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2009 Formula One Thread

Fizzoid said:
Briatore & Symonds affected the outcome of 1 race, Spygate may have affected an entire season.
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This is not even on the same scale as the McLaren/Ferrari spying issue, it is much, much worse. Spying doesn't endanger the life of drivers, track personnel and the general public. It is utterly beyond the pale to tell one of your drivers to crash a car deliberately.
 
Fizzoid said:
Thing is, Renault have a much bigger involvement in motorsport than just F1.
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Yup. If Renault walked completely, GP2 needs to find a new engine supplier for the 2010 season.

They also sponsor and supply a number of development series around the world, including Formula Renault and the World Series by Renault, that would need to find new suppliers and sponsors.

Plus the hardship imposed on the remaining engine manufacturers in F1 to supply engines to teams already contracted with Renault for 2010.
 
Piquet Sr. Told FIA Of Crash Claims Last Year

Piquet Sr. told FIA Race Director and his former Brabham chief mechanic Charlie Whiting of the race fixing allegations at the Brazilian GP, while at the same time expressing doubts about whether the story would hurt his son’s career. Whiting apparently later told Max Mosley. However no FIA investigation was launched at that time.

Piquet Jr was confirmed as Renault driver for 2009 on Wednesday November 5, three days after the Brazilian race.
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Flavio Briatore banned for life and a 5 year ban for Pat Symonds. The FIA must have accepted that Renault knew nothing about it and the blame lies solely with those two.
 
OllyW said:
Flavio Briatore banned for life and a 5 year ban for Pat Symonds. The FIA must have accepted that Renault knew nothing about it and the blame lies solely with those two.
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Blimey!

So, as far as I understand it, this could have repercussions for QPR?
I have no idea about football...
 
So Renault deliberately crash a car with all the potential dangers to other drivers, spectators & stewards and probably change the outcome of the 2008 drivers championship & get a slap on the wrist.

Mclaren have some photocopied blueprints in their possession and get fined £50 million

that seems fair doesn't it?
 
OllyW said:
To run a top league football club you must pass a fit and proper test.
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I can't be arsed to read all that!

I read that if you're banned by one sport's governing body it could effect other sports you're professionally involved in...

EDIT: Looks like Alonso will be ok for his seat with Ferrari then...
 
DAC47 said:
So Renault deliberately crash a car with all the potential dangers to other drivers, spectators & stewards and probably change the outcome of the 2008 drivers championship & get a slap on the wrist.

Mclaren have some photocopied blueprints in their possession and get fined £50 million

that seems fair doesn't it?
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Whilst I agree that it seems very different McLaren did not acknowledge guilt and, in fact, lied to the FIA at the original hearing. So they were punished for that more than the offense. Renault held their hands up, admitted it and did not lie at a FIA hearing (which the FIA pretend is a court of law)...
 
robbieduncan said:
Whilst I agree that it seems very different McLaren did not acknowledge guilt and, in fact, lied to the FIA at the original hearing. So they were punished for that more than the offense. Renault held their hands up, admitted it and did not lie at a FIA hearing (which the FIA pretend is a court of law)...
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I still think the Mclaren fine was completely disproportionate for what they actually did
 
Vogue Harper said:
This is not even on the same scale as the McLaren/Ferrari spying issue, it is much, much worse. Spying doesn't endanger the life of drivers, track personnel and the general public. It is utterly beyond the pale to tell one of your drivers to crash a car deliberately.
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2 years suspended ban means the FIA think otherwise :rolleyes:
 
I think Renault as we know them now are finished. They may come back next year but once the ban starts they will dissolve as a team. Someone will buy their assets and continue racing with some of the same people in all likelihood though. I'm sure they'll lose Alonso.

And if this does not cause Briatore to fail the FA's fit and proper test, I don't know what would? I mean, he's just been banned indefinitely from a sport for cheating, how much less fit and proper could you be? Back luck QPR....:(
 
Lord Blackadder said:
And if this does not cause Briatore to fail the FA's fit and proper test, I don't know what would? I mean, he's just been banned indefinitely from a sport for cheating, how much less fit and proper could you be? Back luck QPR....:(
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Thing is, why indefinitely, when Symonds got 5 years? He could be back next season
 
OllyW said:
The ban is suspended for two years, so as long as they keep their noses clean during that time they don't have to serve any penalties. :confused:
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It's like killing someone and being told "You'll get the death sentence if you do it again".
 
DAC47 said:
I still think the Mclaren fine was completely disproportionate for what they actually did
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in terms of actual "cheating" per se, what macca did was much worse, as it was actual cheating, also it was a teamwide conspiracy.
What RenaultF1 did was more severe morally and in term of (potential) consequences, but as far as the actual cheating is concerned, it was more like finding loopholes and pushing the envelope (and clearly they pushed too far). It was in the mold of a lapped Coulthard taking out Schumacher in '98 to give Heikkinen the championship.

in my opinion, both Renault and McLaren got away with a slap on the wrist (the 100 M was mostly adsorbed by the WCC money which they still got to keep and actually worked well for them for its perceived severity: i turned them into victims in the eyes of their fans and that allowed for maintenance of image and sponsors. and in anyway it obviously had zero effect on their competitivity the following year)

the fact that Piquet got away untouched is ridiculous. He is the main responsible in this sad affair. Also it is unclear to my why Symmonds gets 5 yrs and Briatore a life ban. If anything, Symmonds involvement was much more clear than Briatore's (that said, i'm definitively not sorry to see FB go for good).
It seems this was used by Max to settle old scores.
 
Lord Blackadder said:
I think Renault as we know them now are finished. They may come back next year but once the ban starts they will dissolve as a team. Someone will buy their assets and continue racing with some of the same people in all likelihood though. I'm sure they'll lose Alonso.
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NO, I think Renault came away relatively unscathed. If they behave between now and the end of 2011 they end up free and clear.

Flav and Symonds took the fall. Piquet Jr's career in F1 is likely ended as well. No doubt he could go to NASCAR where they depend on orchestrated crashes to maintain interest.
 
OllyW said:
The ban is suspended for two years, so as long as they keep their noses clean during that time they don't have to serve any penalties. :confused:
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Ah, forget what I said then. This "punishment" is a joke. :mad:

The crucial thing to remember with respect to top-level sport is that they are big businesses with big money at stake - so when rules get in the way we find out just how flexible the rules really are...
 
RaceTripper said:
NO, I think Renault came away relatively unscathed. If they behave between now and the end of 2011 they end up free and clear.

Flav and Symonds took the fall. Piquet Jr's career in F1 is likely ended as well. No doubt he could go to NASCAR where they depend on orchestrated crashes to maintain interest.
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also the additional 'infraction' need to be of the same kind to trigger the penalty, so as long as any of their pilot do not crash voluntarily in the next two years there is no penalty.

they do get some sort of fine, though: in addition to pay for legal costs (which i can't imagine being that much) they also agreed to make a significant monetary 'donation' to the FIA, for safety promotion and such.
 
Has anyone mentioned this bit yet?
FIA revealed that it will not renew the superlicence of any driver associated with Briatore 'or any entity or individual associated with him'. Fernando Alonso, Mark Webber and Heikki Kovalainen are amongst the drivers currently managed by the Italian
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Sounds a touch unfair...
 
Would the same "punishment" have been meted out to a smaller, privateer team with less resources and less financial/political clout?

Or, to take a phrase from the US news media during the recent recession, are Renault too big to be allowed to fail?

bartleby said:
Sounds a touch unfair...
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I tend to agree, but if Flav is going to be totally banned from participating in the sport, they can hardly allow him to manage drivers, can they?
 
Lord Blackadder said:
I tend to agree, but if Flav is going to be totally banned from participating in the sport, they can hardly allow him to manage drivers, can they?
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I guess that's why their current license is still valid. It'll give them time to find a new manager before they need their new licenses...
 
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