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Apple debuting two-button mouse?

rikers_mailbox said:
...My question is. . . if Apple is finally succumbing to 2 button mice, can we expect 2 buttons also appearing on iBook/Powerbook trackpads?

I personally don't want that. There is always the option of using a mouse of your choice with any laptop.
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I agree, it would really destroy the aesthetics of the laptops. Something Apple could look into, is allowing the option of a left and right button on the laptop while keeping the single button appearence. Current iBook and PowerBook users know that the button 'leans' to either the left or right. Some more sensors and a software feature could allow right-clicking. Although this would probably rule out simultaneous right/left operations... if there are any :rolleyes:
 
decash said:
Current iBook and PowerBook users know that the button 'leans' to either the left or right.
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I have a friend who just bought her first Mac - a 17" PowerBook. Are you saying that if she leans the button to the right it executes a control/right click? I think I misunderstood your statement. Just making sure...
 
Cooknn said:
I have a friend who just bought her first Mac - a 17" PowerBook. Are you saying that if she leans the button to the right it executes a control/right click? I think I misunderstood your statement. Just making sure...
Click to expand...

I'm saying that what you describe would be a cool feature. But it currently doesn't exist.
 
Lynxpro said:
Excuse me, but I felt like throwing in another idea in the thread of "no brainers" Apple should be doing to capture more dollars (and euros) from Apple fans and switchers alike. The two button mouse is a no-brainer, and so is offering a 17" LCD monitor for the Mac Mini switchers so they don't spend the same amount of money on a competitor's [Dell] offering instead.

Really, it isn't that hard to keep up in the thread. I posted the 17" LCD monitor comment right after my previous comment supporting this two-button mouse rumor. You sure you aren't a single button mouse user? Can't be trusted to eject media on your own without receiving permission to do so from OS X?
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You must have seriously misunderstood me. I was simply saying that, nowadays, if one wants to read the entire thread AND comment on other posts, it's a time-consuming process. Add a full-time job and 15+ hour time difference to the mix and it's easy to get behind in my reading. It was a statement on the number of users here at MacRumors. Nothing more. Nothing less. (I should have been clearer, I guess.)

And, by the way, I was actually agreeing with you. Why sell a $499 product and let the consumer walk down the street and pay $499 more for a monitor, mouse, and keyboard?

Squire
 
decksnap said:
Lame comment. How dare I use a one button mouse and be a professional power user, right?? I hate how I have to feel like I need to defend the single button mouse every time someone makes one of these comments, but many power users are fluent in key commands and as such prefer one-button mice. Different strokes for different folks, but you can't say 'oh I'm faster cuz my mouse has more buttons'. There's more than your way to get the job done quickly.
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Not if you have a one button mouse! Then the only way to get it done quick is with keyboard commands. People want options.

Keyboards require 2 hands. That would mean putting down my coffee.
 
maka said:
This is the most reasonable post in the thread. (Edit: And I did read all the posts)I see most people that argue for the multi button mouse only tell of their experiences and preferences, which is not an objective reason. I can say how I'm more comfortable with the apple standard mouse, so what? To each his/her own, but the reason to keep the one button mouse standard has nothing to do with that. It's how the Mac GUI was designed.
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Was. Not is. The mac GUI is almost completely useless right now without the 2 button mouse. Most their high end software like Final Cut Pro is slow to operate without a 2 button mouse. They have done so much work trying to figure out just what contextual menu should come up at particular places in a program when you control click that the power of their software user friendliness relies on it. You want to do something, you don't know how. You control click and you're instantly give the most logical options without tearing through manuals and menus. That agreed on, it is inarguable that the movement of one finger in a downward motion is simpler than putting down your coffee and moving your left (or right) arm to press ctrl.

It's silly. When OS's were simpler Jobs argued that it could all be done with one button. He was right. And when people were just learning mice an graphical UIs they needed a small learning curve. But a second button is power. Power to do things quicker. Power to program it. Whatever.

People can claim to use 1 button mouse because they're a purist. Ok, they're a purist, but their allegiance is simply to a person that isn't being a purist. He's simply being stubborn. Anyone want to try and prove Jobs isn't stubborn? Stubborn people can be like home run hitters. They hit a lot of home runs, but man do they strike out alot.
 
Working feverishly?

To quote the original posting...
"Apple is "feverishly working" on a two-button wireless optical mouse to be released soon."
How hard can it be?
Really.
BC
 
wcalderini said:
To quote the original posting...
"Apple is "feverishly working" on a two-button wireless optical mouse to be released soon."
How hard can it be?
Really.
BC
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Its the Steve factor. This mouse will have to do for mice what the ipod did to the portable cd player :p
 
I wonder how many people are actually using their scoll wheels to go through this web page. Each page has a LONG list of posts. It just makes more sence using the keyboard. :p It actually takes more consetration using the scroll wheel for certain tasks. In fact I would dare to call the scroll wheel exercise. But to be fair, it is very useful for things.

But I do have to laugh at you people who scoll wheel EVERYTHING
 
bretm said:
Was. Not is. The mac GUI is almost completely useless right now without the 2 button mouse. Most their high end software like Final Cut Pro is slow to operate without a 2 button mouse. They have done so much work trying to figure out just what contextual menu should come up at particular places in a program when you control click that the power of their software user friendliness relies on it. You want to do something, you don't know how. You control click and you're instantly give the most logical options without tearing through manuals and menus. That agreed on, it is inarguable that the movement of one finger in a downward motion is simpler than putting down your coffee and moving your left (or right) arm to press ctrl.
Click to expand...

I disagree. The mac GUI is made for a 1 button mouse but it allows the usage of more buttons. Most professionals know how their program works and rarely use menus (contextual or not). I don't use FCP but use Logic Audio Pro and Pro Tools and never needed more buttons. I work with one hand on the keyboard for the key shortcuts and modifier keys. BTW I don't think most professionals work with a cup of coffee glued to their hand... That kind of comment makes me think of multibutton mice as "toys" that people use from their sofas...

The only Apple program designed for more buttons is Shake and as it has been said before in the thread, it was designed by another company, not Apple...

bretm said:
It's silly. When OS's were simpler Jobs argued that it could all be done with one button. He was right. And when people were just learning mice an graphical UIs they needed a small learning curve. But a second button is power. Power to do things quicker. Power to program it. Whatever.
Click to expand...

More buttons should always be an option in software, not a requirement, and Apple should keep the 1 button as standard for the reasons already stated. If you think more buttons = more power then good for you, I work faster with a 1 button mouse, but that's my preference. The point is software developers should keep in mind that their UIs should be usable with a 1 button mouse. It makes for more usable software.

bretm said:
People can claim to use 1 button mouse because they're a purist. Ok, they're a purist, but their allegiance is simply to a person that isn't being a purist. He's simply being stubborn. Anyone want to try and prove Jobs isn't stubborn? Stubborn people can be like home run hitters. They hit a lot of home runs, but man do they strike out alot.
Click to expand...

Jobs may be stubborn, but the mouse discussion is not about purism... It's about UI usability. Good UI design is something that makes the mac different and the 1 button mouse is important in that regard.
 
pizzach said:
I wonder how many people are actually using their scoll wheels to go through this web page. Each page has a LONG list of posts. It just makes more sence using the keyboard. :p It actually takes more consetration using the scroll wheel for certain tasks. In fact I would dare to call the scroll wheel exercise. But to be fair, it is very useful for things.

But I do have to laugh at you people who scoll wheel EVERYTHING
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scrolling can be done with the keyboard? how?
 
jsw said:
Dear God - it could be worse! We might see laptops with high-res screens and 7200 RPM drives, or an OS that allows us to resize windows from more than just one corner. Oh, the humanity!

I'd hate to see us borrow useful technology and ideas. I'd rather we spurn anything not invented by Apple. That makes us so unlike those Windows users. ;)
Click to expand...

wow i never really noticed the resizing from one corner thing now thats going to drve me crazy
 
Keyboard and Mice in 2020

Wild futurist projection.....

Haptics (e.g hand gesture recognition) and voice control will rule in 2020. We will be talking to our computer in most cases rather than using a keyboard, as it will be faster unless you are a mega typist.

We will be using gestures and movements of our hands to control the interface, it will be much more than a simple one click action, many hand/finger actions will be recognised to move, scroll, open, close, rotate in 3D etc etc.

Just like in real life, our hands will be returned to their proper role as nimble manipulator, mice of all varieties make very limited use of our natural gestures and capabilites. Haptics will be hugely more productive than any mouse, and yet software will be easier to learn as gestures are an instinctive human communication/action.

The keyboard will be reduced to an optional extra for specialists

Multi button Mice in general will be a quaint joke

One button mice will be a museum piece

My Point?

Apple are moving in the right direction for the future, towards greater gesture control and less dependancy on keyboard control
 
pizzach said:
I wonder how many people are actually using their scoll wheels to go through this web page. Each page has a LONG list of posts. It just makes more sence using the keyboard. :p It actually takes more consetration using the scroll wheel for certain tasks. In fact I would dare to call the scroll wheel exercise. But to be fair, it is very useful for things.

But I do have to laugh at you people who scoll wheel EVERYTHING
Click to expand...

Your right. Using the keyboard does allow you the consetrate less!
 
maka said:
...More buttons should always be an option in software, not a requirement, and Apple should keep the 1 button as standard for the reasons already stated. If you think more buttons = more power then good for you, I work faster with a 1 button mouse, but that's my preference. The point is software developers should keep in mind that their UIs should be usable with a 1 button mouse. It makes for more usable software....
Click to expand...

I can't say I've ever used a program that I was aware required a two button mouse, even in MS Windows.
 
pizzach said:
I wonder how many people are actually using their scoll wheels to go through this web page.
Click to expand...

Um, I always use my scroll wheel and right mouse button for efficiency. I have never owned a PC and never hope to. I started using a 4 button mouse with OS 7.5.3 and moved over to a 5 button wireless Wacom mouse under OS 8, entirely inspired by professional applications like Photoshop. Now, under OS X, I only use 2 button mice because so many programs on the mac rely on them.

It doesn't really bother me that some people love one button mice, I'm happy if Apple keeps them around. However, it is inconvenient for me professionally and causes a slowdown (even if others consider it slight, I notice it) in my productivity to have to purchase laptops with one mouse button. It's just unreasonable that I need to buy yet one more accessory to every pro machine I buy from Apple when they know how many pros want it in the first place. Hence the new mouse design.
 
A single button mouse is the only kind Apple supplies right now because Macs are so simple YOU ONLY NEED ONE BUTTON (in theory) I sincerely do not know what I could do with a 2 button mouse. But, a scroll-wheel based mouse would up the ante.
 
Don't forget, for pbook/ibook users, a 2 button mouse will use twice as much power. If you also take into account operational power consumption (i.e. energy user must expend in order to use the button), this figure will rise dramatically, thus resulting in a decrease in mouse efficiency.
 
I used to be a one-button zelot as well... until I bought a new iMac last December and had to finally switch from my old Apple Desktop Bus II mouse to the new style USB pill shaped mouse (actually, I sprang extra for the Bluetooth version). That has to be the worst mouse ever designed. It's too small. It doesn't fit up into your palm. It's click is too stiff even on the low resistance setting. And, with the Bluetooth version, you CANNOT lift the mouse and keep it clicked while lifting (i.e. if you 'run out' of mousing space). Horrible, horrible, horrible mouse. Garbage. It was designed with only ONE thing in mind, aesthetics. Functionality never even entered the designers mind.

So, for the first time, I was forced to shop for a third party mouse... and there is no such thing as a single button Bluetooth or wireless mouse. So I was forced to finally make the switch to multiple buttons... which I have been fiercely and religously opposed to for years... over a decade (as long as I've been using a computer). I ended up with the Logitech MX Laser mouse... and wow... what can I say. I LOVE IT!!!!! It fits SO nice in the hand. It tracks on anything as smooth as butter (it can almost track on glass). I programmed the little side buttons for Exposé. I don't have to reach for the keyboard anymore to 'right click'. And the wheel is great. It's amazing.

Honestly, I was so against multi-buttons... but once I got used to this new mouse (8 buttons BTW, plus up, down and left, right scolling)... I could NEVER go back to one button. One button is great for my Mom... but I could never go back. And it's high time Apple joined the party. Now at least we can buy a multi-button mouse that's not grey or beige or microsoft blue. Hopefully they will add some innovative touches too.

My only disappointment with this rumor is that it's going to be optical instead of laser. Laser tracks 20X better than optical. I can use the Laser mouse on my very light colored IKEA desk with almost no wood grain. I can't use an optical on this desk... I need a mouse pad to use an optical.

And I agree that with the Mac mini and all the new people coming to the Mac... you just CAN'T go to market with a one button mouse. No way. 98% of people have probably never used a one button mouse... so it's a hard sell. And it's always been a HUGE source of confusion and derision as well. Thank you Apple. Finally!!! Just PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE don't screw up the ergonomics in an attempt to make the mouse look like a museum piece. It would be nice to have both, beauty AND function, but please don't sacrifice function for beauty like you did with the horrible mice you ship now.
 
mpw said:
I can't say I've ever used a program that I was aware required a two button mouse, even in MS Windows.
Click to expand...

Ummm... how about the Finder? It doesn't *require* two buttons... but it's a LOT nicer with a second button. I know you can control click... but once I got a multi-button mouse and got used to right clicking... it's really hard to go back. Try it... you might like it :)
 
mpw said:
I can't say I've ever used a program that I was aware required a two button mouse, even in MS Windows.
Click to expand...

I'm not really sure, haven't used Windows very much... but others have stated that a lot of Windows programs (edit: and even the OS) have commands in contextual menus that you can't access otherwise...

But what I meant is that software should not be designed with a two mouse button in mind, just as an option, and as long as Apple keeps the 1 button as standard, other developers for the mac have to design their UIs acordingly.
 
mpw said:
I can't say I've ever used a program that I was aware required a two button mouse, even in MS Windows.
Click to expand...

Don't have to go very far: in Windows, how do you create a new folder on the desktop without right-clicking?
 
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