite their (or because of their) success in bringing on SaaS customers. If you suddenly go from $X per month in new customer perpetual license revenue to $X/36 per month in SaaS there's an enormous trough in cash flow so just keeping the lights on can be downright difficult. It's not that black and white though as there's a transition period for most businesses (i.e. they continue to sell perpetual as they start to market SaaS) and there's still recurring revenue from maintenance contracts or if you have professional services offerings etc... but it wasn't uncommon and even the best positioned still had a period of pain during that transition.

Beyond the move between models it's all about stickiness and that comes from a variety of sources. New features and releases are certainly part of that but inertia is a factor (not insignificant) as is the pain to implement on another platform. Again, my background comes more from the enterprise world where an implementation project (not software, just the work to move from one to another) on an alternate solution would easily be a seven figure investment but there's pain to change for consumers too. Network effects and social platforms such as Facebook are an example of stickiness to consumers. Regardless of costs, change can be difficult.

My humble opinion is that SaaS is the future for any enterprise solution and will make major inroads in consumer software as well (although there will be a cutoff at which the end user apps just can't make the compelling case). We'll shake out a lot of the weaker players as they attempt to switch (or have a hard time starting up with the lower initial figures) but ultimately I think it's a better model for businesses that can make the case.

edit: I'll also add that if you are seeking funding today you better be a SaaS play. The VCs have zero interest in perpetual license software companies. Take if for what you will, the "smart money" - whether you feel they are smart or not - is chasing SaaS.

 

[NonSoft]

Not really.

Windows and Office were part and parcel. What has changed is that Microsoft has seen Windows revenue plummeting, so has had to divorce Office from it and change to subscription to try and stem the losses. So far, they are still losing money.

Aside from the Nokia impairment in 2015, where are the losses exactly?

[doublepost=1470267320][/doublepost]

We're a bit off topic here, if not completely off the rails.

Ben

Well, it's tangentially related in that I guess the contention is that if even MS can't transition to a subscription based service for a staple such as MS office, then how could any company hope to make such a transition?
I would argue that it is possible, and thus far MS has done it quite succesfully (Hence, there is hope for AgileBits).

Again, it's tangential at best...

 

[thewap]

Well my main intellectual property is my money .. I prefer purchasing a "product tool" to use, rather than being constantly reminded that I do not own someone's "intellectual property" (not in the business of violating copyrights).

Design. engineer a tool for me , I'll buy it and use it...or do they really want to force me to "rent" a hammer?
I digress, I'm sure you get the jist of it.

Try to slowly boil a frog..many times the frogs jump out before it gets too hot... call me old fashioned

Recently macscan just went full subscribe and dropped support for their full purchase model - which I bought and paid for / updates as well - now useless. So I dropped my support for their product.

 

[windowpain]

I'm a bit late to this thread, and agree with a lot of posters here..

Anyway, my point is the App Store although it has lowered prices significantly (to the point that many complain about dollar apps) one thing overlooked is the massive increase in new market for app developers.

Gone are the days where you had to go to the company website and download or order a disk. My wife and mother would have never done so, and would have just stuck with the preloaded apps. How many millions of others would have done the same?

There is now a huge market of hundreds of millions of customers who can easily purchase your app with just a thumbprint...is it really harder to make more money now as a developer?
Are sales (and revenues) of things like pixelmator, Ulysses, scanner pro, carbon copy cloner etc really decreasing, now they are on the App Store? (The hosting and billing etc is all done by Apple (at a cost of course, but done nethertheless.)

I know there is much more competition but solid and useful apps should sell enough to be worth the price.

I have used 1password for many years (maybe since version 2) have bought multiple iterations on multiple platforms, and bought it for my family and recommended it to friends. Probably spent over 2 hundred dollars in all...but will be looking for alternatives from now.
(Which I am loath to do so as I really like the apps) but the new subscription model leaves a bad taste in my mouth. As many have stated, subscritions add up.. And although it is 'just' a few dollars here and there it can add up to something not insubstantial.

The increase in stand alone price too is hard to understand, as I never use Windows.
Had they made a Linux version too I may have been interested, but that is a quite an increase in price!

I understand developers have to eat and I would like to see them (especially those who make top notch apps) be rewarded handsomely for their work, but I just hope you are not shooting yourself in the foot here by pissing off your loyal customer base.. It would only take for Apple to improve iCloud Keychain a little for many to jump ship...in truth I would probably be one of them.

 

[bwoodruff]

Well my main intellectual property is my money .. I prefer purchasing a "product tool" to use, rather than being constantly reminded that I do not own someone's "intellectual property" (not in the business of violating copyrights).

Design. engineer a tool for me , I'll buy it and use it...or do they really want to force me to "rent" a hammer?
I digress, I'm sure you get the jist of it.

Try to slowly boil a frog..many times the frogs jump out before it gets too hot... call me old fashioned

I'm a bit late to this thread, and agree with a lot of posters here..

Anyway, my point is the App Store although it has lowered prices significantly (to the point that many complain about dollar apps) one thing overlooked is the massive increase in new market for app developers.

Gone are the days where you had to go to the company website and download or order a disk. My wife and mother would have never done so, and would have just stuck with the preloaded apps. How many millions of others would have done the same?

There is now a huge market of hundreds of millions of customers who can easily purchase your app with just a thumbprint...is it really harder to make more money now as a developer?
Are sales (and revenues) of things like pixelmator, Ulysses, scanner pro, carbon copy cloner etc really decreasing, now they are on the App Store? (The hosting and billing etc is all done by Apple (at a cost of course, but done nethertheless.)

I know there is much more competition but solid and useful apps should sell enough to be worth the price.

I have used 1password for many years (maybe since version 2) have bought multiple iterations on multiple platforms, and bought it for my family and recommended it to friends. Probably spent over 2 hundred dollars in all...but will be looking for alternatives from now.
(Which I am loath to do so as I really like the apps) but the new subscription model leaves a bad taste in my mouth. As many have stated, subscritions add up.. And although it is 'just' a few dollars here and there it can add up to something not insubstantial.

The increase in stand alone price too is hard to understand, as I never use Windows.
Had they made a Linux version too I may have been interested, but that is a quite an increase in price!

I understand developers have to eat and I would like to see them (especially those who make top notch apps) be rewarded handsomely for their work, but I just hope you are not shooting yourself in the foot here by pissing off your loyal customer base.. It would only take for Apple to improve iCloud Keychain a little for many to jump ship...in truth I would probably be one of them.

We do still sell licenses to 1Password as well for those that prefer.

 

[Floris]

I think you make some very fair points and good observations, Ken.

At AgileBits we've intentionally avoided pre-announcing software. We don't announce when it is going to ship until it is ready to go out the door (with few exceptions).

Floris: If you really want to understand what it means I'd urge you to take a look at the other links I've provided.



Do you sew your money in your mattress too?

--
Ben Woodruff
Positive Experience Architect
AgileBits

Not "that" paranoid, but if I could pay everything in cash I think it wouldn't hurt me. It's not like the bank is giving me any interest anymore. Instead, they take the money and invest it to profit from it without sharing that with me. So I see no reason to keep it in my house. But everything's online yeah. Unfortn.

 

[horsebattery]

The increase in stand alone price too is hard to understand, as I never use Windows.
Had they made a Linux version too I may have been interested, but that is a quite an increase in price!

Ironically, the subscription model now actually does provide compatibility with any operating systems with web access (including Linux). Assuming you don't plan on upgrading to newer versions of 1Password (that come at cost), wouldn't you have to pay something insubstantial regardless?

Edit: added "don't"

 

[Floris]

Unless they are pushing your vaults onto a server somewhere regardless of whether you opt into the web access functionality, that shouldn't be an issue. That's probably a good footnote to add onto their site actually.

Without consent they cannot do that. So I should be fine for now, as long as I don't buy a subscription (then no vault-data gets hosted by them)

 

[MillieWales]

.....We do think that for most folks the subscription service will be the way to go (better disaster recovery, access to latest versions of all apps, etc).....

Oh come on, of course you think that, you get a good monthly revenue and can fairly quickly establish a churn rate and forecast future revenue. I don't mind you doing this, but it's not for me, I like to pay once and choose when I pay again. I've used the iOS version of your app on an iPad and iPhone since it launched, and I use it a lot and think it's great, I don't have a desktop or laptop so no need for any other versions.

The app is good, it's fine to offer choice, but I think you are over-selling it in here and justifying it with 'we do think that for most folk...'. I'm sure your accountants would love that pitch, but no need to push it so hard, let people decide, if you are so confident in the model you wouldn't be defending or justifying, you'd let people decide.

I don't like having to pay for an app monthly, other than my basic household bills and insurances, tv and Internet subscription the only other service I pay for monthly is Apple Music. I have Spotify premium but it's free with my mobile contract or I'd cancel it. If services, apps etc were only available on a pay monthly basis I simply wouldn't bother.

You say you won't move totally to this model, if you did I'd be off, as would many others I'm sure. You are free to choose how you sell your app however, just as we are - there are always other apps.

 

[Benjamin Frost]

Aside from the Nokia impairment in 2015, where are the losses exactly?

[doublepost=1470267320][/doublepost]
Well, it's tangentially related in that I guess the contention is that if even MS can't transition to a subscription based service for a staple such as MS office, then how could any company hope to make such a transition?
I would argue that it is possible, and thus far MS has done it quite succesfully (Hence, there is hope for AgileBits).

Again, it's tangential at best...

Look at the fifth row. It's going in the wrong direction.

 

[horsebattery]

Without consent they cannot do that. So I should be fine for now, as long as I don't buy a subscription (then no vault-data gets hosted by them)

Unfortunately their reply suggests that as long as you use their subscription service, they will indeed store that data:

When using the 1Password.com subscription services your encrypted data is indeed stored on our servers.

But we do still offer the standalone license model where you can sync your data with iCloud, Dropbox, or with 1Password's WLAN server. Or, even, not at all (though I wouldn't recommend it).

 

[windowpain]

Assuming you plan on upgrading to newer versions of 1Password (that come at cost), wouldn't you have to pay something insubstantial regardless?

I would yes.
But I also have the choice to continue using the software as is, without upgrading.
(Assuming the features/software continues to work, which is not always the case, not talking about 1password specifically here, but often new OSs are not always supported.)

 

[Floris]

Oh come on, of course you think that, you get a good monthly revenue and can fairly quickly establish a churn rate and forecast future revenue. I don't mind you doing this, but it's not for me, I like to pay once and choose when I pay again. I've used the iOS version of your app on an iPad and iPhone since it launched, and I use it a lot and think it's great, I don't have a desktop or laptop so no need for any other versions.

The app is good, it's fine to offer choice, but I think you are over-selling it in here and justifying it with 'we do think that for most folk...'. I'm sure your accountants would love that pitch, but no need to push it so hard, let people decide, if you are so confident in the model you wouldn't be defending or justifying, you'd let people decide.

I don't like having to pay for an app monthly, other than my basic household bills and insurances, tv and Internet subscription the only other service I pay for monthly is Apple Music. I have Spotify premium but it's free with my mobile contract or I'd cancel it. If services, apps etc were only available on a pay monthly basis I simply wouldn't bother.

You say you won't move totally to this model, if you did I'd be off, as would many others I'm sure. You are free to choose how you sell your app however, just as we are - there are always other apps.

I think a feature "better disaster recovery options" ..
When 1Pass did NOT have that, I considered THAT a feature. If "I" don't have the pass, boom, that's it. PERFECT. It is 'just me' and nobody else. Trusting "5 ways out of here" just means "5 ways into it for others".
[doublepost=1470268611][/doublepost]

Unfortunately their reply suggests that as long as you use their subscription service, they will indeed store that data:

They confirmed it on twitter. (im there as @Floris, some great replies from them too, which is super appreciated - i now understand this whole situation a lot better)

 

[bwoodruff]

Unfortunately their reply suggests that as long as you use their subscription service, they will indeed store that data:

Right, but Floris said "as long as I don't buy a subscription" -- which is correct.

 

[horsebattery]

I would yes.
But I also have the choice to continue using the software as is, without upgrading.
(Assuming the features/software continues to work, which is not always the case, not talking about 1password specifically here, but often new OSs are not always supported.)

From their FAQs section (scroll down), it sounds like you can just let the subscription lapse and continue using most of the features (e.g. the phone apps), but you lose access to certain ones, such as the web access (which is reasonable). My question now is, will the apps actually deactivate (or revert to a limited functionality state) if you let the subscription lapse? Otherwise it seems like you will have a very cheap way to access the app versions perpetually once you make that first subscription payment.

 

[bwoodruff]

From their FAQs section (scroll down), it sounds like you can just let the subscription lapse and continue using most of the features (e.g. the phone apps), but you lose access to certain ones, such as the web access (which is reasonable). My question now is, will the apps actually deactivate (or revert to a limited functionality state) if you let the subscription lapse? Otherwise it seems like you will have a very cheap way to access the app versions perpetually once you make that first subscription payment.

If your subscription lapses your data will become read-only. You won't be able to add any new items or edit existing ones.

https://support.1password.com/frozen-account/

You'll still be able to login and view your items in your client apps or on the web as well, just not make changes (other than reactivating your subscription).

If you were to try a subscription account and decide you'd rather have a license you can copy most* of your items to a local vault w/ the purchase of a license.

* local vaults don't support documents, so you'd need to manually add those as attachments in the local vault.

--
Ben Woodruff
Positive Experience Architect
AgileBits

 

[horsebattery]

If your subscription lapses your data will become read-only. You won't be able to add any new items or edit existing ones.

https://support.1password.com/frozen-account/

You'll still be able to login and view your items in your client apps or on the web as well, just not make changes (other than reactivating your subscription).

If you were to try a subscription account and decide you'd rather have a license you can copy most* of your items to a local vault w/ the purchase of a license.

* local vaults don't support documents, so you'd need to manually add those as attachments in the local vault.

--
Ben Woodruff
Positive Experience Architect
AgileBits

Gotcha, thanks for the quick clarification; probably should've searched some more before asking that. Sounds a lot like the current behavior when a trial expires.

 

[Floris]

From their FAQs section (scroll down), it sounds like you can just let the subscription lapse and continue using most of the features (e.g. the phone apps), but you lose access to certain ones, such as the web access (which is reasonable). My question now is, will the apps actually deactivate (or revert to a limited functionality state) if you let the subscription lapse? Otherwise it seems like you will have a very cheap way to access the app versions perpetually once you make that first subscription payment.

off-topic: I really do appreciate it that you guys are posting on here and twitter, etc. Explaining the situation with more details, while staying calm and being able to actually explain it. Facts and examples etc really help. Thank you for your time. I am sure others feel the same.

 

[jettredmont]

The choice to bundle Mac and Windows together was based on feedback and customer support requests from customers who were confused about what exactly it was that they needed to buy. It was seriously one of our top 3 customer support inflows for many many moons. To many the previous model probably seemed very straight forward, but to many more it did not. So now instead of a totally a la carte offering for the standalone apps we have a single license that covers both desktop platforms. The basic functionality on mobile is free.

--
Ben Woodruff
Positive Experience Architect
AgileBits

Ugh. Example of squeaky wheels steering the ship into an iceberg, if this is accurate. People were really confused about buying a license for Mac software or for Windows software? How do those people function? I can only imagine that being the case if the website was very obtuse, unless a few customer support calls are being trumped up here as justification for a general drastic price increase.

In any case, if people are "confused" about which version they are buying, then maybe make the more expensive bundle the default option, but for the vast majority of us who understand software and do not need the app on both platforms, offer the single-platform version at the lower price. Doesn't seem like a difficult problem to solve. Again, unless you were trying to solve some other problem.

Really, though, I definitely won't be buying the upgrade if it is $65 next time, given this "feature" of a license on a platform I never use by choice as the rationale. I'll limp along with my old version for a cycle or two instead. I would feel much much better about that price increase if you had justified it with features or inflation or your kid needing braces or whatever, but to justify it with "users keep buying the Mac version and trying to install it on Windows!" is disingenuous and destroys credibility.

(I have been using 1Password for many years, and have recommended it to many friends despite its cost. Making it more expensive, passing that mental $50 barrier, is just not going to keep me on board though.)