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Adobe Executive Kevin Lynch Discusses Flash on Mac, iPhone, and iPad

tenniscutie215 said:
Flash works perfectly on macs. I own a MacBook and an iMac and Flash works fine
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So perfectly that whenever you hit the play button on youtube’s newest HD features you’ll first greeted with a nice rainbow beachball and then your CPU usage is skyrocketing into the infinite.

Even Pentium 4 computers handle HD videos quite well. This is inexcusable and I truly believe we’re facing the beginning of the end of the Flash era. May it be speedy and pro-open-source.
 
Its not about functionality - its about flash's ability to pirate media and compete with the app store.
 
moose122891 said:
Not true. Apple has provided 2 API's that will allow them to take advantage of hardware acceleration. They are OpenCL and Grand Central Dispatch. OpenCL allows developers to tap into the GPU and use it to execute code usually held in reserve for just the CPU. Grand Central Dispatch allows developers to code for multicore processors, but instead of them having to create separate threads for their application, the operating system handles it and splits it up into multiple threads depending on how many are available. So Adobe cannot say that they are unable to create a good Flash plug-in due to lack of proper API's, it's all there waiting for them they, just need to get going.
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Does OpenCL allow access to VP4? I think that is what Adobe is looking to get to and from what they are whining about Apple is denying them access.

For those that don't know VP4 is the PureVideo hardware acceleration that Nvidia uses the do full hardware acceleration of h.264. From my understanding it does not use the shader pipeline like the ATI solution, so OpenCL needs to be able to talk to it directly.
 
AdeFowler said:
I'd like to know who the "top websites" are, and how many there are of which 85% use flash. It seems a bit of a throw away statement.
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Before Adobe goes off bashing Apple for not allowing them to give us Flash on the iPhone (to use 85% of the web, apparently).. they better darn well make sure their mobile flash actually works with all the big video streaming sites. I know ESPN360 requires you to install the Move Player, which is flash-based, but requires a platform dependent install. Good luck with that on the iPhone.

If people get Flash on their iPhones, but all it does is gives them ads and pulldown menus and restaurant splash screens, they'll be pretty peeved. Apple may be saving Adobe from itself.

I'm very pro- "keep it the eff away". I think Flash itself is nice, but I don't like it as a browser plugin. If people want to make Flash sites, they should make fully flash sites with their own URI's. Stop the http plugin piggybacking.
 
TMay said:
And that statement, my friend, is why you and yours are never going to be allowed on Apple Mobile products. You have a business model of not only creating crap, but accepting that same crap as an excepted standard of generating income. A living, breathing industry that has emphysema from breathing the same stench that you create.

My momma warned me about Flashers...
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Spoken by someone who obviously doesn't know jack about Flash development, nor of its myriad uses all over the web. I hate to break it to you Flash-haters, but Flash is still the best tool out there for rich media content on the web, and it isn't going anywhere anytime soon. But I suppose that anytime the cult leader Jobs says something, the ditto heads come out in droves to nod their heads in approval. "Yes, master Jobs. Whatever you say must be true master Jobs. HTML5... HTML5... HTML5..."
 
I am no advocate for html5 but I treat Flash as the equivalent bane of Real Media format. You do not need it. I have a flash blocker plugin on firefox and manage just fine.
 
mabaker said:
So perfectly that whenever you hit the play button on youtube’s newest HD features you’ll first greeted with a nice rainbow beachball and then your CPU usage is skyrocketing into the infinite.

Even Pentium 4 computers handle HD videos quite well. This is inexcusable and I truly believe we’re facing the beginning of the end of the Flash era. May it be speedy and pro-open-source.
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Funny that doesn't happen to me on an original Aluminum iMac. Yes the cpu usage is high but it is nowhere near pegged and there are no beachballs for me.
 
diamond.g said:
Does OpenCL allow access to VP4? I think that is what Adobe is looking to get to and from what they are whining about Apple is denying them access.

For those that don't know VP4 is the PureVideo hardware acceleration that Nvidia uses the do full hardware acceleration of h.264. From my understanding it does not use the shader pipeline like the ATI solution, so OpenCL needs to be able to talk to it directly.
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Well PureVideo HD decodes H.264 video and is built into the architecture of new GPU's from Nvidia. Since it is a hardware based technology instead of software based, OpenCL sould be able to harness that technology as well. It should be able to take advantage of all of the hardware available because it includes a language C99, that allows developers to write at the kernel level of the OS.
 
fruitpunch.ben said:
That statement probably includes those using flash advertisments, something I'm more than happy to not have flash capabilities for!
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Our Web site uses it mostly for ads that are no "richer" in content than animated GIF. I tried to learn how to do that using Flash since it came with CS3, but it was the biggest pain in the butt on Earth.

We also use it for embedded videos, but I have been exploring ways to use non-Flash methods since you can't see the videos on an iPhone. I'm importing all of our videos to YouTube since it has the iPhone app, but then I noticed that our video host is running trials of h.264.

The stories of how Flash affects performance on a Mac are all so true. I tried playing FarmVille at work on this dual-1.8Ghz Power Mac G5. Explain to me why it should struggle so much on something that is literally a cartoon character walking across a farm. THIS is why I'm all behind Steve and HTML5. If there's a better way to build a mouse trap, build it that way.
 
MoreMaypo said:
but Flash is still the best tool out there for rich media content on the web, and it isn't going anywhere anytime soon.
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What flash does well - is ads, media streaming and gorgeous, funny websites

The first will go wherever the money is, the second will go wherever the piracy isn't and as for great flash websites - they can make an app for that.
 
Love the looks but the personality bytes. Flash is like an aging supermodel. (Man or woman)
 
khull said:
I am no advocate for html5 but I treat Flash as the equivalent bane of Real Media format. You do not need it. I have a flash blocker plugin on firefox and manage just fine.
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Man, Real Media. I remember that from back in the day. The mother of all proprietary formats! Thank goodness for that format's death. Now if we could just kill Windows Media since so many Web sites LOVE to use that. Why they can't use QuickTime or mpeg-4 is beyond me.
 
MoreMaypo said:
Spoken by someone who obviously doesn't know jack about Flash development, nor of its myriad uses all over the web. I hate to break it to you Flash-haters, but Flash is still the best tool out there for rich media content on the web, and it isn't going anywhere anytime soon. But I suppose that anytime the cult leader Jobs says something, the ditto heads come out in droves to nod their heads in approval. "Yes, master Jobs. Whatever you say must be true master Jobs. HTML5... HTML5... HTML5..."
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Oh dear. I am so chastised.

Go tilt at windmills on some other platform pal.

You and your ilk lost.

Get over it.
 
I'm really sick of the HTML5 mantra. Most of you spouting this don't even know what it means. HTML5 is not ready to replace Flash. Canvas and Video are the only tags even halfway ready right now, and the browser support for these is quite fragmented. What people call "HTML5" is a working group, and it is a slow, multi-year advancement towards a final standard. Javascript is ***** as a development platform -- they still haven't moved to Ecmascript 3.0 (which is what Flash's ActionScript 3 is based on), and the same slowness people complain about with Flash will be seen with complex "HTML5" sites using Canvas and Video and other things all compositing on top of each other. In fact, I'd wager that an "HTML5" site that replicates an advanced Flash site will be slower. Look at the Canvas tech demos out there. They have potential, but they are slow! Sure, videos..if you can get the browsers to agree on a standard, most videos could be played using the Video tag. But the other stuff, forget it. HTML5 is not ready, so stop trying to force it down everyone's throats.

Basically, most people when they speak of HTML5 and Flash have no ***** idea what they're talking about because they're not developers.
 
"85% of the top websites have Flash on their website."

ok genius... now what percentage of that is ADVERTISING?

or... what percentage of all that flash content is UTTERLY USELESS TO ME?

90%?

this whole "flash runs the web" nonsense is ridiculous... what percentage of ALL flash is advertising? vast, vast, vast majority....
 
AppleMojo said:
Wow.


The Olympics seem relevant at the moment, as well as use an advanced datagrid component delivered in Flash.

http://www.nbcolympics.com/teamusa/browser/index.html

How about another map / browsing component for the Olympics delivered in Flash.

http://www.nbcolympics.com/nations/region=4/index.html

The Olympic sites also deliver content using Java. There is a purpose for each.

I don't have to list these websites, the deniers are full of crap. Flash is everywhere.

What the majority of these kool-aid drinkers are forgetting is that developers ARE developing in Flash, which means there is an investment in time and education to produce even the most annoying of advertisements. It is a living, breathing industry.

Go browse and learn about AS3 (an ECMA standard Object Oriented development language - compiled, not script):

http://www.adobe.com/livedocs/flash/9.0/ActionScriptLangRefV3/

or just understand its history:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ActionScript

Killing Flash is going to be very much equal to removing Python or Ruby from the industry. It isn't going to happen.

Now, if you've made it this far and you are interested in more facts, take a gander at this entry showing job trends and a few popular languages including Objective-C and Actionscript.

http://www.blackcj.com/blog/2010/02/01/cut-the-drama-flash-is-here-to-stay/

Regards to Adobe being lazy; Go educate yourself so you sound more intelligent on the topic:

Air on Mobile Devices:
http://www.adobe.com/aboutadobe/pressroom/pressreleases/201002/021510FlashPlayerMWC.html

Tinic Uro blogs about Flash performance / tech:
http://www.kaourantin.net/2010/02/core-animation.html

And, we'll finish this off with the fact that more than 7 million people attempted to download Flash on the iPhone:

http://www.flashmobileblog.com/2010/02/06/iphone-stats-from-the-flash-player-download-center/

And don't get me started on HTML5 and it actually being considered a contender at its current product maturity level. a 1.0 or even 2.0 product will never catch up. The world turns.
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Great post!

(I made a couple snips because of length when quoting)
 
muskratboy said:
"85% of the top websites have Flash on their website."

ok genius... now what percentage of that is ADVERTISING?

or... what percentage of all that flash content is UTTERLY USELESS TO ME?

90%?

this whole "flash runs the web" nonsense is ridiculous... what percentage of ALL flash is advertising? vast, vast, vast majority....
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too true, thank god for adblocker on firefox :D

anyways i think it'd be good for adobe and apple to finally get over themselves and sort this out,
 
this is business, Flash will open a door to build apps, Apple want to sell Apps, if Apple decide to show Flash content then Apple sales will go down, later people wont buy videos, and so on and on and on until Apple devices became just a hardware for free content. get it? screw Flash, let's see what html5 can bring or better yet let's see what css developers can create! (I mean, the animations on iweb galleries are great and they aren't make with Flash)
 
inlovewithi said:
I knew that when Jobs called Adobe lazy, that the mac fans were going to start repeating over and over on the Internet. The guy is smart, getting people to spread the FUD that he wants to spread. Manipulating, but overall smart.

Forget that Apple doesn't want to work with Adobe to make flash better on the Mac.

Apple hates flash because it would cost them money.
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I understand your logic, but it's just not LOGICAL.

Apple hates Flash because, as the Adobe CEO himself said, Flash doesn't run right on Apples.
 
Bennieboy© said:
too true, thank god for adblocker on firefox :D

anyways i think it'd be good for adobe and apple to finally get over themselves and sort this out,
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Luckily for us Safari users, AdBlock's technology has been ported. :D Now I have no reason to use firefox and a better browsing experience. :eek:

japanime said:
+1

Very good point.
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Or maybe its because Flash really does suck.
 
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