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2009 Formula One Thread
- Thread starter R.Youden
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Well the point is to get Flavio out of Formula One, so forcing him to lose his F1 driver management contracts sounds reasonable - at least from that angle. I'd be surprised if Bernie extends him Grid Access credentials.
A two-year suspended ban gives Renault time to decide whether or not they want to stay in F1 and if they choose not to, allows them to sell the team to another buyer. And yes, I am sure that was why the decision was taken. With BMW and Honda out and Toyota wavering, the FIA and FOTA need every manufacturer they can to stay or, if they go, that the team transitions to new and stable ownership and remains part of the Championship. Having 26 cars next year as opposed to 20 could "spice things up" and help circuits with their ticket sales and keeping them in the Championship.
A two-year suspended ban gives Renault time to decide whether or not they want to stay in F1 and if they choose not to, allows them to sell the team to another buyer. And yes, I am sure that was why the decision was taken. With BMW and Honda out and Toyota wavering, the FIA and FOTA need every manufacturer they can to stay or, if they go, that the team transitions to new and stable ownership and remains part of the Championship. Having 26 cars next year as opposed to 20 could "spice things up" and help circuits with their ticket sales and keeping them in the Championship.
Bernie can't help Flav with that anyway. Part of the ban is that FIA officials are instructed to deny Flav any access. I wonder if he can even get in a race with a general ticket like we buy in the real world.
WMSC said:
but can they legally cut loose if Briatore doesn't let them? and doesn't he own a GP2 team as well?
I imagine they'd be able to buy their way out. Maybe Ferrari will pay off Alonso's contract...
There's going to be 26 cars on the grid next season.
A man can dream, can't he? Seriously, thanks for catching that.
As Briatore can no longer legally represent them in Formula One, I expect he's de facto in breach of contract and that should allow the drivers to unilaterally break their contracts with him without penalty.
I am sure he could, as the FIA doesn't regulate individual ticket sales, to my knowledge. He just could not get past the "Access Controlled Areas" (those pillars that one swipes their pass).
I have not posted on the F1 thread for AGES, ah well I suppose I need to step in here.
Firstly, with regard to Renault situation, the FIA could not win. If they threw out Renault then they would have lost a blue chip manufacturer and limit investment from other big companies. It is bad enough Honda and BMW have pulled the plug, the last thing they wanted was to loose Renault too.
Think of it from a marketing point of view, if you are a sponsor do you want to be associated with Renault or, no disrespect, Manor GP? People all over the world know of Renault and they need to be in there.
Also well done to Rubens, a fantastic guy who will talk to anyone, in a way I want him to beat Jenson but I just don't think he will.
And, sorry Spook, but can someone shut Christian Horner to shut up. He is turning into Nick Fry. At least the boss of Red Bull (I won't try and spell his name!) spoke the truth when he said that Red Bull lost a chance of the title weeks ago.
Firstly, with regard to Renault situation, the FIA could not win. If they threw out Renault then they would have lost a blue chip manufacturer and limit investment from other big companies. It is bad enough Honda and BMW have pulled the plug, the last thing they wanted was to loose Renault too.
Think of it from a marketing point of view, if you are a sponsor do you want to be associated with Renault or, no disrespect, Manor GP? People all over the world know of Renault and they need to be in there.
Also well done to Rubens, a fantastic guy who will talk to anyone, in a way I want him to beat Jenson but I just don't think he will.
And, sorry Spook, but can someone shut Christian Horner to shut up. He is turning into Nick Fry. At least the boss of Red Bull (I won't try and spell his name!) spoke the truth when he said that Red Bull lost a chance of the title weeks ago.
Just to expand on the Flav-QPR angle, from the BBC:
So it sounds like being banned by any sport's governing body would cause Briatore to fail the fit and proper test.
The BBC said:
So it sounds like being banned by any sport's governing body would cause Briatore to fail the fit and proper test.
QPR are a bunch of dirty, time-wasting, match spoiling, injury feigning, new right-back injuring, mascot plagiarising, glove wearing cheats. The nefarious and naughty Briatore is clearly a good fit for them.
You know, you really should do something about that inability to express your feelings.
Sorry to highjack a little, but, Jaffa, are they worse than "dirty, dirty Leeds"?
I am interested to see where Renault goes with this...clearly the lightness of the "punishment" was to keep them around - have they given assurances to that effect to the FIA?
I am interested to see where Renault goes with this...clearly the lightness of the "punishment" was to keep them around - have they given assurances to that effect to the FIA?
They signed the Concorde Agreement. That commits them to F1 until 2012.Sorry to highjack a little, but, Jaffa, are they worse than "dirty, dirty Leeds"?
I am interested to see where Renault goes with this...clearly the lightness of the "punishment" was to keep them around - have they given assurances to that effect to the FIA?
So did Honda....
The Concorde Agreement means very little with regard to who competes in Formula One, it is just a way for the management and Bernie to get some agreement over how the sport is run.
I think they're on a level footing.Sorry to highjack a little, but, Jaffa, are they worse than "dirty, dirty Leeds"?
Seriously though, Briatore's ban from Formula One will certainly impact on his role at QPR. Being banned by the governing body of another sport will mean he doesn't pass the 'fit and proper person test' required by owners and directors of football clubs, and given the fact that his F1 ban revolves around his efforts to fix the result of a race I think the FA will take a very dim view of his suitability to continue at Loftus Road. Football has had match fixing scandals in the past and the authorities will want to avoid any connection to such behaviour. After all, if Briatore is happy to fix a race for his own ends what's to say he wouldn't try to do the same with a football match? Fixing a football result is arguably much trickier (there are more people involved, and in F1 you have two drivers so one can engineer a situation to benefit another) but it's by no means impossible.
As such, he may need to sell his stake. His co-owners are Bernie Ecclestone and some steel dude, so he may simply sell his share to one or both of them.
Anyway, the League are looking into it. Naughty Flavio.
i suppose you are right, but still a hefty fine would have been warranted.
For example they could have ducked them constructor championship points from last year and the associated millions, to put it in line with the macca punishment.
still, what is really ridiculous is that piquet got full immunity. after all is said and done, he is the main culprit in this.
in my opinion the punishment have been inversely proportional to the responsability, obviously a political decision.
order of responsability:
1. Renault (team manager, director of engineering and driver all directly involved, it doesn't get higher than that).
penalty: none (other than legal expenses and an undisclosed 'donation' to the FIA, very limited brand damage).
2. Piquetinho (he 'did it'. of his own will, putting himself and other people in danger, might have even come up first with the idea and was fine with it for a year, tried to blackmail team).
penalty: none (hopefully end of his career).
3. Symonds (likely devised the plan, at least all the technical details).
penalty: 5 year ban
4. briatore (sleazy character, likely floated the idea, almost certainly went along with it -but no real evidence at all of his direct involvement-)
penalty: life ban
People seem to be confused by this. It's not a ban for life, it's an indefinite ban, 2 very different things. Although unlikely, he could actually be back in motorsport next season if the FIA decided on it.
Actually Fizzoid, the more I think about it the more it sounds like an "indefinite" ban has been chosen precisely because they intend to let Flav back in at some point...
And yet his motorsports career, at least at a "serious" level, is dead and buried because of his actions not only on the circuit at Singapore 2008, but his conduct since then.
His father's name is also tainted, IMO. He knew about it from shortly after it happened and while he did take it to the FIA then and there, he remained quiet on it afterwards - until his son's career was in jeopardy at which point he acquiesced to blackmail, as well.
Indeed, my point exactly. Gut feeling says a couple of years tops, although maybe that's just the cynic in me
i think you're reaching here. i don't think it is being confused nor it is ambiguous.
that is exactly what it means, a life ban. it's the most severe penalty in the book, and it has been depicted in this way in every official statement.
the fact that it could be changed/commuted/reduced doesn't change that.
If they do, it will look for what it is: a reduction of the punishment. And of course they could still do the same if it was a 5 years or a 10 years ban.
i guess my point is that they have
anyways, it will be interesting to see what Mr. Briatore decides to do and if he will take down Bernie with him. I am sure he is privvy to a lot of interesting information on the shady dealings in f1 in the last few years.
I'll get the popcorns.
The FIA published their 2010 calendar today. 19 rounds, which I believe either is a record or ties a recent record.
Montreal returns (pending an agreement reached with Bernie) and South Korea is the latest new Championship round.
2010 FIA Formula One World Championship calendar
14 March - Bahrain
28 March - Australia
4 April - Malaysia
18 April - China
9 May - Spain
23 May - Monaco
30 May - Turkey
13 June - Canada*
27 June - Europe (Valencia)
11 July - Great Britain
25 July - Germany
1 August - Hungary
29 August - Belgium
12 September - Italy
26 September - Singapore
3 October - Japan
17 October - Korea
31 October - Abu Dhabi
14 November - Brazil
*Subject to the completion of contract negotiations with Formula One Management. If these are not completed then the Turkish Grand Prix will be moved to 6 June.
Montreal returns (pending an agreement reached with Bernie) and South Korea is the latest new Championship round.
2010 FIA Formula One World Championship calendar
14 March - Bahrain
28 March - Australia
4 April - Malaysia
18 April - China
9 May - Spain
23 May - Monaco
30 May - Turkey
13 June - Canada*
27 June - Europe (Valencia)
11 July - Great Britain
25 July - Germany
1 August - Hungary
29 August - Belgium
12 September - Italy
26 September - Singapore
3 October - Japan
17 October - Korea
31 October - Abu Dhabi
14 November - Brazil
*Subject to the completion of contract negotiations with Formula One Management. If these are not completed then the Turkish Grand Prix will be moved to 6 June.
To the extent it wasn't already tainted before this whole episode. Nelson Piquet Sr has always been one of those marginalised characters in Formula 1. I watched him race in the late 80s early 90s and while he was good and all that, I never really liked him. He always came across as a bit of an arrogant idiot to me. I remember his punch up with Eliseo Salazar well and later in his career he was fairly uncomplimentary about some of his fellow drivers in the press. Certainly for a triple F1 world champion he is rarely (if ever) spoken with the same revered tones as Fangio, Clark, Prost, Senna or Schumacher.
As far as the whole Renault saga is concerned, taking a different angle on things, I wonder if this will have repercussions on how future 'safety car inducing' accidents will be viewed. While I doubt we will ever see another team tell one of its drivers to crash deliberately to bring out a safety car I wonder if the stewards will now keep an eye on these and request telemetry data and representations from teams if anything looks suspicious in the future.