Apple Employees Continue to Fight Return to Campuses and Push for Better Remote Working Options

[sockdoggy]

We have around a dozen staff members in the front office - very much depends on the department, WFH experience, company stage.

Sales people are used to road life and ours prefer the office over their homes. Production-related staff (purchasing, dev) need to stay close to the plant since there's always a deviation between theory and reality. Junior clerks and some senior staff members were not great at WFH since little experience. A few left because they loved WFH (from my perspective they worked a lot less given projects at home they talked about) and found other employers willing to allow it. It has largely not been functional for us because we're just graduating out of pure start up phase and high collaboration bandwidth is critical.

 

[gaximus]

In my opinion, Apple should fire this group and replacement them with people that will come to work etc.

No, Apple shouldn't fire them for asking, if they want, and keep the policy as it is, then fire those who don't show back up to work. But if these employees truly are the best in their fields, Apple might not want to loose them. If you're worth something, ask for what you want. If you don't get it, go somewhere else that will give it.

 

[citysnaps]

Employer-employee relations are a two way street now. "My way or the highway" is a long outdated concept. It's the employees who go a long way towards making a company great.

See my post above, #175.

 

[kuwxman]

Just as much ignorance and hatred in this thread as the last one on the same topic. Some folks thrive in an in person environment while others thrive in a remote environment. There is nothing wrong with employees fighting for an atmosphere that helps them do their best work. Don't see why a hybrid schedule can't be seen as the minimum for most workplaces moving forward with many more offering full time remote work.

As someone who has had the opportunity to work from home since last March, I don't have any want to head back in to the office either. I still see and talk to my co-workers every day. Work related communication has improved with this setup. I had my own office at our building, but having a quiet office here at home is just undeniably better. If anything, too, I'm actually working MORE now than I was before which is a benefit to my company. Thankfully, our owner has been amazing through the pandemic and has been completely supportive for those of us working from home.

 

[iOS Geek]

Apple has been around for 40+ years. With respect to employee dynamics I suspect they've seen a lot over that time period.

Those people that need to work at home should seek employment with companies that offer that option. If they're as highly qualified as some here suggest, it should be easy.

Those that are threatening to quit should be allowed to leave with Apple's thanks and best wishes.

A win those employees and a win for Apple!

Absolutely. And when I say I didn't have the choice to work from home...I know there's someone on here that will tell me that I know what I signed up for. And that's true. I signed up for a job that would require me to be at work on time (heck, I'd probably even have to be in EARLY) if there was a literal apocalypse. I knew what I signed up for...and so did these Apple employees. If they were never told outright that working from home (or even a hybrid option) was going to be permanent...they shouldn't be surprised that this is how it's going.

 

[aesc80]

Looks like I'm late to the game, but I'll still drive my 2 cents.

It's always cute when people hate on others because of the perks they get. "Why do they get to stay home?", "Why do they get that kick back?" - Simply because it's actually kinda of easy to work from home in the tech industry, so long as your supplies and your product access is easily available.

As an engineer myself, it's crazy easy to continue my work. I have all my equipment, I have a great internet connection, I'm not missing out on any equipment - I'm completely productive in what I need to do. Can I operate without going back to the office? Of course! Would I love to WFH permanently - it actually kinda sucks since I'm an extrovert and stuck at home every frickin day + weekends. But yeah, I could totally not miss a beat WFH.

That being said, working at Apple means access to equipment behind the walls (since they're all NDA'd up the wazoo). While people complain that "OMG, iOS 15 isn't innovative because they were working from home" - nope! It's not innovative because there's nothing really additional they can do with the current equipment today. Will iPhone 13 suck because they worked from home? That's the real question! I wonder if Apple sent out any prototype iPhone 13s for the devs to work on and support. I bet it would have been scary AF for Apple to just whip those out to employees hoping they didn't just send it to some rando (And believe me, I've heard stories!).

TL>DR
Apple is a place where you need access. Thanks to NDAs, you won't be productive unless they send the lab to you. I'm willing to bet they'll eventually allow those employees who want to WFH to do so, but they'll slowly be culled out for those who will show up in person.

Apple should provide dormitories for employees!

Funny you should say that! Apple actually does (or did) have townhouses to allow employees to move in and stay while they looked for a new place. No, they won't provide permanent housing, but for the amount of cash Apple employees earn, I'm pretty sure they'd rebound quite quick to find a place (granted, it'll be in Milpitas or something)

 

[redman042]

This is a battle that will play out throughout the industry. I'm not surprised Apple is pushing back on long term work at home proposals. They built their success on close-nit teams working in person and in secret on big long-term projects. They built arguably the most advanced office building on the planet to continue this in. But yes, it is stupid expensive to work in Silicon Valley, the traffic is a nightmare, and people who work there generally have little personal time. Working at home is feasible, but IMO is not quite as good as being there from a collaborative and relationship-building standpoint. I think they'll figure it out but it's a complicated issue.

 

[atomic.flip]

So if these employees are leaving California for lower cost states then I guess Apple has the right to adjust their salary downward accordingly?

That’s actually very standard practice.

 

[Rafterman]

I feel like half the replies are that sort of response.

It does seem that jealousy is a factor here. Me, I'm happy for others who get stuff, even if I don't. I don't have it in me to be spiteful like that.

 

[danuff]

Tim Cook: "COME BACK, OR GET OUT!" Quit being babies and get your asses back to work.

 

[I7guy]

Just as much ignorance and hatred in this thread as the last one on the same topic. Some folks thrive in an in person environment while others thrive in a remote environment.

It depends. Hopefully everyone has their dream job.

There is nothing wrong with employees fighting for an atmosphere that helps them do their best work. Don't see why a hybrid schedule can't be seen as the minimum for most workplaces moving forward with many more offering full time remote work.

Nope nothing wrong in asking. Demanding doesn't get one very far except perhaps out of the door.

As someone who has had the opportunity to work from home since last March, I don't have any want to head back in to the office either.

Me neither, but alas this is coming to an graceful end.

I still see and talk to my co-workers every day.

Me as well.

Work related communication has improved with this setup.

Talking more doesn't equate to improved communication nor to getting things done better, more efficiently or faster.

I had my own office at our building, but having a quiet office here at home is just undeniably better.

It's clearly more lonely.

If anything, too, I'm actually working MORE now than I was before which is a benefit to my company.

I believe many worked more but accomplished less.

Thankfully, our owner has been amazing through the pandemic and has been completely supportive for those of us working from home.

We don't have an owner, and company has supported complete WFH, but that time is nearing an end.

 

[Ethosik]

Cry a River. Go to work like everyone else. No, you can’t sit at home and watch your kids. You go to work.

You HONESTLY think working from home means your not working? I work more on my tasks I’m given since I don’t have 1.5 hour commute anymore.

 

[kuwxman]

It depends. Hopefully everyone has their dream job.

Nope nothing wrong in asking. Demanding doesn't get one very far except perhaps out of the door.

Me neither, but alas this is coming to an graceful end.

Me as well.

Talking more doesn't equate to improved communication nor to getting things done better, more efficiently or faster.

It's clearly more lonely.

I believe many worked more but accomplished less.

We don't have an owner, and company has supported complete WFH, but that time is nearing an end.

Good for you? Everyone's work situation is different. Judging these Apple employees so harshly, based off random internet articles especially, is completely idiotic.

 

[TonyC28]

Work from home should become more of a thing, but it can’t happen this quickly. Give it time people.

 

[Ethosik]

This year’s WWDC sowcased a complete lack of innovation. Things like the new Safari tabs would have been killed before they would’ve been shown to the public because it’s an utter mess.

Companies like Apple need people in an office in order to function for the full 110%. If you can’t live with that idea Apple might nog be your company. It’s part of Apple’s DNA to be around with others creating great things. Being alone in your home office with your kid running around and cars and dogs making noise won’t help you achieve that.

You can’t honestly believe that the person in charge of Safari would have just magically changed their mind if everyone was physically at the office.

And IMO, Apple along with other companies need to slow down in general. Catalina was a massive issue, that was released and worked on without working from home. Big Sur started out very bad too. So Apple needs to stop and actually fix things.

 

[Ethosik]

Fire all 10 of these ungrateful lazy fools and anyone else who whines and make examples of them Tim. They just want to wake up at 11, sip some coffee, watch The Price Is Right and daytimes soaps all under the guise of "working from home". They should consider themselves lucky to be employed by Apple and if they don't like it there's the front door.

You do know that companies track productivity of their workers right? Sometimes for developers it’s number of commits a day or week average. If you constantly take too long, people question it.

 

[aesc80]

You can’t honestly believe that the person in charge of Safari would have just magically changed their mind if everyone was physically at the office.

And IMO, Apple along with other companies need to slow down in general. Catalina was a massive issue, that was released and worked on without working from home. Big Sur started out very bad too. So Apple needs to stop and actually fix things.

I've come to notice that people not in the industry and just want to flaunt shiny new things don't care how it's delivered, they want it know (The Veruca Salt effect).

And you're absolutely correct. As I mentioned about, iOS / tvOS 15 still would have "fell flat" because much of the current tool set on these phone are already maxed out. Developers can't magically put a finger print sensor on your phone, or make your MP more, unless it's software based, and even then, digital zooms tend to suck at some point.

Nope - the general audience just want the umma loompas to get back into the office and find new shiny things, even if it might not make a difference (like my point said, access is important. The new iPhones will be more in question than iOS 15)

 

[daved2424]

Fire them. Apple is offering them much above what their contracts no doubt state. They asked. Apple said no. They asked again. Apple should say goodbye. Most people would be so lucky to get an offer like this.

 

[Maconplasma]

No, Apple shouldn't fire them for asking, if they want, and keep the policy as it is, then fire those who don't show back up to work. But if these employees truly are the best in their fields, Apple might not want to loose them. If you're worth something, ask for what you want. If you don't get it, go somewhere else that will give it.

The thing to keep in mind is that ANYONE can be replaced by another amazing talent. There's no one human being that's irreplaceable.

 

[siddavis]

Every generation believes this and every generation finds out there are equally highly-skilled workers in other parts of the world ready to do their jobs with far less demands. Their are millions of American, highly-skilled, manufacturing workers that also thought they could control their workflow and ratcheted up demands and costs on employment and were abruptly introduced to involuntary career changes into the low-wage service industry.

Yes, and it is not necessarily that companies are dictating this, rather the market. So like others have stated, the best way they can influence change is to disrupt Apple's workforce. Leave. Do it. Find the job that you want. This includes ALL of the perks and benefits associated with it. Can't find it? Anywhere? Well then the market has spoken. Make it for yourself, that is an option.

It's as if only the employer has to take all the risk. This includes building an over the top campus that was intended to be for the workers. Perhaps that risk will not pay off if the WFH landscape is truly changing.

Waaaay too much Marxist proletariat vs bourgeoisie style discussion going on here for my liking. But I guess that's what I should expect when we are bombarded with this thinking at every turn in the media and pop culture. It is toxic and it is clearly tearing us apart.

 

[Steve Adams]

Work from home should become more of a thing, but it can’t happen this quickly. Give it time people.

It's been a year and a half here now, and the sky hasn't fallen. Just proves that going to work (most work) is an antiquated practice from the 20's.

 

[Johnny907]

“Apple employees continue to fight for their right to live somewhere else but keep their inflated NorCal wage.”

Fixed that for you.

 

[siddavis]

Where do you live? Did your school already make a decision on hybrid for the fall because I’m guessing they aren’t in school right now. Hopefully vaccines will be available this fall for younger children. 🤞

Why?

 

[forza1976]

#Millennials!

/CloseThread

 

[jjudson]

Yeah, first of all, these people aren't "bitching and whining." The idea of sitting at work everyday is stupidly outdated as anyone who has every worked in an office can attest to. It's way harder for parents, too, who are still managing the reality of hybrid school (I'm one of them.) That said, it's also laughable to expect that Apple managers will permit their directs to work remotely. I can all but guarantee from personal experience that that will not happen. Apple managers rarely if ever break from the pack, and even if there's a pilot program, I have a hard time imagining anyone is gonna stick their neck out. What WILL happen is brain-drain from Apple as the rest of the valley moves forward with flexible work options and Apple doesn't. Short-sighted move.

Their policy is to work from the shop. If you feel you don't want to do that, there's employment options out there that will suit your needs.