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2012-2013 NFL Football Thread

The NFL's statement on last night's game-winning play:

NFL said:
"In Monday’s game between the Green Bay Packers and Seattle Seahawks, Seattle faced a 4th-and-10 from the Green Bay 24 with eight seconds remaining in the game.

"Seattle quarterback Russell Wilson threw a pass into the end zone. Several players, including Seattle wide receiver Golden Tate and Green Bay safety M.D. Jennings, jumped into the air in an attempt to catch the ball.

"While the ball is in the air, Tate can be seen shoving Green Bay cornerback Sam Shields to the ground. This should have been a penalty for offensive pass interference, which would have ended the game. It was not called and is not reviewable in instant replay.

"When the players hit the ground in the end zone, the officials determined that both Tate and Jennings had possession of the ball. Under the rule for simultaneous catch, the ball belongs to Tate, the offensive player. The result of the play was a touchdown.

"Replay Official Howard Slavin stopped the game for an instant replay review. The aspects of the play that were reviewable included if the ball hit the ground and who had possession of the ball. In the end zone, a ruling of a simultaneous catch is reviewable. That is not the case in the field of play, only in the end zone.

"Referee Wayne Elliott determined that no indisputable visual evidence existed to overturn the call on the field, and as a result, the on-field ruling of touchdown stood. The NFL Officiating Department reviewed the video today and supports the decision not to overturn the on-field ruling following the instant replay review."

The result of the game is final."
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Complete BS. Let's not forget that Seattle got screwed on a few calls as well, particularly a terrible pass interference play that kept a GB drive going and led to a TD. It's really unbelievable though.

I feel like hiring the referees full-time would solve a lot of problems. They could get better training and be more focused on the game, and only the game.
 
dmr727 said:
I still don't think it matters to the NFL until people stop watching/attending the games, advertisers pull out, and revenue begins to fall. If anything this controversy is getting more people talking about the sport. Everyone is pissed while Goodell is laughing all the way to the bank.
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Goodell works for the owners and if enough of them get screwed out of the playoffs things will change.
 
MacNut said:
Goodell works for the owners and if enough of them get screwed out of the playoffs things will change.
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I don't see this situation changing the playoff picture for more than a team or two, if that. Most of these owners are in it for the money as well - I doubt they'll complain too loudly unless it begins to affect their bottom line.

Perhaps I'm being overly pessimistic, but I can't imagine a scenario where the NFL caves on this unless the coaches/players get together and burn the whole season to the ground.
 
dmr727 said:
I don't see this situation changing the playoff picture for more than a team or two, if that. Most of these owners are in it for the money as well - I doubt they'll complain too loudly unless it begins to affect their bottom line.

Perhaps I'm being overly pessimistic, but I can't imagine a scenario where the NFL caves on this unless the coaches/players get together and burn the whole season to the ground.
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Agreed
For every one or two that get screwed out of the playoffs, the same number make it that wouldn't have and are happy

It is $$$$$ not the image and the integrity of the game
Anyone who thinks differently is fooling themselves
We as fans think they (owners/NFL) really love the game
It is a business to them and they hold the power
And ultimately, they will win

Cave now and they will show weakness in the next player contract etc.

Make no mistake, the NFL wins here
Not the players, the coaches, the fans or anyone else

And lets face it, people will keep watching the train wreck
Twitter was ablaze
And even more people will watch now because they missed last night
They are not tuning out, they are kicking themselves for not staying up and watching
 
dmr727 said:
I don't see this situation changing the playoff picture for more than a team or two, if that. Most of these owners are in it for the money as well - I doubt they'll complain too loudly unless it begins to affect their bottom line.

Perhaps I'm being overly pessimistic, but I can't imagine a scenario where the NFL caves on this unless the coaches/players get together and burn the whole season to the ground.
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1 loss like this for the Packers (or the Patriots) could be the difference between home field advantage throughout and having to play on the road. Losing 1 or 2 home playoff games would be a HUGE financial loss for those teams.

That said, who the heck knows how long and far they'll take this? I feel like last night was the worst case scenario in terms of all the bad that could have happened. If that doesn't make something happen soon between the two sides, what will?
 
These refs know they aren't going to be in the NFL for much longer... I think the fix is in... Good for them, they are making some money on the side with bets and going out in a blaze of glory :D
 
More stunning and disturbing than the bad calls some have seen is the play of some top players (or ones who were at the top last year or year before). Even without the bad calls at the worst possible times, this season is going to have a lot of underdogs finally find their wings.
 
MacNut said:
The people who can't be happy are those in Vegas.
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On the contrary, Vegas and bookies made a killing last night.... 80% of bets were on the packers who were winning and covering before that crazy play.... All that money then shifted to the books and way from the betting public. I read somewhere that it was something like 300 Million dollars changing hands on that one call.
 
Dear Roger Goodell,

I am done with the NFL for this season. I'll not watch another game on TV, listen on the radio, or buy any NFL merchandise. When one team has to compete against not only the other team, but the replacement refs as well, what's the point. :mad:
 
Some interesting tidbits on the labor dispute sticking points, since I was curious about both sides of the issue, and the media seems intent on reporting it as one-sided greed:

- The refs union does NOT want the NFL to add 21 extra referees, as it would take away from the number of games they can work (which is their main pay source), and would give the NFL the ability to sit underperforming refs with a larger roster. Number of games are not guaranteed, so having 21 extra bodies would diminish the number they can work.

- The NFL is proposing that with the expanded referee roster, underperforming referees could be sat immediately based on the grading system currently in place. In the current model, referees can be withheld from postseason consideration, but there is no framework in place for mid-season sanctions, it has to wait until the end of the season.

- The sticking point on pensions seems to be whether current refs can be grandfathered in to keeping and accruing to their "defined benefits plan," while new refs will be enrolled in the 401(k) plan most widely used in this country. The NFL wants defined benefits plans eliminated - referees will get to keep what they've accrued, but not add to them any longer, and join the 401(k) world immediately.

- both sides have generally agreed to raises in the 5% - 11% area, based on official, over a 7 year period.

- The average NFL referee salary is $149,000. They are the only professional referees in the four major sports to be part-time employees. For the record, the refs union does not want to move to full-time status.

- From Peter King: "Over the last five years, the league has contributed, on average, about $5.3 million per year to the officials' pension plan. The league, in keeping with the current cost-cutting practice of corporations across America, no longer wants to guarantee how much each official would get in retirement, but rather tie the contributions to a 401(k)-type pension. That would save the league about $3.3 million per year." - source

Referee comparisons:
Number of officials in each league:
NBA--45
MLB--95
NHL--75 (33 linesmen, 42 refs)
NFL--119

Average salaries:
NBA--$100k-$300k
MLB--$120k-$300k
NHL--$115k-$225k
NFL--$149k (they are part-timers)

When labor agreements expire between leagues and officials:
NBA--2016 (agreed to 5-year contract last year)
MLB--through the end of 2014 season.
NHL--through 2013-2014 season.
NFL--dispute continues into week two of NFL season. - source

sources here and here
 
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zioxide said:
Absolutely disgusting that they are essentially throwing away the credibility of this season and the entire league over 0.03667% of their yearly revenue.
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Wow... you couldn't have said it better. This is horrible and down right disgusting. 3.3 million. Ugh you have got to be kidding me. For the sake of this argument, I am hoping both of you are wrong and the number is closer to 100 million! Not 3.3 million. That is just plain horrible.
 
rhett7660 said:
Wow... you couldn't have said it better. This is horrible and down right disgusting. 3.3 million. Ugh you have got to be kidding me. For the sake of this argument, I am hoping both of you are wrong and the number is closer to 100 million! Not 3.3 million. That is just plain horrible.
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It's definitely 3.3 million. Although it's not the only sticking point. As I said, the NFL wants to hire more referees (21 more) and implement a much stricter performance-based system, where low rated referees would be "benched" in favor of higher rated referees during the season. The extra referees would also lower the amount of money per game and total number of games referees would be able to work.
 
Old Muley said:
Dear Roger Goodell,

I am done with the NFL for this season. I'll not watch another game on TV, listen on the radio, or buy any NFL merchandise. When one team has to compete against not only the other team, but the replacement refs as well, what's the point. :mad:
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Let me know how that works out for you. No cheating now... be a person of your word. Oh, and checking this thread would constitute cheating as it's dedicated to the NFL. ;)

Queen of Spades said:
Some interesting tidbits on the labor dispute sticking points, since I was curious about both sides of the issue, and the media seems intent on reporting it as one-sided greed:
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Good stuff Queen. Thanks for doing the research and sharing this information. It's definitely not a one sided issue and we all know each side is fighting for what they believe to be in their own best interest. I must say $150k a year for a part time job is pretty good.
 
zioxide said:
Absolutely disgusting that they are essentially throwing away the credibility of this season and the entire league over 0.03667% of their yearly revenue.
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Exactly. I'd be tempted to assign more blame to the refs if the league was struggling like the rest of the country. A lot of people have had their pensions slashed or removed over the years. But the league is taking in more money than ever, and it's hard to sympathize with owners in an era of $8 beers and astronomical ticket prices.
 
question-

Can the NFL do the catastrophically stupid enough thing and fine any Packer player, official or other player for something that they said on Twitter?
 
mscriv said:
Let me know how that works out for you. No cheating now... be a person of your word. Oh, and checking this thread would constitute cheating as it's dedicated to the NFL. ;)



Good stuff Queen. Thanks for doing the research and sharing this information. It's definitely not a one sided issue and we all know each side is fighting for what they believe to be in their own best interest. I must say $150k a year for a part time job is pretty good.
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This kind of thinking needs to stop because I can just as easily turn around and say "10 million dollars per year for an NFL quarterback is pretty good for a part time job" or "$200 an hour for a professional therapist :rolleyes: is pretty good for a part time job" :p
 
cWV_-468pEGyIWqMQj9Cug2.jpg



of course there is no guarantee that the regualr refs would have made the right call either... but i do like to think they would have...
 
pachyderm said:
of course there is no guarantee that the regualr refs would have made the right call either... but i do like to think they would have...
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The real refs screw up all the time as well, they blow calls and they miss calls... But they have a certain level of certainty and authority when making calls that these replacement refs dont have..... They are so wishy-washy when making a call that its hard for fans, players and coaches to accept their calls. I think thats the major difference... That and the messing up of certain rules and boneheaded mistakes like granting extra timeouts etc....
 
pachyderm said:
Image


of course there is no guarantee that the regualr refs would have made the right call either... but i do like to think they would have...
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My biggest problem with how it went down is that they didn't even confer with each other. You have 2 refs within feet of each other making 2 different calls.

They should have stepped back and talked it over - which they seem to be doing ad nauseum in every other game. Had they actually done that, this whole thing may have been avoided. Obviously one of them saw that Jennings had possession.
 
Lingerie Refs

http://www.latimes.com/sports/sportsnow/la-sp-sn-lingerie-football-league-20120926,0,4173638.story

"The entire crew was released due to several poorly called games which included missed calls, poor judgment and poor presentation for broadcast. They were hurting our overall broadcast caliber. And if it's opening up our players for potential injury, those things raise red flags here. When either of those two things are compromised, it's time to start thinking about parting ways."
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"It was a bit of a shock to see guys that couldn't officiate in our league were officiating in the NFL," Mortaza told Yahoo Sports."
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"They’ve tried to say that Craig Ochoa ... was a BCS official, that he worked in the Big Ten," Pereira said. "He didn’t work in the Big Ten. He’s not been a major college official. I don’t think the NFL is going to say that he actually got released midway through the last Lingerie Football League season as a referee. I don’t think the league is going to put that out. The league wants as little out as possible. They don’t want people talking about it. They don’t want me talking about it."
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bigjnyc said:
The real refs screw up all the time as well, they blow calls and they miss calls... But they have a certain level of certainty and authority when making calls that these replacement refs dont have....
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I agree. With the regular refs you feel like missed calls happen because they are human (and they've had some big missed calls) but with the replacement refs you know that the never-ending blunders are because they just aren't good enough at what they've been asked to do.

Moyank24 said:
My biggest problem with how it went down is that they didn't even confer with each other. You have 2 refs within feet of each other making 2 different calls.
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I'd need to double check the video but didn't the ref in the back of the end zone, the one with a clear view of Jennings, call it an interception while the ref towards the front of the end zone, that could only see the backs of the players, call in a TD?
 
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