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AnandTech's Deep Dive Into M1 Pro and M1 Max Highlights Performance and Efficiency Improvements
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Well, considering that Apple has over 1 billion iPhones and 100 million Macs, and seeing the type of content inside Apple Arcade, I think it’s more that Apple is opting to prioritise the more lucrative market here with their gaming ambitions.
“The #M1Max is the fastest GPU we have ever measured in the @affinitybyserif Photo benchmark. It outperforms the W6900X – a $6000, 300W desktop part – because it has immense compute performance, immense on-chip bandwidth and immediate transfer of data on and off the GPU (UMA).” pic.twitter.com/iPg3L56y2u
— Andy Somerfield (@andysomerfield) October 25, 2021
And that was in a 12c Mac Pro.
— Andy Somerfield (@andysomerfield) October 25, 2021
And that was in a 12c Mac Pro.
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The problem is, they need those titles first. Who's going to buy the hardware without the games to back it up? What Apple could do (and probably will do), is wait for the installed base of higher end M1 SoC's to grow (and spread to lower end systems) - a year or two after the transition is complete and we're onto 2nd or 3rd generation SoC's. Then start bringing AAA titles to the Mac (Apple Arcade+). Either by developing their own or financing game studios to develop them. Once there's enough titles, release an TV "XL" with M# Max for $399 with a 6 month subscription to Apple Arcade+.
Unfortunately, Apple's probably going to have go their own way, yet again, and develop their own game engine (GameKit) that's optimized for Metal and their GPU's and scalable across all their products.
Did you also noticed the blurb that said those are mostly x86 games being played through Apple's translation layer? It's not the silicon that needs improvement, it's the games themselves. None of them are optimized for Apple's GPU's. And none of them will be as there's just no market for it on the Mac.
Why would anyone want a dedicated pro laptop to be like playstation? I am glad Apple doesn’t give 2 f’s about the 40 year old virgin that wants to game everywhere.
Hopefully the Blender org support action is a sign of serious efforts being put on the job. We really need developers to get out of the CUDA spell…
But Apple has to reach out. It would be shameful these machines get crippled by poor or nonexistent software adoption…This also has to really happen prior to the introduction of the “heavy weight” iMac and Mac Pro…otherwise “marginal” sales all over again.
$3,499.00 is all you need to get the "Max", with enough memory and storage for gaming.
Or $3,099.00 if you buy the smaller one.
I would still not buy it just for that, because there are not enough games or optimized games.
But it is almost half the price you mentioned.
With "high power mode" incoming I don't think the 14 inch throttles, so much as the 16 inch model will overclock under high loads.
If Apple's power and thermal claims are accurate then these chips put out far less heat for the same level of performance than the Intel chipsets they replace. This means throttling is probably less of a worry.
Also, TBDR GPUs isn't what Vulkan games typically run on, so if they went with it we'd probably just have unoptimised stuff *only*. Switching to Vulkan would be dumb on their part. What they've always needed to do is evangelise Metal a lot more, but I'm not even sure if they know how to evangelise anymore.
Also probably buying up a studio and/or paying for exclusives, but that should have been done years ago ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I just watched a video comparing a maxed-out Intel i9 16" and a maxed-out M1... uh... Max 16"
CineBench: 9,000 points for the Intel... 12,300 points for the M1 Max.
Even in low-power mode the M1 Max 16" scored almost 11,000 points.
Oh... and the Intel machine sounded like a hairdryer... the M1 Max machine was silent.
I know benchmarks aren't the be-all-end-all... but CineBench stresses all cores. So for the Max 16" to remain silent under that load... wow.
CineBench: 9,000 points for the Intel... 12,300 points for the M1 Max.
Even in low-power mode the M1 Max 16" scored almost 11,000 points.
Oh... and the Intel machine sounded like a hairdryer... the M1 Max machine was silent.
I know benchmarks aren't the be-all-end-all... but CineBench stresses all cores. So for the Max 16" to remain silent under that load... wow.
That threadripper looks like it is very power efficient as well. M1 Pro configs looks like a bargain in the CPU department in comparison. Silence when rendering-so important!
This is also due to the fact that the Intel MacBook Pro is much thinner. The Apple Silicon is thicker and has more room for cooling and better fans.
(Of course, the Apple Silicon MacBook is also more efficient.)
Thank you for your detailed reply.
To be honest, it left me with even more questions
Nevertheless, appreciated.
Are any AAA games optimized for TBDR? Or better question, any game engines optimized for Apple's GPU's? I'd guess not.
Also as I mentioned in another post... Wait a year or two after the transition is over. Apple may be biding their time... waiting for the installed based of systems with higher-end SoCs to reach a certain threshold. Then it might be worth their time and resources to create their own game engine specifically targeting their GPU's. And who knows maybe even starting adding gaming (3D) specific IP to their SoC's; physics, ray tracing, etc.
Let's face it, we're only going to see great AAA games on Macs when and if Apple decides to make it happen. Apple is going have to prove that their hardware is capable of playing "hardcore" games. No one else seems to think it's worth it to them. Mac users have been in this situation before and Apple was forced to step in.
Apple could eventually push low end "Pro" SoC (M1 Pro 6+2/14) down to consumer models, Mac mini, 24" iMac to build that installed base. Once there's a somewhat decent library of games on the Mac, Apple could then decide to release a gaming TV for significantly less than a Mac with similarly equipped SoC. And add those games to Apple Arcade+.
Yes, I know what MoltenVK is and how it works. And on top of that, I'm glad it exists!
But that doesn't change the fact that its a just a workaround. Apple could just bringt native support for Vulkan to MacOS, but Apple chose not to do that, resulting in extra (costly) work for game developers to bring games to the Mac... or in other words: Apple is actively hindering gaming on the Mac by omission.
And yes, Apple can do as Apple pleases and we have to suck it up or just buy a windows gaming laptop instead. Its just disappointing that the M1 Max could enable the Macbook Pro to be a really decent gaming machine, next to being a awesome workhorse, but by Apples decisions, it lacks (natively supported) games and therefore isn't.
This guy...
I'm getting clingy ex-girlfriend vibes... ?
finance.yahoo.com
I can kinda see his foundry argument. It would be good to have multiple suppliers. But he has to prove that Intel can be a better foundry than TSMC.
As for CPUs... Apple's now designing their own. Sorry Pat...
I'm getting clingy ex-girlfriend vibes... ?
Intel CEO: My job is to win Apple back
Intel has its sights set on regaining lost business from Apple, explains CEO Pat Gelsinger at Yahoo Finance's All Markets Summit.
I can kinda see his foundry argument. It would be good to have multiple suppliers. But he has to prove that Intel can be a better foundry than TSMC.
As for CPUs... Apple's now designing their own. Sorry Pat...
Good, good…
Now put them in the big iMac please Apple I’m literally begging you to let me give you money
I’ve been waiting to update my 5k for 6 years
Now put them in the big iMac please Apple I’m literally begging you to let me give you money
I’ve been waiting to update my 5k for 6 years
Regarding games, I think people gave up buying Macs to play games. If you want to game you just don't do it. It is ok to have macs as your general computing device and something else (console or windows PC) to game on. You won't burst into flames having a windows machine in your house alongside your mac, its ok.
Initially I was annoyed that there was a notch but then saw that it is simply a part of the menu bar. Problem solved, its not taking up any space.
Initially I was annoyed that there was a notch but then saw that it is simply a part of the menu bar. Problem solved, its not taking up any space.