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Oh God no, they'd have to hire people from this country! And pay them a living wage!

Oh God no, they'd have to hire people from this country! And pay them a living wage!

Asians generally have a degree in the STEM. Rarely do you find an Asian with a degree outside of that.

Unlike here in America where you got folks getting degrees in general studies. Lol

Tech companies started hiring talent from Asia because they couldn't find enough talent here.
 
Oddly enough, a lot of public assistance money goes to reliably Republican southern states. They may not like Washington but they love their government checks.

Truth. Republican states hate "liberal" values, but they love liberal tax dollars! It's quite offensive if you live in California, New York, and the handful of other, mostly blue, states that pretty much keep this country afloat. I cringe when I hear southerners trash talk California. Glass houses much?
 
Maybe here in the bay area, things are different, but low engineer salaries is not a problem. Finding highly qualified talent is the problem. I know there are various ****** consulting companies and such that abuse the H-1B system, but the people that I've met here on H-1Bs have been at least as qualified as the non-H-1Bs around them and have been paid at least as much. For companies like Apple, Google, etc, I don't think they're bringing people over because of salary (it's a huge pain in the ass to get people into the country), rather they're doing it because *that individual* is the individual that they want and they happen to not already live in the US. I don't see how the US can maintain its status as the tech capital (along with China, though their market is isolated) and _not_ have the ability to import the best talent when it's available.

Also keep in mind that something like 51% of successful silicon valley startups are started by immigrants. If Silicon Valley is a fire, immigrants are a large part of the fuel that keeps it going.

Go ahead and close whatever loopholes those consulting companies are using, though. One of the rules of H-1Bs is that they're supposed to have to be paid market salary, but somehow some of these consulting shops get away with underpaying them while also not bringing in great talent.
 
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Is this the only picture of Trump you have, or are you only always using this one because he looks especially stupid?
 
There are now 38bn reasons for h1-b spouses to work. Cook did Trump a favor, Trump will return the favor.
 
Yes, there is fraud and abuse in the H1B visa system but why do companies have an incentive to commit fraud and abuse? The reason is that an H1B visa holder is legally tied to the company that hires them on that visa. It's simple economics and that kind of treatment could happen to an American citizen too. If the company feels that you as the employee don't have very many options to leave for a better-paying job, the company will take full advantage of that in salary negotiations. If the job market in a particular industry is tight, they can and will low-ball you on a salary package. Companies know that if they bring someone on an H1B visa, they have the upper hand because of immigration law.

On the one hand, many are concerned that companies aren't hiring enough American citizens. On the other hand, companies want freedom to hire the best people. Companies may feel an incentive to hire H1B visa holders because the law gives them a discount on hiring an H1B visa holder compared to hiring an American citizen. Somehow, the law has to take away this discount to solve this problem.
 
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If your going to hire someone based on where they come from then yes! If your going to turn down someone for a job because they come from the Middle East or where ever then yes that is racist! It’s not about where someone comes from it’s about whether they can do the job or not.

When a company enjoys the benefits and protections of existing in a country like America I think it’s reasonable they are expected to hire Americans first. Other countries should expect the same of their companies.
 
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Trump should tell them all to GO F THEMSELVES.
Especially Disney and other companies that hire these foreign temp workers and then make the fired Americans they replace train them in order to receive their severance pay
 
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Hey buddy, try walking across the border into Canada or your beloved Mexico without proper documentation and see what the hell happens.
Wait aren’t those the same two borders? So, are the Mexicans just more effective at patrols, since they don’t seem to need multi-billion dollar wall. Maybe we can just get them to show us their secrets and save at ton of money.
 
Where are you going to find them? Too many self-absorbed millennials out in the wild who expect a six-figure income right out of university. Besides, that mobile phone they have glued to their faces 24/7 is expensive, along with Starbucks and vintage hipster clothing.

People from other countries come here and work at places like McDonald's. You know what they call it? Opportunity.

Entitlement babies created the market for foreign workers.

I always get a kick out of people who think hipsters hang out at Starbucks :)

I mean... I suppose if you are working class, everyone with disposable income might seem the same to you (which is perfectly fine!), but then why would you feel competent to give this lecture in lifestyle to those who may know more about these things than you do?

For the record: I'm an immigrant who was on H1-B at one point. Obviously, I have nothing against immigrant workers. I do have everything against major corporations abusing it to the detriment of both US economy and of those workers.
 
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The reality where I want this from US candidates:

600_460797740.jpeg


And instead all I can find is this:

RESPONSIVE-DESIGN_Text-fall-into-fountain-short.gif


Exact opposite experience from me here. I think you need better recruiters.
 



Apple, Google, Facebook, Microsoft, and other technology companies have sent a message to the Trump administration through various Washington, D.C. lobbying groups, urging President Trump to keep protecting spouses of immigrants who work in the U.S. with H-1B visas. The companies reportedly fear a "looming end" to the program that protects these spouses and allows them to work in the U.S., as it could cause "immense trouble" for many of their workers and potentially lead to large swaths of H-1B employees having to "reconsider working for U.S. companies at all" (via Recode).

The spousal work permit program began in 2015 under the Obama administration, allowing spouses of high-skilled immigrants to be granted work authorizations while in the process of seeking lawful permanent resident status. The Trump administration has worked throughout 2017 to fundamentally reevaluate the program, and in November the Department of Homeland Security noted imminent plans to "propose to rescind" the final rule and remove H-4 dependent spouses "from the class of aliens eligible for employment authorization."



Now, a coalition of tech companies have responded with a statement, noting that spouses are "eager to work" to support their families. Their statement also describes fear of an "increased risk" of losing long-term employees.
Tech companies like Apple would be the hardest hit by such sweeping changes to work visa policies since it employs many workers with H-1B visas, whose spouses potentially also benefit from the program. Nearly one year ago, Apple was also affected by the drafting of an executive order by President Trump, which stated that the country's policy on immigration should not give priority to foreign workers and should instead prioritize and protect American workers.

Following the draft proposal, the Trump administration followed through and rolled out a collection of policy shifts that planned out a roadmap to better serve American workers' current and future jobs. Apple and other tech companies were affected out of the gate as the first change came from the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services agency, which "made it harder" for such companies to bring foreign workers to the country using the H-1B work visa.

Note: Due to the political nature of the discussion regarding this topic, the discussion thread is located in our Politics, Religion, Social Issues forum. All forum members and site visitors are welcome to read and follow the thread, but posting is limited to forum members with at least 100 posts.

Article Link: Apple and Other Companies Fear 'Looming End' of H-1B Work Visa Spousal Protection Program

A little too late.

Wednesday afternoon a Mexican that was brought into the USA as a 10yr old child has lived here, worked here, no criminal record, not even a damn traffic ticket ... and was deported Thursday morning - featured on CNN news. I think his name was Jorge. Leaving behind a wife, 3 children. Man contributes to his community and a proper father and pays his taxes ... way to go. At least he had the forsight to build a home, almost completed in his mother country.
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Oh God no, they'd have to hire people from this country! And pay them a living wage!

oh god ... the most qualified potential employees are better educated outside of the USA because previous presidents and the existing one (ever since Kennedy) never pushed for better education, a freeze on exponentially rising university costs, and made grants so difficult to get for those that have great K12 education aspiring to better themselves.

Where's Trump education goals? I don't know.

That said I think it is smart to prioritize highering inside a nation for the best and highest paying jobs ... keeps the nation healthy by employment and those employed pay their taxes, happily, contributing to a better nation, and better education, and a cycle continues. Yet I do feel for those that have worked their butt off and have been immigrants since childhood calling USA their home being deported when they've been stand up citizens in almost every regard.

We'll see how all this turns out, and giving the current unrest I'm not looking forward to the blind moves that Justin Trudeau has been doing here in my home country of Canada. Seems Canadian government hasn't learned from the mistakes that the USA government made back in 2000 that is only now being fixed.
 
By spending years working with H1B Indians. In fact, one of my good friends is from India who came over on an H1B visa years ago, and he said that the amount of fraud is staggering. People with connections, but no experience and fake degrees are routinely given jobs and, obviously, screw **** up beyond repair. There are obviously some very smart and talented people coming over, but the vast majority of low and mid level IT H1Bs do a subpar job. As the saying goes, you get what you pay for.

Agreed. I have worked with a "tech specialist" from India and she could barely turn on the computer, but she is the fiancee of the team manager in India. She was totally useless. I have recruiter friend who told me she hire one India engineer and few weeks later another guy show up for work and it was clearly not the person she hired or screen/tested at the interview, when they confront him, he just got up and left the building and never return. There are scams in the H1B program.
 
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Curious to see how you came up with this. I can only go by my area since I haven't looked into other places but salaries in the STEM fields have been steadily growing where I'm located. I've only been out of school for 5 years and each year the percentage of my raises have been increasing.

I am an Indian and saying that most people go to US in H1-B have fake degrees (less) and fake experience (more). They get paid very less compared to US counterparts. Most people from southern region of India are soiling the name of India. Even my company (in China) has fired 3 people last year due to fake degrees. China does not allow spouses to work. They have to come with work visa if they want to work.
 
Trump should tell them all to GO F THEMSELVES.
Especially Disney and other companies that hire these foreign temp workers and then make the fired Americans they replace train them in order to receive their severance pay
Does this mean ICE can deport Trump's wife, since she abused her work Visa and committed fraud. Let's start with Trumps own family. And since Baron was born to her, deport him too. This is 'Merica and in Trumps 'Merica you gotta hate all them thar fureigners!
 
Where are you going to find them? Too many self-absorbed millennials out in the wild who expect a six-figure income right out of university. Besides, that mobile phone they have glued to their faces 24/7 is expensive, along with Starbucks and vintage hipster clothing.

People from other countries come here and work at places like McDonald's. You know what they call it? Opportunity.

Fair enough. But then let’s stop subsidizing education. It makes no sense to subsidize people going to college if they aren’t useful employees when they graduate. The people who come to work at McDonalds do so because conditions are so bad in their country that such a job is a huge step up in the world. The entitlement state doesn’t make sense along with immigrant labor. It really needs to be one or the other.
 
H1B's are not coming to work at McDonalds.

Spouses of H1B's could work at McDonalds though. The logic was that workers on H1B would find America an attractive destination only if their spouses could work too. Not just financially. It is extremely limiting a life for a spouse if she legally cannot work. This is as much a social issue as it is economic. Though I am not sure what incentives did Obama administration have to change the regulations, because a large % of H1B holders continued to come despite the restriction.
 
Where are you going to find them? Too many self-absorbed millennials out in the wild who expect a six-figure income right out of university. Besides, that mobile phone they have glued to their faces 24/7 is expensive, along with Starbucks and vintage hipster clothing.

People from other countries come here and work at places like McDonald's. You know what they call it? Opportunity.

Entitlement babies created the market for foreign workers.
Foreign workers often perform the dirty, lowly, underpaid jobs we don't want to do..... the truth hurts.
 
Find them in the laid-off Disney IT workers who were forced to train their cheaper replacements, HP engineers, and countless other victims of down-sizing, right-sizing, off-shoring, etc, etc.
Worse , I had to train the replacements for my coworkers while I kept my job. I felt like such a traitor that I left the company early for another job just to get out of doing it. HR was surprised "but you get to keep to keep your job!" they responded to my 2-weeks noticed. I told them they could betray their coworkers and fellow Americans if they wanted to , but I refused.
Good, the H1B program has done nothing but lower wages for tech workers.
True. I got a look at payroll and the wage gap was huge. I understand that living conditions are lower in some other countries, but they should still stand up for themselves. The H1-B's are being taken advantage of and it must stop!
 
Where are you going to find them? Too many self-absorbed millennials out in the wild who expect a six-figure income right out of university. Besides, that mobile phone they have glued to their faces 24/7 is expensive, along with Starbucks and vintage hipster clothing.

People from other countries come here and work at places like McDonald's. You know what they call it? Opportunity.

Entitlement babies created the market for foreign workers.
What are you talking about? Here in the greater Silicon Valley there's a shortage of qualified engineers. Every tech company I've worked for in the area hired H1-B engineers at the same wage (and benefits) as US citizens with engineering degrees.

Lie after lie, probably coming from self-righteous Boomers, the greediest and most selfish generation in American history. There's no shortage of engineers in Silicon Valley, the rapacious tech companies, namely Apple, Google, Facebook, et al. hate paying Americans when they can pay foreign imports. I'm not even too angry at the foreigners themselves, they're just responding to an opporunity, what's depraved is hanging the threat of visa withdrawal over their heads like a guillotine so they keep their mouths shut and work for less. There's no point to hiring H1-Bs at the same wages when unemployed American tech workers are legion, precisely because they were replaced. It's also well-known that Indians in hiring positions almost exclusively hire fellow Indians, talk about racial profiling and discrimination.
 
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Patently not true.
The wage is almost never higher.
I work in Silicon Valley and see the posting for H1-B with the salary on the walls of lunchrooms.
I've working in The Valley for almost 30 years and I see how the system is gamed.

Look at the following links from our own GAO and the IEEE
GAO -> https://www.gao.gov/products/GAO-11-26
eWeek from 10 years ago even -> http://www.eweek.com/it-management/thousands-of-h-1b-workers-are-underpaid-gao-reports
IEEE -> https://spectrum.ieee.org/view-from...commentary-the-h1b-problem-as-ieeeusa-sees-it

An excerpt from that 2017 article:
"For example, you point out that, according to H1BPay.com, Facebook pays its software engineers in Menlo Park, on average, US $138,294, which is a pretty good salary. However, Smartorg pays software engineers on H-1B visas in Menlo Park only $80,000 annually, which is a ridiculously low salary for the San Jose region.

This difference illustrates an important point about H-1B visas. While some companies pay their H-1B employees’ salaries equivalent to what American workers get paid, many companies do not. In fact, most H-1B visas are used, not by Facebook and other big tech companies, but by outsourcing and consulting companies.

And the salaries paid by those companies tell a different story.

For example, Wipro, a large outsourcing company, paid its 104 program analysts in San Jose exactly $60,000 each in 2016. Brocade, in contrast, paid their programmer analysts $130,000 in the same city.

Similarly, Infosys, the largest user of H-1B visas, paid their 158 technology analysts in New York City, one of the most expensive cities in the world, $67,832 on average last year, not enough to rent a closet in that city."

Migrant Tech Workers Abused -> https://spectrum.ieee.org/view-from...d-by-contract-labor-firms-investigation-shows

So please don't tell me about H1-B having a positive impact on an industry that I have worked in for the last 30 years.
It depends on a very specific job title as to what the pay is going to be set. That is not negotiable.

Your talking about different companies having employee that work for them but you don't know anything about the job titles for the specific employees.

All IT salaries aren't created equally.

If you every hired an H1-B employee you would realize the job titles aren't simply analyst, programmer, developer etc... for a particular market.
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And yet they don't, why? Because the pay is beneath what is required to live and pay student loans. That is the ultimate catch 22 of many us millennials. I got lucky, VERY lucky to escape it and had to live in BFE for years but I was grateful to even get a shot which rarely people my age do.

Pleeeeeeeese.

You don't leave school and land a job at the top of your field.

I don't know where you are living, but most entry level job start at 50k - 60k per year, which could higher or lower depending on the market.

I bet most people can start their career there and make it work even with the LOW monthy payments for student loans.

You make it seem like IT professionals are working for sub 20K per year, which is hardly the case.
 
Wednesday afternoon a Mexican that was brought into the USA as a 10yr old child has lived here, worked here, no criminal record, not even a damn traffic ticket ... and was deported Thursday morning - featured on CNN news. I think his name was Jorge. Leaving behind a wife, 3 children. Man contributes to his community and a proper father and pays his taxes ... way to go. At least he had the forsight to build a home, almost completed in his mother country.

This has nothing to do with the debate over spousal work eligibility for H1B visa workers.

So if we're just talking about anything at all, I guess I'll mention that there is a really bad drought in Cape Town right now.
 
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