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Yes, iPhones and iPads and Apple Watches and Apple TVs are computers, just not in the "old" way many got used to.

When you see someone holding up an iPhone in front of one' face to talk to someone (and not like many have been conditioned to in the last century by holding it to one's ear), then you see someone who sees that device not as a phone, but as a computer with phone capabilities.

Ugh, not this again.

Context, people, context.

Can we just make it so devices running a FULL OS (not mobile OS) are the ones termed "computers"?

There are only so many words in the English language, folks.

I get that the OP was being facetious, but still...
 
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Who are they calling?

Q. Are you happy with your recent Mac purchase?
A. Yes, very happy.
Q. Did you realise the technology is at least 3 years old in your brand new Mac?
A. Er no, I know nothing about computers.
 
Once you go Hack, you never go back.

I've been thinking about doing that too.

I LOVE the Mac's ease-of-use, but I'm sick of waiting for Apple to build a real desktop.

They just won't, and I'm looking to get rid of my 2011 27" iMac.

So, I'm wondering, can you dual-boot a Hack with ease? Or is it more cumbersome (or not possible)?
 
These customer satisfication surveys are absolutely nothing more than a pissing contest.


there's absolutely NO scientific value behind them, as there is no way to do comparison. Someone who owns an Apple laptop likely doesn't own a Dell or Samsung. this is the very nature of purely unscientific questioning.

don't get me wrong, I love my Apple computer. But for some value liek this to make any sense, you would have to have the SAME person rate the different computers. By having different people rate different computers, with no overlap, you dont know if the variable is the user, or the device.

so it doesn't also take into account personal bias. The one thing I have noticed is that Apple users tend to be more "engaged" with loving their devices. More likely to want to show off the devices. More likely to want to claim its' the best thing ever. While thats not a problem to love your own products, it puts an uncontrollable variable into play, where Apple Brand name might be making up for actual deficiencies the user might have. (For example, I know someone who has bought a new MacBook Air every year since 2011. Every year it's sent to the shop. he's had 5 laptops and has sent each one in at least once. But, he will claim no matter what, Apple products are the best, and would likely have rated Apple a 10/10 in any survey.

at the end of the day though. if you're happy with the product you're using, these things are also irrelevant

Same thought here.

This is like the top ten list of best rock bands, movie stars or sports icons.

About the only thing we can take from this is that those who have and use the products are about 80% happy with it and when they have an issue they get above average customer service (Which is the way it should be).
 
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The fact that Amazon is third on that list and, no, they DON'T make what I consider PCs makes this list not credible.
 
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I've been thinking about doing that too.

I LOVE the Mac's ease-of-use, but I'm sick of waiting for Apple to build a real desktop.

They just won't, and I'm looking to get rid of my 2011 27" iMac.

So, I'm wondering, can you dual-boot a Hack with ease? Or is it more cumbersome (or not possible)?


The future is notebooks to be hooked up to a dock.

That dock is connected to printers, internet, monitors of ones preferred size, and whatever other peripherals are needed.

Once the wifi /internet connections become as fast as the processors, no more notebooks.

Get online any place.
You log into your virtual customized desktop, click on your app, do what you have to do.
(Eventually typing will be the exception)

At that point it doesn't matter when skylake or kaby late are happening.
One big mainframe will process things at whatever speed you pay for.
 
I've been thinking about doing that too.

I LOVE the Mac's ease-of-use, but I'm sick of waiting for Apple to build a real desktop.

They just won't, and I'm looking to get rid of my 2011 27" iMac.

So, I'm wondering, can you dual-boot a Hack with ease? Or is it more cumbersome (or not possible)?

I dual booted mine, granted OS X is one one SSD drive and Windows on separate HDD. I didn't have any issues at all, didnt even need to do much of a setup for that, although I think having both operating systems with two partitions on a single drive you might have to fiddle around, but im not sure. I get a startup screen that lets me choose which OS I want to boot into. I've got a detailed review of my hackintosh setup right here:

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/the-hackintosh-thread.1900326/#post-21586131

And I feel your pain; all the desktop choices from Apple are absolute garbage with a ridiculous price tag. I paid peanuts for my rig and it runs like a dream; fast and super quiet even at load with all the fans at max speed... plus it's super flexible with hardware and future upgrades.
 
Apple support isn't terrible now, But it was absolutely STELLAR about 5-10 years ago. I cn believe it. Heck, they STILL do on occasion nice acts like that. My Niece broke the display on her iPad Mini 2 a few weeks ago. So we went to the Apple store. I told her, that unfortunately, her carelessness was probably going to cost her money (she had been saving up money for a bit and had collected $200), I fully told her expect that they will expect her to pay to fix / replace it.

sure enough. the guy at the store did a pure solid and outright replaced it for free. (I was not expecting that at all)

I kind of wish that he didn't, because She broke it again, which clearly shows she didn't learn a lesson. This time she's being made to live with the broken screen as a bit of punishment for her carelessness (it still works, just a crack through the middle of the display)

No, they did the same for my mom's iMac since it had continuously broken down (HDD, logic board, and GPU) and been repaired until it was out of warranty, and she paid for one HDD repair after warranty and had it fail again. The Apple Retail Store near us wouldn't do anything about it, but she went to a different one later and told them how much **** she had to deal with using that iMac... She had a 2012 27" iMac and got a new (2014? I forget) 5K 27" iMac. This was half a year ago.

Yet they refused to do anything about a early 2011 15" MBP for a coworker of mine here that was exhibiting "textbook" symptoms of dGPU failure because the serial number was "not within the effected range"; same model number as effected units and a valid purchase date, just not the "right" serial. They told her to go pound sand essentially.

I don't believe it as more than fanboi stories, spun up only to defend what they love in absence of facts... Sorry.
 
I dual booted mine, granted OS X is one one SSD drive and Windows on separate HDD. I didn't have any issues at all, didnt even need to do much of a setup for that, although I think having both operating systems with two partitions on a single drive you might have to fiddle around, but im not sure. I get a startup screen that lets me choose which OS I want to boot into. I've got a detailed review of my hackintosh setup right here:

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/the-hackintosh-thread.1900326/#post-21586131

And I feel your pain; all the desktop choices from Apple are absolute garbage with a ridiculous price tag. I paid peanuts for my rig and it runs like a dream; fast and super quiet even at load with all the fans at max speed... plus it's super flexible with hardware and future upgrades.

Yup. Did the same. have OSx El capitan on one SSD, and Windows 10 on a 2nd SSD. most of my "office" style stuff, web browsing, Chat, etc, I do in OSx. All gaming / media is in Windows.

booting between the two isn't so much an issue. Windows boots in 3 seconds. OSx in about 10.

the only thing to be very wear of is that OSx isn't truly designed for the widest range of hardware and you will need to be picky with what you buy. Certain motherboard chipsets will not work. Certain video cards will not work, etc.

there will also be some "uniqueness" to the install. For example, I could not install OSx with my 290x installed. I had to remove it, switch ti integrated, Install OSx, then inject an override to force OSx to see it. Then put the card back in, disable on board.

Its also not easy to do updates. Sometimes a patch will break the installation. And going from verseion to version (10.10 to 10.11 might not work at all and requires a new install)
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Yet they refused to do anything about a early 2011 15" MBP for a coworker of mine here that was exhibiting "textbook" symptoms of dGPU failure because the serial number was "not within the effected range"; same model number as effected units and a valid purchase date, just not the "right" serial. They told her to go pound sand essentially.

I don't believe it as more than fanboi stories, spun up only to defend what they love in absence of facts... Sorry.

well, you can believe it or not. But to even assume 'm even a remote fanboy is actually amusing to me, considering I bet you 95% of the users on this site believe i'm an apple hater

(I'm just a very nit picky overly critical ass cantankerous old bastard)
 
Yup. Did the same. have OSx El capitan on one SSD, and Windows 10 on a 2nd SSD. most of my "office" style stuff, web browsing, Chat, etc, I do in OSx. All gaming / media is in Windows.

booting between the two isn't so much an issue. Windows boots in 3 seconds. OSx in about 10.

the only thing to be very wear of is that OSx isn't truly designed for the widest range of hardware and you will need to be picky with what you buy. Certain motherboard chipsets will not work. Certain video cards will not work, etc.

there will also be some "uniqueness" to the install. For example, I could not install OSx with my 290x installed. I had to remove it, switch ti integrated, Install OSx, then inject an override to force OSx to see it. Then put the card back in, disable on board.

Its also not easy to do updates. Sometimes a patch will break the installation. And going from verseion to version (10.10 to 10.11 might not work at all and requires a new install)

All true.

But, to be fair; I installed Yosemite on my Hackintosh last year and I've really had ZERO problems (granted I did go for a GTX 960 which made the GPU install portion much easier). I've been meaning to do a re-install for a while, mainly to 10.10.5 but I just don't feel like going through all of it again, it was a bit of a hassle to get things right. Also, I really do NOT want to switch to El Capitan or Sierra, mainly because of SIP and I can't live without XtraFinder (cut paste command along with a number of other features have become part of my daily usage).
 
All true.

But, to be fair; I installed Yosemite on my Hackintosh last year and I've really had ZERO problems (granted I did go for a GTX 960 which made the GPU install portion much easier). I've been meaning to do a re-install for a while, mainly to 10.10.5 but I just don't feel like going through all of it again, it was a bit of a hassle to get things right. Also, I really do NOT want to switch to El Capitan or Sierra, mainly because of SIP and I can't live without XtraFinder (cut paste command along with a number of other features have become part of my daily usage).

I will probably skip Sierra for my hackintosh too. there's not enough compelling there to upgrade from El Capitan.

not saying that people shouldn't upgrade. but given the hoops I have to go through to install for my hackintosh, it's not worth the upgrade.
 
I will probably skip Sierra for my hackintosh too. there's not enough compelling there to upgrade from El Capitan.

not saying that people shouldn't upgrade. but given the hoops I have to go through to install for my hackintosh, it's not worth the upgrade.

Only reason I could see myself upgrading would be if I got a GTX 10xx series card, but I don't game enough and my GTX 960 is more than capable for my games anyway. Yosemite is fine, although El Capitan is apparently a more polished version of it?
 
False; a desktop cant be 'best' when it comes shipped with a crippled mobile GPU and some of the worst airflow imaginable, so bad that it has to downthrottle the CPU to save it from overheating; this was confirmed by LinusTechTips in the video below:


Everything else is worse.

5K DCI-3P screen or bust.
 
Apple truly does know how to take care of their customers. In June of 2015 I had to take my 2011 15-inch MacBook Pro to get some graphics issue fixed that was manufacturer defect so Apple fixed that issue at no cost.

suddenly after that my MacBook started breaking down everywhere. It would shut off, it would freeze like crazy, I would get beach balls like crazy so I took it in July 6th to the Apple Store and they fixed every part that was malfunctioning.

Took it in for a third time in august 1-day before the 90-day warranty was due to expire from the initial graphics problem in June, and instead of trying to fix it for a 3rd time, the manager from the Apple Store I went to, told me that they were going to replace my 2011 MacBook Pro with a 2015 15-inch MacBook Pro.

So they basically gave me a free top of he line computer and also gave me a tech21 case for free.
 
Everything else is worse.

5K DCI-3P screen or bust.

You're kidding, right? You think it's acceptable to sell an overclockable CPU when you can't overclock, advertise it as 4ghz but force it to downthrottle because it cant handle 4ghz? That's borderline false advertising. Plus a mobile GPU?!

And you're OK with that for a desktop at $3,000????
 
Only reason I could see myself upgrading would be if I got a GTX 10xx series card, but I don't game enough and my GTX 960 is more than capable for my games anyway. Yosemite is fine, although El Capitan is apparently a more polished version of it?

I honestly didn't notice that much of a diffference going from Yosemite to El. El seems to be a bit better on resource management than Yosemite was. And is lightyears better than OS Vista... er, Mavericks
 
I honestly didn't notice that much of a diffference going from Yosemite to El. El seems to be a bit better on resource management than Yosemite was. And is lightyears better than OS Vista... er, Mavericks

I actually liked Mavericks, lol. I hated Lion and Mountain Lion (total garbage).
 
I only care about what SpaceX use since we already know NASA use Thinkpads and both companies are primarily Linux.
 
False; a desktop cant be 'best' when it comes shipped with a crippled mobile GPU and some of the worst airflow imaginable, so bad that it has to downthrottle the CPU to save it from overheating; this was confirmed by LinusTechTips in the video below:


Linus has always impressed me by trying to take the least bias approach to reviewing he can, even if he can be a bit, sarcastic (i get his humour but many people would take it as rude / mean)

There is absolutely no sense to Zirel's comments. don't bother. The iMac is not a bad computer. but it's absolutely a "form over function" device, where they often have sacrificed performance and capabilities in order to make a device that is looks good. but I know you know all this :p

the iMac 5k screen is gorgeous, But, its like lipstick on a pig. its meant to be the showcase of the device, and distract from the obvious shortcomings of lowered performance and significantly less performance per dollar of competition.

its also a non-typical standard resolution that only Apple supports. And unfortunately, their hardware is not really well matched, as aside from a few graphic editing programs or movie production programs, it's goes under-utilized, and could have been equally served by 4k, or even 2k.

when you then even couple in that they supplied a mobile GPU that struggles at 1080p gaming, that 5k display becomes even less useful. One of the reasons why 1080p based displays are still standard on most computers is the fundamental interaction between a computer does not change. as the size scales up of the elements to be usable, the computer UI interaction stays identical. you will get the same use experience out of 1080p or 5k. 5k is just going to look prettier for a small subset of use.
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I actually liked Mavericks, lol. I hated Lion and Mountain Lion (total garbage).

Mavericks wasn't bad from the overal USE. but i'm anal about performance. I found Mavericks to be the most heavy handed for resource utilization of any OSx I've used to date.

for several tests, using hackintosha nd my MacBook air, I found consistently that Mavericks would require minimum of 2.2GB of allocated RAM on fresh boot on clean install. highest use i've seen in an OS since Vista.

I also found there was noticable UI lag, even on SSD machines that didn't have modern CPU's. My Sandy Bridge CPU in the MBA would often cause beachballs while things would load. This was repeatable over multiple test installs. CPU load on average was also much higher.

This seems to have been remedied in Yosemite, and further refined in El Capitan. Its also one of the reasons why Apple has had to increase the base ram offerings, as they really are not super efficient at resource utilisation anymore. Even El capitan on fresh uses more RAM and CPU at idle than Windows 10

and people can say what they want about WIn10 UI, and some of the disjointedness, but currently, Win8.x and Win10 are the two single mainstream OS's that seem to have the best resource utilisation and performance.

example Win10 boots on my machine in 3-4 seconds to desktop
OSx on the exact same hardware is about 10 seconds.

Gaming on the same hardware for many titles, yields anywhere from 10% to a 75% performance degradation in OSx.
 
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Linus has always impressed me by trying to take the least bias approach to reviewing he can, even if he can be a bit, sarcastic (i get his humour but many people would take it as rude / mean)

There is absolutely no sense to Zirel's comments. don't bother. The iMac is not a bad computer. but it's absolutely a "form over function" device, where they often have sacrificed performance and capabilities in order to make a device that is looks good. but I know you know all this :p

the iMac 5k screen is gorgeous, But, its like lipstick on a pig. its meant to be the showcase of the device, and distract from the obvious shortcomings of lowered performance and significantly less performance per dollar of competition.

its also a non-typical standard resolution that only Apple supports. And unfortunately, their hardware is not really well matched, as aside from a few graphic editing programs or movie production programs, it's goes under-utilized, and could have been equally served by 4k, or even 2k.

when you then even couple in that they supplied a mobile GPU that struggles at 1080p gaming, that 5k display becomes even less useful. One of the reasons why 1080p based displays are still standard on most computers is the fundamental interaction between a computer does not change. as the size scales up of the elements to be usable, the computer UI interaction stays identical. you will get the same use experience out of 1080p or 5k. 5k is just going to look prettier for a small subset of use.

What's worse is that the GPU inside that is soldered. So anyone buying it will be stuck with a stone-age GPU forever and newer games are only going to perform even worse, should you even bother wanting to try and do any kind of gaming.

I'm pretty pissed off with myself; after I went the Hackintosh route I immediately questioned why I didn't do it sooner. Price, performance, flexibility and future proofing ALL outperform any Mac desktop.
 
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What's worse is that the GPU inside that is soldered. So anyone buying it will be stuck with a stone-age GPU forever and newer games are only going to perform even worse, should you even bother wanting to try and do any kind of gaming.

I'm pretty pissed off with myself; after I went the Hackintosh route I immediately questioned why I didn't do it sooner. Price, performance, flexibility and future proofing ALL outperform any Mac desktop.

cause it's not legal :p technically speaking from the EULA at least ;)

but I concur. To put in perspective

my desktop isn't some amazing super beast. It's a standard Haswell i5-4670 (Why I didn't spend 20 and get the K is worthy of a kick in my ass), 16GB of well timed DDR3 RAM, 2 x 120GB SSD's, 500GB SSD for fast gaming storage, 290x 4gb graphics card, and I've married it to a 34" ultra wide screen 99% sRGB LED LG display (2560x1080).

I paid < $1,500 Canadian. if you want to include all other accesories over the years, like the USB HDMI input, a cheap 2nd display, high end mechanical keyboard and gaming mouse, and the water cooling kit, cause, you know. I CAN. I have only spent ~$2000 total

Find me an actual Apple computer for that with the same or even near equivelant parts and performance.

at the end of the day. you pay Apple premium for Apple design. I don't begrudge anyone who likes it. its simple. easy and does look great. Will it suffice for a lot of people, damn right. But for those of us who actually do look at the price to performance comparisons, versus Price to design, Apple isn't really "the best of the best" in any way.

and I've ranted enough :p
 
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