Anyone else abandoning ship?

[Honumaui]

I like thin crust pizza
some like thick crust

reckon its worth trying the other once in awhile but not all thin or thick is created equal

bottom line is we find what we like in a OS and how we like to set it up etc..

I love tech more than I do apple but I love apple tech it just works with me better but its far from perfect and like others here sadly apple of today is not the apple of past so who knows in the future what will happen

as I say there is no better but there is better for certain peoples reasons wants needs

and at least ya gave it a solid shot !!!!! so that is what counts as so many bash one side or the other with no real experience in the other side !

So I thought it was time I updated my previous post, it has been a month. It would be fair to say it has been a month of ups and downs The first week was the hardest, I so wanted to go back to macOS cause it just had everything I needed to do what I wanted to do. But I stuck it out.

A month later I am still with Windows, I eventually found the right tools and methods to ensure I could maintain a way of working I was used to and was comfortable with.

The things I thought I would miss most on macOS have been replaced with things that I would miss more on my PC if I had to switch back to macOS.

Software:

Office! I didn't realise that office on the Mac was so different from the Windows version. Much smoother scrolling and typing, it's actually quite pleasant to use Word for example. Hard to explain but there you go.

Gestures is another one I thought I could not live without, but I have found that the option in Windows to simply create multiple desktops with different apps running turns out to be a better way of managing the things I do. IT is very well laid out and the history it keeps is useful.

As it turns out Windows has a lot more software than I remember and a lot that is a like for like version of the macOS version, just a bit different but equally usable. I spend a lot of time doing web development, Windows is not going to compete with the way macOS natively implements the kind of environment I am used to but it is close and I have managed to replicate it to the point I am pretty comfortable. WSL and the new Windows Terminal (as it matures) are going to change that from pretty comfortable to all in happy.

Overall compatibility with devices is better, as soon as I need to print on my Canon it was like, sure, we have software for that, install, print done. macOS can only use AirPrint, which is good, but troublesome.

I am not going to go on and on here, suffice to say there are many more software-related elements that are really good and in just a month would find it hard to let go of them.

Hardware:

Goes without saying that I am now in control of my Hardware. I had a 512GB NVMe in my PC, upgraded last week to a Samsung Evo 1TB NVMe for £155 and the mobo has a 2nd NVMe slot so put the 512GB in there. Also has a couple of older WD red 6TB NAS drives for storage tucked in the back.

Right now the i7-7700k and the GTX 1070 in the PC are more than I need, I did buy two new Dell Ultrasharp U2518D monitors, they were the perfect size to mount on the wall without being too big to scan from one side to the other.

I eventually settled on a Lenovo S940 laptop, love it. i7, 16GB Ram, 1TB NVMe, 3 years on-site warranty, total price £1,700. Expensive for my needs? Yes, but, the MBP I returned with the dodgy keyboard last month has a base price of £1,799 a quarter of the disk space, half the ram, less powerful CPU, no onsite-warranty. To get close to the spec of the Lenovo with Apple would cost me £2,898.

Those that know me on here will know that I am not in any way price sensitive for the right tools. But it's difficult to argue with those numbers.

Love being so much more in control of the hardware choices.

The bottom line?

I am staying with Windows as you probably guessed. Not going to get rid of my 2018 Mac Mini, having options are always preferable and I like to stay tuned in to what is happening on both sides of the fence.

Sure there are things I still miss about macOS but not enough to sway me back at this point. Nothing will drag me away from the iPad but it's looking very unlikely I will buy another iPhone. Not because of the price or that I dislike my Xs, but, there are just so many other great handsets out there that for my needs are perfectly good, I just don't see the need to pay £1k for a phone anymore.

So there you go, no longer an iSheep

 

[LeeW]

and at least ya gave it a solid shot !!!!! so that is what counts as so many bash one side or the other with no real experience in the other side !

Limping into it was never going to work, it had to be all in for a decent time period

I mean I wouldn't start telling everyone to switch to Windows, to be fair I rarely recommend macOS to people, but that is simply because they don't need it, Windows for the majority of home users is totally fine.

For now, I have found Windows a more compelling alternative when it comes to software, hardware and costs. I am happy with it.

 

[Honumaui]

Limping into it was never going to work, it had to be all in for a decent time period

I mean I wouldn't start telling everyone to switch to Windows, to be fair I rarely recommend macOS to people, but that is simply because they don't need it, Windows for the majority of home users is totally fine.

For now, I have found Windows a more compelling alternative when it comes to software, hardware and costs. I am happy with it.

Yup if your friends need help much better they would be on a os you can help with

Folks get to hung up on absolutes these days

 

[LeeW]

Yup if your friends need help much better they would be on a os you can help with

Well, no, just to be clear, this is not about having friends on Windows to help them. I just don't recommend macOS to people who ask, I never have in all the years I have used it. Just not necessary for the majority.

 

[pshufd]

I like thin crust pizza
some like thick crust

reckon its worth trying the other once in awhile but not all thin or thick is created equal

bottom line is we find what we like in a OS and how we like to set it up etc..

I love tech more than I do apple but I love apple tech it just works with me better but its far from perfect and like others here sadly apple of today is not the apple of past so who knows in the future what will happen

as I say there is no better but there is better for certain peoples reasons wants needs

and at least ya gave it a solid shot !!!!! so that is what counts as so many bash one side or the other with no real experience in the other side !

There's thin, thick, sicilian, brooklyn, different kinds of cheese or no cheese. With Apple, they give us a little variety - Air and Pro. In the Windows world, you get lots more variety.

There are a few 2015 15 MBPs maxed out for sale in my area. I'm looking at the Dell Precision 7740 as well. The latter would last me a very long time. Another 2015 would be good for five years. I actually don't need anything right now though - I'm just looking towards the future. Can Apple put something decent together this fall?

 

[LeeW]

Just wanted to add, I found the transition from iPhone to Android many times more difficult than MacOS to Windows. This may have been due in part to having previous Windows experience, but none on Android. Also I think iOS was a long way ahead of Android when I switched. I still find Android a bit of a mixed bag, with a fair amount of annoyances. Wishing you luck there!

For me, a phone is now an internet browser, Skype and messenger. I used to have a nexus 5 for work and found it great, stock android works well, or it did for me at that time. That is why I don't expect to get another iPhone at the $1k price, for what I use it for it is just silly to pay that money.

But if Apple has something competitive by the time I am looking for a new phone then I will go with it. Won't be getting rid of the Xs until it dies or forces my hand.

 

[Martyimac]

Just to add, in my situation since I use the actual phone function about 85%+ of the time, I will never again spend BIG bucks on a smartphone. If that means I have to jump ship, so be it. But I expect what will happen is I will buy a last generation of a phone when the time comes I need to replace my XS. Hopefully I will get at least 2 more years out of it.

 

[ApplesandOranges]

After reading some recent posts I had a thought.

I currently have a 2019 13" MBP, two MacBook Airs, one Mac Mini, two iPhone XS, two iPads, an Apple Watch Gen 4, and two AppleTV 4k's. In my mind I am pretty "Pro Apple".

Yet I can't help but think my current MBP keyboard is automatically covered by a replacement warranty due to issues with "some keyboards", and my 2014 Mac mini is woefully underpowered and not upgradable due to a downgrade some years ago.

On the other hand my two MacBook Airs, 2014 and 2015 respectively have been workhorses and have had zero issues. My older AppleTV was more reliable than my newer 4K models, and my previous Mac Mini was more versatile and more upgradable than the 2014 I bought new in 2017.

In other words my hardware from years past seems to be more reliable than stuff I purchased more recently. I hope this is not the new normal.

 

[0906742]

In other words my hardware from years past seems to be more reliable than stuff I purchased more recently. I hope this is not the new normal.

Unfortunately that applies to pretty much everything you buy these days. I can see the same thing with every product I upgrade. They all are just built using cheaper feeling and looking parts (for example casing material in every product just gets thinner and thinner) and especially batteries are very suspicious in most products sold these days. I was not quite expecting to see this in premium priced Apple gear, but I guess they have to compete with other companies.

 

[Mendota]

Just to add, in my situation since I use the actual phone function about 85%+ of the time, I will never again spend BIG bucks on a smartphone. If that means I have to jump ship, so be it. But I expect what will happen is I will buy a last generation of a phone when the time comes I need to replace my XS. Hopefully I will get at least 2 more years out of it.

I am with you there. I just picked up a LG Stylo 4. Had never heard of it, but it was on sale during Prime days. Cost $159 dollars... I love it! It works, long battery, a little stylus of it's own that works with screen off, and at that price, well even if I have to update in two years, so what? I love tech, but like you and many others I will not pay $1000 plus for a phone. I don't have any need for it. Better spent on a new iPad.

 

[tmmacops]

Just picked up a Surface Pro 6 via work, and I have to say it's outstanding. Still getting used to it, but if things progress as they have, and it holds up I'll leave the MBP @ work and use a few Mac only apps as a desktop, and use the SFP as my main machine. Had a Lenovo Carbon X1, but wasn't nuts about the speakers, and some odd Lenovo only stuff that needs updating often...

 

[chikorita157]

Limping into it was never going to work, it had to be all in for a decent time period

I mean I wouldn't start telling everyone to switch to Windows, to be fair I rarely recommend macOS to people, but that is simply because they don't need it, Windows for the majority of home users is totally fine.

For now, I have found Windows a more compelling alternative when it comes to software, hardware and costs. I am happy with it.

I highly disagree. While I am experienced with Windows (including the server variants), macOS and Linux, I still think that Windows 10 is flawed. Besides privacy issues, from maintaining my parents computers, I experienced issues with updates not installing, Windows 10 deactivating itself despite having a legitimate license from the free upgrade, Firefox profiles corruption, etc. Mind that the PCs are protected by Deep Freeze to prevent accidental malware installation and system changes, problems still occur. I felt that Windows 7 is the last good Windows operating system before it jumped the shark, especially with the spying, forced installation of unnecessary apps, forced updates, loss of user control (e.g. group policy). However, I never experience that many issues with macOS. No, Linux is not a viable option since it's missing apps such as Photoshop, Office, etc and the open source alternatives aren't as good.

In short, no operating system is perfect and one should pick their platform based on their needs. I would only recommend Windows if you use specialized Windows applications or you play PC games a-lot. Otherwise, if price is not a concern, I would still recommend a Mac over a PC every day since it has less problems than Windows from my experience.

 

[LeeW]

I highly disagree.

Of course, that is your opinion, my experience is what it is, never had the issues you have noted. I mean I am not new to Windows, have been using it albeit infrequently over the last 25 years.

I would still recommend a Mac over a PC every day since it has fewer problems than Windows from my experience.

From an OS perspective, I agree that its a great choice over Windows, it is all down to personal preference for the majority. But, from a hardware perspective, no. I could not recommend mac hardware to anyone unless they absolutely have to have macOS. You have too high a chance to get bad hardware, too high a chance to get screwed over by Apple when trying to get it repaired and the future for Apple is bleak they way they are heading towards locking you further into their eco-system.

There is little point in having a great OS, sub-par hardware.

 

[Mendota]

I highly disagree. While I am experienced with Windows (including the server variants), macOS and Linux, I still think that Windows 10 is flawed. Besides privacy issues, from maintaining my parents computers, I experienced issues with updates not installing, Windows 10 deactivating itself despite having a legitimate license from the free upgrade, Firefox profiles corruption, etc. Mind that the PCs are protected by Deep Freeze to prevent accidental malware installation and system changes, problems still occur. I felt that Windows 7 is the last good Windows operating system before it jumped the shark, especially with the spying, forced installation of unnecessary apps, forced updates, loss of user control (e.g. group policy). However, I never experience that many issues with macOS. No, Linux is not a viable option since it's missing apps such as Photoshop, Office, etc and the open source alternatives aren't as good.

In short, no operating system is perfect and one should pick their platform based on their needs. I would only recommend Windows if you use specialized Windows applications or you play PC games a-lot. Otherwise, if price is not a concern, I would still recommend a Mac over a PC every day since it has less problems than Windows from my experience.

I would have to disagree, I have not had any of the issues you describe, and it is obviously not common. Your bias for Windows 7 is the same as those on Mac who wax nostalgically about Snow Leopard. The problem I have with MacOS is the walled garden limitations. This is why I can't recommend it most of the time. There is so much that you cannot do in terms of choice in software and hardware. I enjoy firing up MacOS from time to time, but it doesn't take long before I began to feel claustrophobic.

 

[Kung gu]

I would have to disagree, I have not had any of the issues you describe, and it is obviously not common. Your bias for Windows 7 is the same as those on Mac who wax nostalgically about Snow Leopard. The problem I have with MacOS is the walled garden limitations. This is why I can't recommend it most of the time. There is so much that you cannot do in terms of choice in software and hardware. I enjoy firing up MacOS from time to time, but it doesn't take long before I began to feel claustrophobic.

i agree with chikorita windwos 10 is a rushed OS. Period

 

[Mendota]

i agree with chikorita windwos 10 is a rushed OS. Period

To each his own. For every complaint you want to make about Windows, someone else is unhappy with the changes in Mac. Windows is rock solid and encompasses almost unlimited options for hardware and software. And your complaint is very vague. It doesn't really say anything, so I can't comment on whatever it is that you find "rushed". If you prefer MacOS fine... For myself on the Apple side, I find IOS to be more exciting, and I appreciate what they are bringing to the table there.

 

[phillytim]

i agree with chikorita windwos 10 is a rushed OS. Period

While I do not agree with Microsoft pumping out major Windows 10 upgrades every six months, I also do not agree with you - Windows 10 is the best Windows I've seen in my 30 years, and it's been reliable in my use, and I've been a Mac user for 9 years now for comparison.

 

[maflynn]

i agree with chikorita windwos 10 is a rushed OS. Period

Care to provide specifics on why you believe Windows 10 is rushed? I'm assuming you're using the term rushed to convey a thought that MS has cut corners, features and/or artificially set a release date. If that's not the case, please expound on your point.

 

[EdwardC]

Using both and definitely biased towards Mac OS but from a hardware point there is so much more value on the PC side of things. That said I was looking for a laptop for typical business use and was able to pick up a new 2017 base Mac Book Air for $700.00 at Micro Center several weeks back. Looking at PC's vs. this I decided to go with the Mac even though on paper it's older and not very powerful but as an overall package it's really a solid machine for my use. Looking forward to many years of use.

 

[Kung gu]

Care to provide specifics on why you believe Windows 10 is rushed? I'm assuming you're using the term rushed to convey a thought that MS has cut corners, features and/or artificially set a release date. If that's not the case, please expound on your point.

By "rushed" I mean the state Microsoft is leaving Windows in, take a look at the the UI. The File Explorer, Control Panel and the Settings, IMO i feel as though Microsoft cared for the OS instead seeing it as a full blown money maker, they would have put some thought into designing a OS that is consistent throughout the whole system. However Microsoft is now slowly making the shift to a more unified OS, getting rid of the "Old style" and incorporating a Metro style.

They could done this before Windows 10 made it to the market, but they did not and now what we have is that for each update the setting change and the whereabouts of each option change for EVERY SINGLE UPDATE.

IMHO, I think Microsoft is sort of stuck in the limbo of where it wants Windows 10 to be, a mobile OS or a desktop OS. It has to choose one of those because creating the a OS that caters for both platforms is problems waiting to happen in the future.

The only windows that was consistent FULLY was Windows 7, its design was NICE and played well throughout the system and u could see it 100% for Desktop/Laptop.

Apple made the right decision, by leaving MacOS as a desktop operating system and it looks/feels and operates like one s well and made iOS for mobile and i think Microsoft should have chosen that approach creating a seperate tab/mobile Windows OS.

 

[SteveManila1960]

As I type this on my company issued 2017 MBP 15... I backspace to fix the double strikes. I bang harder on the keyboard to get some to type. I constantly have to deal with dongle hell just to do my daily job functions. I don't have the physical keys I need to touch type my way through my job.

I am a HUGE Apple fan. I have been an all in guy for a decade plus. But this is just getting ridiculous. I'm serious considering bouncing off to Linux because M$ is just not an option in my mind. I'm not going back to virus hell. I'm just wondering if I'm alone? Is this part of the plan? Is Apple pushing us to iPad Pros? It just feels like I got a "MacBook Plus" not a "Pro" machine. By that I mean it seems like somebody let a marketing person convince them that they could up sell people out of MacBook with bells and whistles and didn't bother giving a Pro line machine features and function I needed.

Again, I'm not some Windows or Android zealot here to start a flame war. Just a hardcore Apple guy wondering what Apple is thinking these days and if they just aren't that "into" the laptop market anymore?

I am also an Apple system hard core sign up but with older equipment as others have said. It is an ecosystem that works for me, my wife and our two daughters. Whilst there are always areas for improvement basically it all works and is very integrated.

I just started a new job where I have to use a Windows computer and Android phone. Somebody please help me it is truly horrible.............

 

[Martyimac]

By "rushed" I mean the state Microsoft is leaving Windows in, take a look at the the UI. The File Explorer, Control Panel and the Settings, IMO i feel as though Microsoft cared for the OS instead seeing it as a full blown money maker, they would have put some thought into designing a OS that is consistent throughout the whole system. However Microsoft is now slowly making the shift to a more unified OS, getting rid of the "Old style" and incorporating a Metro style.

They could done this before Windows 10 made it to the market, but they did not and now what we have is that for each update the setting change and the whereabouts of each option change for EVERY SINGLE UPDATE.

IMHO, I think Microsoft is sort of stuck in the limbo of where it wants Windows 10 to be, a mobile OS or a desktop OS. It has to choose one of those because creating the a OS that caters for both platforms is problems waiting to happen in the future.

The only windows that was consistent FULLY was Windows 7, its design was NICE and played well throughout the system and u could see it 100% for Desktop/Laptop.

Apple made the right decision, by leaving MacOS as a desktop operating system and it looks/feels and operates like one s well and made iOS for mobile and i think Microsoft should have chosen that approach creating a seperate tab/mobile Windows OS.

I highlighted the red part because that is what Windows 8 was doing and it was a mess. My least favorite of the recent W versions. Well that and Vista. What you are seeing in my opinion only, is that W10 is primarily a desktop OS. I do agree that things seem to change every major update but then I am seeing that in MacOS too. Especially the upcoming Catalina release. Sheesh, doing way with itunes and now three new apps to replace it. Was it needed? Probably but no different than what MS is doing with W10. Since I have no experience with their tablets/touch screen devices, I can't really comment on that .
OBTW, you do see that there is some cross compatibility coming between iOS and MacOS right?

 

[LeeW]

Sheesh, doing way with itunes and now three new apps to replace it.

Hah, just what I was about to say. But the difference with Apple is that it's creating 3 new opportunities to charge you in the future.

 

[LeeW]

It is an ecosystem that works for me, my wife and our two daughters. Whilst there are always areas for improvement basically it all works and is very integrated.

If it works for you great, many are in the same position. It works for me, mostly but I need the newer equipment and that is largely where the issues lie.

 

[Mendota]

By "rushed" I mean the state Microsoft is leaving Windows in, take a look at the the UI. The File Explorer, Control Panel and the Settings, IMO i feel as though Microsoft cared for the OS instead seeing it as a full blown money maker, they would have put some thought into designing a OS that is consistent throughout the whole system. However Microsoft is now slowly making the shift to a more unified OS, getting rid of the "Old style" and incorporating a Metro style.

They could done this before Windows 10 made it to the market, but they did not and now what we have is that for each update the setting change and the whereabouts of each option change for EVERY SINGLE UPDATE.

IMHO, I think Microsoft is sort of stuck in the limbo of where it wants Windows 10 to be, a mobile OS or a desktop OS. It has to choose one of those because creating the a OS that caters for both platforms is problems waiting to happen in the future.

The only windows that was consistent FULLY was Windows 7, its design was NICE and played well throughout the system and u could see it 100% for Desktop/Laptop.

Apple made the right decision, by leaving MacOS as a desktop operating system and it looks/feels and operates like one s well and made iOS for mobile and i think Microsoft should have chosen that approach creating a seperate tab/mobile Windows OS.

Well you might prefer Apple's way, but I do not. I love having the option to have a full OS in my mobile on the go solutions. i.e. Surface products. While I can appreciate IOS and it can be a fun diversion with it's "mobile apps", in the end my preference is to use my Surface pro and have my full and powerful applications to get things done.

And Windows 10 was solid and powerful from the start. Yes they continue to refine it based on feedback, but that doesn't make it rushed. I have just as many issues, actually more dealing with setting in MacOS. Apple tends to hide things and I find that far more annoying that having multiple options in Windows.
[doublepost=1565479704][/doublepost]

By "rushed" I mean the state Microsoft is leaving Windows in, take a look at the the UI. The File Explorer, Control Panel and the Settings, IMO i feel as though Microsoft cared for the OS instead seeing it as a full blown money maker, they would have put some thought into designing a OS that is consistent throughout the whole system. However Microsoft is now slowly making the shift to a more unified OS, getting rid of the "Old style" and incorporating a Metro style.

They could done this before Windows 10 made it to the market, but they did not and now what we have is that for each update the setting change and the whereabouts of each option change for EVERY SINGLE UPDATE.

IMHO, I think Microsoft is sort of stuck in the limbo of where it wants Windows 10 to be, a mobile OS or a desktop OS. It has to choose one of those because creating the a OS that caters for both platforms is problems waiting to happen in the future.

The only windows that was consistent FULLY was Windows 7, its design was NICE and played well throughout the system and u could see it 100% for Desktop/Laptop.

Apple made the right decision, by leaving MacOS as a desktop operating system and it looks/feels and operates like one s well and made iOS for mobile and i think Microsoft should have chosen that approach creating a seperate tab/mobile Windows OS.

Well you might prefer Apple's way, but I do not. I love having the option to have a full OS in my mobile on the go solutions. i.e. Surface products. While I can appreciate IOS and it can be a fun diversion with it's "mobile apps", in the end my preference is to use my Surface pro and have my full and powerful applications to get things done.

And Windows 10 was solid and powerful from the start. Yes they continue to refine it based on feedback, but that doesn't make it rushed. I have just as many issues, actually more dealing with setting in MacOS. Apple tends to hide things and I find that far more annoying that having multiple options in Windows.

I am also an Apple system hard core sign up but with older equipment as others have said. It is an ecosystem that works for me, my wife and our two daughters. Whilst there are always areas for improvement basically it all works and is very integrated.

I just started a new job where I have to use a Windows computer and Android phone. Somebody please help me it is truly horrible.............

It is not "horrible", and no one can help if you do not give clear issues that we can find solutions for.