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On the contrary, this doesn't sound (no pun intended) anything like a manufacturing problem.

It feels more like independent stereo output buffers are being used, and they can get out of sync.
Curious what gives you that feeling? We've essentially got one bit of data: "not shipping". It seems like some serious tea leaves reading to infer the underlying architectural issue from that...
 
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PLEASE explain why, I really don't understand why Apple HAD to announce any such thing. Immediately or even ever.

There are already many, many Bluetooth options available. I have 1 right here.

Genuinely asking for explanation.

You are going to have to connect the dots on your own. I think my reasoning is pretty self explanatory.
 
Yeah, I do. I also remember Steve publicly calling IBM out for their failure (that had nothing whatsoever to do with Apple, beyond believing IBM's lies) and switching to Intel in recognition of that failure.

Missteps are far more forgivable when the steps to remediate the error are swift, public, and effective. All Tim can muster is gutless apologies.

This isn't some last-minute bug. This is a fundamental defect in their entire design and architecture. This is a problem they should have solved by last March. They don't even have a product.

Actually, it's more like IBM couldn't deliver at the price Apple was willing to pay.

Go take a look at the Power9 CPUs.
 
Ahah, that's what I thought. :rolleyes: Actually, that's not true, I really thought there might have been substance. Particularly, funnily enough, in YOUR post. My mistake.

Okay I will spell it out for you. They pulled the jack off the phone and in order to limit the backlash this was going to cause they felt compelled to launch the pods. They couldn't pull the jack and just tell people "deal with it."
 
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Okay I will spell it out for you. They pulled the jack off the phone and in order to limit the backlash this was going to cause they felt compelled to launch the pods. They couldn't pull the jack and just tell people "deal with it."
You're not explaining, just restating. They pulled the jack, bundled headphones as always, and other options are available. All normal, nothing new here. No compulsion whatsoever. I'm asking for a logical or rational explanation as to why dropping the jack would require THEM to produce alternatives when they already exist. If they were bundling the AirPods with the phone, then yes. But they clearly do not feel a need to do that.
 
The real is that, Apple realised how stupid that design is and now having second thoughts about mass producing that joke of a design.

But not as much as a joke as this post is. So you believe Apple scrapped a finalized product in terms of design because it was a "Second thought." Perhaps you can Elaborate on mass production and what it takes for a 42 Billion dollar company to execute this.
 
The real is that, Apple realised how stupid that design is and now having second thoughts about mass producing that joke of a design.
Funny...John Gruber says their his favorite new Apple product in years.

"If Apple could mass produce AirPods that worked exactly like my review unit pair does, it would be great. Not perfect, but totally great. These AirPods are my favorite new Apple product in years — exactly as they are."
 
Curious what gives you that feeling? We've essentially got one bit of data: "not shipping". It seems like some serious tea leaves reading to infer the underlying architectural issue from that...

That wasn't the only data. Look at the thread title :)

My post was going by the original article claim that the delay is about channel synchronization.

Hard to think of a manufacturing defect that could cause that, which wouldn't stem from a poor design. Like relying on matched timing crystals or something.

Now, if the thread title is no longer correct, then of course all related posts are meaningless. (Or someone went into damage control mode.)
 
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You're not explaining, just restating. They pulled the jack, bundled headphones as always, and other options are available. All normal, nothing new here. No compulsion whatsoever. I'm asking for a logical or rational explanation as to why dropping the jack would require THEM to produce alternatives when they already exist. If they were bundling the AirPods with the phone, then yes. But they clearly do not feel a need to do that.

I can explain it to you but I can't understand it for you.
 
What the hell more do you need? There was an email that Tim Cook wrote to a potential customer that was publicized a couple weeks back stating the AirPods would be released in a few weeks. Did you miss it? Do you need him to set up a press conference? I swear the world is devolving fast. The movie Idiocracy is proving to be prophetic!
With the white iPhone 4 Apple put out a press release in July 2010. And then another one when the white iPhone became available in April of 2011. That's a bigger delay than any product under Cook's watch. Oh and let's not forget about Apple announcing in April of 2007 that Leopard would be delayed until October because of the iPhone. Yet somehow Tim Cook is the major screwup who needs to be fired.

Statement by Apple on White iPhone 4

White iPhone Arrives Tomorrow

Of course AirPods aren't iPhone so perhaps Cook and Schiller don't think they're important enough to warrant one.
 
Did you pay nothing for access to the MacRumors summary, or the ability to use these forums? Because, clearly, all their staff work for free.

I really hate posts like this...

MacRumors offer all that for free so no, I don't pay anything to access MacRumors. I guess they cover all their costs through advertising.

The Wall Street Journal has a paywall which someone was trying to circumvent in order to steal the content.
 
Glad that Gruber clarified it.

Basically WSJ were just trying to get the Christmas AirPods-hungry people to read that paywalled article = $$$

Shame. Shame.
 
They should have just acquired bragi and redesigned the dash. Apple has the money to do so and has acquired other companies to further its brand. Beats, but can't figure out how it works...
 
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It feels more like independent stereo output buffers are being used, and they can get out of sync.

As left and right are both independent and receive their own bluetooth signal of course there are independent "output buffers".

What makes matter worse: the signal can be huge amounts of times apart depending on pairing time and error correction / retransmit.

So as far as I can see the air pods need some extremely precise NTP-like clock sync. Because if the left and right channel are only a few ms, actually just a few samples apart the phase shift will irritate the left and right correlation of the human brain majorly, ...
 
I was hoping it would make it so the battery would last more than 5 hrs! I actually like Earbuds, it's the only headphones that doesn't hurt my ears after an hr of use. So I was looking forward to getting this until they said the stupid things only get 5 hrs. Why even bother?
 
I said it before and I'll say it again. Consumers who want these AirPods don't care what the issue(s) are. Apple should just come out and say we've had a problem but we are committed to releasing these as soon as we can. Our engineers are working to provide the best experience for our customers (and all that crap they normally say). Heck, they resourced those wifi engineers so get them working on this.
 
The market is full of Bluetooth earphones, isn't it?

Yes there are tons. I've got two sets of cheap ones. I think I paid about $55 for them combined. But I suspect the W1 chip which is in the Beats would make it a better experience for someone like me in the Apple eco-system.
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I was hoping it would make it so the battery would last more than 5 hrs! I actually like Earbuds, it's the only headphones that doesn't hurt my ears after an hr of use. So I was looking forward to getting this until they said the stupid things only get 5 hrs. Why even bother?

I think you are supposed to carry the charging case with you and that recharges them for something like 24 hours. Five hours at a listen and then you pop them into the case to be recharged seems fine. I know I've never listened to headphones for five hours in a row.
 
I hope they offer insurance for replacement should one be lost.

I'm looking forward to buying a set
 
This makes no physical sense what so ever. These buds are, what a foot apart and bluetooth happens at the speed of ***** light. Receiving the signal at the same time is nonsense. If it is two independent signals and the problem is that the earbuds aren't receiving the right signals at the right time, its because the right signals aren't being broadcast at the right time.

And honestly, how is such a simple problem such a huge obstacle for Apple? For how long have we been broadcasting simultaneous stereo radio signals?

Broadcasting, even digitally, sure. But have you ever tried receiving a stereo signal on two different digital receivers? I have not seen any system where they play at even roughly the same time, due to small differences in internal decoding runtime. There's always a little, unacceptable echo. I have also not experienced any bluetooth headphones or speakers that synch perfectly to video played on an ipad. For music that may be out of synch bluetooth is fine. But if you require perfect synch it's incredibly hard. I'd be surprised if Apple can actually pull it off.
 
Broadcasting, even digitally, sure. But have you ever tried receiving a stereo signal on two different digital receivers? I have not seen any system where they play at even roughly the same time, due to small differences in internal decoding runtime. There's always a little, unacceptable echo. I have also not experienced any bluetooth headphones or speakers that synch perfectly to video played on an ipad. For music that may be out of synch bluetooth is fine. But if you require perfect synch it's incredibly hard. I'd be surprised if Apple can actually pull it off.

How about Sonos, either independent or when set as a stereo pair?
 
So Apple is announcing product releases before they've even completed the design and engineering phase?
The only reason they released this is so customers don't eat them alive for removing the headphone jack (didn't work quite well)
 
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