2010/11 NHL Season, Stanley Cup Playoffs & off-season Thread

[cuestakid]

http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=357361

and this is what happens with no action by the league.

I will expect a statement from the league basically telling the police to piss off, and that this is a matter of the NHL and not state police.

 

[MooneyFlyer]

http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=357361

and this is what happens with no action by the league.

I will expect a statement from the league basically telling the police to piss off, and that this is a matter of the NHL and not state police.

It is unfortunate that it is going this direction. I do seem to vaguely recall this happening a few years ago too though. I just cannot remember which sport.

If someone crunched you or me against a wall or whacked us with a stick in REAL LIFE these would be crimes. However, as part of a violent sport it's really tough for me to believe this is anything more than posturing unless someone can prove that this was all premeditated.

The real news is Air Canada saying to the NHL - fix this or we walk. Voting with their feet (and wallets) will have an impact. That is an entirely different story.

 

[Surely]

It is unfortunate that it is going this direction. I do seem to vaguely recall this happening a few years ago too though. I just cannot remember which sport.

If someone crunched you or me against a wall or whacked us with a stick in REAL LIFE these would be crimes. However, as part of a violent sport it's really tough for me to believe this is anything more than posturing unless someone can prove that this was all premeditated.

It doesn't matter if it's premeditated or not. Intent isn't necessarily the issue....it's too hard to tell if there was intent or not in this case. This could be viewed as a reckless or careless act. Just like a driver, a professional hockey player is expected to behave with a certain level of care and respect for the other drivers/players on the road/ice. I believe that Chara (and others) have lost their respect for each other.

The lack of respect coupled with the hard plastic/kevlar equipment, the increased size of the players, and the increased speed of the game is the reason we are seeing so many more injuries than in the past.

The courts were involved in the Bertuzzi/Moore incident as well. The courts have been involved in incidents in minor hockey, including the QMJHL.

If the NHL would handle their business properly, outsiders wouldn't need to get involved. Having a couple of ex-players being in charge of discipline is practically a conflict of interest.

The NFL changed their rules in the middle of the season when "spearing" was a problem (leading with your helmet). Why can't the NHL get on something as fast as that?

Remember how Congress got involved with MLB regarding steroids? I'd say that this is the NHL's equivalent issue.

The real news is Air Canada saying to the NHL - fix this or we walk. Voting with their feet (and wallets) will have an impact. That is an entirely different story.

At this point, I don't see how Air Canada doesn't walk unless the NHL actually does something about these types of incidents. Good for them.

 

[iJohnHenry]

The real news is Air Canada saying to the NHL - fix this or we walk. Voting with their feet (and wallets) will have an impact. That is an entirely different story.

I thought the very same thing.

The NHL has been reduced to a money-making entertainment machine.

I welcome some corporate responsibility, to curb this escalating injury problem.

 

[Surely]

Carcillo is such a pu**y.

 

[Abstract]

Chara is a professional hockey player, and plays hockey nearly every day. How can he not know where that wall is?



Did Chara know where he was going to hit Pacioretty into that divider wall? Yes.

Did Chara hit Pacioretty with the sole intent of injuring him? I doubt it. I don't think players play with the sole intention of hurting someone, or certainly not beyond what is expected in the game of hockey.

Did Chara hit Pacioretty with the understanding that Pacioretty may get hurt on the play, or possibly leave the ice with a minor injury? Probably. I can't see how a person like Chara, who is so familiar with ice rinks, wouldn't know or realize this. In the back of his small mind, I'm sure he realized this before the hit.



I see this as a thoughtless act that was made in the heat of "battle". However, thoughtless acts like this deserve punishment, and the league failed once again at delivering adequate punishment. Chara knew what he was doing, and whether he intended to injure Pacioretty to this extent (broken vertebrae in spine) isn't the point. It did happen. He should be punished.

 

[Apple OC]

I agree ... every pro hockey player knows the boards and ice so well ... Chara had to have known he was dishing out the big KO shot.

Not sure though he wanted it to be SO bad.

suspend him for the rest of the season and part of next ... we do not need this type of ***t in the game

 

[Surely]

Sharks' Thornton says Bruins get favourable calls from NHL




Here's an interesting quote from the comments section:

"If you cause a player to be injured, then you have to be responsible for the play that you're involved in, if there's any carelessness or recklessness in it." - Colin Campbell explaining his decision to suspend Alex Ovechkin for his hit on Brian Campbell.

Where's the consistency?

I saw that Chara was involved in another dangerous hit tonight. He was given a boarding penalty for it.

That Bruins Sabres game looked amazing.

robo
Leafs gave it a good shot tonight.......it just didn't happen in the end. The Flyers should be able to do better than that against the lowly Leafs though, don't ya think?

 

[Abstract]

"If you cause a player to be injured, then you have to be responsible for the play that you're involved in, if there's any carelessness or recklessness in it." - Colin Campbell explaining his decision to suspend Alex Ovechkin for his hit on Brian Campbell.


Where's the consistency?

There isn't any.

I don't know which league is run worse, the NHL or NBA. I always think the NBA is worse, but quotes like the one you found change my mind (sometimes).

 

[Surely]

There isn't any.

I don't know which league is run worse, the NHL or NBA. I always think the NBA is worse, but quotes like the one you found change my mind (sometimes).

Let's call it a tie......unless Crosby, Ovechkin, and Stamkos get together during the offseason and all decide to sign in Tampa Bay.....then the NHL wins. Oh, and bonus points if they cry after a regular season loss.

 

[robo]

Carcillo is such a pu**y.

SURELY...WHAT HAPPENED...

And Carcillo is a punk

robo28

 

[MooneyFlyer]

There isn't any.

I don't know which league is run worse, the NHL or NBA. I always think the NBA is worse, but quotes like the one you found change my mind (sometimes).

It's true, consistency is a problem. If injuring the player is the measurement then what about the Hunwick hit on Savard in January that is going to basically end his career (because of the compilation of head injuries). I don't think whether someone is injured on the play or not is the measuring stick. FWIW there was no penalty on that play at all.

 

[robo]

Surely
All of Canada is in an uproar about the Chara hit What's up with that? From the Prime Minister to Air Canada C'mon it's freak'n hockey
I grew up watching the "Broad Steet Bullies" what can I say It's getting to the point where I can't watch anymore NAH...

And by no means I'm I a big Gary Bettman fan but props to him for telling Air Canada to go **** themselves

And by the way, my younger son's HS varsity team just won the Flyers Cup I couldn't be more prouder for him He played his ASS off

LiL Otav89

 

[Counterfit]

http://bruins.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=551650

Because the Bruins always get off easy...?

 

[Surely]

It's true, consistency is a problem. If injuring the player is the measurement then what about the Hunwick hit on Savard in January that is going to basically end his career (because of the compilation of head injuries). I don't think whether someone is injured on the play or not is the measuring stick. FWIW there was no penalty on that play at all.

Whether someone is injured or not on the play should not be the measuring stick. The outcome shouldn't matter.

The measuring stick should be if the play shows a complete disregard for the safety of the other player. Chara demonstrated that he doesn't give a crap about the health or safety of his opponents.

I agree with Abstract, how could he not know the layout of the rink? It's not like it was his first time on the ice. These guys know where every nook and cranny is. I'm not saying that he absolutely intended to injure, but he didn't let up either. He actually raised his forearm as they slid into the stanchion which made the hit worse.

Surely
All of Canada is in an uproar about the Chara hit What's up with that? From the Prime Minister to Air Canada C'mon it's freak'n hockey
I grew up watching the "Broad Steet Bullies" what can I say It's getting to the point where I can't watch anymore NAH...

And by no means I'm I a big Gary Bettman fan but props to him for telling Air Canada to go **** themselves

And by the way, my younger son's HS varsity team just won the Flyers Cup I couldn't be more prouder for him He played his ASS off

LiL Otav89

robo
All of the United States was in an uproar ten years ago over steroids in baseball. Congress got involved. This is no different.

The Broad Street Bullies played in a different time. The league has changed multiple times since then. You can't compare today to the NHL of the 70's.

Props to Air Canada for telling the NHL that they aren't going to give them their money and free/discounted flights unless they get their house in order.

Congrats to your son and his team! That's awesome.

 

[zioxide]

back from colorado.. looks like I missed a lot hahaha

edit- here's a couple videos from ESPN which I think anaylze the situation fairly well.
http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=6198391
http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=6199297

I can agree with this. From the camera angle to Chara's right it seemed to me that he was just rubbing him into the boards. The part that looks bad is the overhead view from Chara's left where he has that last little shove right before the collision with the glass. Personally, I don't think it looks intentional but I think this is one of those situations where the outcome is going to dictate the penalty regardless of road taken to get there. 4 games is what Paille got for the hit a while back in open ice where he was "targeting" someone so I would say it should be less than that.

of course you are analyzing it after watching the super slow mo. when you are skating at 20+mph, it happens way faster than that. slow-mo is like the monday morning quarterback.

As much as I don't think that Chara intended to injure him (that badly), he did give that last minute shove right before Pacioretty hit the partition. If Chara was simply trying to rub him out, that last minute shove wouldn't have happened- it would have been a more fluid movement.

I think that Chara saw the partition at the last second, and for some stupid reason, he decided to push Pacioretty into it. Perhaps at that split-second moment, he didn't think Pacioretty would get hurt so badly. It was probably more reflex than actual well-thought out intentional decision.

I think you guys are way over analyzing this. If that hit happens 2 feet in either direction, he doesn't hit the boards like that. They are skating super fast, and stuff happens way faster than you can analyze and think like that.

If you read the league's comments, it seems that the league is making distinctions between deliberate hits to the head, freak plays and the standard cheap shot artists. I feel that this is the problem. We cannot categorize hits in this manner-otherwise we get plays like this that blur the lines between reckless and freaky.

From seeing the video, this is what this hit appears to be.

I have said it before and I will say it again- the rules for discipline must be clear and distinct. If you get a major running a guy from behind or you throw an elbow to someone's head, you are not only thrown out, you sit 5 games at a minimum, pending review from the league.

agree with this.

Chara has always been a dirty player. Just look at his tactics from his days back in Ottawa. I have no idea how nobody covering hockey ever sees this or mentiones anything. Now, of course we can't ever 'prove' Chara tried to slam Max's head into the turnbuckle. ...Given Chara's dirty past and the rivalry not only between the teams, but between Max and himself, I'd say it's fairly obvious as to Chara's intentions. Heat of the moment sure, but none the less 100% intentional. I'm completely disgusted there was no suspension. Please get well soon Mr. Pacioretty.

Uh huh Chara is a super dirty player. Thats why the article quoted in the post above yours says "Chara had never been involved in any supplemental discipline"

He is a star of the game. Look at some of the stuff a guy like Ovechkin gets away with. Charging at players and crap. Ill admit Crosby does some shady stuff too sometimes. Then you have a guy like Cooke that gets suspended for everything he does practically. The worst part of the NHL is that we have to have these discussions every 2/3 weeks it seems. We should be talking about who is kicking butt on the score board not this crap.

except ending savard's career. go figure that one out for consistency.

I saw the Chara hit and I thought it was clean. Pacioretty was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Hey it's freak'n hockey.

you sir are the winner.

http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=357361

and this is what happens with no action by the league.

I will expect a statement from the league basically telling the police to piss off, and that this is a matter of the NHL and not state police.

because the toolbag montreal radio hosts whined to everyone to call the police and complain. next they will start flipping over cars. what a bunch of idiots. nothing will happen with this.

If someone crunched you or me against a wall or whacked us with a stick in REAL LIFE these would be crimes. However, as part of a violent sport it's really tough for me to believe this is anything more than posturing unless someone can prove that this was all premeditated.

And if a hockey fight occurred on the streets, both parties invovled would go to jail for disorderly conduct, not just get 5 minutes in the penalty box. Hockey isn't "real life".

The real news is Air Canada saying to the NHL - fix this or we walk. Voting with their feet (and wallets) will have an impact. That is an entirely different story.

So they will either fix it or they will just sign a bigger endorsement with a different airline. I'm gonna go with option B...

The NHL has been reduced to a money-making entertainment machine

Welcome to every pro sports league in the last 30 years.

Chara is a professional hockey player, and plays hockey nearly every day. How can he not know where that wall is?

Because when you are skating around at 20+mph, stuff happens really quickly.

Did Chara hit Pacioretty with the understanding that Pacioretty may get hurt on the play, or possibly leave the ice with a minor injury?

You could say this for every hit in hockey, ever.

suspend him for the rest of the season and part of next ... we do not need this type of ***t in the game

LOL. that will happen after Ott and Cooke are banned for life. (hint: NEVER)

Sharks' Thornton says Bruins get favourable calls from NHL

Where's the consistency?

shut the **** up joe thornton. don't whine about the bruins "getting the calls" when arguably their best forward had his career ended in the past year due to two bad hits (one a HUGE cheap shot) that didn't result in suspension.

Surely
All of Canada is in an uproar about the Chara hit What's up with that? From the Prime Minister to Air Canada C'mon it's freak'n hockey
I grew up watching the "Broad Steet Bullies" what can I say It's getting to the point where I can't watch anymore NAH...

Only because it happened to one of their precious fruitcake habs. If that hit happened to someone on the Panthers, it wouldn't be this big of a deal.

 

[Surely]

I don't think I'm overanalyzing this at all.

If a professional hockey player says that he doesn't know where things are around the ice, he's not telling the truth. Chara knew that stanchion was there.



I see there is some consistency........Bruins fans defending Bruins regardless of the action.

If Phaneuf did this, I wouldn't defend him or say that it's just a part of the game.




The old boys network that runs the league needs to go.

 

[MooneyFlyer]

If someone crunched you or me against a wall or whacked us with a stick in REAL LIFE these would be crimes. However, as part of a violent sport it's really tough for me to believe this is anything more than posturing unless someone can prove that this was all premeditated.

And if a hockey fight occurred on the streets, both parties invovled would go to jail for disorderly conduct, not just get 5 minutes in the penalty box. Hockey isn't "real life".

My point exactly. Ready, fire, aim.

 

[Surely]

^^^^Neither of those examples are anything like what Chara did. Neither of them demonstrate a reckless or careless accident. Hitting someone with a stick or getting into a fight are intentional acts.

I think that a driving analogy is more accurate. In order to drive, you need to follow certain rules. If you break one of those rules, even by accident, you have to pay the consequences for your actions.

Whether Chara intended to injure Pachioretty doesn't matter (well, it does, but it is pretty much impossible to determine intent here). His careless/reckless action of driving him into the stanchion does.

 

[zioxide]

http://espn.go.com/blog/nhl/post/_/...ion-ryan-smyth-sees-no-fault-with-zdeno-chara

Zdeno Chara's controversial hit on Max Pacioretty this week was reminiscent for Ryan Smyth.

The veteran Los Angeles Kings winger was nailed into the turnbuckle by Jack Johnson (today they're teammates) in March 2008.

"I think it was really similar," Smyth told ESPN.com Thursday.

Smyth, then with Colorado, missed two weeks with a separated shoulder and a concussion. Johnson escaped NHL discipline, just like Chara did this week. Montreal fans were ultra upset with the league's decision, but Smyth has no issue with it.

"When I looked at it, I think it's just a clean check and an unfortunate situation where the stanchion is there and he hits it," Smyth said. "The same with me. Half a second earlier, there's no call. Half a second later, there's no call. In my opinion. If I was half a second later, I would have just rubbed out against the glass. Half a second earlier, I could have grabbed on a little bit. I could have leaned over and hit my whole body onto it and braced myself a bit more."

Smyth said he feels terrible for Pacioretty, knowing just how it feels to get pounded into the turnbuckle, but the Kings veteran can't find fault with Chara.

"I don't think Zdeno Chara has a mean bone in his body," said Smyth. "And if he did, he could probably kill some guys out there. Litterally, he's a giant. But it is unfortunate, I do feel for Max Pacioretty. It's awful. I feel for him and his career."

Smyth wonders if the league can't improve the area where the stanchions sit near the players' benches.

"I think they should round the plexiglass, curve it so there is no corner, no point," suggested Smyth. "I was looking at it again today in Columbus between the benches. They could go back a foot back and round it. I don't know, that's just my idea."

Part of the discussion next week at the GMs meeting is expected to touch on rink safety around the NHL.

obviously his opinion, but from someone who was in a really similar situation, it's a good read.

and here's the clip of the hit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pjb9Xy2UnWc&feature=player_embedded

It seems like most people around the league (who arent in quebec drinking their kool aid) agree with his position. It was a freak play. Nonetheless, the league needs to work on reducing head shots, but they need to be consistent. If Cooke doesn't get suspended for KOing Savard, I don't see how you can suspend Chara for this. (though in my opinion cooke should have been suspended, and therefore Chara too). hopefully they will work on this and next season we will have new rules and regulations for these types of hits. they just need to be made consistent.

 

[Beezy]

Xioxide - I cant stand any team in Boston let alone the Bruins but I am on your side with this one. I honestly have not seen the other point of view till I read this site. The hockey fans in Pittsburgh like it physical. That said maybe this is the Habs strategy. The Pens are getting crushed by them right now. They look like they are afraid they will get the mounties called on them. Screw them this is the states I want the proverbial can of whoop ass opened upon them.

 

[Surely]

^^^^Seriously?

This isn't a Habs strategy. That is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever read about this issue.

You think we don't like rough tough hockey just because we think Chara should have been suspended for that?

Screw them this is the states? lol

 

[Apple OC]

Canadian Hockey players define toughness when it comes to Hockey

It has always been that way ... the only way to compete with Canada at hockey is to play the game the same way we do ... rough and tough.

 

[iJohnHenry]

It has always been that way ... the only way to compete with Canada at hockey is to play the game the same way we do ... rough and tough.

This is crap thinking. Sorry.

When there was the Original 6, fights broke out because the skill levels were so high, that players got frustrated in being hamstrung in making a play.

Now we have bent-nose guys, who can skate, running at any skilled player that doesn't keep his head up.

The talent pool is too thin, and teams need to be dropped in markets that cannot support them. This is not the best solution for the 'business' of hockey, but it is for the sport.

 

[Beezy]

Lol you cant tell I am being partially facetious because my team was sleepskating through an early game? The Habs fans are out of control though. Call the cops on the Chara JFC. Chillll.