2009-10 Football Thread – The Second Half

[Lord Blackadder]

Welcome Tombs!

3 points for Liverpool, and Gerrard and Torres are back in scoring form. Torres and Benayoun weren't fully match fit, but they were still effective. I thought Maxi Rodriguez had a good match as well, but we should have held more posession, especially in the second half. Not convincing defending from Liverpool, and we played far too deep in our own half for the last 15 minutes. Mascherano looked OK at right back, if not great. Blackburn were lucky to avoid a couple red cards.

I can see why the penalty was given but I disagree with the call, I feel like Carragher instinctively put his arm down as he fell and then raised it in attempt to avoid the ball. Liverpool are still a very average team, but considering how poor the other 4th place challengers are playing we seem to be doing enough at the moment.

One good point the blog does make regards Fabregas' reaction following the injury, and the clear contrast of the current captain's behaviour to that of then captain Gallas' reaction when Eduardo suffered his injury. I remember commenting at the time that I thought Gallas' sulking was unprofessional and did nothing to help the situation, Fabregas' response was the polar opposite and he deserves credit for it.

I agree, Fabregas is a totally different class of captain from Gallas, who is a decent enough player but not really captain material IMO.

Commiserations to Villa, I was hoping they'd at least get it to penalties as they didn't look like they'd score. Still, they'll be partying all over Surrey tonight

Man United win another trophy, yawn...

I was just reading the Guardian piece about Capello's statement that Terry won't be captaining England as long as Capello runs the show, and had to chuckle at this:

For someone renowned as a strict disciplinarian, Capello seems remarkably laid-back in his attitude to player behaviour, which seems to be spiralling out of control.

People joke about the media hype and theatrics surrounding American sports - and they are often over the top, no doubt about it, but the English have a real obsession with self-destructive media-fueled firestorms...the only way the England team will "spiral out of control" is if everyone starts believing what all the hack journalists say...

..which, as a USA fan, is just fine by me.

 

[daneoni]

Am i the only bored of seeing United win another trophy?...it is seriously getting old now and yet again Utd get another major decision go their way which arguably turned the game in their favour.

...and no i'm not jealous.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

Man United win another trophy, yawn...

I can't complain too much, because I support Liverpool, until recently the record title winners (though they've won nothing since I started watching them...hmmm...). No doubt about it, United win trophies because they are a world-class team.

But yes, it's gotten rather predictable, between United and Chelsea the haul of silverware makes a laughingstock of the rest of the league and is certainly a pretty big reason why the FA Cup and League cup aren't very exciting (and Pompey's win no longer seems to be the pleasing exception to the rule, in light of recent events). Liverpool and Arsenal have been paper tigers for the last four years or so. People make complain about the SPL being an eternal two-horse race, but the Premier League is only marginally better if you look at who is actually winning the league.

If you want to watch leagues where the trophy switches hands more often, try the Championship in England, the MLS (shameless plug), or perhaps now the Bundesliga and Ligue 1. This might lead to an argument of the merits of a playoff system, but I think it really ultimately boils down to spending money, as United's debt demonstrates.

I would argue that some of the proposed price controls UEFA has discussed might help change that, though there's no guarantee.

 

[NathanCH]

I agree about Bundesliga. At some points in the season it's a 5 or 6 team race for the title. If you look at the history, you will see Bayern Munich has won a lot, but usually it's very close. In the premier league it's usually a 2 team race by the end... one of which is Manchester United.

Also the MLS is pretty balanced and will only get more competitive as more good teams are introduced (Go Vancouver!). I just wish the stadiums and support was there... but clearly teams like Seattle and Toronto show some cities love it. Portland and Vancouver in 2011 will also be hugely supported teams.

 

[XIII]

From there – in addition to what we're discussing here – this caught my eye...

This I disagree with, and that's the main reason why I posted a link to the image earlier rather than putting it into my post. As others have said here, it's deeply unpleasant to see.

While some Arsenal fans may feel that broadcasters not reshowing the injury is due to some bias against their club or something, I'm sure many more would be condemning them if they reshowed it over and over in slow motion, from different angles et al, accusing them of sensationalising the incident and ghoulishly relishing the injury to an Arsenal player. It's one of those situations where they're damned if they do and damned if they don't, and while Sky can be criticised for many things (such as giving airtime to Andy Gray and Paul Merson's 'expert' opinions, for starters) I think this instance the criticism is misplaced.

One good point the blog does make regards Fabregas' reaction following the injury, and the clear contrast of the current captain's behaviour to that of then captain Gallas' reaction when Eduardo suffered his injury. I remember commenting at the time that I thought Gallas' sulking was unprofessional and did nothing to help the situation, Fabregas' response was the polar opposite and he deserves credit for it.

Oh, and hello Tombs.

Yeah I'm not sure about the showing the incident point.. I don't really have a problem with them not replaying it over and over. That's not really the key idea in the blog though - it's more what the media has said that has lead to this incident.

Fabregas was brilliant yesterday. What more do you want from your captain: 2 assists and 1 goal. He, and the rest of the team, fought hard, and it made me very proud.

Today the big shame was Vidic not being sent off, obviously. Would've been a good match if that had happened, United would've had to really fight.. but as it is, a referee has done his very best to decide a game again. Great.

 

[pknz]

Does anyone actually like Sam Allardyce? (or Diouf for that matter?)

 

[Jaffa Cake]

Does anyone actually like Sam Allardyce?

Phil Brown.

Beyond that, I'm struggling.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

Rooney may be out for the Egypt friendly...Babby Zamora for England? I'm chuckling while I say that....

Meanwhile the US have a tough friendly against the Netherlands on Wednesday. Bob Bradley is naming a strong squad, and I imagine it's a match Fabio Capello will be taking notes on.

 

[capoeirista]

Does anyone actually like Sam Allardyce? (or Diouf for that matter?)

Hmm, Sam Allardyce's mum?

As for Diouf, Pele must be a fan, don't forget he included Diouf in his 100 greatest living footballers book (which actually contained 125 footballers), made to celebrate the 100 anniversary of FIFA. It is a hilarious list which can be found here, and has so many odd inclusions or exclusions it's untrue... Almost as if it was really a publicity exercise for S. Blatter.... scratches chin

 

[oscillatewildly]

Fine day -

League Cup - good performances from Park and Berbatov, though you wouldn't know it from the papers or the MOTM award. Surprised Vidic didn't get a yellow re the penalty.

+

Canada win the Ice Hockey - if only Platini could get his hands on the game.

Allardyce - Ferguson likes him if it winds up Benitez.

Ramsey - was his leg broken before the Shawcross contact?

Cheers,
OW

 

[Silencio]

If you want to watch leagues where the trophy switches hands more often, try the Championship in England, the MLS (shameless plug), or perhaps now the Bundesliga and Ligue 1. This might lead to an argument of the merits of a playoff system, but I think it really ultimately boils down to spending money, as United's debt demonstrates.

I think Ligue 1 will prove to be a poor example of your point. In recent times, Lyon and Marseilles were the dominant powers in French football, but it looks like Bordeaux is becoming the clear top team under Laurent Blanc. I would love to see him replace Sir Alex when the time comes -- maybe in three or four years or something. I've been very impressed with the football Bordeaux plays. They'll dominate Ligue 1 until Blanc decides to move on.

United's debt didn't come from player salaries: it came from the financing the Glazers arranged to take over the club. If not for some over-imaginative American accountants, United would still be a profitable and likely debt-free venture (gee, this sounds like all the rest of the news on the financial page over the past 18 months!).

It will be fascinating to see if the rumored joint protests by disaffected United and Liverpool fans take place when the two teams meet up again at Old Trafford soon. It takes something pretty special to unite the Mancs and the Scousers!

 

[OllyW]

Does anyone actually like Sam Allardyce? (or Diouf for that matter?)

He's a local lad who's done alright for himself so I've got a bit of respect him for that (and he's a Wolves fan too ).

He is Dudley's second most famous footballer after all.

 

[XIII]

Does anyone actually like Sam Allardyce?

No.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

I think Ligue 1 will prove to be a poor example of your point. In recent times, Lyon and Marseilles were the dominant powers in French football, but it looks like Bordeaux is becoming the clear top team under Laurent Blanc. I would love to see him replace Sir Alex when the time comes -- maybe in three or four years or something. I've been very impressed with the football Bordeaux plays. They'll dominate Ligue 1 until Blanc decides to move on.

I mentioned Ligue 1 particularly because last season was an incredibly close and exciting finish and Lyon didn't win for once. But yes, up to that point it was the most predictable top league in Europe. Also, besides Bordeaux, we have newly promoted Montpellier in second place. That would be like Birmingham in second place in the Prem!

United's debt didn't come from player salaries: it came from the financing the Glazers arranged to take over the club. If not for some over-imaginative American accountants, United would still be a profitable and likely debt-free venture (gee, this sounds like all the rest of the news on the financial page over the past 18 months!).

Worryingly, I've seen a lot of disgruntled fans focusing on the fact that the Liverpool and United are owned by Americans. If people just blame Johnny Foreigner for their problems nothing's ever going to get solved, especially when you hear few Man City or Chelski fans complaining about foreign ownership these days. The owners deserve blame for their risky, irresponsible or unscrupulous business practices, regardless of nationality.

It will be fascinating to see if the rumored joint protests by disaffected United and Liverpool fans take place when the two teams meet up again at Old Trafford soon. It takes something pretty special to unite the Mancs and the Scousers!

Xenophobia appears to be special enough. I expect a wide selection of variations on the "Yanks out" theme.

 

[OllyW]

Worryingly, I've seen a lot of disgruntled fans focusing on the fact that the Liverpool and United are owned by Americans. If people just blame Johnny Foreigner for their problems nothing's ever going to get solved, especially when you hear few Man City or Chelski fans complaining about foreign ownership these days. The owners deserve blame for their risky, irresponsible or unscrupulous business practices, regardless of nationality.



Xenophobia appears to be special enough. I expect a wide selection of variations on the "Yanks out" theme.

You don't hear any complaints from the Villa fans.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

You don't hear any complaints from the Villa fans.

They aren't in trouble....but you're absolutely right. Randy Lerner has so far provided an example of successful ownership. (He's also turning the Cleveland Browns around back here in the NFL, which, if he succeeds, will be a miracle...but that's for another thread).

I don't want to broad-brush the English football fan as anti-foreign (most people hate Ken Bates too ), but there is a tend by the media to sensationalize the "Yanks out" aspect of the protests and it sends the wrong message. I know most fans are simply upset with the greed or risky business practices on the part of the owners.

 

[Jaffa Cake]

Let's for a moment move away from discussing highly unpopular football folk that nobody can stand, and talk instead about Neil Warnock.

It looks like QPR have agreed compensation with Crystal Palace for Colin Wanker to move to Loftus Road – and in doing so becoming their fifth manager of the season. Blimey.

Manager and club are well suited towards one another, me thinks.

 

[OllyW]

Let's for a moment move away from discussing highly unpopular football folk that nobody can stand, and talk instead about Neil Warnock.

It looks like QPR have agreed compensation with Crystal Palace for Colin Wanker to move to Loftus Road – and in doing so becoming their fifth manager of the season. Blimey.

Manager and club are well suited towards one another, me thinks.

I like the way he praised a couple of his Palace players for their loyalty in sticking with the club when the receiver wanted to offload them during the transfer window.

He then pisses off to the first club to approach him.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

Let's for a moment move away from discussing highly unpopular football folk that nobody can stand, and talk instead about Neil Warnock.

A very Ramble-esque link there sir.

I am glad that Colin exists, for the simple fact that his name has the most amusing anagram ever. You just gotta love that.

 

[Queso]

Awful this. Those of you who only follow the top flight might not know the name, but Keith Alexander, manager of Macclesfield Town, died last night. Keith was heavily involved with a number of the lower league clubs over his career including Bury, Peterborough, and Lincoln. Really sad

 

[Jaffa Cake]

I'd just come here to mention this myself, Queso – very sad news indeed. I remember him chiefly from his time at Lincoln City, as our local sports news also covers that area and the Imps had a number of play-off campaigns during his tenure. He's also notable for being one of the relatively few black managers in the English game.

He'd had problems with serious illness before of course, and 53 is no age to go.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

Very young, that's terrible news.

 

[leomac08]

USA vs Netherlands...........2-1

Not the type of game I would have liked.

It was two good teams....

but a penalty and a deflection... ruined it for me.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

A lot of USA fans are making a bunch of criticisms on the internet, but the fact of the matter is we were playing the world number 3 team, and while we were fairly beaten we did not make it easy for them, and could very well have drawn that game or, with a little luck even won it.

It's also worth mentioning that we were missing a starting center back, several starting midfielders, and a starting striker.

I'm really upset to hear Stuart Holden has a broken leg. Thanks a lot, Nigel De Jong. Six weeks, aargh.

As for the match, the key points were the huge mistake by Bornstein to give up a totally unnecessary penalty, and a very quiet performance from Donovan. Robbie Findley was outclassed against this level of opposition, he failed to hold up the ball, beat opponents one on one or test the keeper. All he did was run down blind alleys. Apart from Bornstein I thought we defended very well against a top side. The pressure we exerted near the end of the match could have been decisive had we been able to do it earlier. We lost, but we didn't disgrace ourselves. I'm still grumbling though, USA can be better than that.

Altidore looked very good, I love when he nutmegged the Dutch right back and went around him. He looks to be improving, so I should thank Phil Brown and Jaffa. Some people criticized his performance but I don't know what they are complaining about - had Dempsey been up there with him and Donavan involved more we would have given the Dutch a huge scare.

As a final note, Charlie Davies has returned to Sochaux and will probably play again for his club before the World Cup starts. There remains a slim possibility that he'll be available for selection in June. I just want to see him back on the pitch after that near-fatal car accident. Our striking options are thin, and apart from Altidore he's probably the best striker we have (on paper).

 

[leomac08]

A lot of USA fans are making a bunch of criticisms on the internet, but the fact of the matter is we were playing the world number 3 team, and while we were fairly beaten we did not make it easy for them, and could very well have drawn that game or, with a little luck even won it.

Agreed...... Similar thing happend when we played Spain after their Euro 2008 win I think we lost 2-1.

USA is not very good against European Teams. Makes me wonder if the other 2 other teams besides England in the world cup will give USA a run for their money.

I also noticed Oguchi Onyewu wasn't playing. Must be his injury. But he should be back.

and I hope for a speedy recovery of Charlie Davies as well

The USA has the potential but it's not being developed and that is what gets a majority of fans upset.