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The Touch Bar would be useful if it somehow had physical buttons - which could dynamically change according to the layout.
Like an Elgato stream deck? Physical buttons with little screens that can change depending on the use case.

 
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Because it's a bad idea that is poorly implemented anyhow

touchbar is a solution to a problem that not exist.

seriously I never SEE my damn keyboard when I type, I just need FEEL the keys, shortcuts etc. I don't need pause my life to see the keyboard to find things,

touchbar should be optional and I bet less people add it to.
 
touchbar is a solution to a problem that not exist.

seriously I never SEE my damn keyboard when I type, I just need FEEL the keys, shortcuts etc. I don't need pause my life to see the keyboard to find things,

touchbar should be optional and I bet less people add it to.

Precisely
Unless you are brand new to typing, you aren't looking down (and never should be once you can touch by type).

The Touch Bar might be useful for some type of training situation, but any remotely skilled input device user quickly moves on to "never looking down".

It's, as you say, truly a solution made for a problem that doesn't exist.

I've long maintained that the TB should be optional across the line and surely offered on the lowest end if anything. The most unskilled users may indeed benefit from it --- those are not usually buyers of the MacBook Pro models.

Apple has it all reversed with the TB offering.

I wish they'd just can it and move on -- but until then I really wish they'd just make it optional everywhere at least.
 
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I like the touchbar and use it regularly (always with my right hand). I think it should be on all keyboards Apple sells. If people want the actual row of additional keys, why not add that? Say adding physical keys would be an option available for $200.00 extra (for those who REALLY need them) then they would have a touchbar, and physical function keys underneath that. Everyone is happy!
 
Set up a business and disregard customers complains. Let us know how it went.
or you can just look back at history.

"touchscreens suck, we want a PHYSICAL KEYBOARD" -2007
"websites don't load properly, we want FLASH" -2010
"we can't stream games from the cloud using Onlive because of the App Store, we want THIRD PARTY APP STORES" -2013
"i can't connect my headphones without a dongle, we want a HEADPHONE JACK" -2016
"iPhone looks ugly, REMOVE THE NOTCH" -2017
"lightning sucks, we want USB-C" -every year since lightning came out

yet Apple is selling iPhones and iPads juuuuuust fine.
 
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Touch bar 2.0 doesn't sound too far fetched. But I always think they are slowly working towards replacing the keyboard with keys that are little screens with touch sensitivity. Unfortunately instead of making it like an optimus keyboard they might make it to where it hardly moves at all when you type. Maybe they can use foldable screen tech to make strips of LCD's for each line of keys on the keyboard so it can be molded to come up and down just a bit from the aluminum shell for each key. The keys that pop up would have a look and feel of the current touch bar to them. Then it just has to detect when you press onto them to register a key press. That would allow the full size of the key to be used as an individual screen even though its really an LCD strip projecting that row of keys. If they can't make it work with the keyboard then they will replace the touchpad with a touch screen. Apple is just not going to stop "innovating" until they change every part of their computers to be unlike anything out there. Its just a matter of time and getting it to feel normal.
 
or you can just look back at history.

"touchscreens suck, we want a PHYSICAL KEYBOARD" -2007
"websites don't load properly, we want FLASH" -2010
"we can't stream games from the cloud using Onlive because of the App Store, we want THIRD PARTY APP STORES" -2013
"i can't connect my headphones without a dongle, we want a HEADPHONE JACK" -2016
"iPhone looks ugly, REMOVE THE NOTCH" -2017
"lightning sucks, we want USB-C" -every year since lightning came out

yet Apple is selling iPhones and iPads juuuuuust fine.
That’s simplifying the question. Apple is frequently making radical changes, so certainly there will be very loud critiques every time. But there’s a difference between noise at introduction time and complains that are sustained in time.

Let’s take a look at the examples you cited. I agree apple was right on the first two examples. I’ll add to that list removing the floppy drive, then removing the dvd drive. There was also a lot of fuss about Jobs refusing to support blu ray. Macs weren’t better products for that, but in time it stopped being relevant.

Now, for the rest of your list. People complaining about app store are two subsets, those who genuinely want alternative software loading methods, and by now they must be on android, and epic and spotify ceos. Oh, and also Mark Zuckerberg. They have a clear interest on that side. So I wouldn’t qualify this one as customer complaining en masse.

Now, on the jack and usb-c, apple is doing a worse product. Everyone qould be better if we had the same charging standard, and we are getting nothing in return by being forced to use lightning. Those are not fatal flaws, and apple will keep selling lots and lots of phones in spite of that.

Now let’s go through some examples of complains and apple backtracking because customers were right.

The mac being neglected. At first, people who would defend apple no matter what refused to acknowledge said neglecting, often stating that what apple was selling was more than enough for anyone (some models unchanged in specs and pricing for years). Then the argument changed to “an ipad is all you’ll ever need, you’re stuck in the past”. Then the situation was so bad that even Cook had to send an internal memo to reassure apple’s workers that the mac was a very important part of the company and it will get attention once again.

Speaking of the mac, you possibly remember the amount of criticism the trashcan mac pro received. In a never before seen movement, apple publicly acknowledged they were wrong.

Lack of support for external drives on the ipad. After valid complaints they finally introduced it.

And last but not least, the not enough bashed butterfly keyboard. A design so atrocious that even using it in the vacuum wouldn’t guarantee it wouldn’t break, and so cleverly designed that a broken key would mean changing half the computer. After four years of stubbornly refusing to address the problem, apple had to reverse course.

So, is apple right disregarding every customer complaint? No, because they don’t. Apple is a company that is led by very smart people, who know that taking risks has some inherent criticism associated, but that also know how to listen to their customers.

I would categorize the touchbar as the headphone jack and usbc. It doesn’t make better the product, but it won’t harm the sales, so I guess we’re stuck with it at least until a major redesign.
 
They should implement mini oled displays into physical keys. It would give us the best of both worlds. They could also be haptic keys. A simple tap would activate the touch buttons and a long press would act as a “physical”press. The software would be able to tell accidental taps from intentional ones to avoid mistakes, almost like palm rejection. Dedicated “keys” are a lot better then one giant pane of glass.
I think touchbar should take over all keyboard including touckpad: Something like an iPad usable with pencil. You could even use it as dual display for presentation or fully customize you layout including “key” size; you would display only what you need within each app. Those wanting a more “physical” touch experience could still use existing external keyboard and trackpad.
Too stupid?
 
That’s simplifying the question. Apple is frequently making radical changes, so certainly there will be very loud critiques every time. But there’s a difference between noise at introduction time and complains that are sustained in time.

Let’s take a look at the examples you cited. I agree apple was right on the first two examples. I’ll add to that list removing the floppy drive, then removing the dvd drive. There was also a lot of fuss about Jobs refusing to support blu ray. Macs weren’t better products for that, but in time it stopped being relevant.

Now, for the rest of your list. People complaining about app store are two subsets, those who genuinely want alternative software loading methods, and by now they must be on android, and epic and spotify ceos. Oh, and also Mark Zuckerberg. They have a clear interest on that side. So I wouldn’t qualify this one as customer complaining en masse.

Now, on the jack and usb-c, apple is doing a worse product. Everyone qould be better if we had the same charging standard, and we are getting nothing in return by being forced to use lightning. Those are not fatal flaws, and apple will keep selling lots and lots of phones in spite of that.

Now let’s go through some examples of complains and apple backtracking because customers were right.

The mac being neglected. At first, people who would defend apple no matter what refused to acknowledge said neglecting, often stating that what apple was selling was more than enough for anyone (some models unchanged in specs and pricing for years). Then the argument changed to “an ipad is all you’ll ever need, you’re stuck in the past”. Then the situation was so bad that even Cook had to send an internal memo to reassure apple’s workers that the mac was a very important part of the company and it will get attention once again.

Speaking of the mac, you possibly remember the amount of criticism the trashcan mac pro received. In a never before seen movement, apple publicly acknowledged they were wrong.

Lack of support for external drives on the ipad. After valid complaints they finally introduced it.

And last but not least, the not enough bashed butterfly keyboard. A design so atrocious that even using it in the vacuum wouldn’t guarantee it wouldn’t break, and so cleverly designed that a broken key would mean changing half the computer. After four years of stubbornly refusing to address the problem, apple had to reverse course.

So, is apple right disregarding every customer complaint? No, because they don’t. Apple is a company that is led by very smart people, who know that taking risks has some inherent criticism associated, but that also know how to listen to their customers.

I would categorize the touchbar as the headphone jack and usbc. It doesn’t make better the product, but it won’t harm the sales, so I guess we’re stuck with it at least until a major redesign.
The no upgrade-all close unit policy seems to suggest Apple only listen when it doesn’t mind the tune...
IMHO Touchbar is a good concept which failed because wasn’t too implemented by developers at the beginning...people who actually use it tend to like it, but then again also miss the jack;)
 
Sometimes Apple drop the ball with their 'innovations': I remember 'Ping' - the social media / music thing... It's as if at some point they skipped the part where they needed to test this in the wild, with normal people, for 2-3 months.

Both Ping and the Touch Bar are things that you imagine those on the apple campus insisting how cool they are, but which get no traction outside that bubble.
The fact Apple promote it alongside emojis, send the wrong messages to developers, IMHO it was the lack of early adoption and optimization by apps that turned touchbar into such a black sheep amongst fanboy crowd. In my experience People who actually use it tend to like it. Maybe the “iOSation” of macOS makes it more relevant as I see touchscreen macs a no go.
 
The no upgrade-all close unit policy seems to suggest Apple only listen when it doesn’t mind the tune...
IMHO Touchbar is a good concept which failed because wasn’t too implemented by developers at the beginning...people who actually use it tend to like it, but then again also miss the jack;)
Agreed. They only listen when they have no other choice, and get away with as much as they can.
 
I don't have a problem with the concept, other than the fact that a touch interface just isn't suited to its present location.

The Touch Bar actually has a few features that don't get mentioned often, or at least it can be set up in a way to suit most people - from providing the original 'F' key layout, to app-specific controls, to an entirely custom and persistent layout.

The latter is what I'm most interested in. I set mine up to have just the controls I want persistently, which granted, does comprise of many controls that are already found on the physical models, but also includes things like screenshot, display off, lock and more. So that control is nice.

And if you still want the app-specific controls, you just hold down Function and they appear. Personally I'm not a fan of these, because the menu system/hierarchy/lack of intuitiveness and ability to remember all the controls is borderline diabolical and completely defeats the purpose of using a lovely large trackpad to move and click on something.

You also can't 'feel' for the buttons like you can with physical keys, which has obviously been well documented.

And my god, the amount of times I accidentally tap the bar when I'm typing is ridiculous...

Would I go back to physical Function buttons? Absolutely - but only if they could provide a way of highlighting the function each.
 
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I have yet to own a MBP with touch bar, so I can't speak to its usefulness. However I (definitely) want face id on the Mac. Might even wait until apple adds it to buy my next MBP.
 
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