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OH MAH GAWSH

Apple is releasing an optional App Store for Macs!!!111!!

We're doomed!!one!!!!


We can no longer compile our own software! Oh wait, we can.

Well, we can't install system hacks any more! Oh wait, we can.

But I like installing apps from .dmg files! Oh wait, I still can.


But most importantly, I loved spending all day every day explaining to new Mac users on the forums how to install apps from disk imagines instead of some sort of one step installer. Dammit, what else am I going to do with all of my free time now?
:rolleyes:

Yes.
Is anybody else reminded of the forums after the Intel switch was announced?
 
If I own an iPhone (which I do), and Mac (which I do), and an iPad (which I don't yet), i'm going to have to pay 3 times to use the same (insert desired app name here) on each device?

Oh :apple: you slay me.

No you won't.Watch the video of the event.Mac and iOS will be separate,but you can install an OS X App store App on all your Macs free.IOS Apps will be separate,but have the same(non)restrictions.
I think it's fair because they are pretty different.

Any Devs want to chime in?Do you want your OS X and iOS apps treated as one?Buy one and get the other version free?
 
To the people who think this won't work with a mouse on Mac, you guys clearly don't know how many times this game has been ported to other platform.

The latest of which is the PS3 that uses both the regular controller and the new Move controller (a new PS3 controller that resembles the Wii remote). The game is also coming to the Wii later. So I don't see how it wouldn't work on a Mac.
 
Mmm...

I guess this means the crapware WILL be coming to OS X. :(
Uh? "Will"??

OS X already had lots of (subjective) crapware and why would one expect an App Store to be different?

The iPhone App Store is the same. Of course the Mac App Store will be too. Devs build (subjective) crap. Among other things.

But... There's a review system in place for you to filter away bad apps.

Unlike outside of App Stores where you have to hunt for review sites and ask on forums.
 
I'm a little concerned about the pricing of these Mac App Store Apps, to be honest.

Let's say I want to buy Transmit. Currently I can buy it from Panic for $34. If Apple are going to pinch 30% of the sales cost we can only assume that the price of these applications is going to have to go up to compensate (about $14 for this application). I can't see Panic choosing to make less money from their work.

Of course they could just sell it on their website for less than through the Mac App Store, but I'd imagine that will send out mixed signals and Apple won't be so happy about it.

Obviously the advertising that you get through the Mac App Store would be to your benefit, so perhaps this would factor in to your final retail figure.

Just thinking out loud.
 
No you won't.Watch the video of the event.Mac and iOS will be separate,but you can install an OS X App store App on all your Macs free.IOS Apps will be separate,but have the same(non)restrictions.
I think it's fair because they are pretty different.

You can't sell your software anymore. And that's a big dealbreaker.
 
i know steve says he wants all his devices to tie in to each other hence the new lion. I think some people are scared that they well eventually replace osx with ios. I think they are going to have similarities like we saw with the keynote (full screen apps, app store, ect..) but i dont think he is going to make them all run the same OS. the osx will always be different then the ios IMO. Otherwise mac laptops wouldn't be computers anymore, it would be an ipad with an attached keyboard!!
 
10.7 is just preparing us for the touch screen Macs that will ship with OS 11 in a few years.

Like it or not, Mac OS has officially begun morphing into a touch based UI.

Any resistance is futile.

You clearly didnt understand the keynote. Steve agreed that a touchscreen computer is awkward, and wouldnt work. The whole fact of having to reach make it pointless, let alone the other million issues it has.

Face it, it will never happen - which is a GOOD thing.

--

I was skeptical at first but now that I've had time to think about it, the MacAppStore (MAS), as far as I can tell will actually help. Before you blast this statement, let me explain. Why do people stay with Windows? Because their apps work only on windows. Why don't people use Macs? Because (lets face it) the number of apps is severely limited compared to Windows.

The MAS is going to provide an opportunity for smaller developers (heck, even big developers) to get their apps effectively advertised on every_single_mac. Sure, Apple take a cut. But in return for the best advertising in the world.
 
You can't sell your software anymore. And that's a big dealbreaker.

How the hell did you figure that out genius?

All the appstore is is ANOTHER way to sell apps...developers can and will still sell from their own websites.
 
Agreed.Just look at it from the perspective of an average consumer curious potential switcher:
Easy to use
Fantastic iLife suite
No trialware
no virus' so far
low maintenance(scandisk,registry,defrag)
attractive design
cool stuff like expose and the new launchpad(and automatic updates!)
Ultra easy way to find and purchase useful apps and games

One more reason the market share momentum is all Apple.

And judging by the way developers have avoided the App store like the plague(not),The App store's terms seem pretty attractive to many.Of course on the Mac,where a dev can go either way,they may find it's not for them.It will be very interesting to see which they prefer.

Either way The Mac app store is something I've wanted since the iPhone app store was announced.
Can't
Wait.

Easy to use — mediocre to master. Many things you do in Windows by opening countless menu's, options, advanced/extra buttons or straight into the command prompt are three to five buttons away from your desktop. I learn ICT at college. First year. Have to know which can be found where in Windows. At the end of the exercises, I do the same on my Mac (I run Windows in VirtualBox to follow along in the class). And it's sooo much easier to use, even the heavy commands most users don't even know they exist. But then again, it's still the first year in education... :rolleyes:

Fantastic iLife — Now existing of iPhoto, iMovie and GarageBand. Where is the ever so great iWeb or ... oh, never mind... I use my pro iLife, so for me it's okay whatever they use. I won't. I watch all my photos straight into... Finder. I don't have that much photos anyway. I create movies with After Effects or Premiere Pro. Don't say, but I don't like the user interface of Final Cut Studio so much. And the integration of PhotoShop, etc... But it's more of a personal preference. ;)

No trialware, until you start searching for Adobe suites on a more legal way than torrents or want to try out other apps like Snapz Pro X ( =Screen recording software)

No virus' so far. Well, except for that one time you got a virus that can't affect you. At the other thread on MacRumors... This image...
virus_warning1.png

Well, not convinced you got a My Computer screen running in Safari? Well, now you can download you own personal virus to show other people your virus scanner does work: http://www.eicar.org/anti_virus_test_file.htm
You can download a light file which will be picked up as a virus by your scanner (ClamXav.app for instance) Other than that... You may be right...

Low maintenance — Disk Utility have to run sometimes... This is the reason I wanted to post a near-counter argument against your post. But you're right. Low maintenance. Not no maintenance. You're right. I just wanted to make it clear that there still is some maintenance to do. And don't forget to use CleanMyMac if you have the money or the access to less legal ways. It's great to make space on your hard disk drive.

Attractive design — Very, very true. Usability comes before design for me, but if you got both and both integrated in each other... It's so true.
If I'm asked why or in what case Mac hardware is better than other hardware, I always use the MagSafe example. "It's the little things," I say. I let them plug in my MagSafe onto my MacBook. They're shocked, because they don't expect it to be magnetic. If I ask them why Apple decided to make it magnetic, they find it easier to use. And if I explain them if someone trips over the cable (and fully sure of myself, I let them step on my cable, which is hanging somewhere in the air between my MacBook and my hand holding it in the air. It plug out, without damaging my MacBook by carrying it on the ground. If I ask them again, they think it makes kinda sense for such an innovation as a magnetic charger.
If they're convinced about this, I can start to talk other things like trackpad, battery indicator on the MacBook Pro, the clips that let you roll up your power charger (as shown
212570131.jpg
), etc...
That combined with the excellent design makes a wonderful product, even if it's just the hardware alone. That is what makes up for the price people might argue about. After my explanation, they don't argue anymore. They tested it themselves. That is much more convincing than just explaining in words why Macs are more expensive.

Cool stuff — At the cool stuff talked in the previous section about hardware, should I even begin at the software? Even when I explain someone how to install something (Always keep a copy of Firefox.dmg of a version you don't use yourself with you to explain! ;) ) from a dmg, via drag and drop, and how to delete an app (the firefox that has just been installed) by just trashing it away. That is more than convincing enough for the ones that argue about the OS and don't know anything about it. After that, I can still talk about the other things. (Lay-out in System preferences vs Control panel, exposé, etc...)


For the ones that only read the first sections, note that I am not a Apple fanboy and want to stay neutral about the OS wars, not against. But as shown at the end of the series, I still like Apple. :D
 
Quite odd for them to say that's a screenshot when, for more than one reason, it's so obviously not.
 
When I switched to the Mac, the first thing I did was to check out Mac OS X Software... from the Apple drop down menu. The App store will make it far easier for switchers looking for apps, and finally help kill off the "is there a [x] equivalent for mac?" google searches.

It should, in theory, help prevent the spread of trojans / malicious software from untrusted download sources, too.
 
I'm a little concerned about the pricing of these Mac App Store Apps, to be honest.

Let's say I want to buy Transmit. Currently I can buy it from Panic for $34. If Apple are going to pinch 30% of the sales cost we can only assume that the price of these applications is going to have to go up to compensate (about $14 for this application). I can't see Panic choosing to make less money from their work.

Of course they could just sell it on their website for less than through the Mac App Store, but I'd imagine that will send out mixed signals and Apple won't be so happy about it.

Obviously the advertising that you get through the Mac App Store would be to your benefit, so perhaps this would factor in to your final retail figure.

Just thinking out loud.

They will sell more so, price should be unaffected or ever lower.


No you won't.Watch the video of the event.Mac and iOS will be separate,but you can install an OS X App store App on all your Macs free.IOS Apps will be separate,but have the same(non)restrictions.
I think it's fair because they are pretty different.

Any Devs want to chime in?Do you want your OS X and iOS apps treated as one?Buy one and get the other version free?

It is up to devs. Most iOS software are both ipad and iPhone ready, buy one time enjoy on all iOS devices.
 
I'm always amazed how many people don't seem to understand the basics of commercial development and its relation to a platform's success. Let's see if we can't break this down a bit.

Right now, on both Mac and Windows, the software market is utterly dominated by the big boys. Microsoft, Adobe, Apple and others just steamroll over all competition. Yes, the internet provides a way for independents to sell direct to the consumer and it's possible to make a decent living off it but unless you happen to get lucky and make it into the general awareness of the userbase it's a hard road to follow.

Now with something like the App store independents suddenly have an incredible marketing channel to a very high percentage of the userbase. Apple taking 30% isn't a bad figure at all considering the potential to increase sales (not to mention handling the hosting, letting you take credit card payments and makes upgrading easy). Think of it this way, if Apple takes 30% but you double your sales then you're up on the deal. It's also an improvement on things like Steam where all distribution deals are done in private so involve extra negotiation and no guarantee that you're getting a fair deal in relation to your competition.

So the platform becomes more popular with independent developers(or smaller companies) and the amount of apps increase (and yes, you'll see full-on productivity apps here as well, albeit it might take a little longer to develop them than things like Flight Control). This in turn attracts more users to the platform and increases the total user base for developers.

Fast forward a year or two. You have a healthy app ecosystem on the app store and a strong and increasing number of developers who find they can use their skillset to code for both OS X and iOS, more than doubling their potential target audience. As the pool of developers increases it becomes easier and easier for companies to find the development talent they need to bring bigger software projects to the platform. You end up with a snowball effect attracting more and more talent to the platform as the potential revenues increase.

THAT'S what's so exciting about the app store (doubly so as it's coming to Snow Leopard as well) and why all Mac users should be happy to see it. It's not removing anything from the OS, you can still install software any way and over time it can only benefit the platform.
 
Right now, on both Mac and Windows, the software market is utterly dominated by the big boys. Microsoft, Adobe, Apple and others just steamroll over all competition.

Now with something like the App store independents suddenly have an incredible marketing channel to a very high percentage of the userbase.
This.

Appstore on iPhone made it possible for many devs to make lots of money purely on the quality of their product, not on the quality of advertising etc

I don't particularly like the cut (will it be 30% like iPhone appstore ?),
or the control it gives apple to ban apps (control which we've seen them abuse),
but it will make it much easier for the average user to get software.

I know many mac owners (and pc owners for that matter) that don't ever install any programs - yet the same owners have plenty of apps on their iphones...
 
I'm a little concerned about the pricing of these Mac App Store Apps, to be honest.

Let's say I want to buy Transmit. Currently I can buy it from Panic for $34. If Apple are going to pinch 30% of the sales cost we can only assume that the price of these applications is going to have to go up to compensate (about $14 for this application). I can't see Panic choosing to make less money from their work.

Of course they could just sell it on their website for less than through the Mac App Store, but I'd imagine that will send out mixed signals and Apple won't be so happy about it.

Obviously the advertising that you get through the Mac App Store would be to your benefit, so perhaps this would factor in to your final retail figure.

Just thinking out loud.

If they think it's not worth it then they just won't submit it to be in the store and will solely sell it from their site. Simple.
 
Last thing I worry about is the software this might bring.

Heck, the Mac is already flooded with way more crapware than actual good games and software. And I *wish* the quality of casualware Mac games played half as good as the ones on the App-store now.
 
I have contrasting feelings about the mac app store. Most things I can think of which are positive have a potentially negative side too; the problem is we just don't know enough about the curating yet. Hopefully it is all positive, but we'll see.

An example

The number one reason I love using my mac, is that it is bloody powerful, with excellent software written by people who are absolutely dedicated and know how people like us think.

Positives for the app store - More money, more exposure, more cheap advertising, less hassle for the developers, much easier for the mac adopters, big base of developers to come through from ios (I'm not sure if that positive or negative ;) )

Negatives - Is an excellent app like LaunchBar going to be on the app store? Kudo's to apple if it is, because it has no user interface to speak of, god knows what it's getting its claws into in the back end, its purely keyboard based and its a little bit buggy.

I know that they can still sell it off their website, but when 95% of the software traffic will go through the app store, it wouldn't be sustainable if they weren't on it, they wouldn't be able to afford the advertising that was the way I and probably many others heard of it.

On the other hand, the exposure of LaunchBar, as mentioned 1password, omnigroup, scrivener etc to the wider audience might drive many many people to this superior working environment. Or the failure to get on there might drive LaunchBar and the ilk out of business.

As I said, I have conflicting thoughts. Oh well, onwards to exciting times. One thing is for sure, it sure seems this was mapped out long ago.
 
I'm not looking forward to being asked to pay yet again for Flight Control, this time for 'Flight Control Super-HD' or something.

But I'm interested in whether apps which we've already purchased licences for pre-macappstore will show up in the app store for updating and admin purposes...
 
I'm not looking forward to being asked to pay yet again for Flight Control, this time for 'Flight Control Super-HD' or something.

But I'm interested in whether apps which we've already purchased licences for pre-macappstore will show up in the app store for updating and admin purposes...
Hmmm, interesting...
 
This.

Appstore on iPhone made it possible for many devs to make lots of money purely on the quality of their product, not on the quality of advertising etc

I don't particularly like the cut (will it be 30% like iPhone appstore ?),
or the control it gives apple to ban apps (control which we've seen them abuse),
but it will make it much easier for the average user to get software.

I know many mac owners (and pc owners for that matter) that don't ever install any programs - yet the same owners have plenty of apps on their iphones...

About the control aspect: actually it gives Apple very little real control to ban apps as they can always be installed in the normal non-app-store way. The power in this equation as far as the Apple / Dev relationship goes is whether or not it's worth signing up to the app store in return for a) far easier hosting and b) the massive advertising boost you get, not to mention being easy to find / install for virtually every user of the platform. Some will look at that and decide it's not worth it, most will go the other way. That 30% cut is actually pretty reasonable all things considered and will be the last thing most (not all but most) serious devs will be worried about.

Actually, as I'm bored and have a bit of time, let's run some basic figures here. An independent developer codes an app (let's say... uh... a social network app that merges Facebook, Twitter et al). It's a relatively small application at, say, 50Mb but needs a fair bit of maintenance to keep up with changes to the relevant SDK's for those services. It has the potential to be a major hit and you now need to decide how to market it.

Let's say you host it yourself. You're expecting to sell... oh... 1,000 copies a month and update it once a month on average over the year. Everyone that buys the software downloads the latest version the day it's released. The first three months bandwidth would look like this:

1,000 * 50 = 50,000Mb
1,000 * 50 + (1,000 * 50) = 100,000Mb
1,000 * 50 + (2,000 * 50) = 150,000Mb

Total bandwidth = 300,000Mb (or 300Gb over the course of the three months).
Problem is that bandwidth grows over time so by the time you're up to month 12 you need 600Gb capacity that month just to service your users and excluding any visits to the site itself. While a lot of sites will give you 'unlimited' bandwidth that's likely to start brushing up against fair use limits on many of them so you're going to be paying around... oh, say, £20 a month for the hosting.

You then need a way of getting paid. Paypal is one option of course but that depends on your sales volume. So let's say you charge £5 for your software, that's £5,000 a month which after the extra 20p per transaction fee would be 34.5p of every transaction or about 7%.

So hosting and Paypal fees would run you 7.5% of your income (roughly, this is a horribly simple example). That's before any costs / time for designing the site, marketing, buying advertising, issuing free copies for review (still bandwidth costs associated with that), running a support forum etc etc. Even if you figure ALL of that costs you... oh... £100 a month total you're up to 10% of your income spent and a fair bit of time put aside to manage the various aspects of your business.

Realisticly then you're probably looking at paying an extra 20% to Apple in return for their service and their potential customer base. Let's say that by doing so you sell 2,000 copies a month instead of 1,000 at the same price. That would bring in £7,000 profit, as opposed to £4,500 from running everything yourself.

Now that's a terribly rough and simple example but hopefully it provides enough info to be going on with and show why developers may find Apple's store a very tempting proposition indeed.
 
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