That's the beauty of subjectivity. It certainly doesn't sound like a 17" would be ideal for your circumstances, but some people love them
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2012 Macbook Pro Redesign
- Thread starter Funkymonk
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That's the beauty of subjectivity. It certainly doesn't sound like a 17" would be ideal for your circumstances, but some people love them
even though i made a "doomsday" post a couple pages back, i still have faith in apple and look forward to their surprise. I have never watched an apple release/keynote without banging my fist in my hand and saying/yelling "oh my god, holly s***, thats insane, that is sooo bad a**" over and over again.....(i know its sad, and im lame, big deal.)
Anyways, what i would like to discuss or hear thoughts on is:
What could they actually do to make a redesign (not a spec or hardware bump) a complete redesign like the unibody redesign was?
My answer:
Apple changed the game with their laptop case, now the only thing they can do is change the way the game is played. Which is how we interact with our laptops.
After having the ipad and the iphone.....i crack up, laughing in my mind every time im using my MBP and i take my finger, touch the trackpad on my MBP, move my finger around, follow the arrow with my eyes until i get it to hover over what i want to select.....then tap. i feel like a caveman.
THAT IS SERIOUSLY an EFFING JOKE, having to do that. today. still.
Im not saying this is my prediction, im saying theres nothing i can even imagine that can be done to significantly redesign the MBP like the unibody redesign did with out approaching the idea of the touchscreen. Especially after how successful and important it has become for apple.
Thinner, not a redesign.
Better specs, not a redesign.
Better display, not a redesign.
Removing optical bay drive for some other hardware or space, not a redesign.
Adding/changing/removing connector/interface ports, not a redesign.
Touchscreen and removal of trackpad (or keep it) would make more since for a redesign (or even for anything to be considered a 'redesign'), ESPECIALLY since they are integrating/making mountain lion more ios like.
So far the idea has been pooped on in a lot of articles, saying its unlikely and makes no since, and other articles saying previously the problem why it wouldnt work was because the hinges would give out from pressing the screen....
I dont know about you, but i dont "press" anything on my iphone or ipad. its not necessary. so i dont see how the hinge issue is, well, an issue. And like i said in a previous post. Pretend your screen is like the ipad or iphone, you can just see the productivity and efficiency increase over A FREAKING TOUCH PAD. It maybe the best touch pad out there, but its a TOUCH PAD.....its old tech, its inefficient, and its a joke to deal with a pointer after having an iphone or ipad. And i think it would be safe to say, most MBP owners have an iphone or ipad.
Basically, in conclusion, im saying they will either make minor changes for now or do what apple does best, and revolutionize a product and idea, and the only reason to wait and not do it now would be the cost of the touchscreen making the MBP to high to even be considered an option.
Anyways, what i would like to discuss or hear thoughts on is:
What could they actually do to make a redesign (not a spec or hardware bump) a complete redesign like the unibody redesign was?
My answer:
Apple changed the game with their laptop case, now the only thing they can do is change the way the game is played. Which is how we interact with our laptops.
After having the ipad and the iphone.....i crack up, laughing in my mind every time im using my MBP and i take my finger, touch the trackpad on my MBP, move my finger around, follow the arrow with my eyes until i get it to hover over what i want to select.....then tap. i feel like a caveman.
THAT IS SERIOUSLY an EFFING JOKE, having to do that. today. still.
Im not saying this is my prediction, im saying theres nothing i can even imagine that can be done to significantly redesign the MBP like the unibody redesign did with out approaching the idea of the touchscreen. Especially after how successful and important it has become for apple.
Thinner, not a redesign.
Better specs, not a redesign.
Better display, not a redesign.
Removing optical bay drive for some other hardware or space, not a redesign.
Adding/changing/removing connector/interface ports, not a redesign.
Touchscreen and removal of trackpad (or keep it) would make more since for a redesign (or even for anything to be considered a 'redesign'), ESPECIALLY since they are integrating/making mountain lion more ios like.
So far the idea has been pooped on in a lot of articles, saying its unlikely and makes no since, and other articles saying previously the problem why it wouldnt work was because the hinges would give out from pressing the screen....
I dont know about you, but i dont "press" anything on my iphone or ipad. its not necessary. so i dont see how the hinge issue is, well, an issue. And like i said in a previous post. Pretend your screen is like the ipad or iphone, you can just see the productivity and efficiency increase over A FREAKING TOUCH PAD. It maybe the best touch pad out there, but its a TOUCH PAD.....its old tech, its inefficient, and its a joke to deal with a pointer after having an iphone or ipad. And i think it would be safe to say, most MBP owners have an iphone or ipad.
Basically, in conclusion, im saying they will either make minor changes for now or do what apple does best, and revolutionize a product and idea, and the only reason to wait and not do it now would be the cost of the touchscreen making the MBP to high to even be considered an option.
The reason why phones and pads work as touch screens is the way you're holding them. You wouldn't last till lunch if you sat by a computer with touch screen, it would make it look like if painters had it easy.
**** idiot
Probably just turned into a mad man, due to the long wait for the new MBPs.
Discontinued in the sense that it'll be merged with the 13" MBA.
Just can't see the 13" hold onto the Pro moniker.
Don't get me wrong, Apple will still make a s#*t load of 13" MacBook Somethings.
Good morning guys. Here's the latest round up on the 2012's from yesterday. Hearing a lot more rumors about production picking up.
Also, I must say, I've been lurking for a while, and you guys have to be the most patient community I've ever come across. I'm pretty sure there is someone every day on here for the past 3 months asking whether they should buy now or wait, and even though this question has been answered an inordinate amount of times, you guys are still pretty polite about it.
http://www.allvoices.com/contribute...cbook-pro-redesign-on-its-way-to-apple-stores
http://www.mobilemag.com/2012/04/04/new-macbook-pros-on-thier-way/
http://www.ubergizmo.com/2012/04/re...ction-in-april-followed-by-13-models-in-june/
Also, I must say, I've been lurking for a while, and you guys have to be the most patient community I've ever come across. I'm pretty sure there is someone every day on here for the past 3 months asking whether they should buy now or wait, and even though this question has been answered an inordinate amount of times, you guys are still pretty polite about it.
That's the beauty of subjectivity. It certainly doesn't sound like a 17" would be ideal for your circumstances, but some people love them
Ahh, so true!
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This is where I am. Take the "I wish" out of it altogether and it makes sound business sense from a financials point of view. Less the delta is between the MBP and the MBA more of a business case for that being the crossover point.
11", 13", and 15" laptops in an ultra format. 17" form factor ehh, leave as is and let sales peter off before ya kill it.
As an aside, this is the perfect example of viral rumors. All three links are based on the same questionable report from digitimes. So it's not even three separate rumors about production picking up, it's the same one being echoed by different sources.
i cant process raw images and videos...on an ipad...nor can i have a couple terrabytes of data stored on it with out an external storage device....
Are there any other professional designers out, there like me, who really don't give a flying ***** about the form factor of the new MBP??! All this talk of skinny MacBook Airness is really boring now.
I just want fastest possible processors, more space for RAM, a retina display or higher resolution anyway, anti-glare glass or the same old non-glossy screen. That's it. I'm still happy with the ODD drive. (I have hundreds of CDs and DVDs that I use for back-up and reference, not to mention software from over the years). Do I really want to have to carry another drive with as well as my HDD? Call me old fashioned, but this Mac is the workhorse of many of us graphic designers and should remain so.
PS. Can we have this update soon please?!
I just want fastest possible processors, more space for RAM, a retina display or higher resolution anyway, anti-glare glass or the same old non-glossy screen. That's it. I'm still happy with the ODD drive. (I have hundreds of CDs and DVDs that I use for back-up and reference, not to mention software from over the years). Do I really want to have to carry another drive with as well as my HDD? Call me old fashioned, but this Mac is the workhorse of many of us graphic designers and should remain so.
PS. Can we have this update soon please?!
and a reply to who ever called me an idiot.
Well, i agree with you on that, however only if its a touchscreen on a desktop your talking about (it would be tiring, unless again, the whole way we use a desktop is revolutionized, such as how we sit at a desk and so forth). If its a touch screen on a laptop, its a completely different story. the keyboard is already basically touching the screen, and the screens arent 27." Im merely saying it would be the best for portability, and would improve efficiency of productivity on a LAPTOP.....its totally different with a desktop.
so your argument is void when used against my opinion. unless you care to elaborate...which would involve a little more than 3 lines on your part. (not challenging you or being a smart a**, just always enjoy and appreciate other's inputs, elaborated, so we all learn something)
i highly doubt anybody here would choose a MBP with only a trackpad, rather than a MBP with both a trackpad and touchscreen. Even if it cost an extra couple hundred bucks.
I would really like to read an argument against the idea of a touchscreen on the MBP which addresses its affects on improvement or non-improvement of productivity on a laptop...which (again) involves several more lines of type, than 3.
I totally take in your "tiring" argument against it, and I'm still on the fence about how it could be, when used on a laptop.
By the way, if you use the track pad rather than learning keyboard shortcuts.....which would cut your trackpad use down enormously, then your probably not really some one that takes full advantage of the power of a macbook pro. Im addressing this issue/idea from merely a photographer/videographer who deals with mostly images, videos,music, and design, which i believe is the majority of MBP users.
even now, at the end of my post, I'm thinking about this whole issue, and now i really don't see anyone using their trackpad enough for it to look like someone was "painting" if they are using a touch screen instead. i am on my MBP for at least 16 hours a day, and i don't see the trackpad being used that much, its just disappointing when i have to.
i appreciate people calling me an idiot, it only means to me that the person who called me an idiot, might actually have better thoughts/ideas on the issue at hand, and i would appreciate it even more if they did . i would agree i am an idiot, if supplied with a sufficient elaboration of why i am.
dragging in articles from other sites guessing at the redesign, discussing simple hardware/spec bumps, and talking about merging with the air's or removal of the 13" or 17", is really dumb to even be discussing in a "redesign" thread, and i don't see anyone else talking about actual "redesign" in this thread. i got the impression from this thread's title that it was a discussion of thoughts on the possible/desired redesign of the 2012 MBP, in which we could all discuss our thoughts and ideas or post found information on the subject of "redesign." I apologize if i am misunderstanding.
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Are there any other professional designers out, there like me, who really don't give a flying ***** about the form factor of the new MBP??! All this talk of skinny MacBook Airness is really boring now.
I just want fastest possible processors, more space for RAM, a retina display or higher resolution anyway, anti-glare glass or the same old non-glossy screen. That's it. I'm still happy with the ODD drive. (I have hundreds of CDs and DVDs that I use for back-up and reference, not to mention software from over the years). Do I really want to have to carry another drive with as well as my HDD? Call me old fashioned, but this Mac is the workhorse of many of us graphic designers and should remain so.
PS. Can we have this update soon please?!
but a change to the form factor is what is considered a redesign....
and all your asking for is all pretty much a given, well maybe not the retina display.....
their not going to be like, "hey look at our new line of macbooks, but sorry, they have the same old specs." haha, that would be real lame.
I actually removed a part of my answer which addressed this very point
I can see netbooks, or maybe even the 11" MBA having touchscreen and a trackpad, but I personally sit far enough away from my 13" MBP that I can't touch the whole screen without having to lift my arm. Besides, desktop operating systems can't be (at least I can't envision it) made into a touch interface without becoming either ridiculously hard to master, or becoming a very Toys R Us kind of interface - like iOS is.Except people having worked with touch screens, knowing just how useless they are, unless they're going to use it for app development... The way things are today, I wouldn't even pay 50 dollars extra for a touch screen. Hell, I wouldn't even pay the cost for the hardware and installation.
Laptops with touch screen is either for people who for one reason or another needs it (I know a professor in maths that uses touch screen with a stylus during lectures), or who uses it as a gimmick (running Ubuntu Netbook Edition or Windows 8 for instance) - not for the general public.
If it's an addition, go for it, I couldn't care less because I wouldn't use it. But in a comparison, trackpad/mouse win over touchscreen any day.
If you're sitting close enough to your laptop, be it 13" or 17", that you could use the touchscreen instead of a trackpad without wearing your arm out, you're sitting closer to your laptop than most people I know.
I am using keyboard shortcuts, and I can use my trackpad without really having to move my arms. In order for me to touch my screen, it's a lot bigger gesture.
I don't even know what to say...
I will be getting a 13" MacBook Pro. The 15" is just too big for my needs. My biggest fears would be:
1) Due to the slimming redesign, the FireWire port is out. I use firewire hardware and would be disappointed to see it go.
2) With the slimming redesign, the line is blurred between Air and Pro. Therefore, the 13" model now only comes in Air, and 15-17" comes in the Pro. This could also be cause for chopping the FireWire port from the 13".
Now of course, these are my fears and slight speculation, but nothing hard to go with it by.
I'd gladly pay $100 for a straight Firewire to Thunderbolt adapter, but there aren't any out, still. The rumored ones to come out "second half of this year" are docks that cost $300+.
If this happens, I may just need to buy a 2011 refurb once the 2012's are out. I am nearly drooling over a 13" MacBook Pro with no DVD drive, a 128 or 256gb SSD drive, a better close-to-retina screen, and my firewire port. I'd stick 8gb of ram in it and love that its so powerful, and no moving parts.
One can dream...
1) Due to the slimming redesign, the FireWire port is out. I use firewire hardware and would be disappointed to see it go.
2) With the slimming redesign, the line is blurred between Air and Pro. Therefore, the 13" model now only comes in Air, and 15-17" comes in the Pro. This could also be cause for chopping the FireWire port from the 13".
Now of course, these are my fears and slight speculation, but nothing hard to go with it by.
I'd gladly pay $100 for a straight Firewire to Thunderbolt adapter, but there aren't any out, still. The rumored ones to come out "second half of this year" are docks that cost $300+.
If this happens, I may just need to buy a 2011 refurb once the 2012's are out. I am nearly drooling over a 13" MacBook Pro with no DVD drive, a 128 or 256gb SSD drive, a better close-to-retina screen, and my firewire port. I'd stick 8gb of ram in it and love that its so powerful, and no moving parts.
One can dream...
I hope
I hope they don't make the 15 inch macbook pro thinner and omit all of the things like firewire and dvd drive, thats what makes it a pro model..
I hope they don't make the 15 inch macbook pro thinner and omit all of the things like firewire and dvd drive, thats what makes it a pro model..
FireWire must die so that thunderbolt can have more elbow room. once thunderbolt peripherals take off FireWire is toast.
I actually removed a part of my answer which addressed this very point
Except people having worked with touch screens, knowing just how useless they are, unless they're going to use it for app development... The way things are today, I wouldn't even pay 50 dollars extra for a touch screen. Hell, I wouldn't even pay the cost for the hardware and installation.
Laptops with touch screen is either for people who for one reason or another needs it (I know a professor in maths that uses touch screen with a stylus during lectures), or who uses it as a gimmick (running Ubuntu Netbook Edition or Windows 8 for instance) - not for the general public.
If it's an addition, go for it, I couldn't care less because I wouldn't use it. But in a comparison, trackpad/mouse win over touchscreen any day.
If you're sitting close enough to your laptop, be it 13" or 17", that you could use the touchscreen instead of a trackpad without wearing your arm out, you're sitting closer to your laptop than most people I know.
I am using keyboard shortcuts, and I can use my trackpad without really having to move my arms. In order for me to touch my screen, it's a lot bigger gesture.
I don't even know what to say...
Well from what i understand mac os x is moving closer to an ios type operating system, is it not?
Also, your argument against the touch screen is based on and all about the tech you have seen so far incorporated in the PC world of laptops (which does suck and is dumb). Not what Apple can do to revolutionize it. Which is also a major part of my argument, that Apple can take something like that, that isnt working, and make it work, AMAZINGLY WELL.
So basically what im saying is yes you win the argument, because your argument is based on the idea that apple (and software developers) wouldnt alter anything else when incorporating a touchscreen on a laptop. So therefore, yes, i agree, it would be dumb.
Its pretty obvious that apple wouldnt just pop on a touchscreen and be like, see, its better.
We are seeing the move to merge ios and mac osx if not fully, pretty close.
And lets face it, even if apples touchscreen on the iphone and ipad work amazingly well if not perfect, and perfectly with the os, its still a gimmick even then, and gimmicks sell things, and this ones useful.
Im still having a really hard time understanding your argument against the touchscreen. i guess i just dont understand how much and what you are doing with your track pad. the only thing i do is click to select things....and like i said before, i do this 16 hours a day. i just cant see how having to stop, wipe your finger around on the trackpad, find the pointer, move it to where you want to select, then tap, is better than just........tap. i would think just reaching up for a second to tap (with out bending or twisting the wrist) vs. bring my hand/wrist back or twisting it to reach the trackpad than doing the other movements to tap is better/more efficient especially for my carpel tunnel. which every laptop user has
I would like to see some one address that whole issue in detail....
of course you have to understand i am also considering that to employ the touch screen effectively a more ios like os (which is coming) and alterations to third party software as well, along with maybe some kind of redesign of the case would make it effective than the trackpad.
Which brings me back to my first post of the fact that, i dont see how the macbook pro can go anywere else (because it is so perfect right now), and that something like the touchscreen could possible be the only other way to go for anything to be considered a "redesign"which is what this thread is about or "revolutionary" which is what apple is about.
im not simply just into this idea because its "cool" or would be "cool." i really believe it would make my experience and work more efficient in photo, music, and video editing software as well as all the other average/normal activities.
i mean seriously,
lightroom changing exposure setting:
wheres the pointer, swipe, there it is, drag, point, tap, hold drag.
or
tap, drag
or
internet browsing tab change:
wheres the pointer, swipe, there it is, drag, point, tap.
or
tap
or
open application
wheres the pointer, swipe, there it is, drag, tap
or
tap
this is tiring to you? really?
i want to see someone address issues like that, when arguing that it would be tiring, dumb, or efficient.
and i appreciate you sticking with me and trying to help me understand.
I will agree with you that FireWire should be the future, and it will be. It'll be the only port we need.
But the problem is that thunderbolt peripherals still haven't taken off. Especially adapters.
I still cannot buy a firewire>thunderbolt adapter. There are a couple of adapters/docks coming out in the second half of 2012 (earliest one by Belkin in September) and it costs $300. A second manufacturer delayed it from a last month release to "sometime in the second half of 2012" because they did not want to release at such a high price point, and hope that as the technology matures (meaning chipsets become less expensive to make), they can pass on those savings.
Given that these won't be available until the end of the year, affordable or not, how can they cut off FireWire support if adapters don't even physically exist?
I will gladly give up the firewire port for a $100 firewire>thunderbolt adapter. But not $300.
As long as the Thunderbolt Display at $999 is the only firewire adapter available, then I just can't. I rely on my firewire hardware.
Maybe it is, but why don't you check out what people think about Windows 8's new "start menu"? It's nothing if not designed for a touch interface, and people just don't like it.
No, it's mainly based on the fact that the way we sit by computers today, a touch screen is something that will cause physical problems on a level that the mouse hasn't even come close to.
Either people will have to sit a lot closer, or the screen will have to be more horizontal and you need to switch out the keyboard/palm rest for something more in the size of one of those small Apple bluetooth keyboards.
If you're not going to bother reading my posts, I don't see the point in writing another one. But basically, for me (and most others) it takes a very small movement with a finger to cover events on the screen, and the hands are just by the keyboard. The two things we use are right there. For me (and most others), exchanging the trackpad for a touchscreen would mean enormous strain on our shoulders, back and neck.Im still having a really hard time understanding your argument against the touchscreen. i guess i just dont understand how much and what you are doing with your track pad. the only thing i do is click to select things....and like i said before, i do this 16 hours a day. i just cant see how having to stop, wipe your finger around on the trackpad, find the pointer, move it to where you want to select, then tap, is better than just........tap. i would think just reaching up for a second to tap (with out bending or twisting the wrist) vs. bring my hand/wrist back or twisting it to reach the trackpad than doing the other movements to tap is better/more efficient especially for my carpel tunnel. which every laptop user has
I would like to see some one address that whole issue in detail....
of course you have to understand i am also considering that to employ the touch screen effectively a more ios like os (which is coming) and alterations to third party software as well, along with maybe some kind of redesign of the case would make it effective than the trackpad.
Which brings me back to my first post of the fact that, i dont see how the macbook pro can go anywere else (because it is so perfect right now), and that something like the touchscreen could possible be the only other way to go for anything to be considered a "redesign"which is what this thread is about or "revolutionary" which is what apple is about.
im not simply just into this idea because its "cool" or would be "cool." i really believe it would make my experience and work more efficient in photo, music, and video editing software as well as all the other average/normal activities.
i mean seriously,
lightroom changing exposure setting:
wheres the pointer, swipe, there it is, drag, point, tap, hold drag.
or
tap, drag
or
internet browsing tab change:
wheres the pointer, swipe, there it is, drag, point, tap.
or
tap
or
open application
wheres the pointer, swipe, there it is, drag, tap
or
tap
this is tiring to you? really?
i want to see someone address issues like that, when arguing that it would be tiring, dumb, or efficient.
and i appreciate you sticking with me and trying to help me understand.
If you're one of those people who would benefit from a touchscreen, then get one. They've been on the market for quite some time. You can even make just about any screen into a touchscreen with minimal effort. So no point in waiting... Google it and you'll have what you're longing for within a week.
Just sold my 15" 2.2 i7 Oct 2011 MBP for £1200. Actually made a profit on selling it so quite happy.
Quick question though. In the past, when Apple has updated/redesigned their lines, have the price points remained relatively the same? I'm looking to get the 15" mid version so my budget is around £1800.
Quick question though. In the past, when Apple has updated/redesigned their lines, have the price points remained relatively the same? I'm looking to get the 15" mid version so my budget is around £1800.
Looking at other ultrabooks currently released with IB, i'd sadly have to say there are slim chances we will get to see a 13" with a GPU and also even with a quad core
We might just get a bump into ivy bridge, better screen and a mix between MBA and MBP ala the thicker ipad for example.
In that case i don't know what laptop i'll go for, 15" too big 13" too weak
you should be safe. Starting price on the 15" won't be more that £1600 (less even)
and also even with a quad core We might just get a bump into ivy bridge, better screen and a mix between MBA and MBP ala the thicker ipad for example.
In that case i don't know what laptop i'll go for, 15" too big 13" too weak
you should be safe. Starting price on the 15" won't be more that £1600 (less even)
